KickStarter Kingdom Come: Deliverance Pre-Release Thread [RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Cadmus]

Thanks Smejki
I'm glad to see I can post here and learn stuff about the game. I was put off my Dan's short bursts of visits (which is understandable) and thought I'd just have to passively wait for updates.

Is it me or is something wrong with the characters heads? I just checked the game website again and the heads seem kinda big or something =/

 

[Smejki]

All heads are placeholders. Guys are working on a new system. Theres some info on it in one of the updates

 

[set]

Smejki, if you really are a dev....

I haven't really paid much attention to this project. The initial few lines of the game's pitch didn't catch my interest and I don't remember much of it at this point beyond 'pretty grafix'.

I would pay full price for Deliverance, or any medieval action RPG, on day one or episode one or whatever, if it had the following things:

1. A customizable protagonist.

2. Qualifying "customizable": I can choose what weapon he wields, the character's durability in combat, and less combat-oriented things, like what caste he belongs to in society and what survival skills he has (merchant? fisherman? noble?)

3. The ability to play by myself or with a small entourage of mercenaries/soldiers.

4. Gameplay which is open. It can be scripted, but it has to be balanced around various different approaches. If you customize your protagonist to be a dirty thief, that means he's flying solo with a dagger. If he's a leader peasant he might have a few thug allies. If he's charismatic he might talk his way out of conflicts.

5. The ability to--

Okay, basically I'm just going to say, "Copy Mount and Blade but do it better". And that alone should be sufficient. I mean, M&B is far from perfect, but that right there is an indie game which was originally created by a team of TWO. It had all the necessary mechanics to be fun and to invite roleplaying. You could play as a bandit, a peasant, a soldier, a trader, or a king. You could roleplay all of those roles and you could mechanically play as all of them (well maybe not peasant so much) in interesting ways. It was enormously successfuly, financially. It has very weak story elements, but managed to cram in a few.

If all Deliverance is, is a narrow-minded popamole action RPG with a few "realistic elements" I won't buy it. I don't want a heavily scripted story unless it can fit within the context of a sandbox and be adaptable enough to adapt to the way I want to play your game.

You're wasting a colossal amount of money if you all you generate is another story-based game.

And if you're a programmer of some kind, please tell me you're putting actual game mechanics ahead of graphical fluff?

 

[evdk]

Is there something I am missing which made some of you to think that way?

Yeah, I have more faith in Fargo than I do Daniel 'I look like a serial rapist' Vavra. That and something like WL2 is fairly discreet where something like this is much more prone to go off the rails and down the road of pointless technology racking up massive costs. But none of that matters because you seem to be a shill for this game.

I heard what you just said. I am watching you.

 

[Sir Dupre]

Bioware style? no
Other style? Maybe. If it'll makes sense.

But, but i want to be a dragon...

 

[Smejki]

We are no re-making MaB.

freedom and mechanics of Skyrim, the setting of Mount and Blade, the storytelling styles of The Witcher and Red Dead Redemption, and the tough combat dynamics of Dark Souls

So sorry to disappoint you but are looking for another game.

I can choose what weapon he wields

Yes

the character's durability in combat

Uhmm? Dependent on your armor and stats

like what caste he belongs to

You character and his history is set. Think of Geralt, the witcher.

in society and what survival skills he has (merchant? fisherman? noble?)

dtto. You are a smith. But you can learn new things.

3. The ability to play by myself or with a small entourage of mercenaries/soldiers.

No hiring system, no permanent sidekicks. Beside a dog which you can get.

4. Gameplay which is open.

Think of Morrowind in that matter

You're wasting a colossal amount of money if you all you generate is another story-based game.

~RPGCodex, 2014

And if you're a programmer of some kind, please tell me you're putting actual game mechanics ahead of graphical fluff?

I am not. But we do. Besides I don't how being a programmer has any impact on that.

 

[set]

Thanks for enduring my ignorant questions.

But you're still wasting a colossal amount of money, my god. You're actually making a story based game with "realistic medieval elements". Talk about clashing ideologies!

 

[Magic User]

It'll play significant role. That's all I can say for now. After all the events lead to Hussite wars few years down the road which were a massive religious unrest.

Thanks a lot for the reply. I probably worded it in the worst way possible because I didn't know one of the devs was answering questions here and didn't expect a reply, can I try again?

My question was more regarding what role the institution and Catholicism itself will play by and large in the setting. The most historical middle-ages rpg we have so far is Darklands(which had, ironically, an exaggerated version of the period where every myth and superstition was true). Religion was central to everything in medieval life and that game did a pretty good job at expressing that down to a T, both the good and the bad. Arnold Hendricks(the developer) was an historian and that had a large part to do with it.

I ask because I am somewhat of a medieval history buff and that is the main reason why I am interested in this game. Historicity is a big selling point to me, I hate how most fiction about the medieval period is some bullshit propagating the "dark ages myth" that every single medievalist hates.

Also: How will the player interact with the Church? What role does religion and religious rites play in the game? What role do churches, cathedrals and universities play in the game? I have seem a lot about fighting, peasantry and village life, crafts, but very little about that. These things were central to life in every medieval city and Darklands did a good job at presenting that.

 

[tyrannosaurus rex]

I ask because I am somewhat of a medieval history buff and that is the main reason why I am interested in this game. Historicity is a big selling point to me, I hate how most fiction about the medieval period is some bullshit propagating the "dark ages myth" that every single medievalist hates.

 

[Cadmus]

It'll play significant role. That's all I can say for now. After all the events lead to Hussite wars few years down the road which were a massive religious unrest.

Thanks a lot for the reply. I probably worded it in the worst way possible because I didn't know one of the devs was answering questions here and didn't expect a reply, can I try again?

My question was more regarding what role the institution and Catholicism itself will play by and large in the setting. The most historical middle-ages rpg we have so far is Darklands(which had, ironically, an exaggerated version of the period where every myth and superstition was true). Religion was central to everything in medieval life and that game did a pretty good job at expressing that down to a T, both the good and the bad. Arnold Hendricks(the developer) was an historian and that had a large part to do with it.

I ask because I am somewhat of a medieval history buff and that is the main reason why I am interested in this game. Historicity is a big selling point to me, I hate how most fiction about the medieval period is some bullshit propagating the "dark ages myth" that every single medievalist hates.

Also: How will the player interact with the Church? What role does religion and religious rites play in the game? What role do churches, cathedrals and universities play in the game? I have seem a lot about fighting, peasantry and village life, crafts, but very little about that. These things were central to life in every medieval city and Darklands did a good job at presenting that.

derail the train! tell me what these things the medievalists hate are!

 

[mindx2]

I might have no interest (well maybe a little since I am reading this thread) in the game but I am impressed Smejki has stuck it out here on the Codex. Most devs run away in tears and but this one hasn't. Props for that, at least.

 

[tyrannosaurus rex]

derail the train! tell me what these things the medievalists hate are!

1. People who confuses the florentine artistic ''renaissance'' in the 15th century with the intellectual renaissance that had already started in the 12th century.

 

[Magic User]

derail the train! tell me what these things the medievalists hate are!

I'm not derailing anything, one of the selling points of this game is that it is set in a historical setting and my questioning has the purpose of defining how the main characteristic of this period will be presented(or if it will be presented at all).

As for your question, I refer mostly to the "renaissance" and "dark ages" myth, the idea that the middle-ages was an insignificant and stale historical period in which no intellectual, artistic, cultural or technological "progress" happened and that it was also a period of particular opression, ignorance and suffering. We are talking about history that has always been interpreted under the light of religious and anti-religious polemics, after all. Serious and "unbiased" study of medieval history only began to become widespread in the 60's or so, and popular culture has not caught up at all, hence fictional depictions of the medieval period are usually laughably exaggerated. This is a good read that I recommend, if you are interested:

http://web.maths.unsw.edu.au/~jim/renaissance.html


EDIT:

1. People who confuses the florentine artistic ''renaissance'' in the 15th century with the intellectual renaissance that had already started in the 12th century.

Pretty much. I probably should have given a short reply like yours.

 

[Lyric Suite]

People who also confuse things that happened in the 15th century as being specifically part of the Renaissance. Like so called Renaissance "polyphony", which was really a medieval art, and likewise for things like the plays of Shakespeare, which were only partially inspired by the Renaissance and actually became more and more medieval as time went on.

And that's without taking into account all those later trends which were inspired by the middle ages in the first place, like the "Gothic" and Romanticism of the 19th century.

 

[Cadmus]

derail the train! tell me what these things the medievalists hate are!

I'm not derailing anything, one of the selling points of this game is that it is set in a historical setting and my questioning has the purpose of defining how the main characteristic of this period will be presented(or if it will be presented at all).

As for your question, I refer mostly to the "renaissance" and "dark ages" myth, the idea that the middle-ages was an insignificant and stale historical period in which no intellectual, artistic, cultural or technological "progress" happened and that it was also a period of particular opression, ignorance and suffering. We are talking about history that has always been interpreted under the light of religious and anti-religious polemics, after all. Serious and "unbiased" study of medieval history only began to become widespread in the 60's or so, and popular culture has not caught up at all, hence fictional depictions of the medieval period are usually laughably exaggerated. This is a good read that I recommend, if you are interested:

http://web.maths.unsw.edu.au/~jim/renaissance.html


EDIT:

1. People who confuses the florentine artistic ''renaissance'' in the 15th century with the intellectual renaissance that had already started in the 12th century.

Pretty much. I probably should have given a short reply like yours.

thanks gonna read that

 

[Lyric Suite]

I might have no interest (well maybe a little since I am reading this thread) in the game but I am impressed Smejki has stuck it out here on the Codex. Most devs run away in tears and but this one hasn't. Props for that, at least.

Posting in the Codex is like having the crap beaten out of you like in one of those gang initiations one sees in movies.

 

[Kaucukovnik]

I don't like the lighting in the screenshots too much. Blinding bright areas contrasting with dark shadows make it look too much like a photo quickly taken on regular camera. Feels like a shot from some LARP rather than a visit to middle-ages. No style, no atmosphere, just photorealism for the sake of it. Millions down the drain just to replicate live footage of subpar quality.

Those other rpg kickstarters have involved the community much more in the game development cycle, they have changed their games due to fan feedback and their communities have the notion that these games would not have been made without their backing. Warhorse is taking the opposite approach, thats why people seem less inclined to put up with their shananigans.

I'm actually happy to see a KS project that isn't basically a bitch for the fans/backers.
It's pretty weird, that having a coherent vision is regarded as weakness compared to "Tell us what game you want from us!"

 

[Metro]

Coherent vision? That's a stretch.

 

[Kem0sabe]

Those other rpg kickstarters have involved the community much more in the game development cycle, they have changed their games due to fan feedback and their communities have the notion that these games would not have been made without their backing. Warhorse is taking the opposite approach, thats why people seem less inclined to put up with their shananigans.

I'm actually happy to see a KS project that isn't basically a bitch for the fans/backers.
It's pretty weird, that having a coherent vision is regarded as weakness compared to "Tell us what game you want from us!"[/QUOTE]

I don't think their vision is very coherent at this point.

 

[NotAGolfer]

There are so many things I don't get about this project:
1. The combat system... Sorry, but I didn't understand it, is weapon-wielding and movement completely free or do I trigger some sort of premade animation chain using hidden or openly displayed QTE combos? Or what is it? I just don't get it, too many marketing buzzwords during the KS pitch and I never bothered to read between the lines. Even the gameplay videos didn't help, even there I couldn't get a proper feeling how it would play.
2. If the main story is that important will the side quests and in between activities be any good? Hint: They are not in any of the GTAs except San Andreas where one of them (turf wars) was fleshed out enough to stand on its own as a game mechanic worth my while.
3. What do the devs think about QTEs? I for one don't mind some stupid QTE minigame here and there, for example to make angling more immersive, but please don't make it difficult and don't make the difficulty skill-dependant. Install strict skill thresholds instead.
4. Why should I care about how many layers of clothes you can wear?
Why the fuck should I care?
Are TES frostfall immershun faggits the one you can impress with that or what's the deal with it? This was one of the reasons I pulled my pledge before the KS ended, too many updates on unimportant shit like this and too little on game mechanics.

Still, I love the idea of a historically accurate CRPG and I also like well made story fag games like both Witcher games very much, so fingers crossed here. If it will be any good and no railroaded QTE clickfest with b-movie main story and neglected side content, where your character build only adds some fluff but doesn't change gameplay, I will buy it.

Neither will it suffer from TES syndrome (cups and plates and spoon ffs).
You might get a bit overloaded but all the items should be usable and useful.

I don't understand. So you want to add a trillion layers of clothes but deem lootable spoons and plates in the NPC houses useless?
U destroy mah immershun!

 

[Ninjerk]

I might have no interest (well maybe a little since I am reading this thread) in the game but I am impressed Smejki has stuck it out here on the Codex. Most devs run away in tears and but this one hasn't. Props for that, at least.

Posting in the Codex is like having the crap beaten out of you like in one of those gang initiations one sees in movies.

So you wanna make RPGs, eh? *zzzzip*

 

[mikaelis]

4. Why should I care about how many layers of clothes you can wear?
Why the fuck should I care?
Are TES frostfall immershun faggits the one you can impress with that or what's the deal with it? This was one of the reasons I pulled my pledge before the KS ended, too many updates on unimportant shit like this and too little on game mechanics.

Uhm... ..., Maybe because of stacking different defense bonuses and general customisation? (possibly with unique armor sets that give additional bonuses)?

 

[Perkel]

Can i also indulge myself in hard questions ?

You mentioned first person realistic malee and i saw video of that from ks campaign.

Question: How the fuck player will be controlling that. No game before managed to do well FPP and malee as one. There was Dark Messiah which did it well but it was full fantasy malee and still it looked bad. There is M&B which has fantastic 3rd person malee but in FPP mode it doesn't work because of FOV.

Auto combat ala batman/geralt ? Because i find it hard to believe players will be doing proper crossing and parry via mouse and shit.

 

[WhiteGuts]

From what I read and what they said, you basically choose a body part to target, and then you choose which type of attack you want to use (slash, thrust, and a third one).

 

[NotAGolfer]

Sounds like combat in Pirates!, just one level more complicated and in 3D...

Uhm... ..., Maybe because of stacking different defense bonuses and general customisation? (possibly with unique armor sets that give additional bonuses)?

Since when do you need 3 or 4 layers of clothing to achieve that?