KickStarter Kingdom Come: Deliverance Pre-Release Thread [RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Lyric Suite]

For fucks sake people, watch some MMA, Muay Thai, Boxing or even Judo fights. Train this arts and after a while you will see that from the things that you train you will execute only very few in a tournament and even fewer in a real street fight.

Yeah, except if that was really the case you wouldn't even be able to differentiate between the three. You are also talking shit because any "street" fight between someone trained to fight in any type of martial art ends up with the martial art expert flooring the other person using a formal technique. Youtube is littered with such examples.

Frankly, i think it is a bit of a waste of time to explain why form is superior to human fancy, because the modern mindset always thinks in the cheapest terms possible. It would be like trying to explain why Bach (whose music is highly formal) is superior to any popular music (which is cheap and to the "point" the same way a "street" fight is cheap and to the point). It is impossible to understand that form contains a type of superior wisdom which transcends the understanding of the average scrub who really doesn't know as much as he thinks he does. That is the ultimate practical utility of form. That you can get anyone to conform to a standard which transcends what the individual knows or is even capable of grasping. In an age where martial arts were practiced for purely practical reasons by a large number of people and combat didn't revolve around a select number of genetic freaks battling each other for the entertainment of millions martial arts were all the more important.

With that said, one thing that would be really cool to see but which won't probably be implemented is group formation tactics in large scale fights. Those too meant everything in ancient warfare. Just think of the Macedonian phalanx, where the correct execution of its maneuvers was so vital aged veterans were often seen as more valuable than younger (and thus stronger) but more inexperienced recruits.

 

[Excidium II]

Yeah, except if that was really the case you wouldn't even be able to differentiate between the three. You are also talking shit because any "street" fight between someone trained to fight in any type of martial art ends up with the martial art expert flooring the other person using a formal technique. Youtube is littered with such examples.

Not because of technique but conditioning.

Frankly, i think it is a bit of a waste of time to explain why form is superior to human fancy, because the modern mindset always thinks in the cheapest terms possible. It would be like trying to explain why Bach (whose music is highly formal) is superior to any popular music (which is cheap and to the "point" the same way a "street" fight is cheap and to the point). It is impossible to understand that form contains a type of superior wisdom which transcends the understanding of the average scrub who really doesn't know as much as he thinks he does. That is the ultimate practical utility of form. That you can get anyone to conform to a standard which transcends what the individual knows or is even capable of grasping.

Took far too long but there it is.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Not because of technique but conditioning.

Conditioning in the technique that is.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

There is some confusion going on here, where people are confusing different things. Historically, most "martial arts" have some roots in practical fighting. Most of Japanese arts (Judo, Aikido, etc) and Brasilian Jui Jitsu are off-shoots of Japanese Jui Jitsu, which itself originated in medieval times in Japan, partially as techniques for armed combat, partially as unarmed combat in case you lost/broke your weapon. Boxing, kickboxing and savate have their roots in street fighting in Europe's poor neighborhoods. European wrestling has its roots as a sporting thing back in Ancient Greece and Rome (but it was still functional as the object of those tournaments was to beat the other guy). So to say that the techniques in those arts don't work in real fights is silly. Why would people spend all that time developing and practicing those arts if they had no value other than conditioning? You can just jog and get conditioning that way.

What you guys are referring to is that over time, the practical need for most of these martial arts has gone away. Most people don't go into combat anymore, and in sporting tournaments, there are very specific rules, that don't always encourage the most functional and practical approaches. So there is a giant industry of what's called McDonald's Martial Arts schools everywhere that teach all kinds of crap. Teachers there have tons of students so they just teach them some "forms", fancy looking dance-like movements that look good, but aren't meant to be used in combat. At best, they just build muscle memory for certain types of movements, like a punch or a throw, but a real punch or throw is not going to look that neat and elegant.

However, that doesn't mean those arts are useless. As Lyric Suite said, watch some youtube videos of a trained martial artist against some street punks and you will see. And it's not conditioning (that's part of it, sure), it's mostly technique. Fighting is actually difficult, as the human body is not really meant for it (there are other animals far better at it than us), so if you ever watch an amateur fight, it's just 2 people throwing wild punches, rolling on the ground, a complete mess, but a trained martial artist knows what they are doing, they are throwing accurate punches and kicks without telegraphing them, conserving energy, maintaining balance, defending themselves, etc.

 

[warpig]

Any retard who thinks that "martial arts do not work xD" should go to the nearest martial arts* gym and try to start a fight with one of the guys training there

*doesn't count if it's some kind of "bullshido"

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

Read the last few pages. My view is that athleticism is indeed important and it can make up for a lot however in the end skill beats all. In theory you don't need to practice, but in practice you do. If I am facing someone with a claymore and deadly intent, I want practiced technique first of all.

 

[Xzar]

Will there be cities in this game? Only rural areas so far...

 

[Paul_cz]

Will there be cities in this game? Only rural areas so far...

Afaik two larger towns, but not present in beta build since they don't want to spoil everything in unfinished versions.
Still, they won't likely be huge like Novigrad or something, Prague is not in this game.

 

[Drax]

There's at least a castle/fort as seen in the "trailers".

 

[AN4RCHID]

Someone put together some pretty screenshots here http://honza.mmsoft.cz/KCD/KCD.html

gotta say this game has some of the nicest looking flora I've ever seen in a game

Spoiler

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

This reminds me a little bit of the first Far Cry game, back in 2004-2005. That game was so beautiful for the time, I would just sit and stare at the intro movie, and got killed a few times in the game while watching the vistas and not paying attention to enemies. This might very well happen in KCD too.

 

[Starwars]

This is the only game I can remember where I actually got a feeling of real nature (mostly so in the forested areas) in games. There have been plenty of games with pretty environments but in this it just feels right. I have a friend who's pretty much grown up and lived all her life out in the deep woods and she's never been particularly impressed with the nature in any game I've shown her but even she was wowed by the environs in this.

Hopefully there'll be a good game there also.

 

[Starwars]

Been running around some more in the beta, mainly just doing the hitchhiking thing because I don't want to get spoiled on story and quests (and because voiceacting is rather terrible right now).

-For me, the game kinda fills that void of a beautiful medieval gameworld to run around in, with medieval-ish music playing, with beautiful nature. Kinda like how I *wanted* Oblivion to be when I first saw the screenshots (obviously that's fantasy and this is not but...). It really does feel like you're transported back in time, they've done a really good job with the feels part of the game.

-Large parts of the area are empty, at least right now (not sure what the plan is for final version). On the one hand, it's *so* nice to have an open-world game where you're not attacked every 2 minutes. It's rather noticeable after playing the Witcher 3 for example. It feels way more natural as a gameworld. On the other hand... it's kind of a shame if they're going to have this huge beautiful world, and there'll only be things to actually *do* in the towns and so on. I hope this wonderful world won't feel wasted.

-I've only tried combat very briefly but it's... special. It feels unique and I think it's a pretty good idea. The main bad thing is really that it looks really stiff. If they can improve the feel of it, how it looks, then it could be a real winner.

-It's pretty cool to have a game where shit like alchemy and sharpening your sword is an interactive part of the world. Not something I'd want in every game but it fits well here and does a good job of providing that precious immershun!11

-Like I said, haven't done much in the ways of quests but what little I've seen had a nice feeling of just... starting pretty naturally. No huge exclamation points over NPCs or other obvious clues, and they appear to have different entrypoints. Not 100% on that though.

It feels really damn unpolished right now though. I know the VA is placeholder for now but the writing is kinda iffy in spots as well (and I guess too late in the game to be rewritten now). And there's a ton of small stuff that needs fixing or polishing. Given the scope that the game seems to aim for, it feels a bit worrying since it's not *that* far from release but I hope Warhorse has their shit together. They clearly have something that feels pretty special here so it'd be a shame if they don't manage to deliver all the way.

 

[abnaxus]

 

[Lyric Suite]

What excellent examples?

 

[cvv]

-I've only tried combat very briefly but it's... special. It feels unique and I think it's a pretty good idea. The main bad thing is really that it looks really stiff. If they can improve the feel of it, how it looks, then it could be a real winner.

All animations look kindda stiff. The engine is absolutely awesome for landscape and lightning, KCD is prolly the best looking game ever made, at least in the "realistic", non-stylized cathegory. But characters are just not up to the same standards and I don't think they'll ever will.

As for writing it's a bit strange in places, as if they couldn't decide on the proper style. Sometimes the writers are using phrases and idioms without a 100% firm grasp on the context and the feel of the situation.

Oh well, TW3 set the standard for character design and writing so damn high it's gonna be pretty tough to not lag too far behind, let alone beat, not just for semi-indies like Warhorse but for the entire industry.

 

[Excidium II]

What are those round thingies? Potato?

 

[cvv]

What are those round thingies? Potato?

Potato dumplings, best thing in the known universe.

 

[Excidium II]

 

[Lyric Suite]

I'm pretty sure every item on that table is made out of potatoes lel

 

[vonAchdorf]

I wonder how Vávra will depict religion in his game. He seems to be more of a neo-pagan / atheist. A modern interpretation of Hus would probably emphasize a more nationalist than a religious angle.

 

[MRY]

inb4 "there is no traditional Czech cuisine"

 

[Bubbles]

I wonder how Vávra will depict religion in his game. He seems to be more of a neo-pagan / atheist. A modern interpretation of Hus would probably emphasize a more nationalist than a religious angle.

Vavra's religious affiliation is public knowledge:

 

[cvv]

inb4 "there is no traditional Czech cuisine"

What reason would anyone have to say that? Most central/eastern Yuro cuisines - Czech, Polish, Hungarian, Russian and Bulgarian especially - are very distinctive and traditional. Also quite well known I'd reckon, due to all the Slav immigrants flooding the Teuton world in the 1990s.

 

[vonAchdorf]

Vavra's religious affiliation is public knowledge:

Thanks, and yes, I remember one of his acolytes wearing a "Odin instead of Jesus" shirt in one of the video updates.