Let's talk about Lacrymas' homebrew fantasy setting where paladins are eunuchs

[rusty_shackleford]

Literally from the thing you posted -

In other words, just by looking at the brain scan, or height, of someone plucked at random from the study, researchers would be hard pressed to say whether it came from a man or woman. That suggests both sexes’ brains are far more similar than they are different.

It also plainly says the differences are statistical averages like density of grey matter and thickness of the cortex. How you can take that and interpret it to mean "male brain" is beyond me.

Here was your claim:

There is no such thing as a "male brain"

There is no difference in anatomical structure in the brains of men and women

That is clearly not the reality. There are statistically significant differences. So significant in fact, there was a neural network trained to detect whether a brain was male or female with 93.3% accuracy.
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnins.2019.00185/full

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Ok, since It's weekend and I've got all my answers regarding the setting I can finally say what I think about it.
I appreciate how much effort you've put into thinking everything through but I must say I dislike everything about it. It's basically an anti-fantasy adventuring, which is why Sorcerer's setting which was meant to reverse everything turned out to be very close to classic fantasy.
The entire human population is ruled by a bunch of despotic tyrants, and their brand of despotism is just straight misery. They are mostly concerned with removing any source of unpredictability of excitement from life, regardless it it's good or bad. But they don't got far enough to be exciting.

They make family life less exciting by making sure that every pregnancy is pre-planned. On the other hand their policy isn't that restrictive so they won't drive anyone into despair over family planning. They'll just make it bothersome. They discriminate against the dwarves, but they won't actually try to exterminate them as they don't believe in murder. So don't get excited about saving poor dwarves for pogroms like in Witcher. No tragedy will befall them, they'll just live life of quiet misery.

Same can be applied to every group that had been revealed so far. Paladins aren't brainwashed zealots as it would be somewhat exciting. Instead they are little sheeple casting healing spells whenever church tells them to. And the cycle of punishment against seems to be created just to be as depressing as possible. Can they have sex? Nope, no romance for them. Will they get killed if they brake the wow, will they kill them? Nope, just castrated, then they are expected to carry on with their unexcited eunuch lives. What if they regenerate their penises? Society will shun them. If they don't agree to live depressing lives on their own the society will just make them do it. Barbarian's need to register in a mercenary company which is Anime Adventurer's Guild in anything but name. From everything else I've read about it I'm surprised that not everyone needs to registers in some company and get adventurer's license just to be able to explore a dungeon.

Same goes for the world's economy. There is not enough resources to make lives exciting, but too much to make it desperate like in Dark Sun. It's just enough to justify making everyone's lives as soulless as possible. Seems like some dystopian world created by asshole GM to show players why a world ruled by lawful good characters would be horrible.

Reading through all of it made me realize that there every fantasy setting needs powerful arcane casters since they prevent society like this from forming. An individual who would be sufficiently powerful on his own would either destroy this system or force it to become oppressive in an interesting and exciting way.

 

[Storyfag]

The entire human population is ruled by a bunch of despotic tyrants, and their brand of despotism is just straight misery. They are mostly concerned with removing any source of unpredictability of excitement from life, regardless it it's good or bad. But they don't got far enough to be exciting.

Fucking this. Someone already likened Lacrymas' setting to Demolition Man. And with good reason!

 

[Storyfag]

Reading through all of it made me realize that there every fantasy setting needs powerful arcane casters since they prevent society like this from forming. An individual who would be sufficiently powerful on his own would either destroy this system or force it to become oppressive in an interesting and exciting way.

 

[Lacrymas]

Literally from the thing you posted -

In other words, just by looking at the brain scan, or height, of someone plucked at random from the study, researchers would be hard pressed to say whether it came from a man or woman. That suggests both sexes’ brains are far more similar than they are different.

It also plainly says the differences are statistical averages like density of grey matter and thickness of the cortex. How you can take that and interpret it to mean "male brain" is beyond me.

Here was your claim:

There is no such thing as a "male brain"

There is no difference in anatomical structure in the brains of men and women

That is clearly not the reality. There are statistically significant differences. So significant in fact, there was a neural network trained to detect whether a brain was male or female with 93.3% accuracy.
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnins.2019.00185/full

You are citing me out of context, I said the differences are statistical averages. By anatomical structure I mean there are no anatomically distinct structures, as in structures that men have or women don't for example. And since statistical averages exist, of course super advanced neuroimaging can detect micrometer differences (only 93% of the time), if that study isn't tainted from birth because it's from China. This of course doesn't tell us how these differences affect us and how that's possible, so this is moot in of itself, it needs more studies.

This is off-topic, however, and I don't wish to continue.

Ok, since It's weekend and I've got all my answers regarding the setting I can finally say what I think about it.
I appreciate how much effort you've put into thinking everything through but I must say I dislike everything about it. It's basically an anti-fantasy adventuring, which is why Sorcerer's setting which was meant to reverse everything turned out to be very close to classic fantasy.
The entire human population is ruled by a bunch of despotic tyrants, and their brand of despotism is just straight misery. They are mostly concerned with removing any source of unpredictability of excitement from life, regardless it it's good or bad. But they don't got far enough to be exciting.

They make family life less exciting by making sure that every pregnancy is pre-planned. On the other hand their policy isn't that restrictive so they won't drive anyone into despair over family planning. They'll just make it bothersome. They discriminate against the dwarves, but they won't actually try to exterminate them as they don't believe in murder. So don't get excited about saving poor dwarves for pogroms like in Witcher. No tragedy will befall them, they'll just live life of quiet misery.

Same can be applied to every group that had been revealed so far. Paladins aren't brainwashed zealots as it would be somewhat exciting. Instead they are little sheeple casting healing spells whenever church tells them to. And the cycle of punishment against seems to be created just to be as depressing as possible. Can they have sex? Nope, no romance for them. Will they get killed if they brake the wow, will they kill them? Nope, just castrated, then they are expected to carry on with their unexcited eunuch lives. What if they regenerate their penises? Society will shun them. If they don't agree to live depressing lives on their own the society will just make them do it. Barbarian's need to register in a mercenary company which is Anime Adventurer's Guild in anything but name. From everything else I've read about it I'm surprised that not everyone needs to registers in some company and get adventurer's license just to be able to explore a dungeon.

Same goes for the world's economy. There is not enough resources to make lives exciting, but too much to make it desperate like in Dark Sun. It's just enough to justify making everyone's lives as soulless as possible. Seems like some dystopian world created by asshole GM to show players why a world ruled by lawful good characters would be horrible.

Reading through all of it made me realize that there every fantasy setting needs powerful arcane casters since they prevent society like this from forming. An individual who would be sufficiently powerful on his own would either destroy this system or force it to become oppressive in an interesting and exciting way.

But this seems more like real life than anything else. Also, the official stance of the churches regarding anyone doesn't mean there won't be tragedies. It actually is great kindling for tragedy. Let's take the dwarves and halflings, the church has nothing against them in theory and doesn't have official discrimination policies, in the cultural landscape however they are treated as a bad omen. Just like the governments technically don't have discrimination policies against the blacks and gays for example. However, that doesn't stop people from creatively interpreting cultural traits and segregating them in ghettos/not hiring them in the case of the blacks, or outright killing or torturing them in the case of the gays. In the case of the paladins, it can lead to personal tragedy or large scale rebellion, Alan Turing killed himself after he got chemically castrated for daring to be gay, his status as a war hero be damned. I purposefully built this setting with this in mind because it's much closer to real life and how I view RPG parties, a group of individuals with their own personalities. They can get embroiled in large-scale conflicts, but it's not the meat and potatoes of RPGs.

Also, barbarians don't "register in an adventuring guild", they go there to find solidarity and channel their feelings of anger into combat effectiveness. They are just expected to be mercenaries or adventurers after that to keep the sisterhood from falling apart due to lack of resources.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

if that study isn't tainted from birth because it's from China.

fucking lol
"i-i-it's from a country where they aren't fired for not pretending women and men are identical! it's tainted!"
get fucked

 

[Lacrymas]

if that study isn't tainted from birth because it's from China.

fucking lol
"i-i-it's from a country where they aren't fired for not pretending women and men are identical! it's tainted!"
get fucked

You wish to tell me such an ideologically-charged country which forcefully tries to keep men and women in different roles doesn't have a vested interest in preserving their ideology by any means necessary? Also, I said IF it isn't tainted.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

if that study isn't tainted from birth because it's from China.

fucking lol
"i-i-it's from a country where they aren't fired for not pretending women and men are identical! it's tainted!"
get fucked

You wish to tell me such an ideologically-charged country which forcefully distinguishes men from women doesn't have a vested interest in preserving their ideology by any means necessary? Also, I said IF it isn't tainted.

"this country follows basic biology, its results are tainted!"
absolute clown world

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

But this seems more like real life than anything else.

It seems like taking the worst part of real life and making them into a fantasy setting.

Also, the official stance of the churches regarding anyone doesn't mean there won't be tragedies. It actually is great kindling for tragedy. Let's take the dwarves and halflings, the church has nothing against them in theory and don't have official discrimination policies, in the cultural landscape however they are treated as a bad omen. Just like the governments technically don't have discrimination policies against the blacks and gays for example. However, that doesn't stop people from creatively interpreting cultural traits and segregating them in ghettos/not hiring them in the case of the blacks, or outright killing or torturing them in the case of the gays.

The mind-frame behind this setting is the exact opposite of how fantasy world-building usually works. At the best circumstances the discrimination against the dwarves can get as eventful as it is in real life in XXI century. When fantasy gets inspiration from real-life social issue it usually makes it much more eventful and for the lack of better word "epic".
So in this word a dwarf might not get hired because of the prejudice. Sometimes someone might even kill him. But it won't happen, since as you've said before there is a huge stigma against killing. That's about as exciting as the first world country in the XXI century. But in addition to that you have ISIS which was hell-bent on exterminating homosexuals, or some African countries where blacks which are majority murder white farmers.
From what I see the setting lacks these more colorful aspects of discrimination.
Take Witcher for example. There Dwarves are discriminated because of how they look as well, but it's far more interesting than just some souless monolithic organization keeping them down (but usually not too much).
First of all, they aren't commonly discriminated and there are many people who openly accept them. Pogroms are common and in the games players have an opportunity to stop them. Anti-human terrorist organizations recruit them as soldiers and political powers try to buy their loyalty by promising them better, more equal society.
That's much more true to life and exciting than what I see here. I'd like the setting much more if some churches wanted to mercilessly exterminate all the dwarves while others embraced them. Which would of course sometimes spark religious wars. I just don't get why enforce this mild oppression everywhere. It's so much better to be hunted by 1d10 anti-hobbit inquisitors rather than get paid 20% less for a quest because quest-giver is prejudiced.

In the case of the paladins, it can lead to personal tragedy or large scale rebellion, Alan Turing killed himself after he got chemically castrated for daring to be gay, his status as a war hero be damned. I purposefully built this setting with this in mind because it's much closer to real life and how I view RPG parties, a group of individuals with their own personalities. They can get embroiled in large-scale conflicts, but it's not the meat and potatoes of RPGs.

It is a tragedy but It's possibly the least exciting form of tragedy. I can't really imagine anyone being hyped about the setting where depressed paladins kill themselves after being castrated.

 

[Lacrymas]

There are different civilizations than this one, though, I already mentioned the necromantic desert-dwelling orcs, and the nomadic bandit camps in which deviancy from the cultural norms are more common (a lot of dwarves, halflings, prostitutes, those with creative tastes in sexual partners, etc). I'm not saying the bandit camps are free from discrimination, these things tend to live in people, but it's easier to be deviant. The discrimination is also not video game-y as in 20% less reward from a quest. In the one-shot (for which we are still missing 1 person), dwarves and halflings don't get weapons or healing potions from the start, so they are more of a burden on the party, i.e. they either go without weapons and potions, making them less effective in combat, or the party shares their preciously few weapons and healing potions with them.

As for different groups, this civilization is not as monolithic as it seems, there are frequent theological disputes between the churches because of their often conflicting domains and interpretations for example, this tends to create in-group factions. There are also other important institutions, like the military and merchants.

 

[Reinhardt]

Reading through all of it made me realize that there every fantasy setting needs powerful arcane casters

so you can raid their towers, beat their asses and steal they magic equip.

 

[Reinhardt]

Also, barbarians don't "register in an adventuring guild", they go there to find solidarity and channel their feelings of anger into combat effectiveness. They are just expected to be mercenaries or adventurers after that to keep the sisterhood from falling apart due to lack of resources.

That's exactly what was said to you - they go there to find solidarity but instead they must work their asses for "sisterhood" or their "sisters" will hunt them down. Misery for the sake of misery.

 

[Lacrymas]

But they know this before they join, it's their choice to commit. It's like freely joining the military and then complaining you get sent to war and treated badly if you desert.

 

[Storyfag]

Reading through all of it made me realize that there every fantasy setting needs powerful arcane casters

so you can raid their towers, beat their asses and steal they magic equip.

That too is a valid argument for the existance of wizards. I am sure ERYFKRAD will back me up on this one.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

There are different civilizations than this one, though, I already mentioned the necromantic desert-dwelling orcs, and the nomadic bandit camps in which deviancy from the cultural norms are more common (a lot of dwarves, halflings, prostitutes, those with creative tastes in sexual partners, etc). I'm not saying the bandit camps are free from discrimination, these things tend to live in people, but it's easier to be deviant.

I can't really comment on these other civilizations since little was written about them. It's possible that the setting is actually pretty decent, but I can only comment on what I've read here. A game where all players are orcs and clerics serve as enemies would probably be better than what I've read. But I just wanted to make a comment on what was posted so I guess everything I wrote only applies to human cities.

The discrimination is also not video game-y as in 20% less reward from a quest.

That was just a joke/reference to pay-gap.

In the one-shot (for which we are still missing 1 person), dwarves and halflings don't get weapons or healing potions from the start, so they are more of a burden on the party, i.e. they either go without them, making them less effective in combat, or the party shares their preciously few weapons and healing potion with them.

That's more of the things that bother me. Things are just bad enough to be bothersome, but not bad enough to be exciting.
Take WFRPG second edition. One sourcebook allows you to play as a man from Norska. As such you have a chance of starting the game with random mutation. That can be third eye on your hand or having a tentacle instead of an arm. So when you are in a civilized area you have to take care to always hide it since if people find out you might just get killed. I find it to be much more interesting form of discrimination than starting less items.

 

[Bara]

Reading through all of it made me realize that there every fantasy setting needs powerful arcane casters

so you can raid their towers, beat their asses and steal they magic equip.

Or just maybe hang out with like a bro...

 

[Lacrymas]

That's more of the things that bother me. Things are just bad enough to be bothersome, but not bad enough to be exciting.
Take WFRPG second edition. One sourcebook allows you to play as a man from Norska. As such you have a chance of starting the game with random mutation. That can be third eye on your hand or having a tentacle instead of an arm. So when you are in a civilized area you have to take care to always hide it since if people find out you might just get killed. I find it to be much more interesting form of discrimination than starting less items.

Oh, you will feel the discrimination constantly. It was just one example from a one-shot which doesn't contain a lot of content due to its nature as a one-shot. I don't plan on it being only a minor inconvenience at the start.

 

[Zombra]

But this seems more like real life than anything else.

There are a lot of neat ideas in this setting. The revelation that one of your fundamental goals is to make it "like real life" is vastly disappointing.

 

[Lacrymas]

It isn't a fundamental goal to make it like real life, but it is inspired by real life. The fundamental goal was to create a setting without arcane magic in a way that makes sense and as if real people live here and make real decisions that support and encourage roleplaying and are based on the happenings around them. Like I said in the beginning, I wanted discrimination and debatable societal norms which can realistically happen. Massacring dwarves en masse is more sociopathic than what would happen in real life, Nazis and gas chambers notwithstanding.

It is also a reaction against what I see in tabletop sessions, the roleplaying is mostly "quirky" characters doing "quirky" things because we don't get into situations which would require decision making and discussion based on characterization. At most we get to decide whether to kill or not to kill something, which is ultimately boring to me. It also requires extremes in character concepts. The-guy-who-I-thought-was-my-boyfriend's current Pathfinder character is literally a sociopath who can't function if he doesn't do evil acts because his brother has programmed him or some such and now he's trying to shake off that programming. This is ridiculous and pointless. It's roleplaying in a vacuum, pure theory.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

so does your setting have druids?

 

[Bara]

Lacy setting has druids and they're pretty much another arm of the theocracy meant to make the land some what more fertile to support a population.

Really though being apart of the church the should just be clerics with the nature sub-domain or such.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

this is such a terrible setting for D&D because basically any class with magic will break it

 

[Lacrymas]

Even though my intention is to create my own RPG system in the end, I have decreed no summoned things provide sustenance in any way when we play D&D in this setting.

Lacy setting has druids and they're pretty much another arm of the theocracy meant to make the land some what more fertile to support a population.

Really though being apart of the church the should just be clerics with the nature sub-domain or such.

They are recognized as simply priests in-setting, they just have different powers than the other 2 churches. There is no confusion because only men can be Druids, so male priest = druid powers.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Reading through all of it made me realize that there every fantasy setting needs powerful arcane casters

so you can raid their towers, beat their asses and steal they magic equip.

Or just maybe hang out with like a bro...

My point wasn't that player won't feel oppressed. I get that constant feeling of oppression is a given in a setting where castration is a common punishment for the best healers around. What I was trying to say is that oppression doesn't feel exciting compared to other fantasy setting that decided to incorporate real-life racism into the setting like WFRP, Witcher and Dragon Age where prejudice takes a bit more extreme forms.

EDIT:

Massacring dwarves en masse is more sociopathic than what would happen in real life, Nazis and gas chambers notwithstanding.

Pogroms and other massacres of undesirables are a real thing.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

No summoned thing?
Ok.
http://5e.d20srd.org/srd/spells/plantGrowth.htm