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Esquilax

Arcane
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
4,833
Rip limbs off enemies awesome. Then perhaps calamitously slip on the bloody floor and knock himself out. The Dragon's agility is really too low to be a superb warrior on physical stats alone, though I think all of you continue to forget that I emphasized that techniques were important.

No, that wasn't forgotten. Stuff like the Artistic skill allows us to understand the relationship between calligraphy and swordplay, so a smart guy who isn't a physical specimen can compensate through superior technique and he'll then obtain better overall abilities than a brute who is a freak of nature who hasn't refined his art of war.

It's sort of like how a great fighter in MMA or boxing might neutralize his opponent through skill or strategy (i.e. Ali tiring George Foreman out in their fight).
 

treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
Rip limbs off enemies awesome. Then perhaps calamitously slip on the bloody floor and knock himself out. The Dragon's agility is really too low to be a superb warrior on physical stats alone, though I think all of you continue to forget that I emphasized that techniques were important.

No, that wasn't forgotten. Stuff like the Artistic skill allows us to understand the relationship between calligraphy and swordplay, so a smart guy who isn't a physical specimen can compensate through superior technique and he'll then obtain better overall abilities than a brute who is a freak of nature who hasn't refined his art of war.

Then... there shouldn't be an issue with the Dragon-Rabbit or even the plain Rabbit, no? They might not be a world-beater, but they can handle themselves.

Well, no matter. I'll start when you guys get tired of flopping. :D
 

Tigranes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
10,350
Actually, guys, guys. Screw the fucking Dragon. The Dragon's dump stat is Agility, right? Consider:

Qinggong (Light Body Skill)
The ability to perform impossible acrobatics, glide across water, and leap across rooftops in a single bound. Those with high levels of this skill will be able to move as lightly as a feather and dance around their enemies’ blows. (AGI)

There will be no jumping leaping cartwheel rolling weapon swinging kickass dude with the Dragon. Abort now.

We've been focusing too much on treave's descriptions of each combination, we need also to take into account the skills we want to grow - because what matters is also how we want to develop the character.

Which skills do we want the most? I'm thinking Pressure Points (PER), Drinking (END), Speech (CHA), Qinggong (AGI) are a pretty good selection of the kinds of things Codexians will want. Both the Tiger and Rabbit are pretty good at all of those, in fact just about every sign is decent all-round except the Dragon has the AGI dump stat.

My ideal is a nimble acrobatic (Qinggong AGI) fighter with some good weapon skills (STR) which lends itself to Sword & Unarmed (STR+AGI) fighting - since we picked the Adjutant I'm less inclined to go with a stealthy Traps / Pressure Points / Bow / etc type. All that means the Tiger...
 

treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
What the fuck, roll is back? I didn't know that.

Rolling between Dragon and Rabbit.

1-3 Dragon, 4 Dragon-Rabbit, 5-7 Rabbit. :rpgcodex:

Or maybe we'll just roll for all the signs.

1-2 Rat, 3-4 Ox, 5-6 Tiger, 7-8 Rabbit, 9-10 Dragon, 10-11 Snake, 11-12 Horse, 13-14 Goat, 15-16 Monkey, 17-18 Rooster, 19-20 Dog, 21-22 Pig.
 

Smashing Axe

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Messages
2,835
Divinity: Original Sin
You bastards better not cost me the Rabbit-Dragon.

New preference vote: Rabbit-Dragon > Rabbit > Cat

Going to edit original post.
 
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Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
Voting Dragon-Rabbit. Do it. Failing that, I'd vote Dog.
 
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Ifeex

Augur
Joined
Aug 31, 2013
Messages
189
Still voting for Dragon. Unless Tiger can win, then I'm voting for it.
 
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
2,951
Wait, we can make preferential votes now? Ok then, in my order of preference:

1. Rat (nice perception, intelligence and agility - my favourite stats, not bad physically, bad luck but not actually cursed, plus I like curiosity as a character trait)
2. Monkey (stats similar to rat, but slightly worse luck that could be really, really bad when combined with trickster attitude)

Since these two don't stand a chance, there's also:

3. Tiger (again, very bad luck and doesn't really stand out in the brains department)
4. Dragon (I really don't like that low agility)
 

treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
Yeah, you're free to let me know your preference, and I'll try to accommodate unless the conditions get too complicated.

The Dragon-Rabbit Support Group now has 3 votes. Can this unholy hybrid win on its own merit, or will the Dragon prevail?
 

treave

Arcane
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Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
On Inner Strength

"Neigong, or inner strength, is what allows martial artists to perform the wondrous feats that they do. Every person possesses qi, their natural energy - some have are born with more than others, though there are also man-made ways to increase a person's capacity. Learning how to channel this energy is the practice of inner strength. There are various inner strength practices and techniques used to achieve mastery over qi. Qi itself can be divided into two main type: Yin or Yang. Although every person is born with both types of qi, they will usually have a naturally dominant type; either yin or yang.

Yin is slow, soft, yielding, flowing, cold and passive. A snake, or a rabbit, or a goat, can be symbols of yin.
Yang is fast, hard, focused, rigid, hot and aggressive. A dragon, or a tiger, or an dog, can be symbols of yang.

A person's natural qi can be changed via the practice of inner strength techniques. Even if they may be more inclined towards yang, with the proper teachings and effort, they can cultivate a strong yin energy. However, it is almost impossible for a person to maintain a strong presence of both yin and yang within his body - this can lead to the practitioner going berserk. Thus, most inner strength techniques will elevate one type of qi while reducing the other at the same time.

There are also more advanced inner strength techniques that allow the practitioner to incorporate various traits into their qi. Poison, ice and fire are just some of the elements that can be introduced. For example, a skilled master of poisons can gradually incorporate toxins into his qi until his techniques are lethally poisonous. Similarly, some forms of meditation may help form a chilly or fiery qi, which augments the master's attacks. Besides that, inner strength techniques can be used to improve physical performance. By mastering certain techniques, a practitioner can channel his qi into allowing him to move faster and hit harder.

Finally, qi can be transferred from one person to another. This allows restoration of internal damage - healing a person's meridians and purging of poisons, for example. Some master physicians have also developed healing qi, used specifically for its curative effect. Transfer of qi can also be used to strengthen another person - indeed, there are esoteric techniques that specialize in draining an opponent's inner strength and making it the practitioner's own. However, each person's qi is distinctive and any transfer should be approached with care. Should there be incompatibilities beween the two, it may lead to the receiver going berserk or even dying due to the clash of internal energies.

That will be all for our lectures today, Your Highness. There will be a test on this in a fortnight."

As the aged teacher rolls up his scrolls - each depicted a different view of the human body, and mapped out the pressure points in black ink - he bows deeply to the Crown Prince. His eyes flicker towards you, giving you a quick nod of acknowledgement. You bow your head in return. As your teacher walks out of the room that has been set aside for your studies within the bowels of the Imperial Palace, the Crown Prince gives the back of your chair a kick. You turn to look at his smiling face; by all that is proper, he should be sitting in front of you, but the Prince has never been too concerned with propriety. He claims that he focuses better in the back. Well, you know better.

"Pack the books away," he grins, "Did you forget? It's time for the rematch with the chambermaids."
 
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ScubaV

Prophet
Joined
Feb 20, 2011
Messages
1,022
Codex, I am disappoint. Screw your rabbits and your dragons, I don't want you to have either. Flopping to Tiger. Ifeex, let's do this.
 

Smashing Axe

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Messages
2,835
Divinity: Original Sin
Those of you who expressed support for the Rabbit-Dragon, rally! Change your vote to Rabbit-Dragon so we may have the most tsundere martial artist that ever did tsundere. Also, the luck contrast is kind of awesome. We're fate's bitch, but it's not all bad.
 

Jester

Arbiter
Joined
Mar 24, 2013
Messages
1,493
Come on ape is most awesome look at Treaves, good stats and interesting personality.
Rat and Pig are interesting to.

But if i have to chose rabbit/tiger/dragon will choose rabbit.
Tiger have very boring personality and dragon will not scale into late game judging from Treave words about skills.
 

treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
Kashmir - Snake
Lambchop - Tiger
Stygian - Snake/Tiger
Baltika - Tiger
Kipeci - Tiger
Storyfag - Dragon
Azira - Rabbit
Xenomorph - Tiger
Esquilax - Tiger
m4davis - Rabbit
ScubaV - Tiger
Tigranes - Tiger
Smashing Axe - Drabbit/Rabbit
Bloodshifter - Rabbit
Zero Credibility - Rat/Monkey/Tiger/Dragon
Oscar - Horse
TOME - Rabbit
Nevill - Rabbit
root - Dragon
Ifeex - Dragon/Tiger
TBS - Dragon
Absinthe - Drabbit/Dog
Nim - Drabbit
Jester - Monkey/Rat/Pig/Rabbit
ERYFKRAD - Tiger
Boxer - Tiger

Uh, right, hope I haven't missed out anyone this time. From my interpretation of the preferences, I think Tiger has the advantage thus far. Then again there's still the stray snake and horse, so I'm not sure what to make of their votes. It could easily swing to any of the leading three.

Tiger - 12
Rabbit - 7
Dragon - 3
Snake - 1
Horse - 1
Drabbit - 2
 
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Esquilax

Arcane
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
4,833
Then... there shouldn't be an issue with the Dragon-Rabbit or even the plain Rabbit, no? They might not be a world-beater, but they can handle themselves.

Physical abilities still matter. If you're weak, uncoordinated and you get knocked down by a stiff breeze, Mike Tyson is going to stomp the shit out of you no matter what the fuck you do (note: Tyson was also a very clever fighter as well). The Dragon-Rabbit is clumsy, smart, perceptive, and average at strength and endurance; regular Dragon is just as smart and perceptive, but significantly stronger as well. So your regular Dragon is a better bet in a fight.

And I just find the personality annoying. Well, actually it's mostly that. I guess a charismatic character like the Dragon-Rabbit could make his enemies mad through taunting? I dunno...

Anyways, here's Mike Tyson giving a lesson on the art of war. I think this is pretty relevant:

 

Nevill

Arcane
Joined
Jun 6, 2009
Messages
11,211
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Guys, come on!

Baltika9 said:
I'm still going for a pure dragon over the hybrid, purely on the grounds that the stat soup doesn't sit well with me. Still, I don't have anything against it winning.
Baltika9, you are the one who channeled the Drabbit into existence. What can Dragon do that Drabbit can not do better? You wanted to sass people? Well, now you can sass them, disarm them with your charming smile, and sass them again, for double effect.

He is also somewhat sturdier than an ordinary Rabbit and can take care of himself, so no pacifist runs.

Esquilax said:
I just can't justify playing a moody tsundere who can't fight his way out of a paper bag in a martial arts LP. I want a dude who can fight at least a little bit, yet we're going for Lord Byron, complete with the brooding disposition and the club foot.

I want a badass fighter, luck be damned.
Esquilax, didn't you find the idea of bipolar luck fascinating? To me it sounds like someone who takes his misfortune and forges his own luck out of it - sort of 'loses a battle, wins a war'. Does it not appeal to you?

He sounds like a kind of a fighter that accidentally slips in combat and finds several enemies on his sword when he gets up.

And Drabbit is no helpless moody tsundere. Where did you get the brooding part? He may not like fighting, but should you find yourself on his bad side, he'll carve your eyes out with a rusty spoon.

Tigranes said:
Which skills do we want the most? I'm thinking Pressure Points (PER), Drinking (END), Speech (CHA), Qinggong (AGI) are a pretty good selection of the kinds of things Codexians will want. Both the Tiger and Rabbit are pretty good at all of those, in fact just about every sign is decent all-round except the Dragon has the AGI dump stat.
I'd say, Pressure Points and Speech are the most important and can get you out of many tricky situations.

Azira said:
I WANNA BE A DRABBIT!
Storyfag said:
Drabbit sounds awesome! Moar plox?
Guys, are those votes, or no? It does not just sound awesome, it IS awesome!

treave said:
Uh, right, hope I haven't missed out anyone this time.
Drabbit supporters number four already:
Smashing Axe
Absinthe
Nim
Nevill

And I hope he gets more popular. He may not end up as a destroyer of worlds, but it will be tons of FUN.

Those of you who chose Rabbit OR Dragon, join us! Remember the reasons why you did so, and ask yourselves whether you are not going to benefit from the new choice. The Drabbit is going to be twice as entertaining as a Dragon and a Rabbit by themselves.
 
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