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- Thread starter treave
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a cut of domestic sheep prime
Guest
Let's just hope the strategist is quick thinking and quick with the commands. And at the same time, the players need to be quick on their responds to the commands, and have enough self-control to not do anything without being told to...
D'you guys think Xu Jing fits the latter bill?
D'you guys think Xu Jing fits the latter bill?
Kz3r0
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Perfect, the best choice then.
Nevill
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He is far less impulsive than Yunzi.
He might see a move that would work better even though a strategist did not notice it, but if he knows that he can be disqualified for it, I think he'll suppress the urge. The people depend on us, y'know?
We have a hand that possesses an instinct of its own, but it is still our choice whether to give in to it or not... as far as I understood.
Absinthe
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In a real sword fight, those reflexes are great, but here, when we should only follow orders, they'd just screw us over. Jing should not be fighting. Let Armaiti handle it.
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Akkudakku
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B
TEAM
I II III VIII
TACTICAN
X>V I
TACTICAL STRATAGEM
BATTLE MEDITATION WQS
So Bai is still on our side. Also she is smart. If Jing is the strategist and uses WQS to 'sense' the battle then he has almost sure chances at victory.
TEAM
TACTICAN
TACTICAL STRATAGEM
So Bai is still on our side. Also she is smart. If Jing is the strategist and uses WQS to 'sense' the battle then he has almost sure chances at victory.
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a cut of domestic sheep prime
Guest
That's a good question...He is far less impulsive than Yunzi.
He might see a move that would work better even though a strategist did not notice it, but if he knows that he can be disqualified for it, I think he'll suppress the urge. The people depend on us, y'know?
We have a hand that possesses an instinct of its own, but it is still our choice whether to give in to it or not... as far as I understood.
Nevill
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Alright. Jester have covered our choice of tacticians pretty accurately.
I think Jing and Xuezi make for the best tacticians with some drawbacks. They both are the most experienced fighters in our group. Jing is perceptive, creative and adaptive, with a penchant for cheating, which may help him trick his opponents and recognize and react to their traps and feints. He may, for example, purposefully jumble an order or two to give our team some leeway to act on their own accord, if the situation demands it. He also has had a pretty good look into Huashan swordsmanship, both from his exertions with Bai and the Twins, and from Bai's lessons from before, so he should know what he is up against. He is sociable and knows what works for people and what doesn't, since he had to juggle the moods of his crew for the better part of a year now. He can be a pretty good teacher and instructor, too, as we've been spreading the knowledge of our martial arts left and right, from our own team to Qi Liuwu and Bai Jiutian.
He is more of a direct action guy, but there is a matter of his arm that acts without him even thinking about it. Do we want to risk it? His skill easily surpasses everyone else's in our group, but his creatibity would be a bit wasted if he only had to follow someone else's command.
We know little about Xuezi except that she is a walking library of martial arts. It seems that she can teach people, too - if they are bright enough to grasp what she is telling them. She is not the most tactful person and has a bit of a temper/patience issue if things do not go her way. Apparently, Madam Nie is of an opinion that she could dupe her, given enough time, though thankfully, we didn't get to see if it is actually correct. She is prone to overestimating her capabilities - but that's a thing she has in common with Jing. She is good at recognizing feints, though:
As for our fighters, we have several options here.
We can look for personal synergies in a team, though it is a open question if it would be helpful here - since the actions of the duelists are controlled by the tacticial, they can't help each other even if they wanted to unless given the order. We can look for synergies with the opponents if we think they can be provoked into acting ontheir own - and I am looking at Wuxing here, since Bai is almost impossible to throw off her game (unless we strip her, then all bets are off). We can look at personal skill that would help with execution of tactician's commands, as they can only provide guidelines, not solutions, and finally, we can look at personal experience and suitability for this type of combat.
The contenders are:
Xuezi + (Yunzi, Armaiti and Jing)
Pros: Our elite melee fighters that can do wonders if they get at close range, and work very well together. They sport a variety of very powerful techniques Xuezi can utilize to overwhelm the opposition.
Cons: Yunzi is too impulsive and willful to follow someone's else commands when there is a better and more efficient way of doing things. Patience, humility and self-control are not her virtues. Jing as a fighter can be as much a liability as he can be an asset.
Xuezi + (Jing and the Twins)
Pros: The team understands well what they are fighting against, and have had experience with being led. The fighters are also motivated to give it their best.
Cons: The skills of the team of the disciples is bound to be lower than the one of the masters they learned from. The above point about Jing applies.
Misc: The twins might be reluctant to oppose their father and shixiong - or they might feel even more confident than usual, seeing how they are fighting for their independence from the parents and facing someone they've practiced before.
Xuezi + (Jing, Yifang and Lingshu)
Pros: An extremely skilled and close-knit sword-team sporting two legendary blades. Everything Elfberserker have mentioned in his post.
Cons: No prior experience with this type of combat on the part of the Justice League. The above point about Jing applies.
Jing + (Yifang + Lingshu + Armaiti)
Pros: This is a balanced melee/sword offense/defense team that trusts us completely and would follow our orders to the letter. We know their full arsenal of techniques, so our tactical options are richer.
Cons: Can't think of many not common to the other teams.
Jing + (Twins + Lingshu)
Pros: Same as in the team with Xuezi and the Twins. The girls have decided to put their trust in us, and we are taking a part in trying to bail them out of a mess we involved them in, so I expect us to work together just fine. Lingshu has a similar past, as a runaway daughter of the (late) sect head, so I think the girls have some common ground for building a friendship. She can show them what they can achieve without the influence of their sect backing them up. On the Nie side, Wuxing seems to underestimate and look down on Lingshu. She might surprise him.
Cons: The team is much more dependent on the strategy than on individual skills.
Misc: We know weak points of the opposing combatants - Wuxing is a henpecked husband obsessed with his public image, Bai is a girl and Minyue is a false disciple of the Saint, so we might have something dirty up our sleeve to distract the opponents if we have to. There is also the fact that Bai was the one who sent Miss Lingshu towards the path she is following now (together with Man Tiger Pig, no less), so if Wuxing has to blame someone for giving his daughters a 'bad' example, it would be her.
I think we have to get involved one way or the other. Personally, I prefer the last combination, as I think we can be of better help as a tactician, and it is the Twins' fight to win or lose. Any comments would be much appreciated.
I think Jing and Xuezi make for the best tacticians with some drawbacks. They both are the most experienced fighters in our group. Jing is perceptive, creative and adaptive, with a penchant for cheating, which may help him trick his opponents and recognize and react to their traps and feints. He may, for example, purposefully jumble an order or two to give our team some leeway to act on their own accord, if the situation demands it. He also has had a pretty good look into Huashan swordsmanship, both from his exertions with Bai and the Twins, and from Bai's lessons from before, so he should know what he is up against. He is sociable and knows what works for people and what doesn't, since he had to juggle the moods of his crew for the better part of a year now. He can be a pretty good teacher and instructor, too, as we've been spreading the knowledge of our martial arts left and right, from our own team to Qi Liuwu and Bai Jiutian.
He is more of a direct action guy, but there is a matter of his arm that acts without him even thinking about it. Do we want to risk it? His skill easily surpasses everyone else's in our group, but his creatibity would be a bit wasted if he only had to follow someone else's command.
We know little about Xuezi except that she is a walking library of martial arts. It seems that she can teach people, too - if they are bright enough to grasp what she is telling them. She is not the most tactful person and has a bit of a temper/patience issue if things do not go her way. Apparently, Madam Nie is of an opinion that she could dupe her, given enough time, though thankfully, we didn't get to see if it is actually correct. She is prone to overestimating her capabilities - but that's a thing she has in common with Jing. She is good at recognizing feints, though:
It is unknown if she learned some actual strategy at any point in time. I have no doubt she can guide a single person through combat, but a team of them? She is used to be the most powerful being and doing everything alone. She is also not a chess-, pardon, weiqi-master, and she isn't much of a plotter, seeing how she never saw the betrayal of her own people coming.Masters of Shaolin II said:
As for our fighters, we have several options here.
We can look for personal synergies in a team, though it is a open question if it would be helpful here - since the actions of the duelists are controlled by the tacticial, they can't help each other even if they wanted to unless given the order. We can look for synergies with the opponents if we think they can be provoked into acting ontheir own - and I am looking at Wuxing here, since Bai is almost impossible to throw off her game (unless we strip her, then all bets are off). We can look at personal skill that would help with execution of tactician's commands, as they can only provide guidelines, not solutions, and finally, we can look at personal experience and suitability for this type of combat.
The contenders are:
Xuezi + (Yunzi, Armaiti and Jing)
Pros: Our elite melee fighters that can do wonders if they get at close range, and work very well together. They sport a variety of very powerful techniques Xuezi can utilize to overwhelm the opposition.
Cons: Yunzi is too impulsive and willful to follow someone's else commands when there is a better and more efficient way of doing things. Patience, humility and self-control are not her virtues. Jing as a fighter can be as much a liability as he can be an asset.
Xuezi + (Jing and the Twins)
Pros: The team understands well what they are fighting against, and have had experience with being led. The fighters are also motivated to give it their best.
Cons: The skills of the team of the disciples is bound to be lower than the one of the masters they learned from. The above point about Jing applies.
Misc: The twins might be reluctant to oppose their father and shixiong - or they might feel even more confident than usual, seeing how they are fighting for their independence from the parents and facing someone they've practiced before.
Xuezi + (Jing, Yifang and Lingshu)
Pros: An extremely skilled and close-knit sword-team sporting two legendary blades. Everything Elfberserker have mentioned in his post.
Cons: No prior experience with this type of combat on the part of the Justice League. The above point about Jing applies.
Jing + (Yifang + Lingshu + Armaiti)
Pros: This is a balanced melee/sword offense/defense team that trusts us completely and would follow our orders to the letter. We know their full arsenal of techniques, so our tactical options are richer.
Cons: Can't think of many not common to the other teams.
Jing + (Twins + Lingshu)
Pros: Same as in the team with Xuezi and the Twins. The girls have decided to put their trust in us, and we are taking a part in trying to bail them out of a mess we involved them in, so I expect us to work together just fine. Lingshu has a similar past, as a runaway daughter of the (late) sect head, so I think the girls have some common ground for building a friendship. She can show them what they can achieve without the influence of their sect backing them up. On the Nie side, Wuxing seems to underestimate and look down on Lingshu. She might surprise him.
Cons: The team is much more dependent on the strategy than on individual skills.
Misc: We know weak points of the opposing combatants - Wuxing is a henpecked husband obsessed with his public image, Bai is a girl and Minyue is a false disciple of the Saint, so we might have something dirty up our sleeve to distract the opponents if we have to. There is also the fact that Bai was the one who sent Miss Lingshu towards the path she is following now (together with Man Tiger Pig, no less), so if Wuxing has to blame someone for giving his daughters a 'bad' example, it would be her.
I think we have to get involved one way or the other. Personally, I prefer the last combination, as I think we can be of better help as a tactician, and it is the Twins' fight to win or lose. Any comments would be much appreciated.
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Akkudakku
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I will reiterate. The last combo has the added benefit of WQS used to see through enemies strategy that you seem to have overlooked guys.
Also I believe that Xuezi is a shitty strategist - she is used to kicking ass on her own using her overpowered strength and brute force.
Also I believe that Xuezi is a shitty strategist - she is used to kicking ass on her own using her overpowered strength and brute force.
Nevill
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The more I think about it, the less I like it. We've told Bai the truth about the Saint's injury, and we've been projecting sword qi from our arm - something that we've never be able to do before. If this information made it to Madam Nie, she might have come to certain conclusions.
Granted, arm transplants weren't done before, so nobody can be sure how they work. Still, that's a risk I am not willing to take. Even without our enemies consciously exploiting it, we might find ourselves in trouble.
Perhaps just this one time we need not be at the forefront of battle. As the rules change, so should our attitude.
The point about WQS is also a valid one.
I'll vote B.
Tactician - Xu Jing (I)
Duelists - Song Lingshu and the Twins. (II, III, VIII) > Song Lingshu, Yifang, and Armaiti (VII, VIII, IX)
Nah, do continue. "It is better to stir up a question without deciding it than to decide it without stirring it up."
I am not looking at Xuezi's stats. There is not much to look at. I am considering her personality quirks, her prior behavior, her attitude, her interest in the outcome of the matter, her interactions with our crew and all these things you call synergies.
I came around the idea of adding Lingshu to the team, since she is now, more or less, the role model for the Twins to follow and - for good or bad - a reminder to Wuxing what his daughters may turn into. She also has a prior history with Bai Jiutian - the latter seems to sympathize with her somewhat, - and if the fact that it was not Xu Jing, but Tian'er who organized her escape from Qingcheng, comes to light, it might stir some confusion in our opponent's camp.
The Twins are a bit tougher to justify, though, but I think Wuxing may find it harder to punish them if they make their case and prove that they aren't a disgrace to his family name and their former sect.
What's your take?
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Jester
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hmmm i will go with this for now:
vote C (cao vs madam inmud wrestling emm weiqi) > B (Tactician - Xu Jing Duellists - Song Lingshu, Yifang, Armaiti)
i think we will be allowed/manipulate our opponents to explain rules to Cao'er. I dont think she need more than being told all rules once.
vote C (cao vs madam in
i think we will be allowed/manipulate our opponents to explain rules to Cao'er. I dont think she need more than being told all rules once.
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Tribute
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Voting B (Tactician - Xu Jing; Duellists - Song Lingshu, Yifang, Armaiti) > B (Tactician - Xu Jing; Duellists - Song Lingshu and the twins)
Strategy and tactics for martial arts and military stuff is Xu Jing's specialty, and he's a really smart, creative guy when he wants to be. He can't use that on the field, and we don't have anyone else who can match him as a tactician. On the other hand, we have several really good fighters. The first choice is the people who I think are most likely to listen to him and take direction well while understanding his meaning.
Strategy and tactics for martial arts and military stuff is Xu Jing's specialty, and he's a really smart, creative guy when he wants to be. He can't use that on the field, and we don't have anyone else who can match him as a tactician. On the other hand, we have several really good fighters. The first choice is the people who I think are most likely to listen to him and take direction well while understanding his meaning.
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Nevill
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This is going to be a pain to count.
treave, if we let Yifang borrow our Yuchang sword, would that affect her performance in any way, for better or worse? She knows some of our self-taught techs that were designed with it in mind, but she never actually held it in her hands.
Lambchop19 B 10>1 + 2 3 8
Grimgravy B 10>1 + 2 3 8>1
Baltika9 B 10 + 1 6 7
Fangshi A1
Absinthe C (Cao'er) > B 1 + 7 8 9
Kz3r0 C (Xuezi) > B 10 + 1 2 3
Akkudakku B 1 + 2 3 8
Nevill B 1 + 2 3 8 > 1 + 7 8 9
Jester C (Cao'er) > B 1 + 7 8 9
Tribute B 1 + 7 8 9 > 1 + 2 3 8
Elfberserker B 1 + 7 8 9 > 1 + 2 3 8
TOME B 1 + 2 3 8 > 10 + 1 2 3
Kayerts B 1 + 7 8 9
Chumbucket B 1 + 2 3 8
Kipeci B 1 + 2 3 8
asxetos B 4 + 1 2 3
Raw votes:
A1 - 1
B - 12 (15)
C - 3 (0)
Teams:
Xuezi + Twins & Lingshu - 2
Xuezi + Twins & Jing - 1
Xuezi + Yunzi & Armaiti & Jing - 1
Jing + Twins & Lingshu - 5 (up to 7 with Lambchop and Grimgravy)
Jing + Yifang & Lingshu & Armaiti - 5
Qilin + Twins & Jing - 1
Grimgravy B 10>1 + 2 3 8>1
Baltika9 B 10 + 1 6 7
Fangshi A1
Absinthe C (Cao'er) > B 1 + 7 8 9
Kz3r0 C (Xuezi) > B 10 + 1 2 3
Akkudakku B 1 + 2 3 8
Nevill B 1 + 2 3 8 > 1 + 7 8 9
Jester C (Cao'er) > B 1 + 7 8 9
Tribute B 1 + 7 8 9 > 1 + 2 3 8
Elfberserker B 1 + 7 8 9 > 1 + 2 3 8
TOME B 1 + 2 3 8 > 10 + 1 2 3
Kayerts B 1 + 7 8 9
Chumbucket B 1 + 2 3 8
Kipeci B 1 + 2 3 8
asxetos B 4 + 1 2 3
Raw votes:
A1 - 1
B - 12 (15)
C - 3 (0)
Teams:
Xuezi + Twins & Lingshu - 2
Xuezi + Twins & Jing - 1
Xuezi + Yunzi & Armaiti & Jing - 1
Jing + Twins & Lingshu - 5 (up to 7 with Lambchop and Grimgravy)
Jing + Yifang & Lingshu & Armaiti - 5
Qilin + Twins & Jing - 1
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Elfberserker
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I wonder, if there is any chance to use Qilin as asset in the duel?
Sure she is inferior fighter, but she could provide psychological obstacle to Madam Nie, if she is the tactican at the hueshan team.
She also provides decent ranged fighter for lot our melee fighters.
Edit: I doubt that Nie Wuxing is that thrilled about fighting Madam Nie true daughter either.
Sure she is inferior fighter, but she could provide psychological obstacle to Madam Nie, if she is the tactican at the hueshan team.
She also provides decent ranged fighter for lot our melee fighters.
Edit: I doubt that Nie Wuxing is that thrilled about fighting Madam Nie true daughter either.
Nevill
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It isn't to the death, so I doubt he would hesitate. It is no more than a game, except that people's lives are at stake. But Qilin isn't the one in danger, so I don't think either Madam Nie or Wuxing would have a problem with it.
Elfberserker
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Oh damn, well I suppose that makes her less unsuited to this situation.
I just want Miss Song, Yifang and Cao'er to get some spotlight.
Cao'er could provide nice tactical options with her throwing skills and pressure point skills, maybe enough distraction to give one of our other guys a opening.
She could also provide cover fire.
Besides we can bring Yifang and Cao'er closer as sisters....And get more of those elusive justice girl points.
I just want Miss Song, Yifang and Cao'er to get some spotlight.
Cao'er could provide nice tactical options with her throwing skills and pressure point skills, maybe enough distraction to give one of our other guys a opening.
She could also provide cover fire.
Besides we can bring Yifang and Cao'er closer as sisters....And get more of those elusive justice girl points.
Elfberserker
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I vote for BXXXX For now.
Elfberserker
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I think I flop to.
Tactician: Xu Jing
Duelists: Miss Song+Yifang+Armaiti > Miss Song+ the twins.
Tactician: Xu Jing
Duelists: Miss Song+Yifang+Armaiti > Miss Song+ the twins.
Nevill
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I find it strange that the Justice League & Armaiti team does not get enough love, especially considering that on paper they look better than the Twins, what with two legendary blades, a prodigy swordsman, and a whole Amesha Spenta, who we know to be on a level with the masters of Eight Sects.
Why do people still prefer the Nie sisters? Is it because it feels more appropriate for them to earn their freedom, or is there more to it?
Why do people still prefer the Nie sisters? Is it because it feels more appropriate for them to earn their freedom, or is there more to it?
ChumBucket
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I think you answered your own question there... Yes, there would be a certain amount of literary symmetry if the sisters earn their freedom. They seem to have been a focus of this arc, it is only appropriate that they are directly involved in its conclusion. Besides, if they die, they don't deserve to be in the harem.
Nevill
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Well, I am voting for them for that very reason, and I also think our team has the potential to get through this if they work together. I am just a bit worried about it, considering they were ready to jump at our throat just yesterday. Then again, they have saved our life and took advice from us. I have no idea where on the trust/hate meter we currently are with them, and I feel it might become an issue if we misjudged it.
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