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[LP CYOA] Epic

Discussion in 'Choose Your Own Adventure Land' started by treave, Jun 23, 2012.

  1. Kipeci Magister

    Kipeci
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    We can't take on all the immortals in the world at once just because we aren't bound, that'd be suicide, and they apparently can't even tell that we're unbound. Should we keep them from getting too powerful? As with anything else, absolutely, but there's no decent reason to be fighting them now when Marduk is by far the bigger threat.
     
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  2. Esquilax Arcane

    Esquilax
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    You guys proposing a cease-fire are misjudging Ares' personality. We can't broker an alliance with him because he isn't the type to put grudges aside and work together for a common goal. He's far too petty and arrogant for that, especially now that we've slighted him twice. No, the only hope we have here is to piss him off so badly that he abandons his siege of Memphis to come after us in Olympus, hopefully offering reinforcement against Marduk. This will give us another god to work with should it be too late against Marduk.

    I've amended my plan to this:

    C) Find one of the soldiers fleeing from Pikuat via telepathy, then tell him to deliver a message to Ares: We have decided that Ares is too weak to waste our time on, which is why we've opted to go to Olympus to find worthier enemies.

    It's a good plan. Given Ares' haughty nature, it'll be the last straw for him. Even better, it doesn't waste another moment of our time, gives us a meat shield against Marduk, and it saves Egypt.

    But after the revolution, a duel against Marduk was winnable: why take the chance of either of them getting stronger? We could have dealt with them, Egypt had no relevance to our situation. Look, what's done is done, but this was all very obvious - the entire chapter was leading up to a confrontation with Marduk. You didn't need supernatural foresight to figure this shit out.

    Oh, and we are going to make enemies of the other Immortals by our very nature, so you just have to accept this fact; we're an unbound Immortal with a Gieloth big sister. As others have said, the most likely person to ally with here is Shulgi - he'd be very likely to be curious about our condition, and he'd probably also want a way to make himself Unbound as well. Doesn't mean we can trust him, but there you go.
     
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  3. Baltika9 Arcane

    Baltika9
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    Treave, I really need to know if Ean can find Shulgi's tomb in time and use either his own regenerative powers or the statuette to wake him up. Aside from Edem, he's the only one who would be able to help us. Besides, by your chart, I have a feeling that he'll be waking up soon anyways, and if we would just pretend to be him, he would jump right into governing Babylon and fighting Marduk.
     
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  4. treave Arcane Patron

    treave
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    Shulgi isn't asleep, he's active. Lulz.
     
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  5. Baltika9 Arcane

    Baltika9
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    And knowing our luck, Naram made him the conduit of the Masters. There goes that plan.
    Edit: Staying in Egypt really is a zero-sum game. Ares' armies, and the Egyptian armies will be rather useless against Marduk. What can a human do to Marduk? The only reason to stay that I can see is to get that last hunger point and devour Marduk, a point we can get in Greece.
    So, yeah, going with Esquilax's C.
    And let's hope Ares really is as vainglorious as he thinks. Also, send a missive to Sekhenun, or at least Iltani and have her deploy the Gutians and the remaining Babylonian troops to Greece. They may be useless against Marduk, but his armies are another matter. However, sacrificing time for that would be stupid.
    And tell her that if she, by any chance, can find Shulgi, send that guy straight to us.
    Edit2: Actually, instead of telling one fleeing soldier, tell all of them how much they and Ares suck and are not worth the time of Runi. It will ensure that our message gets where it needs to go.
    And I'm with ScubaV on the updates. Most choices don't need to be open-ended, too much hassle for both counting and voting. Others, like governance or general grand strategy are good places to do it, but otherwise it's pointless at best, counter-productive at worst.
    Unless... you're making excuses to get a break.
    Edit3: Seems to me the reason treave gave us the metal knowledge is that he is either fucking with us, big time (in which case, it is a most excellent troll) or just doesn't want this LP and Ean to end.
     
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  6. Quetzacoatl Liturgist

    Quetzacoatl
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    Esquilax's C
     
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  7. ScubaV Prophet

    ScubaV
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    Alright, Brosquilax's plan sounds good. C
     
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  8. Storyfag Perfidious Pole Patron

    Storyfag
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    Esquilax's C
     
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  9. Zero Credibility Arcane

    Zero Credibility
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    I voted for Egypt because it seemed obvious to me that if we are going in a war we need an army. Babylon was in no state to provide one, but Egypt might be. It was also obvious to me that since we want both sides dead it would be best to let them duke it out and then take them out when they are exhausted. And if one defeats the other, great - less work for us. But the entire Marduk's plan that ends with him being invincible depends on a single thing - his secret artifact, that nobody, not Sekhenun and not even Edem knew anything about. Ean himself had only a remote chance of finding about it, and the only reason he "knows" about it now is the infodump. That's pretty much the opposite of obvious. If it was obvious that we need to take out Marduk right now, why didn't Sekhenun, who knew a hell of a lot more then we did about Marduk just say so during the choice? Why did she remain behind in Babylon? If it was obvious that time was of the essence, why did we even bother cleaning up Babylon after Marduk has left? Or why did we take a vacation with the Guidans?
     
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  10. CappenVarra phase-based phantasmist Patron

    CappenVarra
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    Great job, treave! This infodump with the sample C&C chart really threw everybody into panic mode :lol: Just reading the resulting frenzy has unlocked a whole new trolling skill tree in my mind ;)
     
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  11. Esq.'s C
     
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  12. Esquilax Arcane

    Esquilax
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    I hope it's the latter. I like Ean a lot as a character, and from a gameplay standpoint, there's never a dull moment with all the war and battle he's involved in. As cool as Shulgi is, I find him more interesting as a rival/adversary than I do as a PC. The motivation of "MOAR POWER!!!" isn't nearly as interesting as what motivates Ean's character. You can't really beat "Guide and prepare bronze age humans over the millennia to fight extra-dimensional beings of incredible power" as a motivation.

    treave: I find it very interesting that we gained a point with Sekhenun by refusing to let her feed. Has Ean's sense of honor and morality rubbed off on her? I know that she has a distaste for eating her own kind, but does that now extend to humans as well?

    Zero Credibility: We didn't need an army because there were already two armies tearing each other apart in Greece anyways, the chaos would have worked to our advantage. Our presence there have would allowed us to nudge events in our favour - by going to Egypt, we became a passive observer in an event that was far too important to leave up to Zeus and Marduk. As I mentioned before, we also had an ace up our sleeve in the form of Edem. Leaving things up to chance like that was stupid.

    It was clear to me that both sides were evenly matched, and a victory by either side before we intervened would have tipped the balance to the winner to a point where we wouldn't be able to defeat them. Lastly, what the hell are we doing all of this for? Our objective is to defeat Marduk and Zeus, it's the entire end-game of all we've been trying to ahieve. Petty empire-building and hunting down some pissant Olympian out of sentiment for Egypt don't accomplish our goals. They were both bullshit distractions from our real purpose, so they were both bad ideas. treave even told us that a duel with Marduk was winnable, which I took to mean "hey, you should probably go fight him now".

    Too late to take it back now, though. Hopefully we can still salvage things by manipulating Ares into a battle with Marduk once we arrive at Olympus. But I have to stress that we've got to be smart in how we play this. We need to point Ares towards Marduk without getting our hands dirty and wasting any of our energy in the process.

    Once we get there, I actually think we should go after Zeus, not Marduk. The whole reason that Marduk is in Greece in the first place is to eat Zeus and absorb his powers, so if we take Zeus out of the equation (we're Unbound and we have our toxin to aid us), we deprive Marduk of his meal.

    We're going to have to time things extremely well if we want to save our skin and take both of them out of the picture. This late in the game, we need Ares' help to wear down Marduk or else we'll lose for sure, but if we fuck up and he finds us before we've managed to set him towards Marduk, we're completely fucked here. I hope Edem is alive when we get there, but I'm not optimistic about that.

    Kipeci: The reason we fight against the Olympians is because most of them serve the whims of the Masters. Our existence and our nature is something that the Masters find dangerous because we're something they can't control. When you look at Ean's overall goal of raising up Humanity to one day become strong enough to face them, along with the possibility of an alliance with the Gieloth should Sekhenun's faction prevail, it's obvious why the Masters and the loyal immortals with properly functioning voices (i.e. Naram), all want to kill him. Because of this, it's smart to assume that most Immortals are an enemy until they prove otherwise.

    Zeus is almost as much of a threat to us as Marduk is, so he's got to go too. On the list of gods, I see Artemis being a good potential ally. Maybe Athena? That's about it.
     
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  13. newcomer Learned

    newcomer
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    Esquilax's C

    treave
    I don't think we'll need more thinking time under normal circumstances, seeing how other open choice LP like Vernydar's can go for daily update. I prefer more often update if you can handle it (unless there's too much debate like the Tjaru update)
     
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  14. Zero Credibility Arcane

    Zero Credibility
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    The information that Ean could have taken out Marduk at that point was just more metagaming info we have been given. Ean never knew this. And he certainly didn't know that he could infiltrate two massive armies, avoid a bunch of Gieloths and immortals and assassinate both Zeus and Marduk. And now this whole situation that has been created from the last infodump. One moment we are making plans on how to save Egypt and then focus on Greece, the next we are abandoning everything and rushing over to Greece, and all based on what exactly?

    And looking back at my last choice I realize I would have chosen exactly the same thing even if treave hadn't hit us with us with that last revelation. Try to negotiate with Ares, if this doesn't work take him out and proceed to Greece. That's because I just don't find it that fun to play based on metagame knowledge - what's the point in that?

    So later all and have fun. And really, great LP.
     
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  15. Baltika9 Arcane

    Baltika9
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    I'll regret saying this, but Aphrodite may qualify as well, maybe, if she can overcome her voices. Although, I'd keep her at a cannonshot's distance, if not more.

    And I sincerely hope treave is trolling us, because then we might be up shit creek with at least a paddle.
    It also seems to me Sekhenun is helping us because "I like Ean, eh rebels against the Masters and doesn't afraid of anything."
     
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  16. Esquilax Arcane

    Esquilax
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    I can respect not wanting to involve metagame knowledge in choices.

    But my unwillingness to parlay with Ares isn't metagaming related. We've gelded his sons and now we've killed his troops in Pikuat, we can't offer an alliance after we've provoked him like this. If he had Sekhenun's sense of pragmatism or Ean's sense of duty, an alliance might work - but he's arrogant and petty. What would work is this:

    D) Arrive at Memphis immediately to challenge Ares to honorable single combat: no powers, only physical skills. Since his powers other than his physical skills suck from what we've gleamed from reading the twins' minds, he'll accept these terms. He'll pretty much have to accept the terms because he'll look like a pussy for refusing a challenge like this from a fucking amputee who just castrated his sons.

    Of course, once the duel begins, we'll cheat by using telekinesis to deflect his strikes and kill him that way. It's a subtle power, so no one will be the wiser. We'll devour him before heading to Greece.

    This would work*, but it would take precious days out of our schedule. So it's really a choice between the two.

    * Er... unless his physical abilities are significantly better than ours. We should be okay with some trickery and Anbar-Shi at our side.
     
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  17. Kipeci Magister

    Kipeci
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    When did that become our goal? The last time I checked, we just wanted to kick out the Gieloth devouring people's souls. I'd be fine for eliminating threats in immortals who are the same level of awful to the people they rule, but as a whole I don't see the masters giving much of a damn about the existence of humanity either way. They barely care enough about us so that they didn't nuke the planet straight off the bat, once the Gieloth are gone I don't see why they'd care enough to keep up their efforts. For now, it serves our interests better to cooperate rather than to raise alarms about rogue immortals by doing something stupid like taking on the rest of the world.

    We've seen no indication that the other immortals recognize our completely unfettered status, the ones that want to kill us are the ones we pissed off.

    We shouldn't assume all of them are well-intentioned towards us, but we shouldn't shun an attempt to present a united front just because you suspect they may turn against us if our status were somehow revealed (remember, the voices can be lax for some. Ours let us break that artifact that would have summoned the masters into our world, cooperating with a rogue immortal against the more dangerous Gieloth seems pretty tame compared to that) and that our interests could run counter to each other thousands of years in the future.

    Marduk is the much larger threat here. Remember that if Marduk starts looking too strong, the masters will not hesitate to nuke the whole Earth instead of bothering with immortals. Taking on Marduk with the help of the Greek immortals and later turning on them is much, much easier than taking on both at once.
     
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  18. treave Arcane Patron

    treave
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    Re: update speed, one of the disadvantages with DM style in this LP is that everyone is sharing one character, which is why I'm allowing time for disagreements to be hashed out. We'll see how this goes, if there's a period of inactivity for about two days I'll begin an update?
     
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  19. Baltika9 Arcane

    Baltika9
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    Now there's an interesting idea. Multiple characters. I think we have enough people to pull this off.
    But, if the group hasn't already decided, then it'll finish deciding in about, say, two-three hours.
     
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  20. Azira Arcane Patron

    Azira
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    Multiple characters would be a right cluster-fuck... I'd rather treave concentrates on a single character, and then we'll just have to deal with it. :smug:
     
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  21. newcomer Learned

    newcomer
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    I'd say all of us have stopped arguing for now (from the reply history), but maybe you can wait another 1-2 hours more?

    And for multiple characters... Interesting idea, but you will have to make sure that each group cannot see the other group's update. Maybe you can change this CYOA to pure DM style on chapter 6? What I mean everyone in chapter 6 will choose one character to play as (keep ~5 people per character? With generic agenda if the group fails to vote on time?) and we'll still get general update, but general update will be delivered from neutral standpoint (such as from the cataloging immortal POV)

    Honestly I've been thinking of a multiple character CYOA too... but it's kinda hard to deliver generic update that way, and to ensure no one gets metagaming info from the other group
     
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  22. Quetzacoatl Liturgist

    Quetzacoatl
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    Root did something similar with his 40k lp. Seperate forums for each factions were created and people who wanted to decide the course of the faction would get PMed a link to the specific forum. I remember it failing but I don't know why.
     
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  23. newcomer Learned

    newcomer
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    That's what I also thought at first, but then I remember that google search engine is amazing... :troll:

    For me, to completely prevent meta-game we have to use PM for updates instead of forum (unless if some group is very meta-gamey that they are willing to create fake accountr and register as the other groups), which results in no one are able to understand the LP

    It's a matter of tradeoff :troll:
    If you want a lot of views & brofist & less headache, stick with CYOA, but the story can never be amazing as DM style
    But I think even CYOA is already a huge commitment. I am doing a standard LP now & now I know how difficult & time-consuming it is... I can't imagine how much commitment should I spend for CYOA or DM style LP
     
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  24. Storyfag Perfidious Pole Patron

    Storyfag
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    treave: waiting for us to stop arguing is a waste of time. Write your stuff when you feel like it, announcing: "voting closed" :smug:
     
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  25. Smashing Axe Arcane Patron

    Smashing Axe
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    I for one prefer that we have a range of limited options, perhaps with minor room to maneuver for alterations of the plan (IE, poison at the feast), but regardless of the choice you make I'll still be reading your writing treave.

    Anyway, I'm in favour of Esquilax's C.
     
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