Magic the Gathering Arena

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[anvi]

scheming symmetry is so much fun when you play it with 1 black mana left... and then you may or may not chose to spend it

That would be amazing in 2 Headed Giant, I miss that mode I thought about making a deck that uses Witchclaw and Ashiok, you can use the claw to put any card from your library into your hand, and then the opponent try to use it and the Ashiok stops them. Nice trick it seemed kinda not worth the hassle.

 

[spectre]

Yeah, 2HG vs AI was the ultimate chillax with a friend play mode. You could have fun with it regardless of your collection.

The problem with Ashiok is when you use the guy, you're either playing mill (which isn't competitive) or trying to hose a graveyard/search strategy. It's better to use another 'wanker that actually does something, like little magic negro or vraska.
I feel tempted to try WUB in the current meta that is not Doom Foretold, cause I am seeing plenty of targets for Despark. Hero Midrange failed me miserably thus far, but I never had luck with this deck.

Managed to hit Platinum in Historic Bo3 without much fuss today, which concludes my ranked grind this season. Maybe it'll help you too:

Spoiler

Deck
3 Domri, Anarch of Bolas (WAR) 191
4 Mountain (ANA) 64
6 Forest (ANA) 65
3 Embercleave (ELD) 120
3 Rekindling Phoenix (RIX) 111
4 Once Upon a Time (ELD) 169
4 Pelt Collector (GRN) 141
4 Questing Beast (ELD) 171
4 Stomping Ground (RNA) 259
4 Llanowar Elves (DAR) 168
3 Kraul Harpooner (GRN) 136
4 Gruul Spellbreaker (RNA) 179
3 Zhur-Taa Goblin (RNA) 215
4 Burning-Tree Emissary (GTC) 216
4 Rootbound Crag (XLN) 256
1 Fabled Passage (ELD) 244
2 Field of Ruin (XLN) 254

Sideboard
4 Cindervines (RNA) 161
4 Veil of Summer (M20) 198
4 Lightning Strike (M19) 152
3 Sorcerous Spyglass (XLN) 248

Gold meta was pretty much Nexus and Oko food bollocks, with a lone UG Flash and RDW. I saw a bit more variety in platinum, including a mono black control, vampires, mono white,
so it seems most of the tryhards are still stuck in gold. I had some problems with Oko, hence the Spyglass in the sideboard which managed to even things out. Domri's Ambush is
another option, but I couldn't guarantee a kill on Oko or Nissa with it, and it also shuts off another problem card, that is Wicked Wolf.
Most of the time, you side out the 2 CMC stuff, Emissaries for matchups where a 2/2 isn't doing much of a difference (although they are important for getting reliable 4 turn kills), Harpooners if there won't be any Geese or other impactful flyers.
Cindervines go in vs. Nexus (I keep forgetting to keep the mana open, don't be me), Strike when it feels that you need more creature removal. Veil may seem like an overkill, but it made life miserable for mono black control and UG flash.
If I need more than one thing from the SB (e.g. lightning strike and Spyglass for oko food), Domri can also take a hike.
Field of ruin can sometimes fuck up your manabase, which demands GG and RR, but it is helpful for obvious reasons. So far OUaT has been a real lifesaver in this regard and emissaries can sometimes fix you as well, but I recognize there might be an issue,
so if you feel like it's fug'd, swap out the passage for a lifeland, or maybe even add a second one. Generally speaking, you tend to need the double mana on turn 4, so I am more partial to the passage.

 

[anvi]

I just drew 9 lands in a row, this game can be so un-fun sometimes

 

[anvi]

Which of these new net decks do you guys think would be best in Bo1? They all look kinda fun, but I could only make one and want to get the strongest. I assume they are all pretty close though because they all went 5-0 recently.

Jeskai Fires with the Cavaliers

Spoiler

Deck
4 Teferi, Time Raveler (WAR) 221
2 Bonecrusher Giant (ELD) 115
4 Cavalier of Flame (M20) 125
3 Cavalier of Gales (M20) 52
2 Kenrith, the Returned King (ELD) 303
4 Sphinx of Foresight (RNA) 55
3 Deafening Clarion (GRN) 165
3 Shimmer of Possibility (RNA) 51
2 Aether Gust (M20) 42
2 Justice Strike (GRN) 182
4 Fires of Invention (ELD) 125
3 Castle Vantress (ELD) 242
3 Fabled Passage (ELD) 244
4 Hallowed Fountain (RNA) 251
2 Island (ELD) 254
2 Mountain (ELD) 262
1 Plains (ELD) 250
2 Sacred Foundry (GRN) 254
4 Steam Vents (GRN) 257
3 Temple of Epiphany (M20) 253
3 Temple of Triumph (M20) 257

Sideboard
1 Aether Gust (M20) 42
1 Deafening Clarion (GRN) 165
4 Legion Warboss (GRN) 109
4 Mystical Dispute (ELD) 58
2 Narset, Parter of Veils (WAR) 61
3 Tithe Taker (RNA) 27

Simic Ramp with the OP as fuck Nissa, Krasis, and Cavalier of Thorns, and then 2 Agents and a Mass Manip to make it even more op!

Spoiler

Deck
4 Nissa, Who Shakes the World (WAR) 169
2 Agent of Treachery (M20) 43
4 Cavalier of Thorns (M20) 167
4 Gilded Goose (ELD) 160
4 Hydroid Krasis (RNA) 183
4 Leafkin Druid (M20) 178
4 Paradise Druid (WAR) 171
4 Risen Reef (M20) 217
3 Voracious Hydra (M20) 200
1 Mass Manipulation (RNA) 42
2 Quasiduplicate (GRN) 51
4 Breeding Pool (RNA) 246
2 Castle Garenbrig (ELD) 240
1 Castle Vantress (ELD) 242
7 Forest (ELD) 266
6 Island (ELD) 254
4 Temple of Mystery (M20) 255

Sideboard
1 Mass Manipulation (RNA) 42
2 Aether Gust (M20) 42
2 Lovestruck Beast (ELD) 165
2 Mystical Dispute (ELD) 58
1 Negate (RIX) 44
2 Questing Beast (ELD) 171
2 Shifting Ceratops (M20) 194
1 Tamiyo, Collector of Tales (WAR) 220
2 Thrashing Brontodon (RIX) 148

UW control with no expense spared... 4 freakin Brazen's, 4 Absorb, 4 Teferi, 4 Planar Cleansing! and a bunch of draw. Looks scary.

Spoiler

4 Teferi, Time Raveler (WAR) 221
2 Castle Vantress (ELD) 242
2 Castle Ardenvale (ELD) 238
3 Fabled Passage (ELD) 244
4 Tranquil Cove (M20) 259
4 Hallowed Fountain (RNA) 251
7 Island (XLN) 267
5 Plains (ELD) 253
1 Mass Manipulation (RNA) 42
4 Planar Cleansing (M20) 33
2 Time Wipe (WAR) 223
4 Chemister's Insight (GRN) 32
4 Absorb (RNA) 151
2 Quench (RNA) 48
4 Dovin's Veto (WAR) 193
2 Agent of Treachery (M20) 43
2 Gadwick, the Wizened (ELD) 48
4 Brazen Borrower (ELD) 39

3 Giant Killer (ELD) 14
3 Apostle of Purifying Light (M20) 6
3 Spectral Sailor (M20) 76
3 God-Eternal Oketra (WAR) 16
3 Deputy of Detention (RNA) 165

New Clover deck. This looks the most fun to me, 4 Wishes that would duplicate with the clover to wish for anything you wanted, and 4 Brazen Borrower that would duplicate too... bounce their entire board back to their hand. Duplicated Bonecrusher Giant too which hurts. And the Beanstalk for massive ramp.

Spoiler

4 Beanstalk Giant (ELD) 149
4 Bonecrusher Giant (ELD) 115
4 Brazen Borrower (ELD) 39
4 Fae of Wishes (ELD) 44
4 Hydroid Krasis (RNA) 183
4 Lucky Clover (ELD) 226
4 Growth Spiral (RNA) 178
2 Return to Nature (ELD) 173
3 Escape to the Wilds (ELD) 189
4 Breeding Pool (RNA) 246
5 Forest (GRN) 264
3 Island (GRN) 261
2 Mountain (GRN) 263
4 Steam Vents (GRN) 257
4 Stomping Ground (RNA) 259
2 Temple of Epiphany (M20) 253
3 Temple of Mystery (M20) 255

1 Escape to the Wilds (ELD) 189
1 Return to Nature (ELD) 173
1 Aether Gust (M20) 42
1 Chandra, Awakened Inferno (M20) 127
1 Flame Sweep (M20) 139
1 Fling (ELD) 126
1 Frogify (ELD) 47
1 Fry (M20) 140
1 Lava Coil (GRN) 108
2 Mystical Dispute (ELD) 58
1 Negate (M20) 69
1 Once and Future (ELD) 168
1 Planewide Celebration (WAR) 172
1 Sorcerous Spyglass (ELD) 233

I like the last one, all those Fae of Wishes that get duplicated, you could answer whatever you are up against. But I don't like that it all hinges on the Clovers which some decks would get rid of easy. I would Ego them and a lot of people run 4 Mortifys. My guess is the Simic deck would win the most. But maybe the UW control. I don't really know how strong that Cavaliers Fires deck is though. I've played against it and it was good but... I have beat it too.

 

[new fucking guy]

I assume they are all pretty close though because they all went 5-0 recently.

You should note, the 5-0 modo list dumps are curated by wotc. They usually try to make the meta look as diverse as possible.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Been playing this a little. It's fun. Naturally would be improved by a playset of princes, and there could be some better ETB memes I'm forgetting, but it's fun enough. Wanderer feels like she's gone up in power with all the questing beasts and bonecrusher giants running around, and her passive makes dreadhorde go bananas. Then you've got some tolerable power against fires and lifegain/blockers for aggro. Not the worst thing in the world for some variety. I probably should put a Lili or two in too just to juice up dreadhorde a little more, but eh. May have too many taplands, too. 4 temples and the 1 life land occasionally gets in the way even with some scrying on princes to try to smooth out draws.

Spoiler

Deck
3 Charming Prince (ELD) 8
5 Plains (ANA) 61
4 Basilica Bell-Haunt (RNA) 156
5 Swamp (ANA) 63
3 The Wanderer (WAR) 37
3 Command the Dreadhorde (WAR) 82
2 Despark (WAR) 190
4 Mortify (RNA) 192
1 Ethereal Absolution (RNA) 170
4 Temple of Silence (M20) 256
1 Scoured Barrens (M20) 251
4 Godless Shrine (RNA) 248
1 Fabled Passage (ELD) 244
2 Castle Locthwain (ELD) 241
2 Castle Ardenvale (ELD) 238
3 Midnight Reaper (GRN) 77
4 Burglar Rat (GRN) 64
3 Gorging Vulture (M20) 102
2 Seraph of the Scales (RNA) 205
1 Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord (WAR) 217
3 Oath of Kaya (WAR) 209

 

[lobsterfrogman]

Which of these new net decks do you guys think would be best in Bo1? They all look kinda fun, but I could only make one and want to get the strongest. I assume they are all pretty close though because they all went 5-0 recently.

Jeskai Fires - very good deck, lots of raw power, but because many other decks pack enchantments and/or artifacts people will be ready for you (I know you asked about bo1 where there is no sb and I don't play this format, but I would assume people there tune their maindecks for the meta, like playing Brontodons and such). You are also very soft to Casualties of War and BG cat is a popular deck right now. And in bo1 I think the slightly older version with Fae of Wishes might be superior - you don't pay the "sideboard tax" since there is no sb anyway; in fact playing Fae in bo1 almost feels like cheating
Simic Ramp - also very powerful, but you don't have removal in these colors, so you struggle vs aggro. Most aggro decks nowadays play Embercleave and you lose to this card badly.
UW Control - Don't. Too many cats in the meta.
Clover decks - Can't comment on this specific version, but as to traditional adventure decks - I wouldn't. It's not bad per se, but I feel that Cat + Trail of Crumbs is a better engine than Inkeeper + Clover.

If I had to choose from these four I would probably go with Fires, but other decks (apart from UW Control) are not bad choices either.However, what I feel is the most powerful deck in the meta right now is Baked Cat (whether BG or Jund version is better I don't know).

Also, just remembered something - MC VII starts today, so maybe wait over the weekend with burning the wildcards to see what decks the pro scene came up with.

 

[anvi]

Been playing this a little. It's fun. Naturally would be improved by a playset of princes, and there could be some better ETB memes I'm forgetting, but it's fun enough. Wanderer feels like she's gone up in power with all the questing beasts and bonecrusher giants running around, and her passive makes dreadhorde go bananas. Then you've got some tolerable power against fires and lifegain/blockers for aggro. Not the worst thing in the world for some variety. I probably should put a Lili or two in too just to juice up dreadhorde a little more, but eh. May have too many taplands, too. 4 temples and the 1 life land occasionally gets in the way even with some scrying on princes to try to smooth out draws.

Spoiler

Deck
3 Charming Prince (ELD) 8
5 Plains (ANA) 61
4 Basilica Bell-Haunt (RNA) 156
5 Swamp (ANA) 63
3 The Wanderer (WAR) 37
3 Command the Dreadhorde (WAR) 82
2 Despark (WAR) 190
4 Mortify (RNA) 192
1 Ethereal Absolution (RNA) 170
4 Temple of Silence (M20) 256
1 Scoured Barrens (M20) 251
4 Godless Shrine (RNA) 248
1 Fabled Passage (ELD) 244
2 Castle Locthwain (ELD) 241
2 Castle Ardenvale (ELD) 238
3 Midnight Reaper (GRN) 77
4 Burglar Rat (GRN) 64
3 Gorging Vulture (M20) 102
2 Seraph of the Scales (RNA) 205
1 Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord (WAR) 217
3 Oath of Kaya (WAR) 209

I got owned by that deck 3 times yesterday :/ It is interesting because I can easily kill everything it puts out. Sorin lasts 1 second, Basilica nuked, Ethereal Absolution nuked, rats etc, board wipe everything. Looks like I have the game in the bag, and then boom, out comes Command the Dreadhorde and I don't run any counterspells... So I end up faced with a board full of creatures and some PWs all at once and only 1 turn to answer. There was one version that seemed especially strong because he had that creature that says do 1 damage to opponent when a creature enters, and he brings in 10+ creatures at once, with two of those trigger creatures it does 20 damage just from the army entering the board. Interesting deck.

 

[anvi]

Which of these new net decks do you guys think would be best in Bo1? They all look kinda fun, but I could only make one and want to get the strongest. I assume they are all pretty close though because they all went 5-0 recently.

Jeskai Fires - very good deck, lots of raw power, but because many other decks pack enchantments and/or artifacts people will be ready for you (I know you asked about bo1 where there is no sb and I don't play this format, but I would assume people there tune their maindecks for the meta, like playing Brontodons and such). You are also very soft to Casualties of War and BG cat is a popular deck right now. And in bo1 I think the slightly older version with Fae of Wishes might be superior - you don't pay the "sideboard tax" since there is no sb anyway; in fact playing Fae in bo1 almost feels like cheating
Simic Ramp - also very powerful, but you don't have removal in these colors, so you struggle vs aggro. Most aggro decks nowadays play Embercleave and you lose to this card badly.
UW Control - Don't. Too many cats in the meta.
Clover decks - Can't comment on this specific version, but as to traditional adventure decks - I wouldn't. It's not bad per se, but I feel that Cat + Trail of Crumbs is a better engine than Inkeeper + Clover.

If I had to choose from these four I would probably go with Fires, but other decks (apart from UW Control) are not bad choices either.However, what I feel is the most powerful deck in the meta right now is Baked Cat (whether BG or Jund version is better I don't know).

Also, just remembered something - MC VII starts today, so maybe wait over the weekend with burning the wildcards to see what decks the pro scene came up with.

Thanks! And yeah the bo1 meta is so slick, lots of people run enchant removal which makes me wary of Fires. And yeah so many cats decks, I didn't think about that with UW. It would suck to not have a Leyline or Ethereal Absolution against them. My current deck has both and also Carnarium wihch sometimes catches the cats after I Teferi the artifact back to their hand. Without all that I would feel helpless. I think I will stick with my homebrews for now. I would pick Jeskai Fires, it seems best, but it seems boring to play with those hur dur Cavaliers.

 

[spectre]

It depends if you want to be rock, paper or scissors in this meta. Fires beats all the dinky adventure stuff and cats (though it can still fuck you up on the last few life, so don't underestimate them), Counterspell control/tempo beats fires, Cat-Oven beats
counterspells. I like fires because you can make a number of builds with it, some feel more like control, others more like combo, so it's not that boring.
Depends on what you go off to, but in the end it's definitely a competitive deck with powerful plays and flexibility coming from the wishboard. For me, it scratches a number of itches.

I understant if you don't feel like blowing all the mythic wildcards on cavaliers, because they aren't really useful anywhere else. I'm not a fan of the all cavalier build myself because it feels like the most linear approach (though it does pack a nasty punch).
Imo only CoF is essential, and I am using 3x of those and 2x Kenrith as my maindeck win conditions (Kenrith is great because he stabilizes vs. aggro on the spot, immediately starting the beatdown with 12+ hasted trample damage also feels good, no more endless blocking with a 1/1.
And then there's the parting shot from the Cavalier if the opponent wipes). Went 7:2 today in standard event with such a WUR build, so it probably does at least some things right. The two losses were to a bad case of RDW going first and an interesting WU build which spiraled out of control (used Tale's End and Behemoth Beckoner to ramp with Lotus Field, then replayed Cavalier of Gales and fetched removals and counterspells with Fae of Wishes).

Whatever you play, bring enchantment/artifact hate. A lot of guys don't and there's much wailing and gnashing of teeth on the official forums.

 

[anvi]

Thanks! I think I have a change of plan, I just got beat by an insanely powerful deck and I'm gonna steal it Gonna suck to blow all my wildcards on it though if it doesn't work out :/

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[spectre]

Ah, so M20 is on, I never could be bothered to read the schedule.
Good news cause I milked GRN for all it got, started getting gems out of packs and M20 is my other favorite.

I think ranked draft matchmaking cares more about your win count in this particular run rather than ranks. So, expect at least two last games to be vs. gold rank, and if you see a guy below your rank, they most likely drafted something godly.

 

[Jason Liang]

fuck I just realized that Captivating Crew was supposed to combo with Captain's Hook

 

[spectre]

Probably, but I'd rather use them for makeshift munitions. Most fun I ever hand during Ixaland standard. Captain's Hook is a bit iffy in that role because you need to keep more mana open.
Also, the unattaching part is a bit tricky because you need another recipient for equip.

 

[Jason Liang]

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/mythic-championship-vii-top-8-decklists

I see that the bannings have had an enormous effect on restricting Green's dominance

 

[A_boring_GOG_bot]

Does anyone watch this yt channel ?

https://www.youtube.com/user/tolariancommunity/

 

[spectre]

So, receding hairline finally caught up with the guy?
I watched a few vids, they don't seem to have MTGA-centered content, a lot of the stuff is about buying physical cards. The vids about the game's fundamentals were decent, if anybody needs to brush up on those.

 

[Doktor Best]

He did some charity challenge and if a certain treshold of money was reached he said he would shave his head.

Hes a nice guy. Hes always calling out WOTC on shitty moves and helps raising awareness (like missing support for historic or the two wildcards per historic card thing). So he definitely also has some impact on Arena simply by providing a platform for criticism.

 

[anvi]

I thought criticism was illegal nowadays.

 

[Jason Liang]

So. Last night I getting some singles from one of the three shop owners here in Tianjin, and he is *pissed.* He basically told me "I want out of the singles market, just take whatever you want, whatever price you want. Fuck this game."

So he opened his shop about two years ago I guess (this is around when a lot of shops cropped up, I guess around the time WoW CCG went kaput), and so he didn't know you were supposed to dump all of your Standard junk before rotation. So first he's pissed that all his Standard shit is worth pennies now.

Then on top of that, he's lost a TON of money by the bannings of Oko, W6 and OUaT. Foil Oko had a high of about $90 (700 rmb) and now has dropped to $65 and still dropping (500 rmb). Non foil had a high of $65 (500 rmb) and is now down to $42 (300 rmb). W6 has dropped from $100 nonfoil to $60, and foil similarly from $400 to $240. Once Upon a Time has dropped like a turd. Basically all in about a month. It's pretty insane if you think about it from a shop's perspective. I guess this is why you can't ban chase mythics.

Also happier news, I think I've figured out how WotC came up with Oko: they were probably trying to create a planeswalker good enough to play in EDH.

 

[spectre]

On the one hand I feel for the guy, on the other, cardboard has no right justify such prices. It was a bubble waiting to burst at any time.

New state of the game is up.
https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/magic-digital/mtg-arena-state-game-december-2019-12-10
Highlights for historic:

There will be a "suspended" list for historic. The difference between suspended and bannana'd is: no wildcard compensation, the cards may be unuspended at some time.
So yeah, they want to weasel out of giving out WC.

There wll be Artisan (common+uncommon only) event.

There will be a metagame challenge Bo3 event for historic

There will be a ranked draft for Dominaria.

Among other things, we're finally getting deck sorting after all these years. They will also be expanding brawl to become a long-time event,
although it comes with a hefty fee.