MASS EFFECT 5 - yes or no

[whydoibother]

Mass Effect was one of the worst things that ever happened.

As was its developer, Bioware.

I hate how Bioware and their whole library were decided to retroactively always have been shit, and we always hated them, and they were never good, etc, when they fucked up their newer games. Literal fake news, and bad revisionist history.

 

[JDR13]

Mass Effect was one of the worst things that ever happened.

As was its developer, Bioware.

I hate how Bioware and their whole library were decided to retroactively always have been shit, and we always hated them, and they were never good, etc, when they fucked up their newer games. Literal fake news, and bad revisionist history.

QFT. No matter how shit Bioware is now, the BG trilogy is still classic.

 

[luj1]

Also NwN and KotOR (probably the last good games they made)

 

[whydoibother]

Also NwN and KotOR (probably the last good games they made)

I'd say its something like this:

• Indie period: whatever small games they released or worked on at first
• Incline period: Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, SWKOTOR
• Consolidation period: Mass Effect, Jade Empires, Dragon Age Origins
• Signs of decline period: Mass Effect 2, Dragon Age 2, various mobile and spinoffs
• Jump off a cliff period: SWTOR, Mass Effect 3, Dragon Age 3
• Rotting corpse animated by jewish necromancy period: Andromeda, Anthem

If we consider Andromeda to be an attempt at a Mass Effect game, we might conclude that Bioware was good at Game 1, okay at Game 2, and shit at Game 3 and beyond. So you'd think they should make a new original game.
But maybe Anthem was exactly such an attempt at a new original game, which ruins the system. Dunno. At any rate, later failures don't diminish prior successes. An athlete losing physical ability when they get old doesn't mean they weren't once great.

 

[JDR13]

Personally, I've always considered KotOR the start of their decline.

Small, linear level design, 3-person max party size, etc. I've never understood why the game is as popular as it is other than it's Star Wars.

 

[Fedora Master]

Personally, I've always considered KotOR the start of their decline.

Small, linear level design, 3-person max party size, etc. I've never understood why the game is as popular as it is other than it's Star Wars.

It's consoleshit mechanically but it's still enjoyable to play. The real stinker is DA2

 

[Bastardchops]

If it's by Bioware no.

 

[Irxy]

What I don't understand is fixation on ME3 ending. What exactly people expect to happen in a game right after dealing with a super serial cyber ninja and resolving centuries old conflict with AI life form by urging everybody to not being mean to robots. I mean, how is ending any different in quality? It's the same nonsense spread uniformly throughout the game. I suspect that the only reason people find the ending particularly frustrating is because this is the moment when they finally lost all hope of satisfying resolution. But with the way it was developing up to that point there wasn't any chance of satisfying anything anyway.

There are many different reasons for different people discussed many times in the past, how Bioware managed to piss off pretty much everyone no matter what one liked or expected.

The thing I hated most about ME3 in general and the ending specifically is how they have pretty much deconsructed the whole setting and lore making the possibility of any coherent sequel nil. Hence the Andromeda, which also managed to fuck the only possibility for spin-off without rebooting the whole thing. ME1 created a world to rival Star Wars and Star Trek space operas, it had a perfect balance of science fiction and space fantasy, politics and adventuring, which felt both recognizable and unique enough - one of the best worlds created specifically for videogame rpgs.

And then we have ME3. Quarians, their whole culture based upon their conflict with Geth, the migrant fleet - solved. Krogan genophage? Solved. And many other examples like this. Then of course the whole thing ended in one of the apocalypse variants, destroying Citadel, mass relays and whatever has been left of the lore at that point. They didn't just resolve the plot of the trilogy, they've resolved the whole setting destroying its core signature plot elements and ideas.

I can see it happening to some lonely author having a crises, but doing this to a successful commercial franchise at the peak of its popularity is beyond me.

 

[Bliblablubb]

I still consider ME2 (with shadow broker DLC) as one of my favorite games. It didn't want too much, and did everything right. Only bummer was the lack of reapers, making it largely pointless overall.

ME3 on the other hand made the mistake of raising the stakes to maximum. You can't have reapers invade earth and then let the player dick around saving cats from trees. Reapers are not an occupation force that roll out a flag and oppress the population. They kill everyone. How am I supposed to have "fun" knowing that 10000s of humans die while Sheppard eats sushi on the shitadel? "It just does not work"(tm)
Instead, they should have the reapers slowly approach, and everytime the player returns from a story mission, he would see more refugees, military buildup, news feeds, etc.
Wrapping up all species problems was okay in my book, they wanted it to be the last part of the triology, happy endings are appreciated. Except they fucked it up in the end. Make up your goddamn mind!

That whole drama killed Bioware's confidence, so they started listening to the vocal minority and made room for green haired wokeists when making Andromederp:

"Wymyn are oversexed sex objects!" Okay, let's make the women ugly, insulting the model who gave her face for the main character. Male NPCs are allowed to run around shirtless tho.

"Lol Shepard is old lol" Okay, let's make the player a bratty teenager. It worked well for Deus Ex: Invisible War, Anakin Skywalker or Wesley Crusher amirite?
And a dev sneaking in an NPC blurting about his transgender history without asking shows how well they have their team under control...

Bioware is dead. They have lost all confidence, vision and connection to their audience, desperately grasping straws to survive. Pissed off the old playerbase, couldn't get the younger new ones, now they are remaking the old mass effect, not knowing WHY it was successful, simply hoping it would bring the bucks again. It won't. Maybe they even try to make it woke...

RIP.

 

[Morgoth]

Personally, I've always considered KotOR the start of their decline.

Small, linear level design, 3-person max party size, etc. I've never understood why the game is as popular as it is other than it's Star Wars.

It's consoleshit mechanically but it's still enjoyable to play. The real stinker is DA2

I found DA2 to be the most unique and tight game in the DA series. Origins was banal, generic and slow, Inquisition a shameless Skyrim clone.

 

[NJClaw]

Necrophilia is a crime. Let the dead rest.

 

[Fedora Master]

Personally, I've always considered KotOR the start of their decline.

Small, linear level design, 3-person max party size, etc. I've never understood why the game is as popular as it is other than it's Star Wars.

It's consoleshit mechanically but it's still enjoyable to play. The real stinker is DA2

I found DA2 to be the most unique and tight game in the DA series.

Yea but that's you.

 

[Morgoth]

No that's concensus among many DA gamers.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

I found DA2 to be the most unique and tight game in the DA series.

Yeah, it was 'tight' - reused assets everywhere and even the player's access to certain sections of a given location being cut off in order for those areas to be used for some other quests later on.

 

[Morgoth]

Hóngwèibīng. Ask the Internetz. Ask Google. It will tell you that DA2 is underrated.

Spoiler

 

[Morgoth]

I found DA2 to be the most unique and tight game in the DA series.

Yeah, it was 'tight' - reused assets everywhere and even the player's access to certain sections of a given location being cut off in order for those areas to be used for some other quests later on.

The reused assets were the least problem. I just found the premise more appealing. Refugee family that lost everything have to make coin in the slums, working for all sorts of shady characters. Much better than this "I'm fucking Superman and I'm gonna save the world" nonsense.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

I found DA2 to be the most unique and tight game in the DA series.

Yeah, it was 'tight' - reused assets everywhere and even the player's access to certain sections of a given location being cut off in order for those areas to be used for some other quests later on.

The reused assets were the least problem. I just found the premise more appealing. Refugee family that lost everything have to make coin in the slums, working for all sorts of shady characters. Much better than "I'm fucking Superman and I'm gonnna save the world" nonsense.

Eh, I just find DA2 to be mostly mediocre (although it also has its high points such as the character of the Arishok). DAO might've been vanilla in content, but at least it was also well executed.

I also don't like the change in aesthetics from DAO to DA2, with the introduction of 'pointy' armors, alien-looking Elves and powdered Darkspawn.

 

[Bliblablubb]

The idea behind DA2 was great. It was just too rushed with all those reused assets and the anime style combat was crap.
DA3 learned from that and created a pretty good balance.

 

[Morgoth]

Then you should like Inquisition best: Lots of thicc thighs and horns.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

The idea behind DA2 was great. It was just too rushed with all those reused assets and the anime style combat was crap.
DA3 learned from that and a pretty good balance.

I wish that Inquisition would've returned to the visual aesthetics of DAO. Besides the Templar armor (which for the most part stayed true to its DAO version, unlike the Legion of the Dead armor which DAI butchered), there was not a single armor whose design I liked. Most of them were bland (e.g. Warden armors) and/or outright ugly.

 

[Bliblablubb]

Let's be honest here: armor design has never been Bioware's strong suit. Dragon age, KOTOR, Neverwinter, even Mass Effect... good one's were more exception than the rule.
ASSley wore a hello kitty armor ffs.

 

[Bliblablubb]

Then you should like Inquisition best: Lots of thicc thighs and horns.

Ironically I don't even remember much about DA3 armor. The only character I managed to endure the whole game with, was mage wearing what looked like a biker outfit with an assflap.

 

[whydoibother]

Personally, I've always considered KotOR the start of their decline.

Small, linear level design, 3-person max party size, etc. I've never understood why the game is as popular as it is other than it's Star Wars.

It's consoleshit mechanically but it's still enjoyable to play. The real stinker is DA2

I found DA2 to be the most unique and tight game in the DA series. Origins was banal, generic and slow, Inquisition a shameless Skyrim clone.

The only interesting thing about DA2 was that the plot moved through time, rather than through space. We stayed in the same space, and finishing a major quest moved us in time instead of leading us to the next space.
However this was soured a bit by how little the space itself changed. Famously a lot reused areas, not even rotating the caves a bit to confuse us, but also just no new shops opening, no new mayor or something, the only meaningful change was the qunari area.
Everything else in DA2 was a downgrade from Origins, I found. Maybe you can argue that physical damage builds were more interesting? Maybe? Maybe not.

 

[Bliblablubb]

Maybe you can argue that physical damage builds were more interesting? Maybe? Maybe not

Only of you like final faggotry style games, with yuge swords or rogues teleporting around. I couldn't stand it, only dragged myself through it as a mage. Which meant I would have been stuck with the stupid brat of a brother, sending him off to the gay wardens or fighting against the mages. Which made no sense.
Having to hide/protect your sister from the inquisition made a much better narrative.
Thankfully there were savegame editors to give you both.

 

[NJClaw]

Personally, I've always considered KotOR the start of their decline.

Small, linear level design, 3-person max party size, etc. I've never understood why the game is as popular as it is other than it's Star Wars.

It's consoleshit mechanically but it's still enjoyable to play. The real stinker is DA2

I found DA2 to be the most unique and tight game in the DA series. Origins was banal, generic and slow, Inquisition a shameless Skyrim clone.

The only interesting thing about DA2 was that the plot moved through time, rather than through space. We stayed in the same space, and finishing a major quest moved us in time instead of leading us to the next space.
However this was soured a bit by how little the space itself changed. Famously a lot reused areas, not even rotating the caves a bit to confuse us, but also just no new shops opening, no new mayor or something, the only meaningful change was the qunari area.
Everything else in DA2 was a downgrade from Origins, I found. Maybe you can argue that physical damage builds were more interesting? Maybe? Maybe not.

Not having to defend the world against the New Definitive Apocalypse™ was refreshing enough. A refugee wants to make money, then some fuckers want a book, and in the end there's a peaceful protest against the cops. And every chapter touched and explored some relevant aspect of the setting (dwarven ruins in the deep roads, values of the Qunari, and the mages-templars conflict). The actual "game" still sucked, but everything around it wasn't garbage.