Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[J_C]

I think Chaos Chronicles' magic system looks even better (vancian, rest anywhere, but save only in towns and villages, and resting in dungeons carries risk of random encounter). That solves both of the problems usually leveled against IE-magic.

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

 

[LeStryfe79]

 

[Grunker]

Not convincing? I got a shit load more support than any of the crap you've said in this thread so who really is more convincing?

Shit is delicious: One million flies can't be wrong.

This is the same fucking argument that was used to defend Mike Laidlaw over DA2. You design something and it's a success you get the credit for it, not the fucking QA testers, do you see QA Tester number 23 being praised on the Codex? No it's fucking Tim Cain/Avellone/Sawyer who ever the designer/programmer is. Likewise, if your product is a bug infested PoS, you suffer the consequences. I can't believe I am seeing this EXTREMELY BSN style argument being peddled here.

Your argument makes no sense. Systems designers get the credit/blame when their systems are bad. Bugs are another department entirely completely unrelated to the design of a system.

I think Chaos Chronicles' magic system looks even better (vancian, rest anywhere, but save only in towns and villages, and resting in dungeons carries risk of random encounter). That solves both of the problems usually leveled against IE-magic.

You realize that just means I'm going to rest after every single combat? That just exacerbates the problem by making it more degenerate.

Are you fucking blind? How are you going to rest after each combat when resting means potential random encounter? If you run out of resources this way, you have to start the entire dungeon all over again.

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Where did you learn to say this? Or are you just spewing this bullshit because you've learned it's decline in platformers on Nintendo?

For once a mechanic we can use, and that's when you're suddenly all Codexy? Bitch please.

Explain to me how it's in any way dumbed down here compared to your beloved cooldown-system which reduces resource-management to a question of "save dailies for boss-fight, use everything else each fight."

 

[DalekFlay]

I think Chaos Chronicles' magic system looks even better (vancian, rest anywhere, but save only in towns and villages, and resting in dungeons carries risk of random encounter). That solves both of the problems usually leveled against IE-magic.

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Yeah, since when did save points become CRPG classic stuff? The fuck?

 

[Grunker]

Wah! Instead of shitty slings, my mage's gonna use shitty low level spells! All the grittiness of the IE system is ruined!

This fucking place.

Did I miss something? I hate to give the impression that I'm against spells-as-auto-attacks. I'm really, really not. But there's a big fucking difference between that and the system Obsidian is suggesting. Having a few spells that function as auto-attacks doesn't exclude resource-management.

I think Chaos Chronicles' magic system looks even better (vancian, rest anywhere, but save only in towns and villages, and resting in dungeons carries risk of random encounter). That solves both of the problems usually leveled against IE-magic.

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Yeah, since when did save points become CRPG classic stuff? The fuck?

who the fuck called it classic, you dumb-ass

i called it better than the cooldown system and in the same sentence said ahfuckit bogkerpgjpreokeorge

 

[Roguey]

Are you fucking blind? How are you going to rest after each combat when resting means potential random encounter? If you run out of resources this way, you have to start the entire dungeon all over again.

"Hmm, I can't save at all in this dungeon. This means I can take no chances. All right, going to kill this single encounter which will surely only put a minor dent in my total available resources. Now to rest. Oh look, random monsters. Just another minor dent. Repeat if necessary. Rest to full. Repeat as often as possible. Oh, this one mid-dungeon encounter took away more than I'm comfortable with. Time to make the long trek back to the village to rest in safety."

 

[Grunker]

FAGGOTRY


MULTI-HEADED DICKS




POTATO : x



KWANS :patriot:


JEWS



LET OUR POWER COMBINE


BY YOUR POWERS COMBINED, I AM CAPTAIN GRUNKER

 

[J_C]

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Where did you learn to say this? Or are you just spewing this bullshit because you've learned it's decline in platformers on Nintendo?

For once a mechanic we can use, and that's when you're suddenly all Codexy? Bitch please.

Explain to me how it's in any way dumbed down here compared to your beloved cooldown-system which reduces resource-management to a question of "save dailies for boss-fight, use everything else each fight."

Tell me why is it a good thing when you are neck deep in a dungeon but you can't stop playing because you are not near a village. You have some important thing to do? To bad, finish the dungeon first and go back to the village, where you can save. I don't know about you, but I have other things to do besides gaming, and I want to stop my gaming session whenever I want.

 

[Grunker]

Are you fucking blind? How are you going to rest after each combat when resting means potential random encounter? If you run out of resources this way, you have to start the entire dungeon all over again.

"Hmm, I can't save at all in this dungeon. This means I can take no chances. All right, going to kill this single encounter which will surely only put a minor dent in my total available resources. Now to rest. Oh look, random monsters. Just another minor dent. Repeat if necessary. Rest to full. Repeat as often as possible. Oh, this one mid-dungeon encounter took away more than I'm comfortable with. Time to make the long trek back to the village to rest in safety."

That's not a flaw in that rest system if that happens, that would be a flaw in encounter-design.

AKA: You're using a fucking strawman. You're saying "if random encounters and other encounters are not demanding, the system will not work."

I agree completely. So let's hope the developers are not lying when they talk about the difficulty level.

 

[Grunker]

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Where did you learn to say this? Or are you just spewing this bullshit because you've learned it's decline in platformers on Nintendo?

For once a mechanic we can use, and that's when you're suddenly all Codexy? Bitch please.

Explain to me how it's in any way dumbed down here compared to your beloved cooldown-system which reduces resource-management to a question of "save dailies for boss-fight, use everything else each fight."

Tell me why is it a good thing when you are neck deep in a dungeon but you can't stop playing because you are not near a village. You have some important thing to do? To bad, finish the dungeon first and go back to the village, where you can save. I don't know about you, but I have other things to do besides gaming, and I want to stop my gaming session whenever I want.

Luckily for you there's a casual difficulty setting you can play why the rest of us enjoy good mechanics for those willing to invest their time in "the good shit".

In other words, what you say is part of why we can't have nice things.

 

[J_C]

What a witty retort! Does this mean that you don't have an answer?

I can invest time, but there are always cases when I can't invest enough. So I shouldn't play that game? Fuck you!

 

[DalekFlay]

That's not a flaw in that rest system if that happens, that would be a flaw in encounter-design.

AKA: You're using a fucking strawman. You're saying "if random encounters and other encounters are not demanding, the system will not work."

I agree completely. So let's hope the developers are not lying when they talk about the difficulty level.

How is that a flaw in fucking encounter design? It doesn't matter what kind of encounter I am in when my wife says it's time to fuck or my kid breaks his fucking leg you basement loner. Sometimes you need to just quit a fucking game.

 

[Grunker]

What a witty retort! Does this mean that you don't have an answer?

My answer is: If a game requires an extra time investment to be fully enjoyed, I'm willing to give it that. I don't see how that's a non-answer. And what's wrong with alt-tabbing or leaving the game open if you suddenly have to leave? This honestly doesn't happen much for me. Also, if you're so mad about this, what's wrong with just not using the hardcore difficulty setting?

I can invest time, but there are always cases when I can't invest enough. So I shouldn't play that game? Fuck you!

YES! OUT WITH IT MAN! YOURS IS THE FURY!

Honestly? I think we're discussing details that won't matter too much in the overall evaluation of these games. I'm concerned about the cooldown-system because I'm pretty fearful what it will mean for resource-management, but ultimately I'm just glad so many RPGs are seeing the light of day, and I'm pretty sure I'll enjoy all of them. Remember that the Codex is characterized by being an echo-chamber of people who generally agree very much on the general state of one issue - and when people like that disagree, nukes go off.

 

[Grunker]

That's not a flaw in that rest system if that happens, that would be a flaw in encounter-design.

AKA: You're using a fucking strawman. You're saying "if random encounters and other encounters are not demanding, the system will not work."

I agree completely. So let's hope the developers are not lying when they talk about the difficulty level.

How is that a flaw in fucking encounter design? It doesn't matter what kind of encounter I am in when my wife says it's time to fuck or my kid breaks his fucking leg you basement loner.

I was responding to Roguey's argument you fucking dumbass. Go back and read it, and then reply again.

 

[Roguey]

That's not a flaw in that rest system if that happens, that would be a flaw in encounter-design.

AKA: You're using a fucking strawman. You're saying "if random encounters and other encounters are not demanding, the system will not work."

I agree completely. So let's hope the developers are not lying when they talk about the difficulty level.

Individual encounters can't be too demanding or else you wind up with an unenjoyable slog. Either that or there are only 3-4 battles within a single dungeon.

 

[Grunker]

That's not a flaw in that rest system if that happens, that would be a flaw in encounter-design.

AKA: You're using a fucking strawman. You're saying "if random encounters and other encounters are not demanding, the system will not work."

I agree completely. So let's hope the developers are not lying when they talk about the difficulty level.

Individual encounters can't be too demanding

We disagree.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Are you fucking blind? How are you going to rest after each combat when resting means potential random encounter? If you run out of resources this way, you have to start the entire dungeon all over again.

"Hmm, I can't save at all in this dungeon. This means I can take no chances. All right, going to kill this single encounter which will surely only put a minor dent in my total available resources. Now to rest. Oh look, random monsters. Just another minor dent. Repeat if necessary. Rest to full. Repeat as often as possible. Oh, this one mid-dungeon encounter took away more than I'm comfortable with. Time to make the long trek back to the village to rest in safety."

That's not a flaw in that rest system if that happens, that would be a flaw in encounter-design.

AKA: You're using a fucking strawman. You're saying "if random encounters and other encounters are not demanding, the system will not work."

I agree completely. So let's hope the developers are not lying when they talk about the difficulty level.

If resting in the middle of a dungeon only has the potential of causing a random encounter, that's what it's gonna be like. Because you either go ahead and battle the next 3 orcs with a fucked up party, or you sit down for a while hoping you aren't found by 3 orcs before you're completely healthy.

To put it simply

1) rest

2) did a monster find you?

a) yes - rest again

b) no - you're good to go

3) did you finish the dungeon?

a) yes -

b) no - better luck with resting_random_encounter_% next time

This can be prevented with limited resources like food rations (unless they can be hoarded) or time limits for quests (you rested for a week inside the cave, the dragon not only ate the princess, but he already digested her and used her as fertilizer for his cabbage patch), but we don't know much about that other than "there will be no healing spells as you know it" (paraphrasing Sawyer).

 

[Palikka]

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Where did you learn to say this? Or are you just spewing this bullshit because you've learned it's decline in platformers on Nintendo?

For once a mechanic we can use, and that's when you're suddenly all Codexy? Bitch please.

Explain to me how it's in any way dumbed down here compared to your beloved cooldown-system which reduces resource-management to a question of "save dailies for boss-fight, use everything else each fight."

Tell me why is it a good thing when you are neck deep in a dungeon but you can't stop playing because you are not near a village. You have some important thing to do? To bad, finish the dungeon first and go back to the village, where you can save. I don't know about you, but I have other things to do besides gaming, and I want to stop my gaming session whenever I want.

How about making the town saves perma saves which you can load up whenever you want and then make the in-dungeon saves work like in roguelikes, meaning you can save/quit in the dungeon anytime you want but the saves will be deleted when you load the game again.

 

[GordonHalfman]

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Where did you learn to say this? Or are you just spewing this bullshit because you've learned it's decline in platformers on Nintendo?

For once a mechanic we can use, and that's when you're suddenly all Codexy? Bitch please.

Explain to me how it's in any way dumbed down here compared to your beloved cooldown-system which reduces resource-management to a question of "save dailies for boss-fight, use everything else each fight."

Tell me why is it a good thing when you are neck deep in a dungeon but you can't stop playing because you are not near a village. You have some important thing to do? To bad, finish the dungeon first and go back to the village, where you can save. I don't know about you, but I have other things to do besides gaming, and I want to stop my gaming session whenever I want.

If that's the only problem then it's not really a problem, any sensible implementation of this will allow save on exit. (See Dark Souls as an example.)

 

[suejak]

If that's the only problem then it's not really a problem, any sensible implementation of this will allow save on exit. (See Dark Souls as an example.)

Sounds to me like all you gotta do to savescum is reboot the game! Nice!

 

[FeelTheRads]

This fucking place.

Except they're not talking about replacing slings with spells. But if you actually read instead of slamming your face in the keyboard which is what you usually do, maybe you'd have seen they said they want to give mages more options because OMG WHO WANTS TO PLAY MAGES IF THEY CANT DO SHIT ALL THE TIME LIKE THE FIGHTERS.

Ah, wait, maybe you needed some more attention from me again?

 

[groke]

I just wanna point out that my Brofist-to-post count ratio is significantly better than yours. Does this upset you?

And I (a confirmed shitposter) have an even better brofist-to-post ratio! How do you feel now, suejak?

 

[FeelTheRads]

What a witty retort! Does this mean that you don't have an answer?

I can invest time, but there are always cases when I can't invest enough. So I shouldn't play that game? Fuck you!

But does it mean that because you don't like it each and every game is forbidden to have it? No, fuck you. Play the games you can play. There's no obligation to play everything. Not everything has to be the same fucking thing just because you might not like it. Fucking Bethard is what you are. You should stick around there with like-minded individuals.

 

[groke]

I would love for Obsidian to trap players in a dungeon until they die or successfully complete it (like in KotC, maybe?), but thanks to casual shits like you there is absolutely no chance of this happening.

Like in skyrim, right?

Does Skyrim actually lock you in dungeons? I know it does that dumb shit where when you get to the end of the linear underground passage (read: dungeon) it loops back to the start, but I don't remember ever not being able to backtrack. Maybe I raegquit too soon???

 

[Shannow]

Allowing saves at only certain checkpoints are the worst, dumbed down console mechanics. Kill it with fire.

Where did you learn to say this? Or are you just spewing this bullshit because you've learned it's decline in platformers on Nintendo?

For once a mechanic we can use, and that's when you're suddenly all Codexy? Bitch please.

Explain to me how it's in any way dumbed down here compared to your beloved cooldown-system which reduces resource-management to a question of "save dailies for boss-fight, use everything else each fight."

Tell me why is it a good thing when you are neck deep in a dungeon but you can't stop playing because you are not near a village. You have some important thing to do? To bad, finish the dungeon first and go back to the village, where you can save. I don't know about you, but I have other things to do besides gaming, and I want to stop my gaming session whenever I want.

You realize that a simple save in town + auto-save on exit (like in any iron-man-mode) solves your "problem" without changing anything about the effects of the mechanic, right?

Anyway, lots of hate in this thread. Me like.