Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[LeStryfe79]

Yes! Hopefully they continue to codex it up through dev time as well.

 

[IDtenT]

Tbh, from how I see magic there should be only stamina and some interruptable wind-up as you conjure the spell (through pronouncing runes, waving wand, whatever) where being interrupted has consequences (like for ruins, casting the runes that have already been pronounced/signalled/whatever on oneself). I'd be okay with having to scribe scrolls beforehand or whatever.

 

[ironyuri]

General Discussion 43%

Fucking Jaesun. How does he work? Oh that's right, shitty hypocritical one liners, I forgot.


GarfunkeL

General Discussion 5,026 43%

Jaesun

General Discussion 4,126 23%

 

[evdk]

General Discussion 43%

Fucking Jaesun. How does he work? Oh that's right, shitty hypocritical one liners, I forgot.


GarfunkeL

General Discussion 5,026 43%

Jaesun

General Discussion 4,126 23%

Which is less. What's your fucking point?

 

[ironyuri]

General Discussion 43%

Fucking Jaesun. How does he work? Oh that's right, shitty hypocritical one liners, I forgot.


GarfunkeL

General Discussion 5,026 43%

Jaesun

General Discussion 4,126 23%

Which is less. What's your fucking point?

5000 posts in /gd/ vs 4000 posts in /gd/, which is better and why? Discuss!!

My point is the pot is calling the kettle black. Jaesun's gd post count represents his second most posted-in sub-forum. But GarfunkeL is the /gd/tard, apparently.

GG.

 

[Roguey]

Ah, I can live with spell level lockout, especially if its daily thing and not encounter/combat thing. If abilities/spells refresh anew for each combat, well, then the combat devolves into a fairly simple manner of brainless bashing like it was in DA and ME.

The spells do refresh for each combat but not for the highest level spells you can cast (those require resting and we have no idea if/how resting is restricted). He's doing it this way because this is seemingly how most people played the Infinity Engine games according to his own observations:
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/60875-merged-cooldown-thread/page__view__findpost__p__1220605

What I've been consistently saying is that in the IE games, most players did regenerate their spells (through rest) after the end of combat, if not after the end of one combat, usually after two or three. We have some players in this thread insisting that they never do that. I'm not doing to dispute them, but I certainly know what I've watched players actually do (rest constantly and backtrack to rest constantly).

 

[Infinitron]

GarfunkeL
Just read this:

 

[Volourn]

"ut seriously Garfunkel, cooldowns are far, far better than D&D vancian bullcrap"

IGNORANT FUKKIN' IDIOT MORAN DETECTED.

 

[Roguey]

Volourn describe to me how resting every fight or every other fight is functionally different than a cooldown that resets some of your spells after every or every other fight.

 

[GarfunkeL]

Hmm, very interesting. I agree that apparently many people, even on the Codex, rest-scumm all the time. Personally I love going through a dungeon and saving spells for tough fights or trying to think of a new tactic in a fight because I've exhausted the usual encounter-clearers. As long as it's not the DA/ME way, where each and every ability is spammed all the time and you regain hp/mana instantly after combat and you don't even have to worry about mana in-combat because mana potions are so abundant.

Thanks for posting that.

EDIT: IE games should have restricted resting more, though NWN 1/2 was the worst in that sense - though with tiny parties it was more acceptable if you played a caster. KotC did it pretty darn well.

 

[Captain Shrek]

"ut seriously Garfunkel, cooldowns are far, far better than D&D vancian bullcrap"

IGNORANT FUKKIN' IDIOT MORAN DETECTED.

 

[Captain Shrek]

Volourn describe to me how resting every fight or every other fight is functionally different than a cooldown that resets some of your spells after every or every other fight.

Hi.

I see that you did not reply to my (lol) analysis of Sawyer's 5 point's of RPG games he learnt.

 

[Roguey]

Hi.

I see that you did not reply to my (lol) analysis of Sawyer's 5 point's of RPG games he learnt.

It would have been a waste of time, especially since on at least one point you made up a position you think he had and railed against that.

 

[Infinitron]

Oh, shut up about the cooldowns already.

Donations have shot up again, we have over 100k today already with 7 hours to go.

 

[Volourn]

"Volourn describe to me how resting every fight or every other fight is functionally different than a cooldown that resets some of your spells after every or every other fight."

Don't rest spam. People who feel the need to rest after every fight in any system are pathetic pieces of shit. Nor should combat in a game be designed where you have to rest after every fight. If a game lets you just spam your strongest spells every fight then rest afetrwrads it is designed poorly.

Example: Most idiots who played NWN OC spammed their spells every fight, rested, and ported out and abck every single fight then whined it was too easy. i, on the other hand, tried to go complete each dungeon or at lerast every level of a dungeon (since the OC and all CRPGs are combat heavy) and only used the portal stone when the dungeon was complete.

If I were designing a game with vancian casting system (or any magic system); I would do the following: can only rest once every 24 hours, if you rest in a dungeon/enemy terriritory ther ebe a high chance of a dangerous random encounter (not just a random easy enemy) or in some instances you wouldn't be able to rest at all (afterall, tehre's no way should you be able to rest in an orc camp or a wizard tower without ebing swarmed by every enemy there) amongst other devious things.

Again, if you rest after eveyr battle you are a piece of crap. If you prefer any system over vancian then fuck off. I dislike mana but I could make a mana system work. But,a full flege cooldown system is weaksn tuff thoguh can be playable fid esigned for it but ti'sa whole different system ie. DA's cooldown system worked uin that sense that every battlle largely forced you to use your best spells/abiliities as much as possibvle. That's alright and cna be fun but there is no long term strategy involved. Not as cool.

 

[Captain Shrek]

Hi.

I see that you did not reply to my (lol) analysis of Sawyer's 5 point's of RPG games he learnt.

It would have been a waste of time, especially since on at least one point you made up a position you think he had and railed against that.

Did you see that at that point I pointed to an alternative?

 

[kris]

Hmm, very interesting. I agree that apparently many people, even on the Codex, rest-scumm all the time.

In the gold box games I sure didn't do this. But I think the sleep interruption worked better there. If I really needed to rest I normally went back to the city. Lack of spells was countered by wands and scrolls.

 

[Roguey]

"People who feel the need to rest after every fight in any system are pathetic pieces of shit."

I like using spells. Because not using spells means "select all, auto attack, win" which is repetitive and dull. This requires resting every few fights so that I may keep using spells.

"If a game lets you just spam your strongest spells every fight then rest afetrwrads it is designed poorly."

But I thought you liked BG (even if it's "overrated"), BG2, IWD and Torment. Though in Torment you had to backtrack to a safe place to rest since you couldn't do it in a "dungeon" period. This didn't make it harder or improve the experience in any way.

 

[Volourn]

Im like them but not without flaws. I tried not to take advantage of the ability to spam rest either making thema lot mroe fun.


"I like using spells. Because not using spells means "select all, auto attack, win" which is repetitive and dull. This requires resting every few fights so that I may keep using spells."

You are an idiot, unimaginative, and a horrible RPGer. You are a fukkin' wizard. You ain't limited to crossbows or daggers. FFS Use scrolls, wands, and other items to help out. FFS

 

[GarfunkeL]

Hmm, very interesting. I agree that apparently many people, even on the Codex, rest-scumm all the time.

In the gold box games I sure didn't do this. But I think the sleep interruption worked better there. If I really needed to rest I normally went back to the city. Lack of spells was countered by wands and scrolls.

Me neither. It was awesomely exciting trying to struggle through a dungeon when low on spells and utilizing wands and scrolls carefully. Problem in IE games was that almost always the random monsters "waking" you up were not a challenge at all, so it devolved into what Roguey described - select all, auto-attack, win - which was boring and silly.

 

[Hobz]

Ah, I can live with spell level lockout, especially if its daily thing and not encounter/combat thing. If abilities/spells refresh anew for each combat, well, then the combat devolves into a fairly simple manner of brainless bashing like it was in DA and ME.

So according to you attrition is the ONLY mechanism preventing a game from being a "brainless bashing" fest ? What if the game could end up being harder this way because each encounter is designed around the need to use all your ressources flawlessly instead of being able to save your bigger spells for harder fights ? what if all the fights were the "hard" ones ?

I'm not saying getting rid of attrition is the best choice, but it's pretty silly to assume it's automatically a very wrong move.

 

[Infinitron]

Ah, I can live with spell level lockout, especially if its daily thing and not encounter/combat thing. If abilities/spells refresh anew for each combat, well, then the combat devolves into a fairly simple manner of brainless bashing like it was in DA and ME.

So according to you attrition is the ONLY mechanism preventing a game from being a "brainless bashing" fest ? What if the game could end up being harder this way because each encounter is designed around the need to use all your ressources flawlessly instead of being able to save your bigger spells for harder fights ? what if all the fights were the "hard" ones ?

I'm not saying getting rid of attrition is the best choice, but it's pretty silly to assume it's automatically a very wrong move.

This argument is stupid.

The objective here isn't to create the most challenging game possible. The objective is to create a game that's similar to the Infinity Engine games, and you can't do that if you remove attrition entirely.

 

[Arkeus]

Isn't this talk of no matter anyway, as they have chosen attrition to be important (or so it seems)?
Btw, i also agree of their ways of doing it- you may talk about how awesome it was to play BG2 with scrolls and wands, but the truth is that until you knew it by heart it was next to impossible to attempt this. Having the lesser spells be encounter-based while the greater spells be attrition-based makes sense for encouraging the players to not spam rest.

 

[Volourn]

nO, IT WON'T. sO.. ISNTEAD OF SPAMMING BOLTS, WANDS, AND POTIONS YOU NOW SPAM GARABGE LOW LEVEL SPELLS? FFS HOW DUM R U

The people who spam resta re gonan still spam rest b/c they gonan want their uber spells available. Those who spam rest are gonna wait as long a sit takes for cooldowns to be over as well. That's the fukkin' way the cookie crumbles.

 

[Hobz]

Oh, shut up about the cooldowns already.

Donations have shot up again, we have over 100k today already with 7 hours to go.

Assuming paypal ends up at 100k, we need 7k per hours to get the 2d big city.

Have fun looking at this every hour now