Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Arkeus]

But I honesty can't think of anyone who'd want to play on non-expert. I hope it's the default choice.

I don't think so. Dumbfucks would complain, because they don't have enough braincells to find the option and turn it off.

As "expert" is the "make everything stronger as well as lock on every toggles that increases difficulty like hiding skillchecks", i very much doubt it's the default option yeah.

 

[Aeschylus]

Taking a quick break from the Oldschool RPG Dick-Measuring Contest, the Kickstarter just had its most profitable hour since the first couple days of the campaign. It's looking good for 3.5m.

 

[J_C]

From Obsidian Forums:

This is less and less what I thought the game mechanics would entail.

Quest/goal experience is a hugh let-down for me. No traditional healing -- I'm with Monte on this, so I guess I'm failing my intelligence check on that point.

Completely takes the wind out of my sails. With less than 30 hours to go, I have a lot of re-evaluating to do with regard to enjoyment factor versus pledge level.

I so much wanted this to be more in line with the older I.E. games.

WAAH WAAH!, no grinding and no spamming cure light/medium/serious/critical wounds! WAAH WAAH!

Seeing those suckers burn makes my balls tingle.

 

[oldmanpaco]

Where is your RACE TRAITOR tag Aeschylus?

 

[J_C]

Taking a quick break from the Oldschool RPG Dick-Measuring Contest, the Kickstarter just had its most profitable hour since the first couple days of the campaign. It's looking good for 3.5m.

Wow, it seems that if the last rush is big enough, we can reach 3.7 million at the end with paypal.

 

[Aeschylus]

Where is your RACE TRAITOR tag Aeschylus?

Hm, that's a good question. I put a lot into the Kickstarter itself and so I didn't really feel the need to contribute to the Codex fund, but maybe I'll put in a few bucks for the hell of it. Or maybe not.

 

[aVENGER]

Tim and I would rather not give XP for general killin' because it leads to a lot of weird/degenerate scenarios, but I have no problem with having quests oriented specifically around killing and receiving XP for achieving sub-objectives/the main goal.

Goal-based XP awards confirmed? (Bloodlines style)

 

[Jasede]

Josh, would you kindly comment, specifically, on:

* The lack of healing (or is stamina really the new hit points in this crazy brave new world?)

* The XP model (do I get XP for killing a wandering critter not linked to a quest)

You can heal Stamina pretty easily. Priests can do it for a lot of folks, but fighters can self-replenish and paladins can bark orders at you until you suck it up and Deal With It. Health can't be restored by magic; it requires you to rest to get it back.

Tim and I would rather not give XP for general killin' because it leads to a lot of weird/degenerate scenarios, but I have no problem with having quests oriented specifically around killing and receiving XP for achieving sub-objectives/the main goal.

edit: damn you aVENGER. See if I'll delete my post.

Spoiler

I won't.

 

[piydek]

Please stop discussing with that retarded Captain Shrek fuck.

 

[bminorkey]

Also, kudos to Josh for sticking with permadeath.

But I honesty can't think of anyone who'd want to play on non-expert. I hope it's the default choice.

I can think of my scenario: I'll enable permanent death, but I'm probably not going to play Expert mode since I like seeing things like skill thresholds and missed dialogue options. I'll be enabling Ironman and probably Wretched (or w/e they're called), however. Does that count?

 

[oldmanpaco]

Josh, would you kindly comment, specifically, on:

* The lack of healing (or is stamina really the new hit points in this crazy brave new world?)

* The XP model (do I get XP for killing a wandering critter not linked to a quest)

You can heal Stamina pretty easily. Priests can do it for a lot of folks, but fighters can self-replenish and paladins can bark orders at you until you suck it up and Deal With It. Health can't be restored by magic; it requires you to rest to get it back.

Tim and I would rather not give XP for general killin' because it leads to a lot of weird/degenerate scenarios, but I have no problem with having quests oriented specifically around killing and receiving XP for achieving sub-objectives/the main goal.

edit: damn you aVENGER. See if I'll delete my post.

Spoiler

I won't.

So the question is when will health be damaged instead of stamina?

 

[piydek]

Please stop discussing with that retarded Captain Shrek fuck.

There is that ignore button. Press it speshul kid.

Dumbfuck indeed. As you've probably noticed, your trolling is, although laughably bad, still quite efficient as you manage to pull of plenty of reactions. It's not about my ability to ignore you, but about the thread.

 

[Captain Shrek]

So the question is when will health be damaged instead of stamina?

It will be a dampner on health:

e.g. 100 health + 100 stamina.

Hit for damage 35. Stamina lost 35. health lost (2 % of 35)

In that form.

 

[Jasede]

Josh, would you kindly comment, specifically, on:

* The lack of healing (or is stamina really the new hit points in this crazy brave new world?)

* The XP model (do I get XP for killing a wandering critter not linked to a quest)

You can heal Stamina pretty easily. Priests can do it for a lot of folks, but fighters can self-replenish and paladins can bark orders at you until you suck it up and Deal With It. Health can't be restored by magic; it requires you to rest to get it back.

Tim and I would rather not give XP for general killin' because it leads to a lot of weird/degenerate scenarios, but I have no problem with having quests oriented specifically around killing and receiving XP for achieving sub-objectives/the main goal.

edit: damn you aVENGER. See if I'll delete my post.

Spoiler

I won't.

So the question is when will health be damaged instead of stamina?

We don't know. Judging from the update only I'd say every damage done also damages Health to a small extent to maintain attrition but the way it was phrased it was ambiguous and may well not be the case. We'll have to wait and see.

 

[piydek]

I like the idea of stamina/health. It does not make sense for a person to go from 10 HP to 150 HP over the course of a game. It does make sense to go from 10 Stamina to 150 Stamina but to remain at 10 HP.

Hopefully health will be damaged by things like critical hits, certain spells or if some damage threshold for a hit is made.

edit: And of course for running out of stamina.

Sawyer said in an interview for gamebanshee that all hits will drain health as well, not just critical ones. But they'll drain health relatively slow copared to their draining stamina. And health does not regenrate.

 

[Jarpie]

This is just so priceless, I haven't had this fun reading the forums in a while;
Sawyer says:

Tim and I would rather not give XP for general killin' because it leads to a lot of weird/degenerate scenarios, but I have no problem with having quests oriented specifically around killing and receiving XP for achieving sub-objectives/the main goal.

Monte Carlo:

Sorry, I don't understand the answer. Are you telling me that every single encounter in this game has an objective? What's the "degenerate" bit all about?

Srsly, this is a big deal to me and possibly others. The XP mechanic genuinely makes me wonder.

And then Sawyer responds to that with:

Gameplay degeneration occurs when a player engages in gameplay not because they enjoy that gameplay but because the game's mechanics put the player at a disadvantage for not taking advantage of it. Rest spamming is one example. Wholesale slaughter/genocide is another. Quests that involve a peaceful option to resolve that get turned around after completion when the player murders the saved parties is a familiar expression of this sort of degeneration. If XP is linked to quests and objectives within quests, the player has much more freedom to resolve those quests in whatever way he or she wants, whether that means talking through it, fighting, sneaking around, or using some mixture of skills/scripted environment objects to reach the goal.

Love the direction they are taking the whole EXP system.

 

[evdk]

So the question is when will health be damaged instead of stamina?

It will be a dampner on health:

e.g. 100 health + 100 stamina.

Hit for damage 35. Stamina lost 35. health lost (2 % of 35)

In that form.

Source (I presume in good faith that it's not your posterior)?

 

[Jasede]

I love that bit you posted, Jarpie. I remember finishing quests in Baldur's Gate, then killing the questgiver to get more XP.

 

[Hobz]

Wow, it seems that if the last rush is big enough, we can reach 3.7 million at the end with paypal.

We need another stretch goal !

On a side note the health/stamina is looking really great, I'm genuinely curious to know what is wrong with such a system for people complaining about it.

 

[Captain Shrek]

So the question is when will health be damaged instead of stamina?

It will be a dampner on health:

e.g. 100 health + 100 stamina.

Hit for damage 35. Stamina lost 35. health lost (2 % of 35)

In that form.

Source (I presume in good faith that it's not your posterior)?

As I said e.g. Expamplii gracia. As an example.

 

[evdk]

I meant in general, not your bloody example.

 

[Jasede]

Wow, it seems that if the last rush is big enough, we can reach 3.7 million at the end with paypal.

We need another stretch goal !

On a side note the health/stamina is looking really great, I'm genuinely curious to know what is wrong with such a system for people complaining about it.

They're worried about two things:
1) You could just sit around and let Stamina regenerate, thus reducing challenge
2) You could spam Stamina regenerating abilities, thus reducing challenge

This could be circumvented through a bunch of encounter design choices or some mechanical changes. On the other hand, Obsidian hasn't yet proven they can design good combat encounters. With all that said I think they're really going to try this time. It's their chance to shine, so they'll either shine brightly or fail spectacularly. And I feel it'd be in our best interest if the outcome were to be the former.

 

[FeelTheRads]

This could be circumvented through a bunch of encounter design choices or some mechanical changes.

So can rest-spam. So I guess they haven't invented the perfect system.

 

[oldmanpaco]

I like the idea of stamina/health. It does not make sense for a person to go from 10 HP to 150 HP over the course of a game. It does make sense to go from 10 Stamina to 150 Stamina but to remain at 10 HP.

Hopefully health will be damaged by things like critical hits, certain spells or if some damage threshold for a hit is made.

edit: And of course for running out of stamina.

Sawyer said in an interview for gamebanshee that all hits will drain health as well, not just critical ones. But they'll drain health relatively slow copared to their draining stamina. And health does not regenrate.

That's a little worrying. The whole point of a stamina system is that you have a small amount of HPs. It doesn't make sense to have 10x as many HP at the end of the game as the start. A system where you take damage from every 'hit' means HP will probably increase throughout the game. Of course it it's like 1 HP per level that is not too bad although I would prefer it locked at the start.

 

[Jasede]

This could be circumvented through a bunch of encounter design choices or some mechanical changes.

So can rest-spam. So I guess they haven't invented the perfect system.

Maybe not but they're trying something different and I for one hope they are successful. It'd be nice to play a good RPG. I don't quite remember what it feels like.