Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Duraframe300]

I still have trouble seeing the evidence apart from him playing through Skyrim and making jokes. There's no commentary about game mechanics or anything else that would actually be relevant.

By the same logic, I can name several things that other rpg designers enjoyed that are questionable as well.

Also I have trouble seeing the Skyrim insperation at all in material we have seen so far about P:E.

 

[Blaine]

By the same logic, I can name several things that other rpg designers enjoyed that are questionable as well.

It's mostly a joke (to me, anyway), and/or a way to poke fun at certain posters' ideals of celebrity developers being untouchable paragons of good taste and sophistication in gaming and game design.

Lori and Corey Cole (creators of Quest for Glory) played and enjoyed World of Warcraft for years, and as silly as it is, that still bothers me.

 

[Rake]

J.E. Sawyer loves Skyrim
Tim Cain loves Oblivion
Avellone cannot into Arcanum

The LEGENDARY GAME DESIGNERS(TM) have spoken.

 

[Cosmo]

J.E. Sawyer loves Skyrim
Tim Cain loves Oblivion

I suspect they judge those games as designers, not CRPG fans : they like their design, because, paradoxically, streamlining require quite a bit of effort and designing skills. Of course those efforts are totally wasted but that's beside the point.
Add to that the fact that game companies that want to stay in the arena don't have the luxury to alienate big players that could become partners, nor can they ignore gaming trends.

 

[Rake]

J.E. Sawyer loves Skyrim
Tim Cain loves Oblivion

I suspect they judge those games as designers, not CRPG fans : they like their design, because, paradoxically, streamlining require quite a bit of effort and designing skills. Of course those efforts are totally wasted but that's beside the point.
Add to that the fact that game companies that want to stay in the arena don't have the luxury to alienate big players that could become partners, nor can they ignore gaming trends.

I know, i was kidding. Skyrim sold so many copies that now the whole AAA RPG industry tries to mimic it. DA:I, TW3, Cyberpunk etc. It makes sense for developers to play it and try to find what that game had that made every retard out there come buckets.
I think Gaider had said something similar. That he doesn't like modern RPGs, but he plays them for market research.
Even if they really love these games, that doesn't mean they are bad designers, just that they have terrible taste.

 

[Cosmo]

Unfortunately i also suspect that after several years in one given field (here the VG industry), someone's hopes will model themselves after what they can realistically achieve. Fortunately we have kickstarter now, which is a real breath of fresh air for our beloved designer's brains and integrity (even if they don't fully realize it means something else than popamole is possible).

 

[Rake]

That is the main reason i think Obsidian played it safer than inXile. They are an AAA company for years, making games that don't sell as much as other games that are more retard friently. After a decade that had an effect to alter their perseptions about what gamers want. They need some time to return in their old mentality. Fargo was more distanced from the AAA industry, so with his return he went full old school. He doesn't make his games for everyone as he said.
On the other hand some of Sawyer's comments gave me a vibe that he wants a game that can be played by everyone. "People don't react well even on minimum chalenge" it sounds to me that it comes from the complains about New Vegas that it was not open enough because you couldn't kill anything in every direction from lvl1.
I'm sure he understands that P:E has a diffirent audience, but i'm not sure he understands how diffirent.



And he considers Bethesda fans legitimate gamers aand not the waste of space that they are

 

[Kem0sabe]

I know, i was kidding. Skyrim sold so many copies that now the whole AAA RPG industry tries to mimic it. DA:I, TW3, Cyberpunk etc. It makes sense for developers to play it and try to find what that game had that made every retard out there come buckets.
I think Gaider had said something similar. That he doesn't like modern RPGs, but he plays them for market research.
Even if they really love these games, that doesn't mean they are bad designers, just that they have terrible taste.

My problem with Skyrim was not the game world itself, i think a lot of people and designers appreciate what Bethesda managed to achieve in that regard.

Skyrim's weakness was in it's gameplay mechanisms, the combat especially, and in it's C&C. If say Cyberpunk manages Skyrim's level of world design and interactivity with the quality of story of Witcher and a good combat system, then let them be inspired by what Bethesda did, i see no problem in that.

 

[Rake]

I know, i was kidding. Skyrim sold so many copies that now the whole AAA RPG industry tries to mimic it. DA:I, TW3, Cyberpunk etc. It makes sense for developers to play it and try to find what that game had that made every retard out there come buckets.
I think Gaider had said something similar. That he doesn't like modern RPGs, but he plays them for market research.
Even if they really love these games, that doesn't mean they are bad designers, just that they have terrible taste.

My problem with Skyrim was not the game world itself, i think a lot of people and designers appreciate what Bethesda managed to achieve in that regard.

Skyrim's weakness was in it's gameplay mechanisms, the combat especially, and in it's C&C. If say Cyberpunk manages Skyrim's level of world design and interactivity with the quality of story of Witcher and a good combat system, then let them be inspired by what Bethesda did, i see no problem in that.

But that's what make the game succesfull. I have read comments from Bethfans that "New Vegas factions are not that good. You can't even join all of them in the game". They don't want C&C, they want to be able to do anything at anytime. C without C.
As for Cyberpunk, IF is the word here. If they manage what you say i won't have a problem either, but i don't hold my breath.

 

[Kem0sabe]

But that's what make the game succesfull. I have read comments from Bethfans that "New Vegas factions are not that good. You can't even join all of them in the game". They don't want C&C, they want to be able to do anything at anytime. C without C.
As for Cyberpunk, IF is the word here. If they manage what you say i won't have a problem either, but i don't hold my breath.

I'm keeping my expectations in check for both Cyberpunk and the Witcher 3. It's amazing how say a game like Chaos Chronicles, from a developer whom i dislike for raping the JA franchise manages to win me over with their design decisions and game mechanics while CD Project whose games i loved so far, seem to be getting themselves deeper into with every bit of info they put out there about their new projects.

 

[Rake]

Has to do with target audiences. Chaos Chronicles targets ToEE fans. CDR targets Skyrim fans.
The reason that while i'm an Obsidian fan, i haven't played half of their games. Sometimes i know when a game is not targeted at me.
Unlike most Codexers i don't play every game that has "RPG" written on the box.

 

[Roguey]

Skyrim is a perfectly fine hiking simulator. I don't see anything wrong with Josh playing it for 95 hours. What you should be concerned about is Feargus Urquhart playing XCOM: Enemy Unknown for 223 hours.

 

[Jaesun]

 

[Kem0sabe]

Calling it now, XCOM RPG is Obsidian's secret project

 

[J_C]

Calling it now, XCOM RPG is Obsidian's secret project

PLEASE GOD MAKE IT TRUE!!!!

 

[Infinitron]

Skyrim is a perfectly fine hiking simulator. I don't see anything wrong with Josh playing it for 95 hours. What you should be concerned about is Feargus Urquhart playing XCOM: Enemy Unknown for 223 hours.

He left the computer on between turns? Honestly I'm not sure the man has that kind of free time for any game.

 

[Rake]

Calling it now, XCOM RPG is Obsidian's secret project

PLEASE GOD MAKE IT TRUE!!!!

KoTOR 3 - Fallout:LA - M&M RPG - XCOM RPG.
You have to choose one.

 

[Diablo169]

I would play the shit out of that.

 

[J_C]

Calling it now, XCOM RPG is Obsidian's secret project

PLEASE GOD MAKE IT TRUE!!!!

KoTOR 3 - Fallout:LA - M&M RPG - XCOM RPG.
You have to choose one.

X-Might: Knights of the Fallout Magic!

 

[Turisas]

PLEASE GOD MAKE IT TRUE!!!!

Without the base management and R&D? You're just left with a bunch of dumb aliens to shoot.

 

[Roguey]

He left the computer on between turns? Honestly I'm not sure the man has that kind of free time for any game.

He got the achievement for killing over 500 aliens, unlike Josh. Though Josh actually finished it, unlike Feargus.

 

[Jaesun]

 

[Infinitron]

He left the computer on between turns? Honestly I'm not sure the man has that kind of free time for any game.

He got the achievement for killing over 500 aliens, unlike Josh. Though Josh actually finished it, unlike Feargus.

Oh, and another thing. How old are Feargus' kids?

 

[Cosmo]

That is the main reason i think Obsidian played it safer than inXile. They are an AAA company for years, making games that don't sell as much as other games that are more retard friently. After a decade that had an effect to alter their perseptions about what gamers want. They need some time to return in their old mentality. Fargo was more distanced from the AAA industry, so with his return he went full old school. He doesn't make his games for everyone as he said.
On the other hand some of Sawyer's comments gave me a vibe that he wants a game that can be played by everyone. "People don't react well even on minimum chalenge" it sounds to me that it comes from the complains about New Vegas that it was not open enough because you couldn't kill anything in every direction from lvl1.
I'm sure he understands that P:E has a diffirent audience, but i'm not sure he understands how diffirent.

Sawyer knows what he likes as a player, but feel his duty as a designer is to make enjoyable games for as many people as possible.
But rather than going the popamole way, he and the others decided to craft a game with modular difficulty, which is IMO the best choice possible when confronted to this kind of dilemma.

 

[Kem0sabe]

Thinking more about it, i think it would be the dream scifi RPG for many people here and the perfect direction for 2K to take the franchise in. More than Aliens, Mass Effect or KotOR.