Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker Builds and Strats Thread

[polo]

There were kinda 2 in my case. One more suited for real-time gameplay, the other excelling in turn based (although can be adjusted easily to work well in real-time also):

Vivi Tripper:

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...nd-strats-thread.124160/page-113#post-6080746

Bastard Sword Saint:

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...nd-strats-thread.124160/page-114#post-6121550

Oh yeah i think i saw the video of your biter when i was starting the game and didnt understand shit tbh. Its pretty sick now that i see it again.

 

[Desiderius]

There were kinda 2 in my case. One more suited for real-time gameplay, the other excelling in turn based (although can be adjusted easily to work well in real-time also):

Vivi Tripper:

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...nd-strats-thread.124160/page-113#post-6080746

Bastard Sword Saint:

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...nd-strats-thread.124160/page-114#post-6121550

Oh yeah i think i saw the video of your biter when i was starting the game and didnt understand shit tbh. Its pretty sick now that i see it again.

The approach he’s using there can be applied to any melee toon to increase their effectiveness. Currently have Tristian as main tank/DPS using those principles.

Dazzling Display is too slow. Use Lingering Dirge and Dreadful Carnage to get things Shaking. Archon’s Aura and Debilitating Strike are other all-purpose debuffs.

 

[polo]

Yeah as i was playing and learning about the game i had the recurring sensation that you could make tanks without armor in kingmaker, they give you a shitton of AC equipment and spells.

 

[Daidre]

Yeah as i was playing and learning about the game i had the recurring sensation that you could make tanks without armor in kingmaker, they give you a shitton of AC equipment and spells.

Pathfinder just upholds glorious legacy of 3.5 where best tanks always were some DEX based pansies in silken bathrobes.

 

[Desiderius]

Yeah as i was playing and learning about the game i had the recurring sensation that you could make tanks without armor in kingmaker, they give you a shitton of AC equipment and spells.

Pathfinder just upholds glorious legacy of 3.5 where best tanks always were some DEX based pansies in silken bathrobes.

No, the main thing I’m talking about learning from Hap is the power of STR-based melee using enlarging effects. Tristian is tanking because Frightful Aspect gives a big boost to AC and he’s my only toon who has it.

That’s mostly a late game thing. But having making Amiri a Freebooter so she can fight Enlarged with Lead Blades is something I’ve been doing most of the game and I learned that from Hap.

DEX melee struggles with damage.

 

[razvedchiki]

lets say you have a vanilla fighter specced into falcatas,isnt better to one wield the weapon for the added dmg plus crane wing?(plus have someone cast shield on him).

 

[Trashos]

Bastard Sword Saint:

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...nd-strats-thread.124160/page-114#post-6121550

When Haplo interviews adventurers who want to join his party, his first question is: Do you like Bastard Swords?

 

[Desiderius]

lets say you have a vanilla fighter specced into falcatas,isnt better to one wield the weapon for the added dmg plus crane wing?(plus have someone cast shield on him).

Then you’re talking a Monk splash. Pure Fighter snowballs nicely and doesn’t really need a few more AC. Best defense is a good offense. Double Falcata can get things dead fast since Fighter gets so much base to hit/damage boost from full BAB + Weapon Training + Duelist Gloves. Can handle Power Attack hit no problem. Can even add on Combat Expertise for that AC and fight with Helm that gives Will and cancels penalty since you don’t need mental stats for spells.

If you want to one-hand it go AD.

 

[Serus]

A quick question. Early after the game release, if i am not mistaken, you could take multiple combat tricks as a rogue. Is it still the case or was it patched at some point?

 

[Desiderius]

A quick question. Early after the game release, if i am not mistaken, you could take multiple combat tricks as a rogue. Is it still the case or was it patched at some point?

Still the case. Not as broken as it looks.

 

[Yosharian]

A quick question. Early after the game release, if i am not mistaken, you could take multiple combat tricks as a rogue. Is it still the case or was it patched at some point?

It was never patched, really it's a vague one in so far as RAW is concerned, Paizo has never outright stated that you can't take the feat multiple times and arguably each combat trick is a different feat.

Well actually one designer did refer to it only being taken one time and no published creature has ever taken it more than once so it's likely that the intention is for it to be a single use feat. But also there aren't that many choices for rogue talents so it's possible that Owlcat made the decision to allow multiple combat tricks to give rogues more options. Who knows.

 

[Haplo]

A quick question. Early after the game release, if i am not mistaken, you could take multiple combat tricks as a rogue. Is it still the case or was it patched at some point?

Still the case. Not as broken as it looks.

Hm... for many applications makes like Vivisectionists better then Fighters... same number of feats too (minus 1).

 

[Yosharian]

A quick question. Early after the game release, if i am not mistaken, you could take multiple combat tricks as a rogue. Is it still the case or was it patched at some point?

Still the case. Not as broken as it looks.

Hm... for many applications makes like Vivisectionists better then Fighters... same number of feats too (minus 1).

Vivisectionist isn't even supposed to get access to Combat Trick, there's nothing RAW that indicates they get access to Rogue talents at all. It's bonkers that they just added that to an already insanely powerful archetype.

Efe it's not 'fake news'. Read the fucking text on the Vivisectionist page:

"At 10th level or later, a vivisectionist may select the crippling strike rogue talent in place of a discovery."

"A vivisectionist may select the bleeding attack rogue talent in place of a discovery."

Nowhere does it state that Vivisectionists have access to the entire suite of rogue talents. It says precisely the opposite, that they only get access to a few specific ones, and even then only at specific times during their career.

 

[Serus]

I have 0 experience with druids in any d&d game (the hippy tree huggers they are ). But since there must be a first time to (almost) everything i'd like to try one in PK.
I have a vague idea what a caster druid should look like: pump wis (or cha) add a bit of con and dex, go nuts with cc and summoning spells.
But how one make/play a melee/shifter druid. Defender with pet (i like pets) but what stats, feats... I don't ask for complete build just some pointers. What this class is all about so to speak.

 

[Desiderius]

I have 0 experience with druids in any d&d game (the hippy tree huggers they are ). But since there must be a first time to (almost) everything i'd like to try one in PK.
I have a vague idea what a caster druid should look like: pump wis (or cha) add a bit of con and dex, go nuts with cc and summoning spells.
But how one make/play a melee/shifter druid. Defender with pet (i like pets) but what stats, feats... I don't ask for complete build just some pointers. What this class is all about so to speak.

Feyspeaker Displacer Beast (Mirror Image is the most powerful thing you can do for a melee toon, and only Feyspeaker gets it. Displacement too, but that can be cast on you by someone else. Image can't). Wild Shape (especially Smilodon form) mostly doesn't care about the slower BAB progression. Defender gets shapes two levels earlier and summons/pets get bonuses vs fey, which are some of your hardest opponents, but without Image should play more as "cast first round, then Charge in." Enlarging spells work with Wildshape (Animal Growth doesn't) so you'll want someone who can keep you large. There's a Cloak you can get early that gives you a free Trip with your bites, so building around that can be productive.

Natural Spell (casting while shaped) requires 13 WIS and Wolf Shape (lvl 4 for Defender, 6 for Feyspeaker), so keep that in mind if you go Feyspeaker.

 

[Sykar]

lets say you have a vanilla fighter specced into falcatas,isnt better to one wield the weapon for the added dmg plus crane wing?(plus have someone cast shield on him).

Then you’re talking a Monk splash. Pure Fighter snowballs nicely and doesn’t really need a few more AC. Best defense is a good offense. Double Falcata can get things dead fast since Fighter gets so much base to hit/damage boost from full BAB + Weapon Training + Duelist Gloves. Can handle Power Attack hit no problem. Can even add on Combat Expertise for that AC and fight with Helm that gives Will and cancels penalty since you don’t need mental stats for spells.

If you want to one-hand it go AD.

How well do the fighter archetypes fare against the base class? I know TSS is considered weak. I think I read recently that Two Handed is not that great either but I got no idea about Aldori Defender.

 

[Desiderius]

How well do the fighter archetypes fare against the base class? I know TSS is considered weak. I think I read recently that Two Handed is not that great either but I got no idea about Aldori Defender.

They all have their strengths. One thing I've overlooked on THF is the snowballing bonus to Sunder Armor. That could really come in handy on higher difficulties where the hardest foes have a ton of armor tacked on and you can get your CMB almost arbitrarily high with the right party comp.

TSS9 is nice to give your shield bonus to touch AC which becomes a factor late (when the great Towers show up), but sword and shield is mostly undersupported.

I had a lot of fun with an AD8/Thug/Bard using Disarming Strike. Disarmed toons keep trying to attack untrained in Unarmed combat, triggering AoOs for all around. The big payoff there is Steel Net at AD8. Along with Crane Wing and some way to get a decent Mirror Image you'll have a lot of staying power in melee, if not a ton of straight damage. Aldori Dueling Mastery is a nice quality of life early feat.

CMs are implemented as standard actions, so you could also combine with Freebooter 10 which has Freebooter's Bane Move action to make a resilient tank/debuffer in the middle of combat.

 

[Haplo]

How well do the fighter archetypes fare against the base class? I know TSS is considered weak. I think I read recently that Two Handed is not that great either but I got no idea about Aldori Defender.

They all have their strengths. One thing I've overlooked on THF is the snowballing bonus to Sunder Armor. That could really come in handy on higher difficulties where the hardest foes have a ton of armor tacked on and you can get your CMB almost arbitrarily high with the right party comp.

TSS9 is nice to give your shield bonus to touch AC which becomes a factor late (when the great Towers show up), but sword and shield is mostly undersupported.

I had a lot of fun with an AD8/Thug/Bard using Disarming Strike. Disarmed toons keep trying to attack untrained in Unarmed combat, triggering AoOs for all around. The big payoff there is Steel Net at AD8. Along with Crane Wing and some way to get a decent Mirror Image you'll have a lot of staying power in melee, if not a ton of straight damage. Aldori Dueling Mastery is a nice quality of life early feat.

CMs are implemented as standard actions, so you could also combine with Freebooter 10 which has Freebooter's Bane Move action to make a resilient tank/debuffer in the middle of combat.

Which hard enemies have actual armor? Cause I don't remember many (any?). Maybe 1 form of the final boss. Sunder Armor (and Brilliant Energy) are useless. Except for some "win more" in chapters 4 & 5 vs Barbarians and Pitax guards. Sunder could also be used against undead in chapter 3... but they are not exactly difficult to hit.

Aldori probably has a niche... given how common duelling swords are.

But in general the default Fighter seems to be the best. THF for 3/5 level dips.

 

[Desiderius]

Which hard enemies have actual armor? Cause I don't remember many (any?). Maybe 1 form of the final boss. Sunder Armor (and Brilliant Energy) are useless. Except for some "win more" in chapters 4 & 5 vs Barbarians and Pitax guards. Sunder could also be used against undead in chapter 3... but they are not exactly difficult to hit.

Aldori probably has a niche... given how common duelling swords are.

But in general the default Fighter seems to be the best. THF for 3/5 level dips.

Bokken, Ithulliak and the like.

Unless I'm mistaken, Sunder hits Natural armor, unlike Brilliant.

DEX Aldori is in a sweet spot gameplay experience wise. Damage isn't broken but a lot of staying power/ways of messing with the enemy.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Two-Handed Fighter is pretty good, and no one should use base Fighter class when THF is available. My THF main is basically the only real damage dealer in my party (Valerie tanks, Harrim heals, Linzi buffs/sings/does thief shit, Octavia/Jubilost/Tristian do niche spell-casting/buffing/healing), and I am never short for damage. The only tough fights is when the enemy has ridiculous AC so my THF can't hit him, or CC, or some stupid Owlcat tricks.

I have Bane of the Living Elven Curve Blade, and critical threat range 15-20, 4 attacks per round, roughly 55-60 damage per attack, with super high AB for each, my 4th attack per round is higher than other party members' first. So with Haste, 5 attacks per round, 3rd of them critting for 120 + 75 (Harm from sword), can rip through most enemies with ease.

 

[Haplo]

Which hard enemies have actual armor? Cause I don't remember many (any?). Maybe 1 form of the final boss. Sunder Armor (and Brilliant Energy) are useless. Except for some "win more" in chapters 4 & 5 vs Barbarians and Pitax guards. Sunder could also be used against undead in chapter 3... but they are not exactly difficult to hit.

Aldori probably has a niche... given how common duelling swords are.

But in general the default Fighter seems to be the best. THF for 3/5 level dips.

Bokken, Ithulliak and the like.

Unless I'm mistaken, Sunder hits Natural armor, unlike Brilliant.

Not according to the description. Unless it functions differently.
All dangerous enemies have Natural Armor, not external armor you can break.

 

[Desiderius]

Not according to the description. Unless it functions differently.
All dangerous enemies have Natural Armor, not external armor you can break.

If that's the case then you're absolutely correct. THF was obsoleted when they added the extra feats to base Fighter.

 

[Haplo]

Not according to the description. Unless it functions differently.
All dangerous enemies have Natural Armor, not external armor you can break.

If that's the case then you're absolutely correct. THF was obsoleted when they added the extra feats to base Fighter.

Though to be honest, those Training Options probably should apply to THF also.

 

[RNGsus]

I want to reroll a tiefling, does anybody have that torment: numanuma codex troll for my character portrait?

I can't find the codex version anymore.

 

[Yosharian]

I have 0 experience with druids in any d&d game (the hippy tree huggers they are ). But since there must be a first time to (almost) everything i'd like to try one in PK.
I have a vague idea what a caster druid should look like: pump wis (or cha) add a bit of con and dex, go nuts with cc and summoning spells.
But how one make/play a melee/shifter druid. Defender with pet (i like pets) but what stats, feats... I don't ask for complete build just some pointers. What this class is all about so to speak.

I have an Amiri druid build in my sig, not exactly a Shifter though. Wild Shape isn't very good in Pathfinder. Not for combat, anyway. It's great for everything other than the stuff you do in CRPGs.

Roughly speaking, I go for a reach weapon melee build, with a mix of support spells, buffs and the occasional nuke (Sirocco, because it doesn't matter if they save or not).

Caster druid is a little underwhelming in my opinion. Probably the best way to utilise caster druid is to go Mystic Theurge with, say, a Sorcerer/Feyspeaker.