Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker Builds and Strats Thread

[razvedchiki]

i made a custom npc grenadier and gave him choke bombs,all fights became trivial after a barrage of choke-explosive bombs.

 

[~*´¨¯¨`*·~-.¸-AIN'T]

Go grenadier blow shit up make alliance with Talibs

playing a grenadier is a blast

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Here's a poor build you can try at home.
I started as an Archaeologist, dual-classed to Rogue and then finally Dragon Disciple. My current character is 5 Arch/4 Rogue/2 Dragon Disciple.

5 Arch gets you Archaeologist's Luck +2, which adds +2 to pretty much everything he/she can do in combat and out. I'm thinking of taking another Rogue level to get another 1d6 Sneak Attack damage, but his stealth is high and he hits a lot with sneak attacks. 2 Dragon Disciple adds +2 STR to my character to give a higher attack bonus (21 STR now, for a +5). I also get a free Bite attack and the possibility to grow claws (currently using a shield, though). Attack bonus and damage is moderate but the Luck +2 helps a lot, and the character has decent AC at 28 for level 11. Boom, poor build you can try yourself.

 

[Yosharian]

Here's a poor build you can try at home.
I started as an Archaeologist, dual-classed to Rogue and then finally Dragon Disciple. My current character is 5 Arch/4 Rogue/2 Dragon Disciple.

5 Arch gets you Archaeologist's Luck +2, which adds +2 to pretty much everything he/she can do in combat and out. I'm thinking of taking another Rogue level to get another 1d6 Sneak Attack damage, but his stealth is high and he hits a lot with sneak attacks. 2 Dragon Disciple adds +2 STR to my character to give a higher attack bonus (21 STR now, for a +5). I also get a free Bite attack and the possibility to grow claws (currently using a shield, though). Attack bonus and damage is moderate but the Luck +2 helps a lot, and the character has decent AC at 28 for level 11. Boom, poor build you can try yourself.

> decent AC at 28 for level 11

I mean... not really

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

> decent AC at 28 for level 11

I mean... not really

Sadly that's second highest for my squad behind Valerie at 40

 

[Efe]

what happens when you dual wield weapons with different reach?

 

[Haplo]

All reach weapons are two-handed AFAIK

 

[Jaedar]

Some thoughts on sorc vs wiz for this game:
sorc seems mostly better after early game. The tradeoff was always supposed to be versatility vs power (casts per day). But it doesn't really hold true in the game, because there are no vendors for arcane scrolls with a broad supply (at least so far). So both wiz and sorc are pretty much stuck with what they choose on levelup (aside from some scrolls being in very high supply like fireball, haste and a few others). I think sorcerer might just be better, esp if you have some secondary arcane caster like alchemist in your party.

For divine casters, I feel somewhat similarly. Just not that many essential spells (death ward is pretty much the only one), so an inquisitor can easily handle all the clerical duties except healing(and there's honestly quite a lot of potions and scrolls of it around). Not to mention you can buy scrolls for all this stuff is essentially limitless supply.

 

[Efe]

All reach weapons are two-handed AFAIK

there is a dagger with 2ft + 5ft on weapon table.
i probably had it but sold cos dagger
now im curious if you can make a reach magus or weird dual wielding combo with it.

 

[Valtiel]

after so many thoughts i've decided to try the painful way of the Mystic Theurge with a necromancy flavor for role playing reason, I wanted an inquisitor but there was already Jaethal, I thought about a Magus but there was already another companion, LE paladin wasn't an option and cleric seemed the right way for me, but then I remembered how much I loved to summon planetar/deva and went for the double class. Am I destined to fail?
Also, just played 3 h and reached that first bandit camp after oleg, i've got no rogue to open chests and disarm trap, is that normal? My party is kinda unbalanced right now with Jaethal, Valerie and Amiri

 

[Chippy]

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

 

[Yosharian]

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

I failed at this too. Flurry only works with Monk weapons, not weapons that the Monk is proficient with. Check D20PFSRD for which weapons have the 'monk' quality

 

[Lawntoilet]

after so many thoughts i've decided to try the painful way of the Mystic Theurge with a necromancy flavor for role playing reason, I wanted an inquisitor but there was already Jaethal, I thought about a Magus but there was already another companion, LE paladin wasn't an option and cleric seemed the right way for me, but then I remembered how much I loved to summon planetar/deva and went for the double class. Am I destined to fail?
Also, just played 3 h and reached that first bandit camp after oleg, i've got no rogue to open chests and disarm trap, is that normal? My party is kinda unbalanced right now with Jaethal, Valerie and Amiri

I made Tristian a Mystic Theurge, you'll probably struggle a bit longer in the early game but you will eventually end up with so many spell slots that it is almost impossible to run out.
Once you get to Mystic Theurge 3 or so, you'll be good.
So as long as your computer can handle all the summons you're going to throw on the map, you should be OK.

 

[Chippy]

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

I failed at this too. Flurry only works with Monk weapons, not weapons that the Monk is proficient with. Check D20PFSRD for which weapons have the 'monk' quality

Damn. You're right: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/weapons/

 

[Monkeyfinger]

I really don't think it's worth it to ditch Vivisectionist levels in favour of Fighter levels. Pure Vivisectionist is the way to go.

In this game more attack bonus >>>>>>> more sneak dice. If sneak attack were the same bonus damage and simply worked on everything with no need for setup it would still be true.

1 viv for mutagen and accomplished sneak attacker, rest in full BAB classes.

Overcoming enemy AC is the end all and be all of making a physical damage class work and it's very hard for a 3/4th BAB class to do, even with 30 main stat and maxed out buffs and flanking and what have you.

 

[Yosharian]

I really don't think it's worth it to ditch Vivisectionist levels in favour of Fighter levels. Pure Vivisectionist is the way to go.

In this game more attack bonus >>>>>>> more sneak dice. If sneak attack were the same bonus damage and simply worked on everything with no need for setup it would still be true.

1 viv for mutagen and accomplished sneak attacker, rest in full BAB classes.

Overcoming enemy AC is the end all and be all of making a physical damage class work and it's very hard for a 3/4th BAB class to do, even with 30 main stat and maxed out buffs and flanking and what have you.

Well, we'll see. I think you're overstating it.

Rating my comment as shit sure persuaded me, though! Good job!

 

[Haplo]

I really don't think it's worth it to ditch Vivisectionist levels in favour of Fighter levels. Pure Vivisectionist is the way to go.

In this game more attack bonus >>>>>>> more sneak dice. If sneak attack were the same bonus damage and simply worked on everything with no need for setup it would still be true.

1 viv for mutagen and accomplished sneak attacker, rest in full BAB classes.

Overcoming enemy AC is the end all and be all of making a physical damage class work and it's very hard for a 3/4th BAB class to do, even with 30 main stat and maxed out buffs and flanking and what have you.

30 Main stat? That's kinda weak. I expect my Vivi to have 40 Strenght. 46 buffed. Also when he gets Transformation, buffed he will have full BAB.

Also sure, AB is important. But you can buff it quite a bit. Flanking + Outflank: +4. Freebooter's Bane + Freebooter's Bond: +4 (at level 5), up to +7. Greater Heroism: +4. Bard Inspire Courage: +4. Prayer +1. Attacking Prone enemy: -4 AC.

 

[Cael]

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

I failed at this too. Flurry only works with Monk weapons, not weapons that the Monk is proficient with. Check D20PFSRD for which weapons have the 'monk' quality

Damn. You're right: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/weapons/

This has been the way since 3.0...

 

[santino27]

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

FWIW, they only just fixed flurry to not work with other (non-monk) weapons in the latest patch. So it was broken before that.

I haven't checked in game, but I believe sai should count as monk weapons though. That's the intersect between knife master and monk flurry.

 

[Chippy]

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

I failed at this too. Flurry only works with Monk weapons, not weapons that the Monk is proficient with. Check D20PFSRD for which weapons have the 'monk' quality

Damn. You're right: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/weapons/

This has been the way since 3.0...

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

FWIW, they only just fixed flurry to not work with other (non-monk) weapons in the latest patch. So it was broken before that.

I haven't checked in game, but I believe sai should count as monk weapons though. That's the intersect between knife master and monk flurry.

Yeah I never really paid much attention to Monks, always thought playing the class was the same as cheating.

I also noticed a contadiction in the Slashin Grace feat: if you read the description here: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/slashing-grace-combat/ it provides the description ingame for fencing grace which states fencing grace applies when you are using a single weapon one handed.
The slashing grace description in-game suggests it applies when you are using the TWF feats.

I had a brief moment of fabulous optimism where I thought it might qualify handaxes for the knife master' D8 sneak attack progression.

 

[Cael]

Yeah I never really paid much attention to Monks, always thought playing the class was the same as cheating.

Monks has hitorically been one of the weakest classes in 3.x. So much so that they updated it in 3.5 with the Swordsaint. I am not sure where you got the idea that they are "cheating" from...

 

[Serus]

I really don't think it's worth it to ditch Vivisectionist levels in favour of Fighter levels. Pure Vivisectionist is the way to go.

In this game more attack bonus >>>>>>> more sneak dice. If sneak attack were the same bonus damage and simply worked on everything with no need for setup it would still be true.

1 viv for mutagen and accomplished sneak attacker, rest in full BAB classes.

Overcoming enemy AC is the end all and be all of making a physical damage class work and it's very hard for a 3/4th BAB class to do, even with 30 main stat and maxed out buffs and flanking and what have you.

30 Main stat? That's kinda weak. I expect my Vivi to have 40 Strenght. 46 buffed. Also when he gets Transformation, buffed he will have full BAB.

Also sure, AB is important. But you can buff it quite a bit. Flanking + Outflank: +4. Freebooter's Bane + Freebooter's Bond: +4 (at level 5), up to +7. Greater Heroism: +4. Bard Inspire Courage: +4. Prayer +1. Attacking Prone enemy: -4 AC.

Transformation comes a bit too late to matter though, it's a level 6 alchemist spell AFAIK which means level 16? You supposedly end the game at 16~17 with full party so that's only helpful at the very end.
However all this is missing the big picture. That a Fighter X/Vivi 1 is reliant on spells from others while a pure Vivisectionist is actually mostly-self sufficient and can even provide buffs for other party members. Individually might not be stronger (though it can be argued that he is) but the party as a whole certainly is. Making a char is not just about damage but also synergy with the rest of the party.

 

[Raghar]

I'm playing around with a few ideas and rolled a rogue knife master, cheated in some XP and took a level in Monk. The internet say's that flurry of blows works automatically - now if that were true - and the game states I have x1 APR, then I take TWF giving me two, then I would make x3 attacks against an enemy correct?. Because by my count I'm only getting x2.

So I think Flurry is either borked (because I can't work out how to engage it) or it doesn't work with daggers.

Dagger in hands of dagger master is accurate weapon aimed at vitals and imperfections in armor. Flurry of blow is about using so many strikes enemy can't defend against all of them. So it kinda works completely differently.
Of course these weapons Nok-Nok is specialized with, kinda works with flurry of blows. (Actually these are also dagger family, DnD restricts monk flurry of blow to monk traditional weapons like Kama, or brass knuckles.)

 

[Raghar]

Actually I looked at pathfinder rules. And there are two version. New version states either take two weapon fighting, or use flurry of blows.
Old version said, you can use penalties for two weapon fighting and combine them with penalties with two weapon fighting to have even more attacks, if you would actually hit anything and don't stab yourself.

 

[Chippy]

Actually I looked at pathfinder rules. And there are two version. New version states either take two weapon fighting, or use flurry of blows.
Old version said, you can use penalties for two weapon fighting and combine them with penalties with two weapon fighting to have even more attacks, if you would actually hit anything and don't stab yourself.

I've been fiddling about with this and that, using the savegame editor to load a few builds. Which I didn't really want to do really, but I can't find a feat list for the game and I expect they're (or might) add feats with patches. I expect everyone will tailor a build around Crusader's Flurry if they add it. Personally I think it's a crime Quickdraw didn't make it in.