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Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

Incendax

Augur
Joined
Jul 4, 2010
Messages
892
lvl 2 Boneshaker is pretty useful. I killed plenty of enemies or bosses just spamming it. I took Spell Specialization and as result it always let me do 1d6 more than normal. And low level empower rods are cheap so you can often empower it.
Stone Call performs so much better than Boneshaker. There's no save, a massive AOE, and a damage type that is useful against Undead. Even Blindness can have a more profound impact on combat, since it denies dexterity, imposes a -2 AC penalty on top of that, and a 50% miss chance. So, there are better options for damage OR disable.
 

Incendax

Augur
Joined
Jul 4, 2010
Messages
892
Stone Call always 2d6, good in ch1, but Boneshaker scales with level (+1d6/2).
Unfortunately, Scorching Ray scales faster if you are in a hurry, and Sense Vitals scales much higher if you’ve got some time or multiple battles to run out the duration. So Boneshaker loses in the short term and the long term, except in extremely niche circumstances.
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
21,341
Stone Call always 2d6, good in ch1, but Boneshaker scales with level (+1d6/2).
Unfortunately, Scorching Ray scales faster if you are in a hurry, and Sense Vitals scales much higher if you’ve got some time or multiple battles to run out the duration. So Boneshaker loses in the short term and the long term, except in extremely niche circumstances.
Both SR and Sense Vitals need you to have two feats if you hope to hit anything. Also both are very vulnerable to enemy concealment, high AC or mirror image. Also fire resistance.
Boneshaker is guaranteed damage. Only weakness being undead and constructs.
 

Incendax

Augur
Joined
Jul 4, 2010
Messages
892
Both SR and Sense Vitals need you to have two feats if you hope to hit anything. Also both are very vulnerable to enemy concealment, high AC or mirror image. Also fire resistance.
In the early game where feats are rare, Stone Call requires no feats and outperforms Boneshaker. Later in the game, you should definitely have those two feats because they apply to important spells like Enervate and Energy Drain. But let's assume you don't for whatever reason. Wild Hunt Scouts have 37 Touch AC on Unfair Difficulty. My buffs put my necromancer at +38 To Hit without even counting enemy debuffs, which means a -4 from not having Precise Shot is still hitting 90% of the time.

Also, and Unholy Resistance is much more common than Fire Resistance in Kingmaker.
 
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Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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Does not bode well as far as the people who said buggyness was diminished that I'm at character creation and True Strike is bugged as [unknown key: #longseriesofnumbers#] :lol:
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
21,341
Both SR and Sense Vitals need you to have two feats if you hope to hit anything. Also both are very vulnerable to enemy concealment, high AC or mirror image. Also fire resistance.
In the early game where feats are rare, Stone Call requires no feats and outperforms Boneshaker. Later in the game, you should definitely have those two feats because they apply to important spells like Enervate and Energy Drain. But let's assume you don't for whatever reason. Wild Hunt Scouts have 37 Touch AC on Unfair Difficulty. My buffs put my necromancer at +38 To Hit without even counting enemy debuffs, which means a -4 from not having Precise Shot is still hitting 90% of the time.

Also, and Unholy Resistance is much more common than Fire Resistance in Kingmaker.
2d6 is really pathetic damage, even with no save. In some cases I might be useful to spam where you run into big mass of weak enemies (like zombies before Stag Lord) but in most cases you can kill those groups without it. Boneshaker is 4d6 when you get it and 5d6 at lvl 4. Also its damage is unnamed EDIT: just checked, it does say unholy in the log, they just prevented you from targeting undead and similar enemies. And what does end game hit chance have to do with this conversation? Nobody is going to be using Boneshaker as their end game spell of choice unless you used up your better spells. Just like you are no longer using Scorching Ray anymore if you got better spells available.

At lower levels Boneshaker is best spell to finish off fast casters and rogue characters. Especially useful dealing with all those kobold casters in Sycamore.
 
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ArchAngel

Arcane
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Mar 16, 2015
Messages
21,341
Does not bode well as far as the people who said buggyness was diminished that I'm at character creation and True Strike is bugged as [unknown key: #longseriesofnumbers#] :lol:
That one was introduced with last hotfix but you will have to try hard to find more bugs until much much later into the game
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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Does not bode well as far as the people who said buggyness was diminished that I'm at character creation and True Strike is bugged as [unknown key: #longseriesofnumbers#] :lol:
That one was introduced with last hotfix but you will have to try hard to find more bugs until much much later into the game

Good to know! Is there a way to make sure characters auto-attack nearest enemy unless I've made them do something else - but without having general party AI on meaning they'll do all sorts of shit?
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
21,341
Does not bode well as far as the people who said buggyness was diminished that I'm at character creation and True Strike is bugged as [unknown key: #longseriesofnumbers#] :lol:
That one was introduced with last hotfix but you will have to try hard to find more bugs until much much later into the game

Good to know! Is there a way to make sure characters auto-attack nearest enemy unless I've made them do something else - but without having general party AI on meaning they'll do all sorts of shit?
Default AI only uses basic attack or skill/spell you set to autocast. There is an option in Game options that lets you tell them to use or not use daily limited abilities.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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Does not bode well as far as the people who said buggyness was diminished that I'm at character creation and True Strike is bugged as [unknown key: #longseriesofnumbers#] :lol:
That one was introduced with last hotfix but you will have to try hard to find more bugs until much much later into the game

Good to know! Is there a way to make sure characters auto-attack nearest enemy unless I've made them do something else - but without having general party AI on meaning they'll do all sorts of shit?
Default AI only uses basic attack or skill/spell you set to autocast. There is an option in Game options that lets you tell them to use or not use daily limited abilities.

Thanks, but at least my AI likes to use Cantrips over ranged weapons when it isn't really profitable in my opinion.
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
21,341
Does not bode well as far as the people who said buggyness was diminished that I'm at character creation and True Strike is bugged as [unknown key: #longseriesofnumbers#] :lol:
That one was introduced with last hotfix but you will have to try hard to find more bugs until much much later into the game

Good to know! Is there a way to make sure characters auto-attack nearest enemy unless I've made them do something else - but without having general party AI on meaning they'll do all sorts of shit?
Default AI only uses basic attack or skill/spell you set to autocast. There is an option in Game options that lets you tell them to use or not use daily limited abilities.

Thanks, but at least my AI likes to use Cantrips over ranged weapons when it isn't really profitable in my opinion.
That is only Octavia. I guess they forced her AI to use attack that has better chance to hit. She does more damage with sneak attack + cantrip than shortbow that rarely hits. If you tell her to attack someone manually she will use her bow. Also a trick is to put charge on autocast. Then she uses only bow.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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^ thanks. Another question: If I set Amiri to use Charge right at the start of combat she waits for 4 seconds before charging. What's up with that? I realize it's an action, but the usefulness of it in an RT environment kind of goes away when it's faster to just move to your target and make an attack.
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
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Messages
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^ thanks. Another question: If I set Amiri to use Charge right at the start of combat she waits for 4 seconds before charging. What's up with that? I realize it's an action, but the usefulness of it in an RT environment kind of goes away when it's faster to just move to your target and make an attack.
Charge also gives +2 to attack.
And if you start combat with Charge it goes off before initiative is rolled. And if you lost initiative to enemy, you don't want to be first in melee as your guys are flatfooted until you get to your initiative.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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^ thanks. Another question: If I set Amiri to use Charge right at the start of combat she waits for 4 seconds before charging. What's up with that? I realize it's an action, but the usefulness of it in an RT environment kind of goes away when it's faster to just move to your target and make an attack.
Charge also gives +2 to attack.
And if you start combat with Charge it goes off before initiative is rolled. And if you lost initiative to enemy, you don't want to be first in melee as your guys are flatfooted until you get to your initiative.

That... doesn't really answer my question, though.
 

Efe

Erudite
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Dec 27, 2015
Messages
2,606
he said if you start combat with charge it goes off instantly. otherwise initiative is rolled and you wait for your turn.
ask the devs if you want someone to defend a design decision
 

Terra

Cipher
Joined
Sep 4, 2016
Messages
922
Just finished Season of Bloom last night and have spent some time skipping time in the capital working on the event cards there. Got a question about a companion quest that's just appeared.

Another event for Tristian just popped up at the Secret Sanctum but when I go there with him, there's nothing to do. (I already had a fight with the cultists here previously.) There's now just a bunch of soaked torches and a firepit I can't interact with in the area. Am I missing something or is this another bug?
 

Haplo

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Sep 14, 2016
Messages
6,563
Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Plus charge may let you cover a lot more ground then regular movement if you're a mobile character.
 

santino27

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
2,786
My team has the sexiest and deadliest waifus you can recruit.
^ thanks. Another question: If I set Amiri to use Charge right at the start of combat she waits for 4 seconds before charging. What's up with that? I realize it's an action, but the usefulness of it in an RT environment kind of goes away when it's faster to just move to your target and make an attack.
Charge also gives +2 to attack.
And if you start combat with Charge it goes off before initiative is rolled. And if you lost initiative to enemy, you don't want to be first in melee as your guys are flatfooted until you get to your initiative.

That... doesn't really answer my question, though.
If you're already in combat, ability usage is determined by your initiative. That's why you're seeing the 4 second delay in that case. (It's actually a variable delay depending on initiative roll.) As he said, it's better to charge the target from outside their awareness circle (and thus before combat has started) as it can be done instantaneously in that case. Basically, creep closer to the mob, pause, have all of your melee types charge, unpause, and they will rush the mob (which will cover a lot more ground faster than just walking there) and trigger combat... and then the delay to their next action will be determined by initiative roll.
 

Projas

Information Superhighwayman
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Best Republic
Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Just finished Season of Bloom last night and have spent some time skipping time in the capital working on the event cards there. Got a question about a companion quest that's just appeared.

Another event for Tristian just popped up at the Secret Sanctum but when I go there with him, there's nothing to do. (I already had a fight with the cultists here previously.) There's now just a bunch of soaked torches and a firepit I can't interact with in the area. Am I missing something or is this another bug?
I think you have to go at night, but I might be confusing that with a different quest.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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Re: charge/initiative - thanks guys, that makes sense.
 

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