Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Nano]

I know that the game had quite a few bugs at first, but I bought it several months after its release, so I never actually had to deal with them.

Well, not until the recent update, anyway. There are definitely bugs now, and they're messing with my saves.

And people were laughing at me for not wanting to update. Laziness sometimes pays off.

 

[FreeKaner]

prebuffing aka precheating

An AD&D fanatic gronard and medieval fantasy fanboy was teaching a class on Bioware, known action-adventure studio

”Before the class begins, you must get on your knees and worship Bioware and accept that it was the best rpg developer world has ever known, even greater than Troika!”

At this moment, a brave, innovative, pro-crowdfunding Ars Magica game master who played 1500 hours of Pillars of Eternity and understood the necessity of streamlining and fully supported all design decisions made by Josh Sawyer to eliminate prebuffing stood up and held up a copy of BG2.

”What is this, pinhead?”

The arrogant professor smirked quite Jewishly and smugly replied “The best RPG ever made, you stupid larper”

”Wrong. It doesn't even have C&C. If it was the best, as you say, RPG… then it should have been balanced”

The professor was visibly shaken, and dropped his chalk and copy of D&D 2nd edition. He stormed out of the room crying those kensai-mage crocodile tears. The same tears kensai-mages cry for the “itemisation” (who today have such selection that most own 23 unique swords) when they jealously try to claw justly earned auto-attacks from the deserving martial classes. There is no doubt that at this point our professor, Edwin, wished he had learned another ruleset and become more than a nostalgiafag. He wished so much that he had an in-game gamepedia, but he himself had petitioned against them!

The students applauded and all registered as fig backers that day and accepted Feargus Urquhart as their lord and savior. An eagle named “Obsidian” flew into the room and perched atop director's board and shed a tear on the chalk. The pillars of Eternity gameguide was read several times, and Tim Cain himself showed up and announced a new IP.

The professor lost his tenure and was fired the next day. He died of The Awakening and was tossed into the In-Between for all eternity.

Watcher of Caed Nua.

Spoiler

Nothing wrong with pre-buffing in a game that has time constraints, as it costs you resources to prebuff, moreover prebuffing is fun.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

prebuffing aka precheating

An AD&D fanatic gronard and medieval fantasy fanboy was teaching a class on Bioware, known action-adventure studio

”Before the class begins, you must get on your knees and worship Bioware and accept that it was the best rpg developer world has ever known, even greater than Troika!”

At this moment, a brave, innovative, pro-crowdfunding Ars Magica game master who played 1500 hours of Pillars of Eternity and understood the necessity of streamlining and fully supported all design decisions made by Josh Sawyer to eliminate prebuffing stood up and held up a copy of BG2.

”What is this, pinhead?”

The arrogant professor smirked quite Jewishly and smugly replied “The best RPG ever made, you stupid larper”

”Wrong. It doesn't even have C&C. If it was the best, as you say, RPG… then it should have been balanced”

The professor was visibly shaken, and dropped his chalk and copy of D&D 2nd edition. He stormed out of the room crying those kensai-mage crocodile tears. The same tears kensai-mages cry for the “itemisation” (who today have such selection that most own 23 unique swords) when they jealously try to claw justly earned auto-attacks from the deserving martial classes. There is no doubt that at this point our professor, Edwin, wished he had learned another ruleset and become more than a nostalgiafag. He wished so much that he had an in-game gamepedia, but he himself had petitioned against them!

The students applauded and all registered as fig backers that day and accepted Feargus Urquhart as their lord and savior. An eagle named “Obsidian” flew into the room and perched atop director's board and shed a tear on the chalk. The pillars of Eternity gameguide was read several times, and Tim Cain himself showed up and announced a new IP.

The professor lost his tenure and was fired the next day. He died of The Awakening and was tossed into the In-Between for all eternity.

Watcher of Caed Nua.

Spoiler

Nothing wrong with pre-buffing in a game that has time constraints, as it costs you resources to prebuff, moreover prebuffing is fun.

ok precheater

 

[Daidre]

Straight-up Inquisitor ends up being similar to Paladin in the way it snowballs with levels in the class, so you're better off staying single-class. It won't be broken like a focused Cleric but on the other hand it's hard to end up weak either. The base class and the three subtypes all play significantly differently so I'd encourage you to experiment with each, but none are a good fit for a Rogue splash or DEX combat although I've done ranged on a caster-focused builds and been fine.

I like Rogue 4 splash even on STR characters, especially when I do not have pure Rogue in the party. It is:
- 3d6 Sneak, also one Rogue level early + Accomplished Sneak Attack Feat already 2d6 and its huge on low level
- 2 Extra Feats
- Debilitating Injury for -2/-4 enemy's attack/AC
- if Thug, then Improved Shaken/Fear that works very nicely with Inquisitor's Intimidation bonus. And Brutal Beating at lvl 3 that could be useful.
Honestly, I like it more than Vivi dip and it is lot less offensive to my RP-sensibilities.

Sacred Huntmaster could afford this dip since Boon Companion feat compensates 4 levels loss of pet progression and there are no ultimately good spells on Inquisitor lvl 6 list (I mean buffs), so delaying it is no big deal for me. Also, Huntmaster's level 17-20 abilities are nothing to write home about.

With extra team feats such character can easily afford Precise Strike + Outflank on levels 3 and 6 and share them on pet and add Power Attack + Weapon Focus + Dazzling Display + Shatter Defenses + Dreadful Carnage + Impoved Crit (+ Accomplished Sneak + Boon Companion) on top of that.

Also, inquisitor gets Deity's favored weapon so Shelyn (good) or Rovagug (evil) are solid options to get access to Glaive or Greataxe respectively and switch it later to Fauchard or Curve Elven Blade with Exotic Proficiency and skip Martial entirely.

With Inquisitor's ton of skill points that allow focusing Trickery + Persuasion + Perception it makes pretty amazing all-around character who is especially brutal on low level when the game at its hardest: 1 Rogue/3-6 Sacred Hunmaster with +2d6 Sneak Attack and + 1d6 from Precise Strike + PET with Outflank and 3-5 natural attacks is crazy on battlefield in chapters 1-2. Only problem, party would probably need another source of divine spells with not-gimped progression.

 

[Desiderius]

Straight-up Inquisitor ends up being similar to Paladin in the way it snowballs with levels in the class, so you're better off staying single-class. It won't be broken like a focused Cleric but on the other hand it's hard to end up weak either. The base class and the three subtypes all play significantly differently so I'd encourage you to experiment with each, but none are a good fit for a Rogue splash or DEX combat although I've done ranged on a caster-focused builds and been fine.

I like Rogue 4 splash even on STR characters, especially when I do not have pure Rogue in the party. It is:
- 3d6 Sneak, also one Rogue level early + Accomplished Sneak Attack Feat already 2d6 and its huge on low level
- 2 Extra Feats
- Debilitating Injury for -2/-4 enemy's attack/AC
- if Thug, then Improved Shaken/Fear that works very nicely with Inquisitor's Intimidation bonus. And Brutal Beating at lvl 3 that could be useful.
Honestly, I like it more than Vivi dip and it is lot less offensive to my RP-sensibilities.

Sacred Huntmaster could afford this dip since Boon Companion feat compensates 4 levels loss of pet progression and there are no ultimately good spells on Inquisitor lvl 6 list (I mean buffs), so delaying it is no big deal for me. Also, Huntmaster's level 17-20 abilities are nothing to write home about.

With extra team feats such character can easily afford Precise Strike + Outflank on levels 3 and 6 and share them on pet and add Power Attack + Weapon Focus + Dazzling Display + Shatter Defenses + Dreadful Carnage + Impoved Crit (+ Accomplished Sneak + Boon Companion) on top of that.

Also, inquisitor gets Deity's favored weapon so Shelyn (good) or Rovagug (evil) are solid options to get access to Glaive or Greataxe respectively and switch it later to Fauchard or Curve Elven Blade with Exotic Proficiency and skip Martial entirely.

With Inquisitor's ton of skill points that allow focusing Trickery + Persuasion + Perception it makes pretty amazing all-around character who is especially brutal on low level when the game at its hardest: 1 Rogue/3-6 Sacred Hunmaster with +2d6 Sneak Attack and + 1d6 from Precise Strike + PET with Outflank and 3-5 natural attacks is crazy on battlefield in chapters 1-2. Only problem, party would probably need another source of divine spells with not-gimped progression.

Some very good pts, especially using non-martial toons for exotics, but I’m just off of sneaks altogether. A ton of group damage boosting out there and sneaks can let you down when you need them most. If you’re playing with smaller party sizes/less group boosts they obviously go up in importance.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

On my second playthrough, I've gone for the "conventional" party. First run I did a CN run to keep my options open and made a party of misanthropes to see what all there was. MC was Arcane Trickster with Harrim, Jaethal, Jubilost, Nok-Nok, & Twins fit that bill. Now, I'm running MC Slayer, Valerie (Slayer), Linzi, Amiri (Freebooter), Tristian, & Octavia. Octavia may get the boot for Jubilost if she gets annoying, but I'm trying different things this go. Amazing how much I'm steam-rolling this game. Last time it took me until Trobold before things were firmly in the auto-pilot territory. I've barely done half the zones available in Act 1, but I am sweeping through Old Sycamore like a tsunami. I am still playing on Challenging. I think it will time to boost that up after the Stag Lord.

 

[Pink Eye]

Will it turn out that the self-prolaimed munchkin-kings don't have an answer to whether Cleric/Rogue or Inquisitor/Vivisectionist (or some other combination of these classes) is better?

I am NOT a self proclamined munchkin. But lets see. I am going to try my best. Here's what I think. No matter how you build it your going to hurt your spell progression. So you might as well maximize what you can. I suggest fifteen levels into Cleric. This will give you access to Level eight spells. The subclass crusader seems look like a good fit. You get fighter combat feats for free. Four in total if you go level fifteen cleric. I also suggest picking the war domain. The war domain gives two main advantages. The extra combat feat (Bringing us up to five combat feats. The reason why combat feats are important here is because clerics don't normally qualify for certain ones. For example, because of the Crusader you can get weapon focus for free at level one. Normally you would need at least one BAB to qualify for it. Basically these combat feats will allow you to bypass some restrictions) The war doman will also allow you access to a unique buff. Battle rage. Battle rage gives bonuses to melee damage rolls. This bonus increases based on how many levels you have in your class. The times you can use it is based on your WIS stat.

Now I suggest the knife master subclass. Go five levels into it. Tell me if you want a further detailed write up on the build.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I think more reasonable question is: why would anyone gimp the spell progression of a Cleric? And if such gimping is done deliberately, then what does it have to do with munchkinism?

 

[Pink Eye]

That's what I said! But he wants a rogue/cleric. So we should help him with it.

 

[Delterius]

Will it turn out that the self-prolaimed munchkin-kings don't have an answer to whether Cleric/Rogue or Inquisitor/Vivisectionist (or some other combination of these classes) is better?

motherfucker just go inquisitor there's no skaen priest here

 

[LannTheStupid]

there's no skaen priest here

Now I see where he is coming from. Yes, Skaen priest was pretty fun, and totally matched my attitude to life.

That's what I said! But he wants a rogue/cleric. So we should help him with it.

Well, it's not straight min/maxing, then. It is optimization in the predefined conditions. However, this is a nice puzzle, and I enjoy reading the collective thought process.

 

[LannTheStupid]

https://store.steampowered.com/newshub/app/640820/view/4806984167766276680

Update 2.1.0j – August 24, 2020
Please be aware of plot spoilers in the description below!

• Fixed the error due to which you could lose control over your party after Tristian’s attack at the Abandoned Keep.
  
• It was impossible to enter the Valley of the Dead if Jaethal wasn’t in the party. Resolution: fixed.
  
• When you chose a chaotic evil option in the dialogue with Rook at the Ruined Watchtower, it was impossible to get the item necessary to solve the puzzle. Resolution: fixed.
  
• Even if one of the tiefling sisters was dead, you could still ask to talk to her in the corresponding dialogue in the capital. That resulted in numerous further issues. Resolution: fixed.
  
• Unessential messages are no longer displayed in the combat log during cutscenes at the House at the Edge of Time.
  
• Some converted spells were incorrectly displayed on the spell panel. Resolution: fixed.
  
• In some cases, hints in the Equipment and Inventory windows were displayed incorrectly. Resolution: fixed.

A friendly reminder: while we deeply admire the contribution that mod authors make to our game, we would like you to remember that running custom modifications can lead to unexpected bugs and crashes. Unfortunately, if you encounter any issues while playing with mods, our team will not be able to help you. If this happens, please report these issues to the mod's original creator. Also, remember that after each game update, there is a high probability of previously installed mods not functioning properly. If you wish to play with mods anyway, disabling auto-updates might prevent your save files from becoming corrupted.

 

[Delterius]

this game is never gonna stop being patched is it

 

[FriendlyMerchant]

Will it turn out that the self-prolaimed munchkin-kings don't have an answer to whether Cleric/Rogue or Inquisitor/Vivisectionist (or some other combination of these classes) is better?

Seems like Rogue/Viv will be the best combination of those 4 classes. Other than losing a few level 6 spells--only really need transformation and you can rely on your party wizard/sorc for Legendary proportions-- and losing out on a few AC points and at most 20-40 HP from sticking to Grand Mutagen instead of True Mutagen, 16 Viv/ 4 Rogue seems like the best combo out of those four classes. Though out of the two you mentioned, Inq/Viv seems to be a lot better just because of Viv alone than Cleric/Rogue. Cleric and Rogue don't really seem to sync that well together unless you're doing something like thug and you're really trying to lean on the fear spells. Even then, it just seems like anything more than three rogue levels and you miss out on overwhelming presence or some level 9 domain spells which would really go well with the fear spells.

 

[Lacrymas]

motherfucker just go inquisitor there's no skaen priest here

You caught me, the Skaen Priest is what fueled my love for this type of character ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I am NOT a self proclamined munchkin. But lets see. I am going to try my best. Here's what I think. No matter how you build it your going to hurt your spell progression. So you might as well maximize what you can. I suggest fifteen levels into Cleric. This will give you access to Level eight spells. The subclass crusader seems look like a good fit. You get fighter combat feats for free. Four in total if you go level fifteen cleric. I also suggest picking the war domain. The war domain gives two main advantages. The extra combat feat (Bringing us up to five combat feats. The reason why combat feats are important here is because clerics don't normally qualify for certain ones. For example, because of the Crusader you can get weapon focus for free at level one. Normally you would need at least one BAB to qualify for it. Basically these combat feats will allow you to bypass some restrictions) The war doman will also allow you access to a unique buff. Battle rage. Battle rage gives bonuses to melee damage rolls. This bonus increases based on how many levels you have in your class. The times you can use it is based on your WIS stat.

Now I suggest the knife master subclass. Go five levels into it. Tell me if you want a further detailed write up on the build.

This is literally the thing I did, including the knife master, but I went with a DEX build which I saw is not the greatest. Why Rogue instead of Vivi? All others seem to suggest Cleric/Vivi is better.

 

[LannTheStupid]

To be fair, 2.0.8 was stable from January 20, 2020 - but then they released the console port.

 

[Pink Eye]

Knife master does more damage with small weapons. Get martial weapon proficiency. Get kukris. Do damage.
>This is literally the thing I did,
Did you? Sorry. I may have missed your posts. Even though I stalk the Owlcat Games subforum. I sometimes miss posts.

 

[Pink Eye]

>but I went with a DEX build which I saw is not the greatest.
I was playing around with it in the DLC dungeon. It was doing okay damage with 17 STR + Power Attack.

Spoiler

Did you go five levels of Knife Master first?

 

[Lacrymas]

I got to Oleg's, lol. At what level is this? Seems pretty good actually if it's like lvl 1 or 2.

 

[Pink Eye]

It was at level 1. But on the normal difficulty.

Spoiler

Like I said try going five levels into knife master first. Get kukris. Enlarge. Then do damage.

 

[Lacrymas]

It sounds like a good idea. Also, why 14 in CHA? Why not switch it with INT for those sweet skills?

 

[Pink Eye]

It sounds like a good idea. Also, why 14 in CHA? Why not switch it with INT for those sweet skills?

CHA is for Cleric's channel energy.

 

[Pink Eye]

Make sure you put all of your level up ability points into STR. You get five. Thus putting your STR at 22. Which means even more damage. Also don't neglect belts that gives bonuses to STR. As Power Attack scales with the more STR you have. Which means more damage.

 

[FriendlyMerchant]

Make sure you put all of your level up ability points into STR. You get five. Thus putting your STR at 22. Which means even more damage. Also don't neglect belts that gives bonuses to STR. As Power Attack scales with the more STR you have. Which means more damage.

It doesn't seem like power attack cares about your STR as long as it's over 13. Though bigger STR is still bigger damage.

 

[Pink Eye]

Think so? Let me go check.