Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Yosharian]

Hmm. Doesn't really seem worth losing an entire level of progression. Just cast different spells? If you're a Wizard you have an entire arsenal at your disposal.

Undeath to Death. Anything that's fire. Chains of Light. Pit spells? I dunno.

 

[razvedchiki]

Wizards also get a +4 INT Staff at V's tomb that stacks with everything (profane bonus)

you need to be evil to use it.

 

[ga♥]

Also since it's melee I barely ever used it. Unless you plan to micromanage, equip, cast spell and then go back to ranged.

 

[hell bovine]

Hmm. Doesn't really seem worth losing an entire level of progression. Just cast different spells? If you're a Wizard you have an entire arsenal at your disposal.

I was testing mind controlling spells at that time. Serpentine lets you affect monsters as if they were human, and you get "dominate human" much earlier than "dominate monster". It's not always about playing the most powerful caster; I've had more fun with an enchantress in BG2 than a sorceress.

 

[Trashos]

you need to be evil to use it.

which my MC is!

Also since it's melee I barely ever used it. Unless you plan to micromanage, equip, cast spell and then go back to ranged.

It does not have to be wielded, it just needs to be in one of the weapon slots.

Undeath to Death. Anything that's fire. Chains of Light. Pit spells? I dunno.

Actually, I am trying an Enchantment/Illusion/Necromancy build currently on Hard, exactly because I wanted to pay some attention to Undeath to Death (and Circle of Death). I was not thrilled by the results. OK spells, but that's it. They are also a bit foreign to the concept of a Controller, as they are blasting spells.

Yes, the conjuration spells are an alternative. Chains of Light + Grease vs Reflexes.

I am basically trading off one level of progression mid-game with the ability to cast my core spells (Enchantment/Illusion) on the undead of Ch3&4. This is satisfying to me in a role-playing way, I am not necessarily saying that it is the best strategy. But it won't be bad either.

There will be plenty of Chains of Light cast on the Cyclopes too, do not worry about that!

 

[ga♥]

It does not have to be wielded, it just needs to be in one of the weapon slots.

Really? Last playthrough was a lot of time ago but I clearly remember having it in the weapon slot didn't work.

 

[Trashos]

Yes, using it in my current playthrough, so I am absolutely certain about it. v2.0.8 unmodded.
v2.0.8 is not the last version, so I do not know if there have been changes since.

I would also argue that the bonus to DC is more important than being able to pew-pew with a crossbow anyway.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Also since it's melee I barely ever used it. Unless you plan to micromanage, equip, cast spell and then go back to ranged.

You don't need to use the staff to cast spells and cantrips. And they are ranged.

That's how my Octavia wields 2 daggers.

Undeath to Death (and Circle of Death). I was not thrilled by the results. OK spells, but that's it

What's so underwhelming about these spells? Jaethal has them now, but in Kingmaker the game they cost 10 Diamond Dust each, and I do not want to spend it. Also, the description is not intuitive enough for me.

 

[ga♥]

Cantrips casting time will become slower than the attacks per round once you progress in the game. So what happens is, the mage will cast a cantrip then engage melee.

Anyway it's a non issue because apparently now you get the bonus by having the staff in a slot without even using it.

 

[Xamenos]

Cantrips casting time will become slower than the attacks per round once you progress in the game. So what happens is, the mage will cast a cantrip then engage melee.

You could just turn AI off for your casters. That way they'll simply stand still when they finish casting. Preferable to them rushing into melee, and not that different from them firing a crossbow.

 

[Trashos]

That is an issue, actually, I have noticed it happening (with AI off too) when I am carrying the Fireball staff (which actually needs to be wielded). But I didn't know why it was happening. Anyway, my wizard is not specced for ranged attacks, so I either did nothing when not casting or I paid attention so that my wizard would not move in for melee.

 

[Nano]

Or you could just use the turn-based mode and your characters will be completely in your control.

 

[Trashos]

Nope. I have plenty of good TB games nowadays. It was a good RTwP game I was missing, even if I generally prefer TB.

(this thread apparently needed some more shitstorm)

 

[ga♥]

Cantrips casting time will become slower than the attacks per round once you progress in the game. So what happens is, the mage will cast a cantrip then engage melee.

You could just turn AI off for your casters. That way they'll simply stand still when they finish casting. Preferable to them rushing into melee, and not that different from them firing a crossbow.

He will keep attacking because apparently casting a cantrip to an enemy its equivalent as giving the attack action.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Cantrips casting time will become slower than the attacks per round once you progress in the game.

Starting from which caster level is it happening? I have never seen this before, but I have not played with 20 level casters (yet).

What I can tell, though, is that the game reports the range of crossbows and bows (long and composite) as 50 ft, the range of all Octavia cantrips as "close", and the range of Magic Missile as "medium". By googling it seems that "medium" range is about 100 ft, so it should be farther than the crossbow range. "Close" seems to be 30 ft, so it is closer than bows.

I know that Octavia with daggers loves to run into her own AoE effects at the end of the fight - to cast close range cantrips on survived archers. Also, I know that Tristian has never tried to run ahead with the staff if he has Magic Missiles to shoot. And I almost always keep the A.I. on.

So are you sure it is about the casting times and not about the attack ranges that the A.I. tries to cover?

 

[Technomancer]

Wizards also get a +4 INT Staff at V's tomb that stacks with everything (profane bonus). I haven't played Sorc and I do not know if they get something similar.

Profane amulet +2 for mentals.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Profane amulet +2 for mentals.

The neck and the head are two most precious slots, though. The weapon that the caster will never use is more preferable IMHO.

 

[Trashos]

if it is this one we are talking about:
https://pathfinderkingmaker.gamepedia.com/Amulet_of_the_Dying_Wisdom
then it requires a dlc. And the bonus is smaller too. And it comes with -3 penalty to physicals. Not at all on the same level with the INT staff. But I guess it is something.

 

[razvedchiki]

when is the earliest i can get oppressor/ serpent prince? late chapter 2?

 

[Xamenos]

when is the earliest i can get oppressor/ serpent prince? late chapter 2?

Theoritically yes since they're both artisan-made. Practically, it's not going to be easy rushing to unlock them and getting lucky before the end of the chapter.

 

[Trashos]

In theory you unlock them as soon as you finish Shaynih'a's quest. So yes, late Ch2. Your probability to get any of them at that point should be 30%. It is often the case that you drown in kamas before getting them, but who knows, you might get lucky.

You are going to have a better probability once your Relations reach tier 4.

 

[razvedchiki]

not really, relations 4 is when she brings a gift from tier 3 (oppressor is tier 1).

found a mod that gives boss type mobs extra abilities that supposedly make them harder.
https://github.com/Jarinex/Kingmaker-Tweak-Mod
at least vordakai changes seem good, he is a push over in vanilla.

 

[Yosharian]

Theoritically yes since they're both artisan-made. Practically, it's not going to be easy rushing to unlock them and getting lucky before the end of the chapter.

I mean you could just use a vendor mod

 

[Yosharian]

Also fuck mods that require COTW.

 

[Trashos]

not really, relations 4 is when she brings a gift from tier 3 (oppressor is tier 1).

Worskhop gets her to Tier 0, Quest gets her to Tier 1... how do you intend to get to Tier 2?

Yes, you unlock them at Tier 1 (so that's the earliest indeed), but you have a better probability to get something from Current Tier-1.