Pathfinder Pathfinder: WoTR - What the heck happened to female characters in this game?

[Serus]

To the OP:
2010s and 2020s happened. In gaming and elsewhere. That's the usually the best answer when a game character or story isn't to a sane's person expectations.

 

[Serus]

Games (and the literature that preceded them) used to revolve around themes of manly heroism because players (readers) were missing the opportunity for that in modern life. They still do (often badly) but now we get sex and chix injected in because, well, many gheymers are missing another kind of opportunity.

It's the opposite now thanks to woke neo-puritanism in movies and games. 90s movies ususally had at least one sex scene with mostly partial or rare full-frontal female nudity. Bioware RPGs had awkward sex scenes when ME1 caused the last conservative backlash and GTA: San Andreas caused outrage with Hot Coffee. Now we don't have sex scenes in mainstream and AAA games.

80-90s films injected gratuitously sex and nudity because that was the only way ordinary folk could get their erotica in a socially acceptable manner. It got inserted simply for the sake of it. Desiderius is correct. Troons and neckbeards lack the ability for romantic fulfillment, so they seek it in their video games. With the improvements in AI chatbots and text to speech software, we're only a few years away from Her. Maybe then video games can return to being games.

The "erotica" in those movies was of the "soft" kind. And you could buy soft erotica in America in 80s-90s, lol. It was there because people liked it but not because they couldn't get it elsewhere. You also actually had a little erotica in video games of 80s-90s. No gamer complained then and it didn't cause any worse experience or quality of gameplay. But then this erotica was of a normal kind for a medium like computer games - aka boobs. Men of most eras and cultures do similar things in their own way. The problem with today's games and CRPGs is about what kind and how much of it - but not because it simply exists.

 

[Desiderius]

Leisure Suit Larry and video poker don't count. Beauty DNE pron.

 

[Dishonoredbr]

Camellia is based.

 

[Dishonoredbr]

Wrong. The most popular characters are Arueshalae, Regill and Daeran. Woljif is more popular than Camellia despite having no romance (yet).

If was'nt for Azata, Regill would be best girl for sure.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

Serus Fair points. I think the difference between then and now in video games might also be that video games have been feminized. If there was a female character model prior to 2010, it was conventionally attractive. That was where it ended. It had no influence other than visual. Female porn is literary. With the influx of danger-hairs into the game development world from previously unemployable academic backgrounds, objective beauty was sacrificed and literary porn took the stage.

Desiderius Leisure Suit Larry definitely counts as porn. Titillation was the entire point. The games even had age-protection questionnaires before you could play the game. It was OK though because it was its own thing. That's very different from playing a medieval combat game were every other NPC is vying to seduce your MC, or random NPCs bringing sex into totally unrelated conversations. I thought Siege of Dragonspear was bad, but WotR has it beat.

 

[Serus]

Leisure Suit Larry and video poker don't count. Beauty DNE pron.

I didn't think of those. I didn't even remember Larry series until you mentioned it. I meant gratuitous boobs in games from time to time. Like in, say, Daggerfall. As Mr. Magniloquent correctly said, Larry was not something you were running onto by accident. It was an adventure game series made specifically with sex and making fun of sex in mind. Every other adventure game of that era didn't have Larry-like qualities. Similar were pokers with photos of naked girls. The problem* - at least the problem discussed here as i understand it - are not those. Just like Hentai games aren't a problem either*. Those games are exactly what they are supposed to be. However mainstream CRPGs are not supposed the have all this crap. Other than, maybe, rare, non obligatory, boobs.

*There maybe a question of overabundance of erotica in medias and ease of access for minors in general, but that's not the same discussion.

 

[Incendax]

Ember is an eldritch horror who starts out not being able to convince a couple dudes from murdering her, and evolves into a mind raping cult leader who could ask a hundred demons to kill themselves and they would. Her persuasion slowly becomes supernatural, then eventually overcomes even consent or self-interest.

At first you think her writing is terrible, then you see it's the same writer as Arue telling a *very* different story. And sure, that still doesn't make Ember's writing good, but it does become really dang nefarious: sincere repentance vs blind faith.

 

[Socrates]

Delterius

Also, Nenio is my main arcane caster, so she is always in the party, and she is awesome. On the other hand, I myself much prefer chatting with ChatGPT than with any human being.

If there was any sin this game committed it was the creation of that fucking character.

 

[LabRat]

Regill was interesting at first, but over time, I feel like he just another writer self-insert gary stu character. The problem is that the writers have to make a lot of character idiots in order to make him look smarter than others.

 

[skaraher]

Ember is an eldritch horror who starts out not being able to convince a couple dudes from murdering her, and evolves into a mind raping cult leader who could ask a hundred demons to kill themselves and they would. Her persuasion slowly becomes supernatural, then eventually overcomes even consent or self-interest.

At first you think her writing is terrible, then you see it's the same writer as Arue telling a *very* different story. And sure, that still doesn't make Ember's writing good, but it does become really dang nefarious: sincere repentance vs blind faith.

Both Ember and Arue are badly written and their writer is an avowed brony.

 

[Mauman]

Ember is an eldritch horror who starts out not being able to convince a couple dudes from murdering her, and evolves into a mind raping cult leader who could ask a hundred demons to kill themselves and they would. Her persuasion slowly becomes supernatural, then eventually overcomes even consent or self-interest.

At first you think her writing is terrible, then you see it's the same writer as Arue telling a *very* different story. And sure, that still doesn't make Ember's writing good, but it does become really dang nefarious: sincere repentance vs blind faith.

Both Ember and Arue are badly written and their writer is an avowed brony.

I find Arue to be a bit more tolerable, but yes I wasn't impressed with them. Ember in particular grated on my nerves.

That being said, when it comes to the straight dude romance options (not Ember obviously), Arue is still the best of the bunch.

Camilla - hahaha no
Wenduag - cannibal cooch. Probably doesn't understand what a bath is.
Galfrey - spank me harder grandma

Somehow Arue came out as the sane choice despite still being shit.

 

[Semiurge]

When you have men write female characters they are either "harmless" husks devoid of any personality - reflecting the writers' honest opinion on 99% of women, or vicious chaotic evil sluts. Regarding their personality they're either 'meh', or scary. Sometimes the male writers give female characters male personalities, even down to their sexual orientations. When women write female characters the characters often reflect how the writer wishes to see herself, resulting in childish wish-fulfilment.

But now the feminine way of writing has become the norm in AAA. Every female character must be exemplary.

 

[jakkis]

When you have men write female characters they are either "harmless" husks devoid of any personality - reflecting the writers' honest opinion on 99% of women, or vicious chaotic evil sluts. Regarding their personality they're either 'meh', or scary. Sometimes the male writers give female characters male personalities, even down to their sexual orientations. When women write female characters the characters often reflect how the writer wishes to see herself, resulting in childish wish-fulfilment.

But now the feminine way of writing has become the norm in AAA. Every female character must be exemplary.

So what you're saying is, men can't write female characters, nor can women... So only non-binary writers should write female characters, or for that matter write anything, as you can't have stories with just men.

You only want stories written by non-binary headcases? Or that no-one in the history of stories has written a good female characters? What are you advocating for here?

 

[Froila]

You only want stories written by non-binary headcases?

YES!!! We need more stories as 'I Sexually Identify as an Attack Helicopter'.

Shitstorm about it was a pleasure to read and a pure fun.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Sexually_Identify_as_an_Attack_Helicopter#Publication_history

 

[skaraher]

When you have men write female characters they are either "harmless" husks devoid of any personality - reflecting the writers' honest opinion on 99% of women, or vicious chaotic evil sluts. Regarding their personality they're either 'meh', or scary. Sometimes the male writers give female characters male personalities, even down to their sexual orientations. When women write female characters the characters often reflect how the writer wishes to see herself, resulting in childish wish-fulfilment.

But now the feminine way of writing has become the norm in AAA. Every female character must be exemplary.

Nah, fat non-binary accultured nerds can't write women.

Enjoy an entire generation of writers without a solid grasp of classical literature and oldschool SciFi/fantasy.

 

[Semiurge]

When you have men write female characters they are either "harmless" husks devoid of any personality - reflecting the writers' honest opinion on 99% of women, or vicious chaotic evil sluts. Regarding their personality they're either 'meh', or scary. Sometimes the male writers give female characters male personalities, even down to their sexual orientations. When women write female characters the characters often reflect how the writer wishes to see herself, resulting in childish wish-fulfilment.

But now the feminine way of writing has become the norm in AAA. Every female character must be exemplary.

So what you're saying is, men can't write female characters, nor can women... So only non-binary writers should write female characters, or for that matter write anything, as you can't have stories with just men.

You only want stories written by non-binary headcases? Or that no-one in the history of stories has written a good female characters? What are you advocating for here?

Those are the common pitfalls that talented writers of both sexes can avoid, if they want to.

 

[KeAShizuku]

Who cares about women when you can have blood orgies with your demon waifu?

Stop being boring.

 

[deama]

Who cares about women when you can have blood orgies with your demon waifu?

Stop being boring.

Which one is the demon waifu? The end one? Don't you basically cuck youself with her?

 

[Desiderius]

Ember is an eldritch horror who starts out not being able to convince a couple dudes from murdering her, and evolves into a mind raping cult leader who could ask a hundred demons to kill themselves and they would. Her persuasion slowly becomes supernatural, then eventually overcomes even consent or self-interest.

At first you think her writing is terrible, then you see it's the same writer as Arue telling a *very* different story. And sure, that still doesn't make Ember's writing good, but it does become really dang nefarious: sincere repentance vs blind faith.

Both Ember and Arue are badly written and their writer is an avowed brony.

I find Arue to be a bit more tolerable, but yes I wasn't impressed with them. Ember in particular grated on my nerves.

That being said, when it comes to the straight dude romance options (not Ember obviously), Arue is still the best of the bunch.

Camilla - hahaha no
Wenduag - cannibal cooch. Probably doesn't understand what a bath is.
Galfrey - spank me harder grandma

Somehow Arue came out as the sane choice despite still being shit.

This is how women see other women (their rivals).

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Wenduag is my absolute favorite and my one true waifuu. Don't you dare insult her!!!

Spidercat is amazing and hot.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_Kingmaker/s/ZRlFr9JlsM

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_Kingmaker/s/GbFW7MNlWK

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_Kingmaker/s/WNzxmVR5i6

https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_Kingmaker/s/HkLeza0J1W

 

[Major_Blackhart]

What I don't get is why there isn't alot of rule34 about her tho.

On a more serious note I made wendu into a warpriest axe thrower. I actually really enjoyed her character development in my playthru but I went chaotic neutral demon and blood for the Bloodgod... uh... Witness Me Gorum cavalier.

 

[Reinhardt]

Wenduag is my absolute favorite and my one true waifuu. Don't you dare insult her!!!

cuck

 

[oldmanpaco]

No one ever released an Ember romance mod. Why even play the game...

 

[Morality Games]

I've never found myself engrossed in the female characters / romances in Owlcat games, but they're serviceable and fit to purpose as role-laying options.

The best thing I can say about them is that they are technically impressive in terms of scale if nothing else. Wenduag in particular is the game's answer to Viconia and you can do a lot with her to live out different role playing fantasies.

The big flaw though is that there is a lot of jank. In order for a good-aligned character to get where they would want to be with Wenduag, they would have to meta game around different decisions they would never ordinarily make if they were playing their character organically (starting with recruiting her in the first place, a moral and rational person would never side with Wenduag over Lann).

Still, "technically impressive in scale with a lot of jank" is part of Owlcat's charm and one I'm sure I'll miss if/when they graduate to polished but superficial Mass Effect clones.