Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Reinhardt]

Civilization made you WEAK!

 

[Desiderius]

Regarding the stop and hold buttons. Stop - stops the current activity of a character. For example, the character will stop moving Hold - The character will hold their current position, only attacking enemies within their reach. They won't move unless you order them to. This button is a toggle on/off now, but doesn't show this way in the UI. So if you noticed that your melee characters stopped moving closer to enemies, try to click on the Hold button once. It will probably fix it, because it will turn off the Hold toggle. In the future we will make it visible whether Hold is on or off to avoid confusion. @Beta

I grew up with WarCraft 2, StarCraft and WarCraft 3, so, for me, whenever these posts happen, it's like... trying to teach the drooling image of the village idiot how to drink water from the local well.

No, we grew up hating those games with a passion because not Empire/Civ. Getting this right is important. Must be the problem with Lann’s mount.

 

[Desiderius]

The genius of these games is you can basically play 3.5 (OMG full BAB and fast spell progression!) while assuming those other 2,573 abilities all suck and be none the wiser other than coming up against a few mobs that aren’t vulnerable to your narrow lines of attack or you know having to slog through trash fights while people who play the actual game fly through them.

Pretty much any build that plans to suck the whole game before finally getting that uber ability (and the EK capstone is far from that - if you’re critting you’re already winning) is theorycrafting at best.

 

[Delterius]

wanted to play crossblooded sorcerer (fey + serpentine) to really focus on enchantment and making sure it works against most people

turns out serpentine arcana has been bugged since kingmaker rip me

 

[LannTheStupid]

I grew up with WarCraft 2, StarCraft and WarCraft 3, so, for me, whenever these posts happen, it's like... trying to teach the drooling image of the village idiot how to drink water from the local well.

I have never played and will never play any RTS. Without indefinite time to think my brain stops working (and I drop dead on the floor).

However, I have not noticed the "Hold" button in the GUI until you mentioned it, and for that I am very thankful. I wonder if it was always in Kingmaker, because now it certainly is.

 

[Desiderius]

Btw is there any SAMURAI class in Wrath?

Not yet.

I hear rusty_shackleford is working on convincing them to add the whole Wizardry Far Eastern package.

 

[The_Mask]

I'm at Daeran's place right now, just fought the demons that crashed his party. The sound design for the lines spoken is... off. Each line/word has a tiny echo.

Papa Mishulin, if you're reading this, please don't let mice play on the table. Check your sound dept. I think they're playing footsies over there. We can tell how people sound like in a room. <3

 

[Cryomancer]

How I can reform my party on ch4? I wanna visit the brothel of the then thousand delights, but if Arueshalae sees me doing that, she will be pissed off.

So far, I an loving the portrait of the Abyss. Everything and everyone is very chaotic and you will be backstabed many times. Also, only because you are really powerful on the material plane, doesn't means that you are powerful here. Thanadaemons(CR13) are regular guards on the lower parts of the town here. If you wanna read bellow, will be spoilers.

main objective on ch 4

My main objective is to get enough renown to get a audience with the Nocticula among other things. So far, I had some fights on the arena and the arena battles are very chaotic. The judge got bored and started to cast spells in the area, I got taken as slave with a mysterious collar and my enslaves killed thenselves to death after a discussion of who betrayed who. I also bough and freed some slaves. But I don't have enough renown to get Nocticula's attention.

So far, the game is being a complete masterpiece. Chaotic evil is often retarded evil in video games. I an enjoying this part of the game a lot

 

[Iluvcheezcake]

Eldritch knight?
How you would buuld one?

If this game is anything like Kingmaker, the correct way to build an Eldritch Knight is to play a Magus with zero Eldritch Knight levels. The EK is an anachronistic heritage of D&D 3.x, where you needed prestige classes to play a fighter/caster hybrid. Since in Pathfinder these hybrids already exist as base classes, there's really no point to it. I mean, yes, you get a different spell list, if that's what you're into.

But if you're really stubborn, the basic entry options are Paladin 2/Sorcerer 6, Fighter 1/Wizard 5, or just Wizard 5 if the Martial Weapon Proficiency feat still gives proficiency with all the weapons.

AND IF OWLCAT IS LISTENING, they really should homebrew a new Eldritch Knight taking inspiration from the 3.5 Abjurant Champion. THANK YOU OWLCAT, VERY COOL.

Last time i played i made 4 sorc/ek, octavia into AT, 1 into Mystic Theurge. 1 lvl in base class, 9 lvls of sorc and 10 lvls of EK. It was the most enjoyable run ever
And all of that with the game companions, no custom characters.

 

[Desiderius]

Time for some more

Spoiler

New Advanced Rogue Talents (there's one each for Knowledge and Lore as well) that are the equivalent of two Mythic Feats (already took the one for Perception). Since we have Touch of Law on Seelah this one probably isn't necessary (but would be great for Stealth) and pretty much obligated to pick up Double Debilitation (the #1 reason to play Rogue). Already have Ever Ready Mythic Ability so Opportunist will be up next, then we may go for these.

Build is Trickster focusing on Mythic Perception and Knowledge (World) to buff team in unusual ways (and find ALL the hidden shit).

This is one of those annoying little things (archetype changes WIS-based class to CHR-based so abilities need to be adjusted as well) that games like this often miss and indeed the text here is wrong.

Owlcat got that shit right (6 sec/rnd -> +6 CHR -> 36 sec)! Good on you designers! Now we'll see if it does anything since they just added some Demon categories and all she has is Outsiders.

Animal Growth grows your animal now! Yes, also makes the pathfinding even more of a nightmare (no pun intended) as it should. I recommend playing Small pets (they grow into medium, then Large with this spell) for that reason and Charging with your Mount to start combat if you have one.

Will o' the Wisp summon now casts Obsidian Flow, which works pretty well with my parties that keep Feather Step, Mass up at all times.

Formerly generic Cloaks now all have additional unique abilities. Awesome!

The way to this (very important - it's hard to boost damage on xbows without burning valuable Feats) xbow was blocked on previous beta. Reported and fixed!

Daeran's Mobility much appreciated for parkour around Siege of Drezen to pick you battles skillfully. Animal Aspect from Lann's Drovier Aura.

Now two random dispellers off the screen in various fights. Very devious! Can't rest much on this map either or the corruption will get you.

Aru gets the Linzi Cheat Death mechanic, this time with butterflies.

This is in fact the very heart of The Good. Glad they got that, and said it.



Suck it evil phaggots.

Love this Slippery Mind update. Used to just be a re-roll, which is good but doesn't do much if you suck. This fixes the suck so well it gives you another reason to play a Rogue.

 

[Infinitron]

 

[Parabalus]

The genius of these games is you can basically play 3.5 (OMG full BAB and fast spell progression!) while assuming those other 2,573 abilities all suck and be none the wiser other than coming up against a few mobs that aren’t vulnerable to your narrow lines of attack or you know having to slog through trash fights while people who play the actual game fly through them.

Pretty much any build that plans to suck the whole game before finally getting that uber ability (and the EK capstone is far from that - if you’re critting you’re already winning) is theorycrafting at best.

So you'd rather go Sorc20/Lich10 instead of mixing some Signifier or EK?

You arguments make no sense. A-moving with buffs is faster than casting spells, unless you mean to say that pure Sorc is a better melee.

How I can reform my party on ch4? I wanna visit the brothel of the then thousand delights, but if Arueshalae sees me doing that, she will be pissed off.

So far, I an loving the portrait of the Abyss. Everything and everyone is very chaotic and you will be backstabed many times. Also, only because you are really powerful on the material plane, doesn't means that you are powerful here. Thanadaemons(CR13) are regular guards on the lower parts of the town here. If you wanna read bellow, will be spoilers.

main objective on ch 4

My main objective is to get enough renown to get a audience with the Nocticula among other things. So far, I had some fights on the arena and the arena battles are very chaotic. The judge got bored and started to cast spells in the area, I got taken as slave with a mysterious collar and my enslaves killed thenselves to death after a discussion of who betrayed who. I also bough and freed some slaves. But I don't have enough renown to get Nocticula's attention.

So far, the game is being a complete masterpiece. Chaotic evil is often retarded evil in video games. I an enjoying this part of the game a lot

In 0.5 I had to go back to base (starting area) and leave through the portal there (the one you use to enter the city the first time), teleporters didn't help.

 

[CaesarCzech]

How I can reform my party on ch4? I wanna visit the brothel of the then thousand delights, but if Arueshalae sees me doing that, she will be pissed off.

So far, I an loving the portrait of the Abyss. Everything and everyone is very chaotic and you will be backstabed many times. Also, only because you are really powerful on the material plane, doesn't means that you are powerful here. Thanadaemons(CR13) are regular guards on the lower parts of the town here. If you wanna read bellow, will be spoilers.

main objective on ch 4

My main objective is to get enough renown to get a audience with the Nocticula among other things. So far, I had some fights on the arena and the arena battles are very chaotic. The judge got bored and started to cast spells in the area, I got taken as slave with a mysterious collar and my enslaves killed thenselves to death after a discussion of who betrayed who. I also bough and freed some slaves. But I don't have enough renown to get Nocticula's attention.

So far, the game is being a complete masterpiece. Chaotic evil is often retarded evil in video games. I an enjoying this part of the game a lot

so chaotic evil is less stupid evil and more bunch of bandits and killers with mentality of Middle Eastern Dictaror in this game ?

 

[NotSerious]

Is this in a good state? How much meat on the bone currently exists?

The RPG famine has me tempted to give it a go despite wanting to wait till its finished.

 

[Parabalus]

Is this in a good state? How much meat on the bone currently exists?

The RPG famine has me tempted to give it a go despite wanting to wait till its finished.

Worth playing, less bugs than KM after several major patches. Extremely fun.

 

[CaesarCzech]

I don't understand what seems to be wrong with Eldritch Knight. My favourite Russian speaking youtuber published one interesting build for it which I am trying in WotR now.

I'd say they are mediocre warriors and mediocre mages. Melee/mage combos work only when the melee side is very good and you use the mage side to buff that to godly levels. EKs get very rudimentary melee abilities and you are better off casting damaging spells than letting melee consume your actions in any given turn. The Spell Critical feat they gain at level 10 is okay (if you get a crit) and I'd say it's the only cool thing the EK gets, but you need to heavily invest in an otherwise mediocre class.

mediocre melee and mage doesnt work in turnbased, you cant pull using magical flashbang and then using one handed sword to impale enemy into head, they would basically need special abilities and spell and made it specifically class. Like spray acid and use shield and you have flamethrower close range since shield can be used offensively. this is basically reality not being able to fit into mechanics.

 

[CaesarCzech]

pretty lame that you can mount inside the dungeons.

mounted combat would be better if it was reserved for special occasions, ie traveling on the wasteland or certain dungeon areas build for it.

On the tabletop you can only enter dungeons if you're using a medium mount, which means medium sized cavaliers can't usually use their mounts in dungeons (without beast rider shenanigans anyway).

This is a problematic rule though, as most APs are dungeon heavy and Cavaliers and Samurai are both heavily dependent on their mount to be competitive with other martials unless they take a mountless archetype (in which case, why not just play any of the standard martials?)

A lot of DMs hand wave the mount size and just allow people to take warhorses into dungeons, and people playing with strict DMs usually just play with small races so they can use medium mounts in dungeons.

It really is no fun to block core class features from the majority of you game. As a DM, you either tell the player not to pick that class or you warp your world to allow it. It's not like it's something gamebreaking.

alternatively just have player take appropriate mount like i get that horse wont be much use there, but equivalent of warg or Smilodon would still be usefull there.

 

[Tacgnol]

pretty lame that you can mount inside the dungeons.

mounted combat would be better if it was reserved for special occasions, ie traveling on the wasteland or certain dungeon areas build for it.

On the tabletop you can only enter dungeons if you're using a medium mount, which means medium sized cavaliers can't usually use their mounts in dungeons (without beast rider shenanigans anyway).

This is a problematic rule though, as most APs are dungeon heavy and Cavaliers and Samurai are both heavily dependent on their mount to be competitive with other martials unless they take a mountless archetype (in which case, why not just play any of the standard martials?)

A lot of DMs hand wave the mount size and just allow people to take warhorses into dungeons, and people playing with strict DMs usually just play with small races so they can use medium mounts in dungeons.

It really is no fun to block core class features from the majority of you game. As a DM, you either tell the player not to pick that class or you warp your world to allow it. It's not like it's something gamebreaking.

alternatively just have player take appropriate mount like i get that horse wont be much use there, but equivalent of warg or Smilodon would still be usefull there.

Same issue. Mounts have to be one size category larger than rider by RAW. Wargs are medium so can only be ridden by small cavaliers such as halfings.

It's not taking a horse into a dungeon that's the problem, but the fact the war horse is large sized.

Either way, it's easier to just let them use what they want in the dungeons. Mounted Cavaliers are no more powerful than any other optimised martial.

 

[The_Mask]

Is this in a good state?

This title is in a working beta, which means there is a lot of things to fix, but the scope and work involved lead us to think that this title looks very promising.

How much meat on the bone currently exists?

By my estimate, so far, about 50 to 60% complete. This, however, should not discourage you, since this 60% is still enough content to last you years, if not decades.

The RPG famine has me tempted to give it a go despite wanting to wait till its finished.

I would strongly recommend to wait for the final product, unless you're a huge fan of what's going on. My personal opinion is that if you're not 100% invested and interested in what's going on, you will end up extremely frustrated, since it is a work in progress. Otherwise, you're free to invest your money and time as you see fit, of course.

 

[LannTheStupid]

So you'd rather go Sorc20/Lich10

It sounds like a perfect caster build to beat saving throws. What's wrong with that?

 

[Cryomancer]

of bandits and killers with mentality of Middle Eastern Dictaror in this game ?

Yep. I would say that demon lords are more akin to the most chaotic "drug lords" than to "kings". Devils in other hands, are all about strict hierarchy. Demons lie to you for no good reason, plot one against other, and only obey those who are extremely strong and will try to overthrow his leaders in the first opportunity with no loyalty. Even the architecture of the city is very chaotic.

By my estimate, so far, about 50 to 60% complete.

Is the final game 7 chapters long?

 

[The_Mask]

Is the final game 7 chapters long?

As I've stated before, I would give at least 20% of the funds & time to debugging. These days ensuring that the player has an uninterrupted and immersive experience the 2h they invest in your game is gold. Many gamers find that "respecting my time" should be a priority for game developers.

So they have 20% of the game to finish, I guess. And 20% debugging. In my opinion, of course. Feel free to correct me.

 

[Delterius]

So you'd rather go Sorc20/Lich10

It sounds like a perfect caster build to beat saving throws. What's wrong with that?

I think DC casters have a lot of options actually. Stacking CLs doesn't give you better DCs in Pathfinder. So what you're looking for is a competition between Lich/Angel's Level 10 spells (10 base DC for those spells) vs Azata's Favorable Magic vs Demon's 5+DC swings via Aspects.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Many gamers find that "respecting my time" should be a priority for game developers.

I hope those people have their parents die from COVID-19, and their children die from leukemia. This is the only way they can repent the fact of their existence.

 

[Parabalus]

So you'd rather go Sorc20/Lich10

It sounds like a perfect caster build to beat saving throws. What's wrong with that?

Context was bashing stuff in melee with a X/Y/Z/Lich.

Is Sorc20 even competitive for maxing DCs?