Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Game of the Year Edition

[CthuluIsSpy]

So I started my playthrough.
My character.
Did not invest in dex because I'm wearing heavy armour and you don't get dex bonuses from that at all, so better to not have it. Kept lowest stats at 10 because I don't know what I absolutely will not need.
Took Acolyte for background so persuasion checks scale off wisdom instead of charisma, and it made sense to me for an inquisitor to be persuasive.
Went human because this is a first playthrough. Could have gone orc but I didn't feel like it.

My Character's pet Triceratops. I probably should have gone horse, but the idea of a fantatical mace wielding inquisitor riding a dinosaur was so ludicrous I just had to go with it.

Got out the first dungeon, my thoughts so far -
- The pacing feels a lot faster than Kingmaker for now. I remember Kingmaker having a really slow start.
- You do not get an early arcane caster but you do get a couple of divine casters, so starting as some variant of mage would probably be a better start.
- Angel mythic path is incredibly useful
- Camellia is sus as shit.
- Pets are OP. I mean, you get an extra party member who doesn't seem to die. That's incredibly useful.
- You get a stupid amount of loot in the first dungeon. Some of which are like 100 gold each.
- The combat encounters aren't too hard, with the exception of the Mongrel Brutes which can easily down a party member on core. Cambion archers also killed my mc. To me this indicates that having a frontliner as your mc might be a bad idea early on.
- You absolutely need remove fear for the end boss. Hence why Camilia comes with it.
- The game gives you cold iron weapons early on, and you're going to need them. What else counts as cold iron? Enchanted?

 

[Haplo]

- You do not get an early arcane caster but you do get a couple of divine casters, so starting as some variant of mage would probably be a better start.

Eh, you'll get 1 hybrid arcane caster + 2 full arcanes very soon. Don't worry about it.

- Angel mythic path is incredibly useful

You don't get Mythic Ranks untill the end of Act 1. In fact you don't commit to a "real" Mythic path untill the end of Act 2 (the Mythic flavor choice at Rank 1 is purely cosmetic and has no consequence).

Spoiler

But how you handle the Wardstone does matter, particularly if you want to become an Aeon.

Note some Mythic Paths are missable or blockable (only Angel and Demon are always available).

- Camellia is sus as shit.

She is helpful, is she not?

- Pets are OP. I mean, you get an extra party member who doesn't seem to die. That's incredibly useful.

Yep.

- The combat encounters aren't too hard, with the exception of the Mongrel Brutes which can easily down a party member on core. Cambion archers also killed my mc. To me this indicates that having a frontliner as your mc might be a bad idea early on.

Having a squishy MC is an even worse idea - many enemies like to beeline your MC - *particularly* if he's squishy. Its even possible to eploit this, by placing martials between the enemies and MC and reaping AoOs as they charge past the tanks.

- The game gives you cold iron weapons early on, and you're going to need them. What else counts as cold iron? Enchanted?

+3 Enchantment counts as Cold Iron. +4 counts as Adamantine. +5 counts as Alignment.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Oh, Camellia is most certainly helpful. Shamans seem like a very useful class to have with their hexes and spirits.
However, the fact that she's hiding her alignment and was standing over a dead guy when you recruit her seems suspect.
I guess I'll find out later if she's a spy or not.

 

[Haplo]

Oh, Camellia is most certainly helpful. Shamans seem like a very useful class to have with their hexes and spirits.
However, the fact that she's hiding her alignment and was standing over a dead guy when you recruit her seems suspect.
I guess I'll find out later if she's a spy or not.

You will get to know her better

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

How do you see weapon traits? There doesn't seem to be a list in the encyclopedia?
I know masterwork gives a +1 to hit and cold iron bypasses some immunities, but what about finesse weapon?

 

[Haplo]

How do you see weapon traits? There doesn't seem to be a list in the encyclopedia?
I know masterwork gives a +1 to hit and cold iron bypasses some immunities, but what about finesse weapon?

Finesse means it can use Dexterity for attack with Weapon Finesse Feat (and for damage with Mythic Finesse or Rogue Finesse Training).
Light means it has a smaller penalty when used offhand (-2 AB), but cannot be grabbed two-handed (for +50% Str or Dex damage bonus and +50% Power Attack bonus).

In principle when you'll go mounted, I'd definately drop that shield for more damage.

 

[Cpt. Dallas]

Oh, Camellia is most certainly helpful. Shamans seem like a very useful class to have with their hexes and spirits.
However, the fact that she's hiding her alignment and was standing over a dead guy when you recruit her seems suspect.
I guess I'll find out later if she's a spy or not.

You will get to know her better

There is a good aligned cape you can try fitting her with.

 

[Average Manatee]

Did not invest in dex because I'm wearing heavy armour and you don't get dex bonuses from that at all, so better to not have it.

There is still some use, you can get more AoOs per turn from combat reflexes. Though 10 is still acceptable since you'll have +dex equipment or buffs.

- The combat encounters aren't too hard, with the exception of the Mongrel Brutes which can easily down a party member on core. Cambion archers also killed my mc. To me this indicates that having a frontliner as your mc might be a bad idea early on.

Reach weapon + Enlarge person = you're now a midliner hiding well behind your pet. Add in Lunge and you are practically a ranged character with like 20 foot reach. Later you can ride your pet and they absorb 95% of attacks. Actually tanking enemies with your character is for chumps, optimize for maximum AB/Damage. If I'm playing with a pet in shield maze (which is basically always, I'll give an NPC one if needed), I'll even have Seelah be armorless just to increase her movement speed since if you manage things well she's not being hit while she has a glaive.

 

[volklore]

Mmh mobility 2 is strong. Needs a ton of setup to beat CMDs on unfair because when you fail a mobility check you entire round goes to waste but with take 10 from mythic skill focus that's a pretty clear threshold

-Seems like mobility 2 tricks bypasses flatfooted immunities like uncanny dodge, probably intended but strong indeed
-Crippling Kiss estoc description was actually updated from its release state with a ''multiple application of this effect do not stack'' but it still stacks as it used to do lol

I was trying to grease the treant once its reflex save was dumped into oblivion by so many applications of crippling kiss but he was totally unaffected by it and even as I rewatch, it cannot understand why. He does'nt have FoM. Is that a side effect of winds of vengeance granting fly speed?

 

[Average Manatee]

You badly need Seize the Moment with a build like that. Every other party member could be throwing AoOs when you walk past someone and crit them. Even Lann if he's got snap shot feats.

Yeah, you're probably right about him having fly speed.

 

[Haplo]

Mmh mobility 2 is strong. Needs a ton of setup to beat CMDs on unfair because when you fail a mobility check you entire round goes to waste but with take 10 from mythic skill focus that's a pretty clear threshold

-Seems like mobility 2 tricks bypasses flatfooted immunities like uncanny dodge, probably intended but strong indeed
-Crippling Kiss estoc description was actually updated from its release state with a ''multiple application of this effect do not stack'' but it still stacks as it used to do lol

I was trying to grease the treant once its reflex save was dumped into oblivion by so many applications of crippling kiss but he was totally unaffected by it and even as I rewatch, it cannot understand why. He does'nt have FoM. Is that a side effect of winds of vengeance granting fly speed?

Yeah, Mobility 2 is awesome!

But a Thug? Frankly I don't see the synergy here. Also the damage seems rather sad.
I think you need at least Power Attack + Mythic.

 

[Haplo]

You badly need Seize the Moment with a build like that. Every other party member could be throwing AoOs when you walk past someone and crit them. Even Lann if he's got snap shot feats.

Yeah, you're probably right about him having fly speed.

Yeah, or just Outflank with reach, Lunge melees staying near.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I was trying to grease the treant once its reflex save was dumped into oblivion by so many applications of crippling kiss but he was totally unaffected by it and even as I rewatch, it cannot understand why. He does'nt have FoM. Is that a side effect of winds of vengeance granting fly speed?

Grease makes targets prone. Is the Treant immune to the prone condition?

Also, I doubt that Freedom of Movement has anything to do with protection against Grease, as (IIRC) Freedom of Movement does not prevent falling off one's feet.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

I was trying to grease the treant once its reflex save was dumped into oblivion by so many applications of crippling kiss but he was totally unaffected by it and even as I rewatch, it cannot understand why. He does'nt have FoM. Is that a side effect of winds of vengeance granting fly speed?

Grease makes targets prone. Is the Treant immune to the prone condition?

Also, I doubt that Freedom of Movement has anything to do with protection against Grease, as (IIRC) Freedom of Movement does not prevent falling off one's feet.

It's not. I was able to grease it.

 

[volklore]

I was trying to grease the treant once its reflex save was dumped into oblivion by so many applications of crippling kiss but he was totally unaffected by it and even as I rewatch, it cannot understand why. He does'nt have FoM. Is that a side effect of winds of vengeance granting fly speed?

Grease makes targets prone. Is the Treant immune to the prone condition?

He's not prone immune (at least it's not listed) I the vid i just mouth over his entire sheet because I couldnt figure out what was causing grease to not even trigger a save.

 

[volklore]

Mmh mobility 2 is strong. Needs a ton of setup to beat CMDs on unfair because when you fail a mobility check you entire round goes to waste but with take 10 from mythic skill focus that's a pretty clear threshold

-Seems like mobility 2 tricks bypasses flatfooted immunities like uncanny dodge, probably intended but strong indeed
-Crippling Kiss estoc description was actually updated from its release state with a ''multiple application of this effect do not stack'' but it still stacks as it used to do lol

I was trying to grease the treant once its reflex save was dumped into oblivion by so many applications of crippling kiss but he was totally unaffected by it and even as I rewatch, it cannot understand why. He does'nt have FoM. Is that a side effect of winds of vengeance granting fly speed?

Yeah, Mobility 2 is awesome!

But a Thug? Frankly I don't see the synergy here. Also the damage seems rather sad.
I think you need at least Power Attack + Mythic.

Well I built it for multi-oponents battles really. I.e run around and proc sicken/injury/stagger from the shadow clemency ring and debuffs from crippling kiss, and eventually dispelling attacks since you get sneak attacks without having to flank due to always making mobs flat-footed. I think that's plenty of synergy, basically allowing spreading thug sneak attack debuffs which normally would hit 1 enemy per round to the entirety of melee in the field.
I kinda didn't really realize how much I actually could run with 100 movement. So I'd assume I'd get 1 attack per mook on big packs and if mobs are pretty spaced out, and so the idea was packing as many on hit debuff as possible on each hit and leave everything so crippled they aren't a threat anymore. Also the fear on dazzle was really good in the early game and still a good option, and swift action dazzle fits well in my action econ, in addition to be a neat way to also CC archers and mages. All in all I was attemping to build more of a debuffing/CC machine rather than a damage dealer.
I agree now that I see how much you can run that damage oriented would be better (since you still get to use the clemency ring). I thought about saint with looks like the obvious candidate but I didn't want to play another saint. but tbh this already made wintersun really, really easy so is more damage really needed?
Now that you speak about dmg though, why are some of my hits sneaks and some not in the vid ? If the treant isn't immune to precision damage he should take sneak attack dmg on every hit.

Edit : actually it's even more strange. I replayed the fight and the sneak attacks register in the combat log but I do not get the SA dice on my damage rolls, seemingly in completely random fashion. Some attacks I do get them but some not.

 

[Harthwain]

If its more than 10% according to this chart that's a purgin'

I would rather have a Khajiit with distinct cat-like features (knees, claws, for example) over "a human, but with cat ears and a tail!1101". At least the former makes it feel like an actual race, not some play-pretend bullshit.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

So there's a hidden time limit before the tavern attack.
I am not a fan of that. I lost 2 hours after having to roll back a save because I thought I could camp in peace and get a breather and some spells recharged.
Ember is pretty nice though. That hex mechanic is great, although if you fail you can't target the same enemy again, which is kind of bullshit. I thought I would have to purge her for being a witch, but the lawful choice is to actually save her and kill the instigator.

 

[Cpt. Dallas]

I moved on to Chp.4 without taking the boat ride at 'Murky Grotto' and got the failed quest notification. The DLC is described as 'rougelike', so I assume just XP farming?

 

[Delterius]

I moved on to Chp.4 without taking the boat ride at 'Murky Grotto' and got the failed quest notification. The DLC is described as 'rougelike', so I assume just XP farming?

its a series of dungeons with boss fights in between. it has a little story to it, and lots of exps and gold, yes.

 

[Yosharian]

I moved on to Chp.4 without taking the boat ride at 'Murky Grotto' and got the failed quest notification. The DLC is described as 'rougelike', so I assume just XP farming?

It's pure shit, just use Toy Box to spawn in any loot you missed

 

[Crichton]

I moved on to Chp.4 without taking the boat ride at 'Murky Grotto' and got the failed quest notification. The DLC is described as 'rougelike', so I assume just XP farming?

It's pure shit, just use Toy Box to spawn in any loot you missed

I liked it at the start but it has one of the same ultimate problems as the equivalent DLC from the first game; enemy variety totally goes to hell at the end (and I don't just mean all the demons)

Animated suit of armor
Animated suit of armor
Animated suit of armor
Animated suit of armor
Deadly mythic sharpshooting harlot
Animated suit of armor

(Repeat at Owlcat encounter density)

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Is it me or is Zen Archer OP?
Lann is just wreaking shit with his Flurry of Bows. Like, he can nearly two shot anything outside of demons, and that's because I hadn't discovered cold iron arrows yet.
Weird thing though is that he has potion crafting but no spell book to actually make the potions with. What's up with that?

 

[Haplo]

Well I built it for multi-oponents battles really. I.e run around and proc sicken/injury/stagger from the shadow clemency ring and debuffs from crippling kiss, and eventually dispelling attacks since you get sneak attacks without having to flank due to always making mobs flat-footed. I kinda didn't really realize how much I actually could run with 100 movement. So I'd assume I'd get 1 attack per mook on big packs and if mobs are pretty spaced out, and so the idea was packing as many on hit debuff as possible on each hit and leave everything so crippled they aren't a threat anymore. Also the fear on dazzle was really good in the early game and still a good option, and swift action dazzle fits well in my action econ, in addition to be a neat way to also CC archers and mages. All in all I was attemping to build more of a debuffing/CC machine rather than a damage dealer.
I agree now that I see how much you can run that damage oriented would be better (since you still get to use the clemency ring). I thought about saint with looks like the obvious candidate but I didn't want to play another saint. but tbh this already made wintersun really, really easy so is more damage really needed?
Now that you speak about dmg though, why are some of my hits sneaks and some not in the vid ? If the treant isn't immune to precision damage he should take sneak attack dmg on every hit.

Edit : actually it's even more strange. I replayed the fight and the sneak attacks register in the combat log but I do not get the SA dice on my damage rolls, seemingly in completely random fashion. Some attacks I do get them but some not.

Well, Discord resident Mobility Trickster expert, NStark, prefers pure Mutation Warrior for Mobility Trickster.
Does have a clear Dex -> Mobility advantage, with Grand Mutagen giving +8 and TTT alternate capstone another +8 Dex. I guess makes beating those Unfair CMDs easier.
And lots of feats.
With TTT, also nice things, such as Focused Weapon Advanced Training for increased damage dice.

TTT also has the lovely Impossible Speed Mythic Ability, which is fantastic for Mobility Tricksters.
And the unneeded, but still nice for skillchecks, Graceful Athlete.

Don't know what's happening with random sneak attack application.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Where do you see the list of weapon traits, and where does it tell you that enhancements are the same as cold iron? I see nothing about it in the encyclopedia.
Also, does adamantine affect DR/Cold Iron, or does it only affect DR/Adamantine?