Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Game of the Year Edition

[Average Manatee]

Did they nerf the Defender's Heart siege? Seemed way easier than previous times I've done it, playing on Hard and I feel like I could have destroyed it even on Unfair. Mino having 18 AC is really a joke.

Granted I did ding level 6 before it and had 3 extended castings of Haste on Nenio (and of course selective grease). Though I'm also holding off on leveling my pets past 4 and nothing could even come close to hitting them with mid 30s AC.

Although it also took WAY longer than I thought was normal, so I wonder if there's some kind of level-adjustment where you have to fight more waves the higher level you are. Or is it just that only the arsonists progress the siege while normal enemies spawn as fast as you kill them, so if you wipe them out quickly you get more of the normal dudes?

 

[Desiderius]

of course selective grease

That screws all your ranged allies trying to shoot stuff from the roof-tops.

It's a first level spell. Let it go.

Thing about Defense is it's the one time in the game you're fighting 1 and 2 HD enemies so stuff like Sleep (Wolj sells a cheap wand), Hypnotize, and Scare can go off. Web is probably the best since it's long-lasting and doesn't Prone so you can just pew pew everything stuck in the Webs.

It does feel like it's been nerfed.

 

[Desiderius]

Tried out the Cruromancer and his Turn Undead ability is not a Channel but a 30 ft Fear with a Will Save (that Order of the Scourge can debuff). Got Vampire Lord Heritage and going Hellknight Signifier Lich. Will be awhile until I get to it but should be interesting.

https://poets.org/poem/vampire-0

 

[Average Manatee]

That screws all your ranged allies trying to shoot stuff from the roof-tops.

It's a first level spell. Let it go.

1. Who cares about crappy AIs that barely do anything.
2. An enemy that is on the ground with a -100% chance to hit me is always worth a few ranged characters having a -20% chance to hit them.
3. My characters hitting for close to effective +20 AB and 20 damage per hit 2-3 APR makes it kind of trivial

It does feel like it's been nerfed.

Yeah I remember the Mino being at least marginally powerful and taking a few rounds to go down. And it wasn't just my first game where I was less optimized and had to go defend at level 3 or 4, my 2nd and 3rd tries also seemed significantly harder than this.

 

[Desiderius]

TTT doesn't unlock Selective until lvl 10 but it's simply a huge waste that early when I need Spell Pen and Spell Focus so much more on a caster. Obv if you wait until lvl six to do it it will be trivial but that's hard to do without gaming the exp and even there you can't rest that much until timer runs out.

 

[Haplo]

Outflank works just fine on all enemies you threaten, you don't need to attack the same enemy.

Fairly sure this is wrong. I tested by turning AI off and having a character just stand still next to an enemy they obviously threatened, outflank did not proc on crits but seize the moment did.

Well, I don't know, maybe you char was flat-footed, CC'ed, the enemy's placement cirle did not align with his model, you did some non-combat actions, were invisible or something.
Outflank in vanilla definately works on all enemies in melee range. No need to actively attack the target.

 

[Haplo]

TTT doesn't unlock Selective until lvl 10 but it's simply a huge waste that early when I need Spell Pen and Spell Focus so much more on a caster. Obv if you wait until lvl six to do it it will be trivial but that's hard to do without gaming the exp and even there you can't rest that much until timer runs out.

No such a thing as Selective Grease (or pitts, Sirocco) in TTT.

 

[Haplo]

Did they nerf the Defender's Heart siege? Seemed way easier than previous times I've done it, playing on Hard and I feel like I could have destroyed it even on Unfair. Mino having 18 AC is really a joke.

Granted I did ding level 6 before it and had 3 extended castings of Haste on Nenio (and of course selective grease). Though I'm also holding off on leveling my pets past 4 and nothing could even come close to hitting them with mid 30s AC.

Although it also took WAY longer than I thought was normal, so I wonder if there's some kind of level-adjustment where you have to fight more waves the higher level you are. Or is it just that only the arsonists progress the siege while normal enemies spawn as fast as you kill them, so if you wipe them out quickly you get more of the normal dudes?

From what I remember, only killing Arsonists and the small demons counts for Siege progression. Cultists spawn endlessly.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

yeah, you have to kill killing arsonists until the minotaur spawns. Then you kill the minotaur and the remaining arsonists.
Its a bit of a grind, really. I didn't think it was too hard, but it outstayed its welcome and takes forever on turn based.

 

[Parabalus]

What's a good choice for a (mounted) Demon auto-attacker?

Were VS Cleaving Finishes nerfed, can you still chain them indefinitely?

Last played after TtA release, didn't keep up with the patches. No mods like TTT.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

I finally beat the gargoyle party cave.
I had to grab the back line, move them towards Regil to trigger the cutscene. This time the AI didn't just walk a couple of gargoyles into the middle of my formation with scripted bullshit and I just ran the entire party over to the corner with the human archers. Nenio cast displacement on the pet and the MC, they tanked, Daeran buffed with bless and prayer, and Ember tried staying out of the way and used slumber.

Some things I learned -
- Magic Weapon apparently doesn't work on pets? I tried using it on my triceratops and it still said reduced damage, even though he was dealing about 15 a hit. I checked the page for the Hunters and it just says Damage Reduction 10, exception Magic.
- Ki Power : Extra Attack does in fact work on bows, even though nothing in the class or ability description says it does. It took me 25 hours to discover that.
- If you cast Stinking Cloud directly onto a enemy that has poison immunity, the spell fails and no cloud is generated. You're better off selecting an area with ctrl
- Whilst the hunters are immune to poison, the clerics aren't. I found that out after the High Cleric gave my MC negative levels.
- Skeletons are amazing distractions.
- I really should have given Nenio and Daeran Point Blank and Precise shot. Oh well.

All in all, pretty shitty encounter that makes no sense. Why bother running into a cave if Gargoyles can phase through solid rock and drop in? It makes no sense. They should have all come in through the entrance instead of just spawning in the middle of the map to fuck the player over. I don't see how you can do it without meta-gaming, and that's just bad game design.
Can you imagine if a DM pulled shit like this? The party would have some really choice words for him, most of which beginning with "Fuck" and ending in "You".


Is Perfect Form good? It gives Damage Reduction 10 / Chaotic which sounds amazing...if not for most enemies being chaotic.
Is it worth it for Lann to go 20 ZA, or should I multiclass. He's level 7 now.

 

[Haplo]

Some things I learned -
- Magic Weapon apparently doesn't work on pets? I tried using it on my triceratops and it still said reduced damage, even though he was dealing about 15 a hit. I checked the page for the Hunters and it just says Damage Reduction 10, exception Magic.

No, you need (Greater) Magic Fang buff for that (Ranger/Hunter/Druid/Loremaster only). Or an Amulet of Mighty/Agile Fists.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Some things I learned -
- Magic Weapon apparently doesn't work on pets? I tried using it on my triceratops and it still said reduced damage, even though he was dealing about 15 a hit. I checked the page for the Hunters and it just says Damage Reduction 10, exception Magic.

No, you need (Greater) Magic Fang buff for that. Or an Amulet of Mighty/Agile Fists.

Ah, that makes a lot of sense, actually.
Does the Amulet of Mighty / Agile fists also affect a Zen Archer's bow, as apparently anything that affects his fists also affects his bow?

 

[Haplo]

What's a good choice for a (mounted) Demon auto-attacker?

Were VS Cleaving Finishes nerfed, can you still chain them indefinitely?

Last played after TtA release, didn't keep up with the patches. No mods like TTT.

Yeah, VS Cleaving Finishes still work AFAIK.

Auto-attacker? Demonslayer Ranger? Or a Sohei - but needs Lawful.

Mad Dog is okay if you don't have a Skald, I guess. Or Gendarme.

 

[Parabalus]

What's a good choice for a (mounted) Demon auto-attacker?

Were VS Cleaving Finishes nerfed, can you still chain them indefinitely?

Last played after TtA release, didn't keep up with the patches. No mods like TTT.

Yeah, VS Cleaving Finishes still work AFAIK.

Auto-attacker? Demonslayer Ranger? Or a Sohei - but needs Lawful.

Mad Dog is okay if you don't have a Skald, I guess. Or Gendarme.

And if you drop the mount?

Demonic Charge -> CF Room Clear seems interesting.

Primalist? IW?

No mercs, unrespeced default companions.

Who abuses Kalkavus best, apart from Deadly Earth?

 

[Haplo]

What's a good choice for a (mounted) Demon auto-attacker?

Were VS Cleaving Finishes nerfed, can you still chain them indefinitely?

Last played after TtA release, didn't keep up with the patches. No mods like TTT.

Yeah, VS Cleaving Finishes still work AFAIK.

Auto-attacker? Demonslayer Ranger? Or a Sohei - but needs Lawful.

Mad Dog is okay if you don't have a Skald, I guess. Or Gendarme.

And if you drop the mount?

Demonic Charge -> CF Room Clear seems interesting.

Yeah, that's a bit challenging to pump enough damage for that.

Primalist? IW?

Primalist can get more range. More damage bonuses too, AFAIR.

No mercs, unrespeced default companions.

Who abuses Kalkavus best, apart from Deadly Earth?

Shifter?

 

[Average Manatee]

Well, I don't know, maybe you char was flat-footed, CC'ed, the enemy's placement cirle did not align with his model, you did some non-combat actions, were invisible or something.
Outflank in vanilla definately works on all enemies in melee range. No need to actively attack the target.

I tested yesterday and I swear it worked as I said, and I had combat reflexes so being flat footed shouldn't matter. And I wasn't doing any of the others. But today it seems to work as you say. Although I did find one thing interesting over about 15 tests, it seems that you can't make AoOs while moving in real time. Maybe that's why you see so much fewer AoOs then you'd expect when playing in RT.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Regill's default character build is weird.
He has finesse fighting, but gnome hammer specialization.
Gnome hammer is not a finesse weapon.
He has shield specialization and TWF, but Gnome hammer is a two handed weapon.

I don't know what to do with him.
Also, I should have given my character some points into charisma afterall, because glancing at Regill's hellknight traits you seem to want some charisma as a hellknight. I doubt Acolyte changes that.

 

[Haplo]

Regill's default character build is weird.
He has finesse fighting, but gnome hammer specialization.
Gnome hammer is not a finesse weapon.
He has shield specialization and TWF, but Gnome hammer is a two handed weapon.

I don't know what to do with him.
Also, I should have given my character some points into charisma afterall, because glancing at Regill's hellknight traits you seem to want some charisma as a hellknight. I doubt Acolyte changes that.

He's a level 5 HK Armiger - a Fighter archetype. And has Fighter's Finesse Advanced Weapon Training feat, that allows him to Finesse wield any weapon he has Weapon Training in. This solves the Attack Bonus. When you pick Mythic Weapon Finesse Mythic feat, this combo will let you add Dex to damage for his hammers as well. Shouldn't be long
Also there is an excellent hooked hammer you'll find very soon.
And yeah, its a Double weapon, so he does need TWF for it.

Not sure about the shield specialization. A shield makes no sense for him.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

Regill's default character build is weird.
He has finesse fighting, but gnome hammer specialization.
Gnome hammer is not a finesse weapon.
He has shield specialization and TWF, but Gnome hammer is a two handed weapon.

I don't know what to do with him.
Also, I should have given my character some points into charisma afterall, because glancing at Regill's hellknight traits you seem to want some charisma as a hellknight. I doubt Acolyte changes that.

Regill has Fighter's Finesse, which allows the hook hammer to be finessable. Double-sided weapons like hook hammers function as two-weapon fighting, and benefit from the same feats.

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

Trying to do Leper's Smile and its a pain in the arse. Despite using Protection from Alignment from Evil my characters still get chain confused. Its not great.
Apparently gibbering is supposed to not affect the same character again for 24 hours, but for some fucktarded reason Owlcat forgot to add that.

It doesn't help that the swarms just ignore my tanks and move past them to attack the rest of the party. What's even the point of a tank if the AI can just ignore them?

Once again you need to metagame because if you don't you're fucked.

 

[Parabalus]

What's a good choice for a (mounted) Demon auto-attacker?

Were VS Cleaving Finishes nerfed, can you still chain them indefinitely?

Last played after TtA release, didn't keep up with the patches. No mods like TTT.

Yeah, VS Cleaving Finishes still work AFAIK.

Auto-attacker? Demonslayer Ranger? Or a Sohei - but needs Lawful.

Mad Dog is okay if you don't have a Skald, I guess. Or Gendarme.

And if you drop the mount?

Demonic Charge -> CF Room Clear seems interesting.

Yeah, that's a bit challenging to pump enough damage for that.

Primalist? IW?

Primalist can get more range. More damage bonuses too, AFAIR.

No mercs, unrespeced default companions.

Who abuses Kalkavus best, apart from Deadly Earth?

Shifter?

New dude is Shifter, will probably play with him so I wouldn't want it on MC.

Do you get full attacks after Demonic Charge?

Are normal charges still broken by the tiniest of pebbles, or did they fix that?

 

[Haplo]

Trying to do Leper's Smile and its a pain in the arse. Despite using Protection from Alignment from Evil my characters still get chain confused. Its not great.
Apparently gibbering is supposed to not affect the same character again for 24 hours, but for some fucktarded reason Owlcat forgot to add that.

It doesn't help that the swarms just ignore my tanks and move past them to attack the rest of the party. What's even the point of a tank if the AI can just ignore them?

Once again you need to metagame because if you don't you're fucked.

Protection from Alignment only protects against Domination, not other Compulsions/Confusion.

Bookworm's Headband would help. Also if you have the 4th DLC, Ulbrig's amulet, Swarmbane Clasp, would be very helpful.
Once a character is confused by Gibber, Unbreakable Heart level 1 spell will suspend the effect and temporarily protect you from it.

 

[Haplo]

New dude is Shifter, will probably play with him so I wouldn't want it on MC.

Do you get full attacks after Demonic Charge?

Are normal charges still broken by the tiniest of pebbles, or did they fix that?

No, Demonic Charge is a Move Action, so no Full Attacks afterwards.

Not much has changed in the effectiveness of the normal Charges I think.

But the new guy cheats and has an ability called Death from Above, that lets him Charge without regard for obstacles or line of sight. Also gets Pounce at level 9.

 

[Average Manatee]

If you aren't playing vs. swarms in turn based, do so. It's infinitely easier to manage them and spread your guys out while still focus firing.