KickStarter Phoenix Point - the new game from X-COM creator Julian Gollop

[Zboj Lamignat]

I'm sure the reason for backing the game is because it looks like the best game of it's type since... well... Gollop's X-Com.

Not sure if :fabulously optimistic: or :fake news:. And that's besides the "it's" part.

What can I say? I've enjoyed what I've played. The targeting mechanic and ballistics are vastly superior to anything in Firaxis games and the boss encounters are genuinely epic as you get massive enemies smashing through buildings to get to you. The squad mechanics are excellent and the system forces you into tough decisions regarding ammo and willpower. The scope of the game was obviously bigger than it's budget from the outset so if this deal helps reach those ambitions then I'm happy.

Btw, screw grammar - my school got knocked down to build a McDonalds.

Well, if you were talking about nuxcom specifically then ok. But there were a lot of tactical games released between the original and the time gaming went to shit and some of them were really, really good

My snarky comment was mostly about lapping up the PR bs. It was super hard to accept these dollar bills, but we can use it to buy you free hookers hand-signed by Gollob and all that. None of things that transpired so far points towards that. Like many before them, instead of betting on the quality of their game, they accepted the third party cash to turn their product into de facto advert for a new store.

And their apparent lack of confidence is probably well-grounded. They made a classic mistake of getting old fans on board by promising a classic game, then streamlining it just enough to piss off the actual audience, but not enough to get the attention of retards.

With all of that in mind, it's pretty logical that ongoing support and all that jazz might not became a priority.

 

[Blaine]

When people care more about the launcher than the game.

I'll stop caring about the launcher when developers and publishers stop caring about the launcher. They aren't the ones who potentially have to install handfuls of DRM clients (which is what these "launchers" actually are) on their computers.

Don't want, don't buy, but pirating because you cannot play it on Uncle Gaben's launcher is dumb.

Or—and I know this is a strange idea for people born in 1998 who think that day-one DLC, pre-order incentives, and invasive DRM are normal, but bear with me—they could release DRM-free (gasp!), like CDPR.

 

[Maggot]

When people care more about the launcher than the game. And shitheads are so triggered that they're okay with pirating the game. Get over yourself. Don't want, don't buy, but pirating because you cannot play it on Uncle Gaben's launcher is dumb.

I'd like to see you in Epic's shoes. What'd you do? You'd end up just like GOG with only 1% of gamers buying there, cuz no steam, no buy.

yes think of the poor corporations what else are they supposed to do with their fortnite bucks?

 

[Perkel]

Fact of the matter is that Launchers are more or less meaningless now as games servers don't care about which launcher you pick and you either way conduct all of your social needs via discord which is superior to any kind of steam "friends".

The only good argument is about DRM but again. You have to be consistent. If you don't like it being on Epic you also need to hate it for being on Steam.

I treat launchers now effectively like just game launchers. Switch on, play, switch off.

i can totally see in future Discord futher integrating those platforms into app itself and becoming crosslauncher that hides all the crap you see and just runs game. If not discord then someone else.

In the end those shops will have to compete delivering best prices without scamming people into their "ecosytems"

 

[Alienman]

Rejoice, replacing one monopoly(if you consider Steam having one) with another!

And holy shit, it's not about DRM and they are not competing when buying out games.

 

[Kutulu]

Ohhh i already got four types of cancer.... lets get a fifth.

 

[Perkel]

and they are not competing when buying out games.

2+2=5

Why would anyone put games on Epic store if not Epic competing with Steam to give devs better deal ?
Do you think Epic just goes to devs and:

- epic : Your game should be exclusive to my store. You should agree
- dev : i agree.

Taking 12% instead of 30% already is huge difference and on top of that Epic is willing to "guarantee" sales by covering every full price copy purchase if game doesn't reach agreed upon numbers and some devs even got extra money for funding.
Already developers who pick that are winners of competition which in returns means more games to you and down the line proper competition for actual price of game.

Already as consumer you get free games from them just to try their Store. Soon they will have their own sales and you will not have to wait for Steam sales but with more players there will be always "sales" which ultimately will drive down prices even more.

This debacle reminds me a lot of when new telecommunication player went online in Poland called Play.

"Why would you use it if coverage is spotty"
"It doesn't have XYZ"
"Why i can't buy phone XYZ from Era ? Why it is exclusive to Play ?"

And we went from paying about 0.2$ for SMS to making videocalls 24/7 included in single bill that never changes regardless of how much calls like that you make in a month.

 

[thesheeep]

I certainly hope that the Epic Store is a success.
Mostly because I also hope that this will lead to Valve being broken from their lethargy and actually improving their client, and not only by improving the algorithm that determines which games you see in the store...

Fabulously optimistic, I know, but who knows, in four years, we might have a better Steam plus other client/community/launcher packages that are good as well.

And even better, Steam might reduce their absurd 30% cut to something more sensible, which will be great for developers.

Or this changes the landscape so now exclusives becomes the norm and any major title will be exclusive to something.
In that case, I can only hope software like Playnite and Lutris really take off.

 

[Perkel]

I certainly hope that the Epic Store is a success.
Mostly because I also hope that this will lead to Valve being broken from their lethargy and actually improving their client, and not only by improving the algorithm that determines which games you see in the store...

Fabulously optimistic, I know, but who knows, in four years, we might have a better Steam plus other client/community/launcher packages that are good as well.

Or this changes the landscape so now exclusives becomes the norm and any major title will be exclusive to something.
In that case, I can only hope software like Playnite and Lutris really take off.

Imho i hope that soon there will be so many launchers that whole point of launchers will go away and everything will be tied to frontends in similar fashion to Discord.

Already discord is killing those launchers because all social aspects are taken out of those launchers killing their idea of "ecosystem". Your gaming friends list is on discord not in steam or other launchers.

 

[Alienman]

and they are not competing when buying out games.

2+2=5

Why would anyone put games on Epic store if not Epic competing with Steam to give devs better deal ?
Do you think Epic just goes to devs and:

- epic : Your game should be exclusive to my store. You should agree
- dev : i agree.

Taking 12% instead of 30% already is huge difference and on top of that Epic is willing to "guarantee" sales by covering every full price copy purchase if game doesn't reach agreed upon numbers and some devs even got extra money for funding.
Already developers who pick that are winners of competition which in returns means more games to you and down the line proper competition for actual price of game.

Already as consumer you get free games from them just to try their Store. Soon they will have their own sales and you will not have to wait for Steam sales but with more players there will be always "sales" which ultimately will drive down prices even more.

This debacle reminds me a lot of when new telecommunication player went online in Poland called Play.

"Why would you use it if coverage is spotty"
"It doesn't have XYZ"
"Why i can't buy phone XYZ from Era ? Why it is exclusive to Play ?"

And we went from paying about 0.2$ for SMS to making videocalls 24/7 included in single bill that never changes regardless of how much calls like that you make in a month.

I don't care about what the devs make. I care about making the best deals possible for me, and I don't care about their free game policy to get me to use their store. That stuff will end anyways.

I care about stuff like after the 15th you will only be able to buy The Division 2 on two stores, UBI and EPIC. Before that you could buy it mostly anywhere, where the stores actually competes with its prices. Like the other day I bought Division 1 from a random Norwegian store for 4 bucks. It cost 40 Euro on Ubistore currently.

 

[Perkel]

Well if you care about that then you should be right now cheering for Epic.
Because if GOG showed us anything is that good service does not equal success.

Epic also knows that they don't have infinite time. They know perfectly well that Fornite is fad and soon it will end shutting off their money river. If they want to make dent into market they have to be bullish.

 

[Alienman]

I don't get it, why would I cheer for Epic? Just told you they are putting limitation on where I can stuff. Steam does not for an example. GOG is only great that it is DRM free, everything else is lackluster. They even ruined their own site for some unknown reason.

Look, I would praise Epic to the high heavens if they didn't buy out games that I wanted to play and held them hostage, and provided competition the fair way, by putting those billions into making a great platform for consumers. At the end of the day, we are the ones that are paying devs. This Epic welfare stuff will only last so long.

 

[GrainWetski]

Do you think Epic just goes to devs and:

- epic : Your game should be exclusive to my store. You should agree
- dev : i agree.

They're actually doing this

Epic: We'll pay you millions of dollars to be exclusive on our store.
Shortsighted cunt: We accept!

It has nothing to do with some pay cut whining from paid off devs. That you're swallowing that hook, line and sinker says a lot. The same devs whining about Valve's cut aren't whining about Microsoft's, Sony's, Nintendo's cuts or any of the PC stores. It's only Steam. Gee, I wonder why that is.. Gullible sheep will be gullible, I guess.

I don't get it, why would I cheer for Epic? Just told you they are putting limitation on where I can stuff. Steam does not for an example. GOG is only great that it is DRM free, everything else is lackluster. They even ruined their own site for some unknown reason.

Look, I would praise Epic to the high heavens if they didn't buy out games that I wanted to play and held them hostage, and provided competition the fair way, by putting those billions into making a great platform for consumers. At the end of the day, we are the ones that are paying devs. This Epic welfare stuff will only last so long.

You should cheer for them because being a contrarian against "Steamtards" is cool or something. Gamejournos told him so.

 

[PanteraNera]

You guys forget about Half Life 2, it was steam exclusive and there was a major uproar back than.
I was really into Half Life back than, but I didn't buy HL2, because of steam.
Than I found darksteam, good old times.

 

[Alienman]

Half-Life 2 was a Valve game.

 

[Perkel]

Half-Life 2 was a Valve game.

And ? Games that come to epic store belong to devs so by same argument you can argue that they are free to release it how they want and you shouldn't complain.

And yes shitting on steamtards is fun time.
Two good things at the same time.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

I only mentioned like 20 times previously how I miss times when strategy board did not attract shitposters.

Well, here we go again.

 

[Alienman]

Half-Life 2 was a Valve game.

And ? Games that come to epic store belong to devs so by same argument you can argue that they are free to release it how they want and you shouldn't complain.

And yes shitting on steamtards is fun time.
Two good things at the same time.

Devs can do whatever they want, but how does it benefit you and me when EPIC is creating A REAL monopoly, one thing you EPIC cock-munchers keep complaining Steam is doing constantly? It does not benefit me, nor you, nor the devs, since the welfare money will run out.

 

[PanteraNera]

Half-Life 2 was a Valve game.

Doesn't matter (to me).
Point is it was exclusive, people that wanted to play it needed to install steam. Epic tries to do the same now.

 

[Taka-Haradin puolipeikko]

May I remind you that before Beamdog "enchanted" PS:T, GOG was only digital store that offered it commercially.
These exclusive deals aren't new in any shape or form, besides Epic exclusivity has that publicly known 1 year limit.

 

[PanteraNera]

Honestly to me all of them (Steam, Epic, Ubi, Bethesda) are equally bad. The only good one is GoG. But people stick to steam as they are used to it.

 

[Alienman]

Half-Life 2 was a Valve game.

Doesn't matter (to me).
Point is it was exclusive, people that wanted to play it needed to install steam. Epic tries to do the same now.

Point is, it's their own game. They built Steam from scratch with that game and it took them years. Epic could and should have done that with Fortnite instead of buying out games and putting them under lock on their store.

 

[Trans-Financial-Man]

Games aren't inherently Steam exclusive though. There is nothing preventing Devs from putting their games on GoG or even Discord's store other than consumer interest. You're trading the accidental monopoly of Steam for an intentional and forced one by Chinese controlled Epic.

Games aren't inherently Epic exclusive though. There is nothing preventing DEvs from putting their games on Steam or even Discord Store other than consumer interest. You're trading the accidental monopoly of Steam for company that tries to make dent into Steam monopoly market.

I mean if you don't like garbage at least be consistent.

GOG has the best service and see where it is. Nowhere near steam so the idea that you can provide best service to people and people will magically come is as naive as being hot blonde in lingerie walking through Tihuana at night thinking everything will be fine.

Fact is that at the end of the day Epic seems to have capability to make a dent in market and soon Steam will not be monopoly anymore and suprise suprise it will have to compete with others for devs asking for better deals.

You're right. Steam won't be a monopoly anymore because Epic will be the monopoly. Do you want to live in a world where one publisher makes a point of ensuring you can only purchase games on their service? And that only certain games are allowed. A fragmented market where you can only purchase certain games on certain platforms doesn't work as well as Console makers would have you believe.

Also look at Rainbow Six Siege. If you honestly think China won't have any influence on western games when Tencent are actively aquiring western devs with investments from the chinese government then it's time I tell you about this bridge I have for sale.

 

[PanteraNera]

Point is, it's their own game. They built Steam from scratch with that game and it took them years. Epic could and should have done that with Fortnite instead of buying out games and putting them under lock on their store.

Well I see and absolutely respect were you are coming from.

 

[Perkel]

Devs can do whatever they want, but how does it benefit you and me when EPIC is creating A REAL monopoly, one thing you EPIC cock-munchers keep complaining Steam is doing constantly? It does not benefit me, nor you, nor the devs, since the welfare money will run out.

How can one have monopoly when Steam is monopoly ? I mean even if Epic will continue this for a long time there is finite limit of money and how much they can invest into this. Assuming they have infinite money which they don't there will be a point where they will have to make profits instead of funding games left and right for exclusivity.

Which pretty much means that even with this bullish policy at best they can carve chunk of Steam market and not kill it. And that is assuming they will be the only one and no one new shows up and further makes their pies less.

It does not benefit me

1. Better games as devs are constantly struggling with money they can invest more money into game or provide better support after released
2. More games from said devs as they have guaranteed success if they go for Epic store now.
2. Free games and more sales. Do you think Epic will no run its own Steam sales ? Why do you need to exactly wait for steam sales ? How about sales all year long ?

no you

1. It is always fun to poke at steamfags
2. I like to have cheap games, sales and free games which means more competition to Steam the better that stuff will get.
3. I generally care about health of industry, so for me even i won't buy anything from Epic store means that down the road things will improve for everyone.

nor the devs

1. It switched paradigm from 30% to 12% cut and other stores like GOG seems to be bullied into following that. EVEN STEAM revised their strategy where the bigger game is the less cut they will receive now. Hurray for competition !
2. Bunch of other stuff which could be said "walfare" as you suggest it but it still does count.

Marx would be proud of you.