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KickStarter Phoenix Point - the new game from X-COM creator Julian Gollop

spectre

Arcane
Joined
Oct 26, 2008
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5,603
Yeah, it helps to work out some consistent notation for them. Doesn't help that the originals went under different names in the US and Europe.
Personally, I find it sufficient to refer to Firaxis' offerings as EXCUM, or corrupt the spelling otherwise, because only the originals get the honor of the full and correct name.

The essential vibe of UFO is that Xcom is humanity's last hope and a technological spearhead
i completely disagree. x-com is the last defense because no one else gives a damn or even worse they're waiting for you to fail, otherwise you wouldn't have bills to pay, equipment to buy, stuff to build yourself. you're on your own while nations demand results. it's not a concerted effort, a last stand. you're an average blue collar.
I think that's a perfectly fine way to feel about it. The originals leave a whole bunch of gaps for the player to fill, which in my books is the best way to go about it.
I don't really get the recent trend to deeply explore and overexplain, leaving no loose end behind. Now sure when head canon became the enemy of today's writers.

To me the gameover screens told me what I needed to hear: Yeah, without you in the picture they tried to work out some kind of a deal, but in the end, the aliens had other plans.
YOU have failed to save the earth and any knowledge you gained is now lost. The fact that you had jump through hoops and run your own Motion Scanner manufacturing side gig to finance it
while the Earth's governments were perfectly willing to throw Earth under the bus if it came to it was a nice cherry on top. Your role was heroic, but not in a comic-book sense.
For some reason, it's not something that gets easily replicated these days.

In any case, my original point was: I'm not getting any such vibes out of Phoenix Point. If anything, it feels all over the place:
hi-tech buildings and cybernetic post-humans next to mutated tribals, next to ruined buildings and guys sporting mad max gear.
And whatever the fuck I'm doing for the first few story missions? Travelling all over the world, scrounging for diaries and time capsules, uncovering secrets of my ancestors, like it's some kind of a XIX century novel.
Almost makes me think the X-Piratez thing had more thematic consistency. It's like a bunch of people took turns at the helm for PP, with each pulling in a totally different direction.
The infuriating thing is, the underlying gameplay is still serviceable (obviously, I'm talking about the battlescape, not the Geoscape), but it could (probably) work so much better if placed in a framework that's better thought-out;
though you'd have to give it all a violent shake and rebuild from scratch, putting the pieces back together and probably also throwing out a whole bunch of the odd ones.
 

gurugeorge

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Strap Yourselves In
I fear they'll turn the capeshit stuff to 11 in XCOM 3.

They already did. That's what XCom Diversity Chimera Squad was about.
Ha. I don't even know what that game is about. Watched about 20 mins of a Youtube video when it came out but the characters were so obnoxious I couldn't go on. Is at least the mechanics serviceable?

The SWAT twist is quite good fun for a few missions and the smaller geoscape is interesting. After like 4 missions or so I couldn't stomach the faggotry any longer, so I couldn't tell you beyond that.
 

Luka-boy

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Sep 24, 2014
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Asspain
Ha. I don't even know what that game is about. Watched about 20 mins of a Youtube video when it came out but the characters were so obnoxious I couldn't go on. Is at least the mechanics serviceable?
It's... okay. Like an XCOM 2 lite with a SWAT twist and a couple of fun new mechanics. For me it's a 5 ouf of ten at its worst and a 6 or 7 out of ten at its best. I don't regret the 6 Euros and 20 hours of my life I spent and I might even replay it in a few years with some mods.

Then again the setting and characters can definitely make or break the experience. As a Demolition Man fan I'm used to the constant "There's no way society changed so much in so little time" feeling and I have higher tolerance than most Codexers to the characters and their """"""quirky"""""" dialogue and humour, but only because I can laugh at how dumb it is. I definitely can see how many people find it absolutely infuriating.
 

Mazisky

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Rome, IT
Chimera Squad is a minor spin-off with low quality, with recycled assets and made by a side team, not the main XCOM team. We can easily forget it existed
 

Parabalus

Arcane
Joined
Mar 23, 2015
Messages
17,504
Chimera squad isn't all bad, very fun for a day or two, pretty much as advertised.

The initiative system is nice as well, lets the aliens act a little.
 

Mazisky

Magister
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Chimera squad isn't all bad, very fun for a day or two, pretty much as advertised.

The initiative system is nice as well, lets the aliens act a little.

It's not bad as a single cheap game but it is horrendous as a Xcom.

Simcity mobile is not a horrible game but tell it to the Simcity fans. The same comparison applies here
 

Mefi

Prophet
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waiting for a train at Perdido Street Station
Chimera Squad is a minor spin-off with low quality, with recycled assets and made by a side team, not the main XCOM team. We can easily forget it existed

Seemed to exist purely to test the 'breaching' mechanics, following on from Phantom Doctrine playing about with the idea a bit too.

---

Another Phoenix Point player survey for the last patch. Wonder what responses they're getting to "Do you want more of this or for us to try making another game?".
 

cvv

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Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
It's only $15.99 on Gamesplanet right now. Worth it?
I'm playing it rn actually, for the first time. About 6 hours in. The tactical part is mildly interesting and I sense a nice potential there with elite soldiers, unique weapons and various powers you can deploy. Not sure about the whole story and setting gravy tho. Not exactly gripped by any of this so far.

What I like the most compared to XCOM is the lack of one-shotting (at the moment and on Veteran diff. at least). I fucking hate early game XCOM because of that shit. When your ranked dude behind full cover and in smoke can be hit, critted and instagibbed by a Thin Man from half across the map. No such cancer here so far.
 

gurugeorge

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Strap Yourselves In
Tom Chick's review over at Quarter to Three is actually pretty good.

He points out that you can only be an X-Com/XCOM virgin once, and the whole thing of the alien horror gradually being revealed and your doughty team struggling to get ahead of the curve can only be deeply immersive once, the first time. It seems like what Gollop was trying to do was to provide a similar kind of gradual ramp up of a reveal of alien horror but this time in a more Lovecraftian vein, not the traditional 50s aliens vein.

It very nearly works, but doesn't quite; and it even more doesn't work with the graphic "tone" being so light now (as opposed to the dark, gloomy vibe of the early stuff they showed). What they really needed to do to nail that vibe was to make the aliens types more distinct from each other, each one a fresh horror from an opium dream - but as it is they all seem to look kind of similar and unmemorable. It's modern generic spikey shoulderpad art design, not as much creative flair as would have been required to pull it off.

I've been noticing more and more how crucial the initial art design is to a game's flavour, uniqueness and "stickiness." You really do have to have someone with genuine creative talent at the helm in the art department, not just someone who can draw well, otherwise it's all pretty much for naught.
 

gurugeorge

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Strap Yourselves In
The UI should differentiate the willpower abilities graphically from ordinary abilities.

For a long time it hadn't quite sunk in just how powerful it is to dash or shave off an action point, etc., in various ways. I've got it automatic now to think of hitting the will powers prior to doing anything else, but that should be ingrained from the beginning in the tutorial, along with the ways that cover and overwatch are very different from XCOM.

(I think what the tutorial should do is let you play with characters from the three classes who are at level 3, so you get to play with the will power abilities from the start, to get a glimpse of them - then those starter characters could be killed off an Sophie struggles on to Phoenix point and meets the other named characters.)

I gave up struggling with the harder difficulties and I'm just doing it on Rookie, which is actually quite comfortable - it's not much different in terms of the combat mechanics from the harder difficulties (fewer enemies, though not much) - mainly the difference is that the strategic layer is more relaxed, so you actually get a chance to build up some substantial forces and play with all the toys, and the DLC stuff isn't overwhelming. I'd considered playing the game au naturel before trying out the DLCs, but life's too short.

Bar the spit and polish and smoothing all the curves out, it really is a fun game in parts.
 

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,404
The mechanics are a cargo cult from X-COM and Apocalypse and the visual presentation of XCOM, and the reality is that they shouldnt be trying to blindly transplant mechanics from other games and trying to make them work on their premise. The premise is Cthulhu monsters are coming from the sea to wipe out humanity, when I think on Cthulhu monsters, I think on psychological/cosmic horror, that was their premise that they didnt deliver because instead of making mechanics for it, they gone with safe and just copy pasted mechanics and graphic styles from other games. It is a pity because I can think on alot of mechanics to include shit on the pants psychological horror on a X-COM style game.

It was the same problem of CDPR with Cyberbug where they just copy pasted the mechanics of the Witcha 3 without thinking how that would translate to an urban enviroment.
 

cvv

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Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
I've been noticing more and more how crucial the initial art design is to a game's flavour, uniqueness and "stickiness." You really do have to have someone with genuine creative talent at the helm in the art department, not just someone who can draw well, otherwise it's all pretty much for naught.

Yes, this is spot on and I've been banging that drum for years. Art is super important for strategy games, save for a minority of autists who could enjoy an Excel-based game.

Btw it's not just the creature design. It's also about the UI. There's this modern day cancerous trend of ultra-functionalists, clean, almost mobile-app-like UIs without any artistic flair or aesthetics and PP is a victim of this too. I mean it's a game about lovecraftian horrors coming from the see but the UI resembles an interactive PowerPoint presentation. Where are my Gigerian design elements? I remember this ancient game that Giger participated on. Not saying PP should've been exactly like this but it just gives you the idea of what kind of UI flair I'm talking about:


10950.jpg



win3x-darkseed-ii-screen.png


Screenshot-3.png

Instead we get this:

phoenix-point13.jpg



If you bet only on functionality and usability and not on art, immersion and memorability you'll get a wonderfully functional and usable game nobody is talking about. Which is where PP is today.
 

7h30n

Augur
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Messages
311
If you bet only on functionality and usability and not on art, immersion and memorability you'll get a wonderfully functional and usable game nobody is talking about. Which is where PP is today.

Well, I wish it was functional! Last time I played there was no option for customized sorting and filtering of equipment, instead we got some buttons for per-class filtering while in reality any class can wield any weapon. And that is not only user-unfriendly but actively hides the gameplay feature.
 

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