Pillars of Eternity Beta Discussion [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Metal Hurlant]

That IndiraLightfoot lady is a major ditz.

IndiraLightfoot is a guy

 

[Sensuki]

Yeah he's a guy. I talk to him on steam.

 

[Infinitron]

Oops, I could have sworn I saw him identify as female somewhere. In any case he's quite ditzy.

 

[Athelas]

Definitely the biggest improvement in combat playability yet (speed, pathfinding, hit feedback, etc.). Who knew playing the game you're working on could improve it?

They seem to have added some new A.I. routines. I'm noticing enemies now trying to rush towards party members in the back quite often. Of course, the disengagement attack they suffer usually torpedoes such attempts. Another reason why they should scrap the engagement system. Also new: enemies attacking each other. The spiders and spirits in the ruins below Stormwall Gorge appear to be in a state of constant warfare.

 

[Rake]

Oops, I could have sworn I saw him identify as female somewhere. In any case he's quite ditzy.

Well, he liked NWN2 so...

 

[Sensuki]

That's what I am saying though. The people that liked the combat in NWN2 are liking the PE combat. That's a sign of something horribly wrong.

 

[Shevek]

Sensuki
While there are some similarities to NWN2, PoE and NWN2 combats systems are not the same. The games play different both due to underlying mechanics and differences in character development systems. You are upset because you do not have as much mobility as you would like. I can appreciate that. However, just because the system has AoOs doesn't make it bad. The end all be all of cRPG combat is not simply repositioning and taking advantage of bad ai/pathing to overcome combat challenges.

 

[Starwars]

I disliked NWN2 combat yet I quite like the PoE combat (well, I like it despite the current bugs and with the knowledge that it's still a WiP of course).

Hey guys, what if there's a guy who actually likes the IE combat... but *also* like NWN2 combat?! Mind blown right?! Surely such a thing cannot be. Well, probably not on the Codex but...

 

[Athelas]

Hey, Korgrak's cave got a paint over pass apparently. It looks so much better.

I would say the most pressing issues that need fiixing/removing are the engagement system and VFX clutter. With those out of the way, it might end up being a game with fun combat.

 

[Starwars]

The clutter (just general visibility in combat actually) is number one on my list. It's still way too hard to actually *see* what the fuck is going on in the game.

Still really not a fan of the talents+skill merger, I wonder if they'll change that again though.

 

[Maculo]

At this point, I think Obsidian should add Nipsen as a NPC that warns players about the bandit Sensuki who pillaged Nipsen's wife.

 

[Sensuki]

While there are some similarities to NWN2, PoE and NWN2 combats systems are not the same. The games play different both due to underlying mechanics and differences in character development systems. You are upset because you do not have as much mobility as you would like. I can appreciate that. However, just because the system has AoOs doesn't make it bad. The end all be all of cRPG combat is not simply repositioning and taking advantage of bad ai/pathing to overcome combat challenges.

I'm not sure you've been listening correctly. If someone asked me to describe the PE combat I would say something like imagine NWN2 and DA:O with high lethality with a touch of Icewind Dale 2 in the visual style and control scheme. Combat in PE does not even remotely play like an Infinity Engine game. There are many, many, many people saying this. Only you seem to think it's similar and that may be because you can apply your favourite play style and do okay. People openly admit that it is different however because they liked X or Y they don't mind it. I have not seen one Infinity Engine "diehard" say that they think the combat is enjoyable. That is a failure on Obsidian's part and will continue to be a failure unless (unlikely) something is done about it.

 

[Shevek]

I know how YOU would describe it and that it may not play the way YOU play the IE games. Your desciptions and declarations are yours to make. They aren't facts or universal truths though. Also, while many do see differences (because they are there) plenty are still getting the IE feels. Different does not mean worse.

Finally, just look at the boards. People are enjoying the game. They like it. So, you can keep going, man, but you are making mountain our of a molehill. There is no failure. The sky isn't falling. The gameplay was fine before and its pretty darn good now.

 

[tuluse]

I disliked NWN2 combat yet I quite like the PoE combat (well, I like it despite the current bugs and with the knowledge that it's still a WiP of course).

Hey guys, what if there's a guy who actually likes the IE combat... but *also* like NWN2 combat?! Mind blown right?! Surely such a thing cannot be. Well, probably not on the Codex but...

There should not exist people who enjoyed NWN2 combat.

 

[Hormalakh]

There is no failure. The sky isn't falling. The gameplay was fine before and its pretty darn good now.

you mean in your opinion, right?
half the posters on the boards don't have the beta, and I would say its evenly split among the rest.

there are vocally opposed players like sensuki, and those who think it's "ok." nobody is really satisfied, though.

i don't agree with sensuki on everything - but i tend to agree with him on this aspect. Combat doesn't play like IE, be it by design or not.

as for failure: i'll leave that judgement for until after the game is finalized.

 

[Athelas]

I disliked NWN2 combat yet I quite like the PoE combat (well, I like it despite the current bugs and with the knowledge that it's still a WiP of course).

Hey guys, what if there's a guy who actually likes the IE combat... but *also* like NWN2 combat?! Mind blown right?! Surely such a thing cannot be. Well, probably not on the Codex but...

There should not exist people who enjoyed NWN2 combat.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadomasochism

 

[Bleed the Man]

I disliked NWN2 combat yet I quite like the PoE combat (well, I like it despite the current bugs and with the knowledge that it's still a WiP of course).

Hey guys, what if there's a guy who actually likes the IE combat... but *also* like NWN2 combat?! Mind blown right?! Surely such a thing cannot be. Well, probably not on the Codex but...

There should not exist people who enjoyed NWN2 combat.

If there's people who enjoy eating shit (or playing Oblivion, same thing), I'm sure there are people who enjoy NWN2 combat.

 

[Sensuki]

It's going to be an Obsidian game. I have no doubt that the story/writing will be worthy of any of their previous titles. However it also looks like it's going to be a typical Obsidian game, and it's really not the publisher's fault afterall that they can't seem to get combat right.

 

[Infinitron]

It seems that "Dragon Age is more fun" is the universal shark-jumping moment of the obsessed Kickstarter RPG critic.

 

[Shevek]

There is no failure. The sky isn't falling. The gameplay was fine before and its pretty darn good now.

you mean in your opinion, right?
half the posters on the boards don't have the beta, and I would say its evenly split among the rest.

there are vocally opposed players like sensuki, and those who think it's "ok." nobody is really satisfied, though.

i don't agree with sensuki on everything - but i tend to agree with him on this aspect. Combat doesn't play like IE, be it by design or not.

as for failure: i'll leave that judgement for until after the game is finalized.

Of course I do. As for it not playing EXACTLY like the IE games, that should come as no surprise. If it played EXACTLY like the IE games, all we would need to do is rest, cast haste and steamroll through everything or, if that didnt work, we could rest, stinking cloud, web and cheese the game to death. Or maybe load up on a bunch of thief traps and skull traps, move two inches, watch everything die, rest, rinse and repeat. A boss? Oh ya, spell sequencers with debuffs and then some chromatic orbs. No, it does not play like that at all.

I just dont see OE making a game differently from that as a bad thing. No, you cant run around with impunity, prebuff or metagame the challenge into the ground. And?

Some folks like to highlight all they ways they perceive the game doesnt measure up because they have 3 inch thick rose-colored nostalgia goggles on. They are failing to really acknowledge how well this game succeeds at giving satisfying combat without the cheese the IE games had in abundance.

 

[Sensuki]

Do you try and cheese every game you play ? I personally think it's hilarious that you think that because the IE games had some exploits and you used them, that that is what they played like.

You also can't do a lot of those tactics in all of the IE games, unless you rest spam with rest anywhere mod.

 

[Shevek]

Real men fight their battles by running in circles and popping potions, I guess. Epic gameplay.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

Every game I've ever played has had ways to cheese the system. I doubt PoE will be any different. Whether you take advantage of those exploits is up to you. I found it most fun to restrict my rests and not use stuff like the cloak of reflection which made beholders laughable, but each to their own.

I personally don't judge games according to how many exploits (that I don't use) there are, and won't be judging PoE like that either.

edit: Sounds like you don't think much of the IE games, so what attracted you to an 'IE successor'?

 

[Abu Antar]

No one cares about the following:
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/69478-current-non-combat-skillsystem-needs-to-go/

It's without a doubt the worst change to the game that I have seen.

 

[Sensuki]

I care very much, thank you.

Real men fight their battles by running in circles and popping potions, I guess. Epic gameplay.

Ignorance is bliss, I guess. I have a full IWD LP that proves otherwise. Rarely if ever do I pop potions and run in circles.