Pillars of Eternity Beta Discussion [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Infinitron]

Hey, what happened??? Did Dengler not like his portrait?

No one cares about the following:
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/69478-current-non-combat-skillsystem-needs-to-go/

It's without a doubt the worst change to the game that I have seen.

IE games weren't "skill games", so not a high priority IMO. Before this change you had lots of people who hated the idea of stealthy Barbarians with no trade-off attached, so there'll always be butthurt.

 

[Sensuki]

fuck I forgot to back up the pngs of that one.

 

[Abu Antar]

Hey, what happened??? Did Dengler not like his portrait?

No one cares about the following:
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/69478-current-non-combat-skillsystem-needs-to-go/

It's without a doubt the worst change to the game that I have seen.

IE games weren't "skill games", so not a high priority IMO. Before this change you had lots of people who hated the idea of stealthy Barbarians with no trade-off attached, so there'll always be butthurt.

Anything is better than the current system, though. The skills attached to some of the talents don't make any sense. Previous version was better. We know non-combat skills will have importance in dialog options. Therefore, they need to make a system that makes more sense than the one that we currently have. The IE games might not have been very focused on skills other than rouges, but Pillars of Eternity uses them on several occasions in the beta alone.

 

[Infinitron]

Anything is better than the current system, though. The skills attached to some of the talents don't make any sense. Previous version was better. We know non-combat skills will have importance in dialog options. Therefore, they need to make a system that makes more sense than the one that we currently have. The IE games might not have been very focused on skills other than rouges, but Pillars of Eternity uses them on several occasions in the beta alone.

Perhaps it's better not to think of them as "skills" at all. In the RPG player's mind, the word "skills" brings to mind certain requirements. It might be better to think of them as "aptitudes" or "etiquettes" - a kind of side effect or bonus of character development, but not an actual object of character development.

Like the etiquettes in Shadowrun, really, just with a number attached - like, imagine if instead of just a binary "Security" or "Corporate" you had the opportunity to level each one up multiple times when increasing certain stats, as a side effect.

 

[Sensuki]

You choose your own Etiquettes, seperately from other things.

 

[Seari]

Hey, what happened??? Did Dengler not like his portrait?

Wow that looks so much worse. I guess they're trying to remake portraits to fit the same art style.

 

[Infinitron]

Looks better IMO. The guy on the left looks like a real life guy LARPing. The guy on the right reminds me of the Aryan blonde Avatar from Ultima. I might be biased.

The background color is nicer too, so that might have an impact on my impression.

 

[Abu Antar]

Anything is better than the current system, though. The skills attached to some of the talents don't make any sense. Previous version was better. We know non-combat skills will have importance in dialog options. Therefore, they need to make a system that makes more sense than the one that we currently have. The IE games might not have been very focused on skills other than rouges, but Pillars of Eternity uses them on several occasions in the beta alone.

Perhaps it's better not to think of them as "skills" at all. In the RPG player's mind, the word "skills" brings to mind certain requirements. It might be better to think of them as "aptitudes" or "etiquettes" - a kind of side effect or bonus of character development, but not an actual object of character development.

Like the etiquettes in Shadowrun, really, just with a number attached - like, imagine if instead of just a binary "Security" or "Corporate" you had the opportunity to level each one up multiple times when increasing certain stats, as a side effect.

The difference is that I didn't use etiquette much in the Shadowrun games. They could be used on some occasions, but with the amount of text (I think) Pillars of Eternity will use these choices more. We also have the text adventure style choices that we get to make. Again, skills are involved. The name doesn't matter, skill, etiquette or whatever they want to call them.

 

[Starwars]

I like the new portrait better. I think they're both pretty good but yeah, the first one looks like a real-life guy posing. The second looks more like a "proper" painted portrait.

 

[Infinitron]

The difference is that I didn't use etiquette much in the Shadowrun games. They could be used on some occasions, but with the amount of text (I think) Pillars of Eternity will use these choices more. We also have the text adventure style choices that we get to make. Again, skills are involved. The name doesn't matter, skill, etiquette or whatever they want to call them.

I'm saying that the name does matter. "Skill" makes you think "Hey, I should be able to control this, don't be constraining my character development freedomz, bro". "Etiquette" or "Aptitude" makes you think "Well, I guess by building my character this way I got to do X. Next playthrough I'll build him in a different way, and get to do Y."

*shrug* It's no really important either way, because like I said, not skill games. That's why I was also willing to accept the previous system despite it being pretty dumb. Maybe they can come up with some sort of hybrid.

 

[Abu Antar]

The difference is that I didn't use etiquette much in the Shadowrun games. They could be used on some occasions, but with the amount of text (I think) Pillars of Eternity will use these choices more. We also have the text adventure style choices that we get to make. Again, skills are involved. The name doesn't matter, skill, etiquette or whatever they want to call them.

I'm saying that the name does matter. "Skill" makes you think "Hey, I should be able to control this, don't be constraining my character development freedomz, bro". "Etiquette" or "Aptitude" makes you think "Well, I guess by building my character this way I got to do X. Next playthrough I'll build him in a different way, and get to do different stuff."

*shrug* It's no really important either way, because like I said, not skill games. That's why I was also willing to accept the previous system despite it being pretty dumb. Maybe they can come up with some sort of hybrid.

It's about choice, imo. If I want some talents for my character, it feels strange that non-combat stuff are tacked on to that. That's more or less how I see it.
We'll see how this goes in the end. My biggest gripe is that so far, they way it is done has been unbalanced.

 

[Shevek]

I thought the skill-talent merger was pretty dumb when they did it as well but the previous implementation was just as bad. The problem is they need like 10 more skills to make a regular skill implementation make sense. It might make sense for them to change the name from "Skills" to "Competencies" or something. That way people don't judge it as they would a proper skill system.

 

[Sensuki]

Triangular progression was a bad idea. Should have just done single skill points with a level cap or something.

 

[tuluse]

Triangular progression was a bad idea. Should have just done single skill points with a level cap or something.

Or thresholds like Fallout. First X number of skill points cost Y number of investment points, then it costs Y * 2 (or Y + 5 or smth).

 

[Sensuki]

Spoiler

There's a file in the new data that confirms that Cliaban Ruillag is the Animat Factory.

not too spoilery if you paid attention to previous names of KS images

 

[tuluse]

Sensuki

Can you use spoiler tags for stuff that isn't meant to be revealed?

 

[LizardWizard]

See Infinitron, it's not just me.

Wasn't IndiriaLightfoot the same person that claimed DA:I's party AI was great? I thought that poster was a troll.

 

[Sensuki]

Actually there's quite a few people on the OE boards saying theat DA:I combat is better than PE. They say the controls and camera are terrible but it at least requires some tactical input and attention to positioning from the player after combat begins.

 

[tuluse]

Actually there's quite a few people on the OE boards saying theat DA:I combat is better than PE. They say the controls and camera are terrible but it at least requires some tactical input and attention to positioning from the player after combat begins.

LOL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcXbiNefMiw

 

[Sensuki]

Sorry I forgot "on Nightmare difficulty".

 

[Jaesun]

Actually there's quite a few people on the OE boards saying theat DA:I combat is better than PE. They say the controls and camera are terrible but it at least requires some tactical input and attention to positioning from the player after combat begins.

Excuse me?

 

[Sensuki]

Yeah, well that's what they've been saying, lol. And judging by how bad those videos are, there's people that hate PE combat more than I do.

 

[Cyberarmy]

Anyone saying DA:I's combat is better than PoE's, is clearly insane.
If anyone considers DA:I's combat good, I consider'em mad.

 

[Sensuki]

Man this sucks, the female voice sets are shit, you can noticeably tell they're all done by the same chick (I think it's the twitter girl) and her normal voice bleeds into all of the sets depending on the bark, and whoever recorded it didn't fix her sibilant S's. Eugh.

 

[Ninjerk]

What a piece of shit, let's kill her boys