Pillars of Eternity Beta Discussion [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[MasterSmithFandango]

Yeah, dude, that's kind of the point. That's been a design goal since day 1.

That's shitty design.

 

[Infinitron]

Yeah, dude, that's kind of the point. That's been a design goal since day 1.

That's shitty design.

It's a legitimate design. Nowhere does it say that "correct character construction" needs to be a challenge factor in each and every CRPG.

This game will have easy character building, but difficult battles. As a forum that praises RPGs that do the opposite (obtuse character building, but laughably easy combat), that's a tradeoff we should be willing to accept.

 

[Grunker]

Obsidian went too far with the gameplay mechanics and tried to reinvent the wheel. Too bad their innovation came up in the form of a square wheel!

Even if nobody expected them to follow too closely the 2nd and 3rd edition D&D, at least they should have studied more closely the strenght of the miriads of D20 system perfcted in the last thirty years.

At this point, as a backer, I'd rather have the game pushed back one year rather than playing it with this half assed implementation.

This is not the first wheel-based incident with Obsidian.

They will never learn.

 

[Rivmusique]

Guys, for those of you that are playing. Can you please answer some questions for me:

In the Dyrford Crossing EXTERIOR (not the cave or the dungeon under the statue) is there anything but a few hostile encounters with beetles? Are there any corpses to loot? Any hidden stashes? Did you meet any neutral NPCs?

There are some guys that are trying to get a dragon egg that you can talk with, possibly pay them to leave/convince them to leave (I've not done it, but dialogue options are there. I suppose they could just be flavor choices and they attack anyway). I have just murdered them though. There's also hostile encounters with Wurms, wolves, spiders and some 'forest lurkers' (something like that). The lurkers are standing over a corpse with some magic item (I forget what).

Edit:

Rivmusique

Do you happen to have played the game since you broke the quest? If you haven't can you upload your Unity log file ?

I uploaded that output_log: http://www.upload.ee/files/4220551/output_log.txt.html

I just started a new game and recreated the event, as I had already overwritten it before. Bonus issue this time, the character sliding off the map that rarely happens. Happened when the fighter was getting up from a knockdown, began standing and suddenly slide NW extremely fast (was in slow mo so I could follow him), kept going past where the camera could reach.

 

[bonescraper]

You can miss, graze, hit, or critical hit.

Missing and critting are relatively rare.

If so, then they're very, very rare. I never missed with 3 Dexterity. Hats off to Sawyer.

 

[Sensuki]

What weapon are you using there?

 

[Sensuki]

Guys, for those of you that are playing. Can you please answer some questions for me:

In the Dyrford Crossing EXTERIOR (not the cave or the dungeon under the statue) is there anything but a few hostile encounters with beetles? Are there any corpses to loot? Any hidden stashes? Did you meet any neutral NPCs?

There is some guys that are trying to get a dragon egg that you can talk with, possibly pay them to leave/convince them to leave (I've not done it, but dialogue options are there. I suppose they could just be flavor choices and they attack anyway). I have just murdered them though. There's also hostile encounters with Wurms, wolves, spiders and some 'forest lurkers' (something like that). The lurkers are standing over a corpse with some magic item (I forget what).

Cool, that's alright then. On my playthrough I literally saw Adra, Wood and Stone beetles and that's it, but I only did about half the map.

 

[bonescraper]

What weapon are you using there?

Spells and starter junk. A stick or sth.

 

[Ulminati]

"A system in which everything is equally viable is indistinguishable from a system in which everything is shit."

 

[Sensuki]

What weapon are you using there?

Spells and starter junk. A stick or sth.

That Lion looks like the equivalent of a kobold. 0 DT, sweet fuck all damage, low deflection

btw spells have an accuracy bonus

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

This game will have easy character building, but difficult battles. As a forum that praises RPGs that do the opposite (obtuse character building, but laughably easy combat), that's a tradeoff we should be willing to accept.

Those games are praised (overall) despite the combat though, and their combat is still criticised. So it seems reasonable that even if people like POE overall they can still criticise the character building.

 

[Jaedar]

So, I haven't played this (not paying for a beta, and no one has gifted me a key) BUT

Is it just to me it seems that pumping strength and very little else is the correct way to go? If you can make your high S grazes do more damage than medium S hits, it seems kinda pointless to not pump strength.

 

[bonescraper]

What weapon are you using there?

Spells and starter junk. A stick or sth.

That Lion looks like the equivalent of a kobold. 0 DT, sweet fuck all damage, low deflection

And i'm using a starter weapon and level 1 spells.

 

[Infinitron]

This game will have easy character building, but difficult battles. As a forum that praises RPGs that do the opposite (obtuse character building, but laughably easy combat), that's a tradeoff we should be willing to accept.

Those games are praised (overall) despite the combat though, and their combat is still criticised. So it seems reasonable that even if people like POE overall they can still criticise the character building.

Sure, I guess.

Personally I think the idea of character building as a difficult exercise is, uh, overrated, but I can understand the appeal. Puzzling out all the moving parts and what they effect can be fun - it's like a second layer of "game" on top of the actual game.

I hope there are enough RPGs in the future that can scratch that itch.

 

[Sensuki]

Attribute balance is probably out too, you may well be right that 2% might is stronger than +1 Acc per point

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Is it possible people find +40% damage from Might negligible in actual combat? Age of Decadence for example uses % modifier and DR system as well and I could definitely feel the difference between a char with 8 STR (+20%) and 10 STR (+40%). Especially in tough battles and even more so for low damage fast weapons, higher STR could mean the difference between damaging medium-high DR opponent and doing nothing to him (unless you trigger dagger passive which is bypassing DR completely).

 

[Sensuki]

Currently the INT AoE size is too big. Not sure about duration effect.

A level 1 Fighter gets more +accuracy (25) than the amount that you can get from 20 Dex (20)

You might be correct with Might, I'm not sure.

CON seems to be okay, a Max CON monk has a little bit of staying power

 

[Shannow]

L0L I've given plenty of 'constructive criticism'. Nice try though. Don't be butthurt. And, don't spread rumours.

Please provide me a link where you actually engage in constructive criticism on the Obsidian board.

I don't think that is actually possible. There is a reason you have that tag here.

Joined: May 14, 2004
Typical noob mistake. If Volly says so, it is "fact". Actual facts and/or proof are irrelevant.

So guys, I've read the last 3-4 pages of this thread, and this is what I've gathered:

• PoE is in a state that one would expect from an OE beta, considering many of their other games' states at release. (lotsa bugs)
  
• Stats don't feel impactful enough.
• Quests are the only source of exp.
• Sounds like the game gives little feedback (on saving throws, etc.)

I'm not really in the mood to read more. Anybody care to point me to a good summation? Can the game speed be changed like in IE games?

 

[Ramireza]

Calm down guys! I think in 1 - 2 years that could be a nice, liltte IE clone. Until then we "replaying our classics" :D

 

[SuicideBunny]

Yeah, dude, that's kind of the point. That's been a design goal since day 1.

That's shitty design.

not in any way, shape, or form. it's just unusual.

 

[Untermensch]

"A system in which everything is equally viable is indistinguishable from a system in which everything is shit."

No. It's just a system where the game lets you to play the way you want.

 

[Sensuki]

Due to the fact that damage bonuses in this game are percentile based, wouldn't it be more balanced to use a percentile system for armor as well?

That way you wouldn't have issues like Hunting Bows being fucking terrible

 

[bonescraper]

An army of wizards in full plate armor and zweihanders, that's my wet dream. Sawyer makes it come true.

So, when are they going to announce Eternity MOBA?

"A system in which everything is equally viable is indistinguishable from a system in which everything is shit."

No. It's just a system where the game lets you to play the way you want.

Dude, that's just like... Skyrim. Fuck yeah.

 

[Infinitron]

So, badler and other Obsidian lurkers (and Sensuki too), here's a little suggestion.

Divide the list of portraits by race and sex, such that when need to select a portrait it starts from the appropriate portraits first. Note that I'm not suggesting that you exclude anybody from using any of the other portraits - the scrolling should just start from the more appropriate ones.

I think Neverwinter Nights 1 did this.

 

[Shannow]

Yeah, dude, that's kind of the point. That's been a design goal since day 1.

That's shitty design.

It's a legitimate design. Nowhere does it say that "correct character construction" needs to be a challenge factor in each and every CRPG.

Where should it say character creation should be a fun factor in RPGs? Sawyer's Guide on RPGs?

"Character creation should be a fun and integral part of every RPG. It's what separates the genre from CYOAs, (action) Adventures, action games, etc."
There, now "it" says so

This game will have easy character building, but difficult battles. As a forum that praises RPGs that do the opposite (obtuse character building, but laughably easy combat), that's a tradeoff we should be willing to accept.

This "forum" praises almost everything and criticises almost everything, because it's not a single entity, but a bunch of fractious fags.
But evenso you are arguing extremely dishonstly. Point out a single codexer who praises a character system for being "obtuse". And once you've failed at that, point out a single codexer who praises a game for its complex and involved character system and also for "laughably easy combat".
You are claiming a dichtonomy where there is none, and in - what I find to be - a very dishonest way...
Prefering simple "no stat left behind"/"the player cannot gimp his character" systems to complex ones is perfectly valid. But be honest about the reasons.