Poll: The Outer Worlds and Fallout: New Vegas

[Duraframe300]

Also in FNV, the game is clearly hinting that you have amnesia, i mean you got shot in the head for god's sake but the game doesn't explicitly say it to not ruin people's ideas of how to roleplay, if you have amnesia (and personally that's how i roleplay the game) and all you knew was that you got ambushed and shot in the head? wouldn't you be curious as to why this happened and how you got yourself into that situation and most importantly who did it to you?

No, it doesn't. You don't have amnesia in F:NV. There's even multiple dialouge options that go against it. You may ignore those if you want, and role-play it, but there's no hint that you're and amnesiac.

His arguments are still retarded, regardless.

You could roleplay it as though you're remembering as you go along in your journey, or do these dialogue options occur right at the start of the game? i would like to know.

Also even if these dialogue options exist at the start of the game, and i persoanlly don't remember them you can just not choose them.

As I said, you're free to role-play so. In the end though, officially the courier doesn't have or need amnesia.

 

[barghwata]

Also in FNV, the game is clearly hinting that you have amnesia, i mean you got shot in the head for god's sake but the game doesn't explicitly say it to not ruin people's ideas of how to roleplay, if you have amnesia (and personally that's how i roleplay the game) and all you knew was that you got ambushed and shot in the head? wouldn't you be curious as to why this happened and how you got yourself into that situation and most importantly who did it to you?

No, it doesn't. You don't have amnesia in F:NV. There's even multiple dialouge options that go against it. You may ignore those if you want, and role-play it, but there's no hint that you're and amnesiac.

His arguments are still retarded, regardless.

You could roleplay it as though you're remembering as you go along in your journey, or do these dialogue options occur right at the start of the game? i would like to know.

Also even if these dialogue options exist at the start of the game, and i persoanlly don't remember them you can just not choose them.

As I said, you're free to role-play so. In the end though, officially the courier doesn't have or need amnesia.

I see, well personally i find it to be an amusing way to roleplay, and this is the beauty of having an extremely vague character, you could roleplay however you want, and yet Terenty for some reason wants to make the character pre defined.

 

[Trashos]

I don't remember any evidence that I don't have amnesia. It seemed to be up in the air.

 

[Butter]

When you meet Bruce Isaac, you can tell him you saw him perform in New Reno.

 

[Trashos]

I didn't remember that. But does it prove that the courier remembers normally? He doesn't remember much (if anything, I have to play again and pay attention) in the beginning. Also, I have to recall the discussions with Ulysses. I don't think the Courier remembered the events narrated by Ulysses either (but I may be wrong, have to play again).

 

[barghwata]

I didn't remember that. But does it prove that the courier remembers normally? He doesn't remember much (if anything, I have to play again and pay attention) in the beginning. Also, I have to recall the discussions with Ulysses. I don't think the Courier remembered the events narrated by Ulysses either (but I may be wrong, have to play again).

I think overall, the game doesn't go out of its way to forcibly contradict an amnesia narrative at all, you can roleplay it however you want.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Kind of surprised Roguey didn't beat me to this

Well, he's incorrect about the Courier; you absolutely do not have amnesia. There is no point at which you are unable to remember aspects of your past and, more importantly, outside of being a courier in the wrong place at the wrong time, your past is considered irrelevant to how you move forward in the story.

from Sawyer

 

[DalekFlay]

As I said, you're free to role-play so. In the end though, officially the courier doesn't have or need amnesia.

First time I played New Vegas I was an NCR spy sniper who was working as a courier undercover. Nothing in the game made me betray that really, that I remember. Maybe the conversation with the ambassador.

 

[Carrion]

The "criticism" of New Vegas in this thread seems superficial or outright moronic to me. Yeah, the game's butt-ugly, the combat sucks and the engine just fucking blows overall, everybody knows that. There are also other issues like how S.P.E.C.I.A.L. isn't nearly as important as it should be, with skills generally being much more important than their governing attributes. The strengths of the game are in the quest design and the way the game supports different builds, the open-ended structure, the reactivity and the different ways you can affect the game world, small but significant things like being able to finish the game as a pacifist or kill any character in the game world, even if it's an important quest character or the leader of a powerful faction. The fact that FO3 fanboys fail to recognize these aspects is understandable, but you'd expect a bit more from people who actually know something about RPGs. As a role-playing game New Vegas does some exceptional things, even if it's dragged down by the fact that it's build on a much inferior game and an engine that's a pretty poor fit for Fallout.

did you also mod out the meta knowledge you had of the game from playing it start to finish 20 times?

but yeah, it sorta kinda does, doesn't it? by design, as part of the realism and making the world feel connected and lived-in, characters constantly bring up locations in the local area and directions and such, especially in Goodsprings, where a number of characters give you info on the world and go to lengths to tell you where a thing is in relation to another distinct thing (tower, schoolhouse, memorial, this highway, that highway...)

I still kinda doubt that it'd all come together right for a first-timer as it is, but... maybe? I removed shillcheck tags with a mod, that worked too

You can definitely play most of it without any quest markers. There are only a couple of exceptions, like some of the BoS quests (which have an in-game explanation for the GPS), and one or two quests in New Vegas proper that are a bit vague in their descriptions. In almost every quest it's easy to find you way around without any quest markers whatsoever, even on a first playthrough. It's just one of the myriad of little things that New Vegas does to improve on its "predecessor".

As for The Outer Worlds, I'm not expecting miracles, but if they can replicate some of the best aspects of New Vegas it might still be a worthwhile game.

 

[Terenty]

I see, well personally i find it to be an amusing way to roleplay, and this is the beauty of having an extremely vague character, you could roleplay however you want, and yet Terenty for some reason wants to make the character pre defined.

Ok, let me put it this way.

With the way the game sets up its story it doesn't feel natural(for me anyway) to roleplay as some daredevil badass, after being shot in the head and barely surviving. I feel disconnected. The natural course of action for the protagonist is to give up his previous life and keep his head down, not go after the person who ambushed him/her and almost killed. Not to become a vagabond and an errand boy for every person on the way. This is the premise they provided, it feels counter intuitive, its not relatable

Now, if i had a choice to become the resident of Goodsprings, helping them out with some work, maybe going to different settlements, including New Vegas, to get some spare parts, food, water etc., and maybe along the way become entangled in these politics and machinations against your will somehow( i dont know how, its a work for writers), this would at least feel plausible. It would be relatable. This is how it worked in Fallout 1 for the most part.

 

[Steamboat Willie]

The "criticism" of New Vegas in this thread seems superficial or outright moronic to me. Yeah, the game's butt-ugly, the combat sucks and the engine just fucking blows overall

 

[Okagron]

after being shot in the head and barely surviving. I feel disconnected.

People already explained you were ambushed. Don't know why you keep ignoring the people keep saying this, but it feels like part of your agenda to just have a convenient narrative to criticize the game, even when your retarded arguments are refuted.

The natural course of action for the protagonist is to give up his previous life and keep his head down, not go after the person who ambushed him/her and almost killed. Not to become a vagabond and an errand boy for every person on the way. This is the premise they provided, it feels counter intuitive, its not relatable

Natural course varies from person to person. I already explained (and others) that not everybody will react the same way. Specially in a game where you give the backstory to the Courier and not the game itself (for the most part).

Now, if i had a choice to become the resident of Goodsprings, helping them out with some work, maybe going to different settlements, including New Vegas, to get some spare parts, food, water etc., and maybe along the way become entangled in these politics and machinations against your will somehow( i dont know how, its a work for writers), this would at least feel plausible. It would be relatable. This is how it worked in Fallout 1 for the most part.

You mean how you get entangled in the conflict of the Hoover Damn by going after Benny? Yeah, same exact way as Fallout 1. And don't know why you keep going on and on about "relatable", because not everything in fictional media is meant to be relatable. In fact, characters doing actions that are not relatable tend to be some of the most interesting and engaging characters, because they are actually capable of actions a lot of people wouldn't do normally.

It seems at this point you are just blatantly ignoring arguments that clearly refutes your retarded arguments because you have no way of actually countering them. Specially when your retarded arguments could be easily applied to Fallout 1 but that game somehow gets a pass for you.

 

[barghwata]

I see, well personally i find it to be an amusing way to roleplay, and this is the beauty of having an extremely vague character, you could roleplay however you want, and yet Terenty for some reason wants to make the character pre defined.

Ok, let me put it this way.

With the way the game sets up its story it doesn't feel natural(for me anyway) to roleplay as some daredevil badass, after being shot in the head and barely surviving. I feel disconnected. The natural course of action for the protagonist is to give up his previous life and keep his head down, not go after the person who ambushed him/her and almost killed. Not to become a vagabond and an errand boy for every person on the way. This is the premise they provided, it feels counter intuitive, its not relatable

Now, if i had a choice to become the resident of Goodsprings, helping them out with some work, maybe going to different settlements, including New Vegas, to get some spare parts, food, water etc., and maybe along the way become entangled in these politics and machinations against your will somehow( i dont know how, its a work for writers), this would at least feel plausible. It would be relatable. This is how it worked in Fallout 1 for the most part.

Honestly i think there's enough motivation there to push on with the main quest:
1- Revenge, for almost getting killed and losing your contract.
2- Curiosity, in wanting to know who the guy who tried to kill you is and why the package was so important to him.
3- Greed, since the package is clearly something of great value to warrant an ambush in the first place and the courier might be tempted to get his hands on it.
4- a combination of all of the above.

Now obviously not all people would be motivated enough to chase benny for these reasons alone, but here's the kicker........... you don't have to do it.
In my second playthrough of the game i ignored the main quest completely at first and just wandered around the wasteland doing my own thing, in my journey i made contact with the NCR and ended up aligning with their ideology; eventually i came around to going to vegas, i didn't even look for benny since the character i was roleplaying wasn't interested and i managed to finish the game through the NCR main quest anyways, i was suprised, but appearently i am not the only one who this happened to

https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/77mykd/til_you_can_finish_fallout_new_vegas_and_never/ .

From my personal experience; the game has amazing levels of reactivity, you can kill whoever you want, fuck around however you want and completely ignore certain factions or important quests and still finish the game just fine.

 

[Terenty]

People already explained you were ambushed. Don't know why you keep ignoring the people keep saying this, but it feels like part of your agenda to just have a convenient narrative to criticize the game, even when your retarded arguments are refuted.

You seem to be the retard here. What the fuck does it change that i was ambushed? If i was ambushed and survived miraculously from a headshot i wouldn't go after my killer. I would thank God i stayed alive and do something else with my live

And don't know why you keep going on and on about "relatable", because not everything in fictional media is meant to be relatable. In fact, characters doing actions that are not relatable tend to be some of the most interesting and engaging characters, because they are actually capable of actions a lot of people wouldn't do normally.

wtf are you talking about? I thought we were talking about roleplaying here, not some other characters.

You mean how you get entangled in the conflict of the Hoover Damn by going after Benny? Yeah, same exact way as Fallout 1.

Not the same way at all. Why should i go after Benny, why should i go find info about the chip? I don't care about either of these things let me roleplay a believable character who wants to be left alone and live a normal life as i gave the example earlier. I can't ? Well the game is shit then for not providing me the opportunity, but setting up the story that way .

 

[Terenty]

Now obviously not all people would be motivated enough to chase benny for these reasons alone, but here's the kicker........... you don't have to do it.
In my second playthrough of the game i ignored the main quest completely at first and just wandered around the wasteland doing my own thing, in my journey i made contact with the NCR and ended up aligning with their ideology; eventually i came around to going to vegas, i didn't even look for benny since the character i was roleplaying wasn't interested and i managed to finish the game through the NCR main quest anyways, i was suprised, but appearently i am not the only one who this happened to

Well, this sounds better. And you dont have to mention Benny in dialogue, like, do you know this person etc etc? Just completely ignore this line?

 

[barghwata]

Now obviously not all people would be motivated enough to chase benny for these reasons alone, but here's the kicker........... you don't have to do it.
In my second playthrough of the game i ignored the main quest completely at first and just wandered around the wasteland doing my own thing, in my journey i made contact with the NCR and ended up aligning with their ideology; eventually i came around to going to vegas, i didn't even look for benny since the character i was roleplaying wasn't interested and i managed to finish the game through the NCR main quest anyways, i was suprised, but appearently i am not the only one who this happened to

Well, this sounds better. And you dont have to mention Benny in dialogue, like, do you know this person etc etc? Just completely ignore this line?

This was years ago so i don't remember the details, but i am pretty sure i ignored benny completely in my playthrough.

To side with house however, you would have to do the benny quest, since he'll ask you to deal with him before you can gain his trust, but he will offer you a good compensation for it and more to come, in other words you will have a motivation to deal with benny outside of just revenge or something like that.

With Caesar's legion, you will have to finish benny's quest first but i find that this is kind of realistic since you would have to do something like that to attract Caesar's attention in the first place.

It's more nuanced then just "chase benny for the thrills".

 

[Trashos]

Kind of surprised Roguey didn't beat me to this

Well, he's incorrect about the Courier; you absolutely do not have amnesia. There is no point at which you are unable to remember aspects of your past and, more importantly, outside of being a courier in the wrong place at the wrong time, your past is considered irrelevant to how you move forward in the story.

from Sawyer

This is informative *as an intention*, but the interesting question is whether it is supported in-game. The Bruce Isaak memory is supportive, but I don't find it convincing on its own. It sounds like something that a person with amnesia could remember, once he saw the face/heard the voice (although, mind you, I don't really know much about amnesia).

Now, I may be convinced otherwise if the courier also remembers other stuff, but I can't think of any. I have to check whether he remembers the delivery mentioned by Ulysses (although, still, even if he remembers the delivery, it still doesn't prove that the courier didn't regain his memory gradually).

(I don't have stakes in this btw, I usually role play as a dude who is half courier-half handyman)

 

[Quillon]

Courier is the embodiment of all RPG characters; his backstory is that he's been doing fetch quests. Courier is YOU!

 

[Neanderthal]

Poll needs tightening up, it looks bad means you have an opinion, whereas it could be good covers far more territory including the other option. Needs more specificity to avoid lies, damn lies and statistics trope.

 

[Sigourn]

I'm glad to be in the winner's camp. As expected, TOW turned out to be total shit.

 

[Ontopoly]

I'm glad to be in the winner's camp. As expected, TOW turned out to be total shit.

TOW is way better than F:NV in pretty much every way, only Bethesda fanbois says otherwise tbh.

1. The combat was improved, feels way better and more like a real shooter. This is what you do most of the game so it's incredibly important to the overall experience.

2. Looks way less ugly, New Vegas looked terrible. TOW is kinda pretty.

3. Choices matter more, in New Vegas you got choices every now and then but they were mostly superficial and didn't change the story. In TOW things you do matter.

4. Waaaay better written companions, who were shallow as f*ck in New Vegas.

5. Less empty spaces and waste of time, New Vegas was a big game but there really wasn't much more in it than was in TOW. 95% of the time was spent just walking or looting containers.

That's my top five reasons TOW kicks ass!

 

[ItsChon]

I'm glad to be in the winner's camp. As expected, TOW turned out to be total shit.

TOW is way better than F:NV in pretty much every way, only Bethesda fanbois says otherwise tbh.

1. The combat was improved, feels way better and more like a real shooter. This is what you do most of the game so it's incredibly important to the overall experience.

2. Looks way less ugly, New Vegas looked terrible. TOW is kinda pretty.

3. Choices matter more, in New Vegas you got choices every now and then but they were mostly superficial and didn't change the story. In TOW things you do matter.

4. Waaaay better written companions, who were shallow as f*ck in New Vegas.

5. Less empty spaces and waste of time, New Vegas was a big game but there really wasn't much more in it than was in TOW. 95% of the time was spent just walking or looting containers.

That's my top five reasons TOW kicks ass!

Both were shit. And whoevers alt this is needs to try harder.

 

[Sweeper]

Both were shit

Fuck off nigger. New Vegas was pretty great.

 

[ItsChon]

Fuck off nigger. New Vegas was pretty great.

Third person garbage.

Gameplay was dog shit.
Art style was dog shit.
World felt stiff and wooden due to dog shit Bethesda engine.
Factions were dog shit.

That's basically the entire game lmfao.

 

[Wunderbar]

^ this guy also hates Fallout 1-2 because of a brown palette and because combat is worse than in underrail.