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Arkane PREY - Arkane's immersive coffee cup transformation sim - now with Mooncrash roguelike mode DLC

LarryTyphoid

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There are very few working examples of "diegetic" UI done right and they all work when they both make sense and aren't trying to replace something that tries to bridge the gap between the game's supposed world and the reality of interfacing with that world though the limited approximation that is a 2D monitor with some input device
Looking Glass did do diegetic UI very well in Terra Nova: Strike Force Centauri. It's basically SS1's UI but you're in a mech, so the limited field of view makes a bit more sense, though SS1's fullscreen UI also works very well.
 

Bad Sector

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Eh, SS1's UI is diegetic only in the most cheating hand wavy explanation, in that all you see is the UI of the hardware in your scull and you move the cursor around with your brain, kinda like the pull down menus that Cain had in Robocop 2 :-P
 

MuscleSpark

Augur
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I can agree with NPCs giving the player some agency and personality. But I do think it's a trade-off, and in the context of an immersive sim not one I personally would be willing to make. That said, Prey probably handles it as well as it could imho; NPCs will talk at you and ask you things but not require any player input to respond other than doing or not doing the task itself. Having text trees where you ask questions about what they think of the current situation and about their backstory and they answer you like you're some kind of newspaper interviewer just feels a little grating.

I can be immersed in games with abstract UIs too, and in fact I've been trained to do so over the past 25 or so years I've been playing video games (it helps if the game is good and/or interesting), but that doesn't mean games can't do better. If Thief had no health shields and the light gem was an actual in-game gem attached to your wrist you'd have to look down at, wouldn't that be good? That's what Gloomwood is doing, and while paradoxically it ended up taking me out of the experience at first due to the realization that the UI is diegetic and I'm playing a video game, in the long term it was beneficial.

As for Half-Life, maybe I'm being too harsh on it, but I honestly do think a lot of what you attribute to storytelling is just thanks to the design of the game being incredibly linear. You might not directly be told what to do, but if you're presented with a door leading to a corridor leading to another door and so forth and there's no other way to progress, you're going to be walking that path. I will say that I prefer Half-Life's storytelling to Half-Life 2's though, as I don't like having information dumped at me (which is why I like old school dungeon crawlers), and I feel that Prey handles it pretty well because what the characters tell you serves to flesh out their personality (which is very important for the plot's main conceit) while giving you a straightforward goal and isn't overlong, irrelevant exposition.

Yeah, health is an abstraction in the first place. It doesn't differentiate between a broken arm or a broken leg and is just a measure of "average damage person can take before dying". You can do away with precise health values/bars ala Resident Evil (which does technically have numbers, but hidden from the player) and combine it with Prey's trauma system and that'd be relatively abstract and realistic. Although probably quite frustrating for players too.

Inventory screens can be done with a container of some sort (like the suitcase in Gloomwood). I liked the way the Ultima games did it. Backpacks were actual bags that you could freely move stuff around in and would cover up your screen/vision when you opened them, it was a good abstraction. ZombiU did a neat thing where your character would crouch and look down at their backpack while the secondary WiiU screen turned into an inventory screen and then you would have to look down and interact with it, but that's a very specific example. Prey I didn't like because it moved it to a clearly separate menu and paused the game logic, where it could easily have kept the game going ala Dark Souls and interacted via the Transtar device, the thing serving as the menu-opening animation in the first place.

Also, generally speaking, sci-fi games have a big advantage when it comes to making diegetic UIs in that technology can be advanced enough where information is shown in a HUD via the character's helmet or implants or whatnot. In a fantasy game you could do it with a magic spell that tells you your life force or something, but good luck explaining why it'd constantly be up in your line of sight draining your mana. Alternatively, you could do a life gem akin to Thief's light gem. In an otherwise realistic first-person game? You'll have to rely on a Fitbit unless you want red screen tinting and blood jam.
But yeah, this kind of stuff might become more important as VR and virtual worlds take off (or whatever is after that, holograms, full dive?), until then there's still the separation between player and computer screen.
 

LarryTyphoid

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If Thief had no health shields and the light gem was an actual in-game gem attached to your wrist you'd have to look down at, wouldn't that be good?
Personally, I'd disagree with this decision. The light gem is already sort of a gamey workaround for the level of lighting not always being correspondent with what you actually see - from what I remember, the shadow-based stealth system was cobbled together with duck-tape, so the gem was necessary. In universe, Garrett shouldn't need a stupid gizmo to know how hidden he is, he should know by instinct, and the gem is a way for the player to be on the same page. The idea of a "light gem bracelet" for Garrett is just another example of what I was talking about - removing all "gamey" elements (like dialogue trees or, in this case, UI elements) for the sake of immersion is a mistake if the changes make the protagonist appear less competent in-universe.
 

MuscleSpark

Augur
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If Thief had no health shields and the light gem was an actual in-game gem attached to your wrist you'd have to look down at, wouldn't that be good?
Personally, I'd disagree with this decision. The light gem is already sort of a gamey workaround for the level of lighting not always being correspondent with what you actually see - from what I remember, the shadow-based stealth system was cobbled together with duck-tape, so the gem was necessary. In universe, Garrett shouldn't need a stupid gizmo to know how hidden he is, he should know by instinct, and the gem is a way for the player to be on the same page. The idea of a "light gem bracelet" for Garrett is just another example of what I was talking about - removing all "gamey" elements (like dialogue trees or, in this case, UI elements) for the sake of immersion is a mistake if the changes make the protagonist appear less competent in-universe.
I'd argue even a master thief like Garrett can't be 100% certain of how hidden he is in every single scenario and that a light gem would be a useful tool for a thief regardless; a thief who uses every tool and advantage at his disposal is a lot more competent than one who doesn't, in my opinion. Not that it matters how competent or incompetent Garrett is because it all comes down to the player controlling him and how skilled they are at the video game.
 

Bad Sector

Arcane
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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Inventory screens can be done with a container of some sort (like the suitcase in Gloomwood). I liked the way the Ultima games did it. Backpacks were actual bags that you could freely move stuff around in and would cover up your screen/vision when you opened them, it was a good abstraction. ZombiU did a neat thing where your character would crouch and look down at their backpack while the secondary WiiU screen turned into an inventory screen and then you would have to look down and interact with it, but that's a very specific example. Prey I didn't like because it moved it to a clearly separate menu and paused the game logic, where it could easily have kept the game going ala Dark Souls and interacted via the Transtar device, the thing serving as the menu-opening animation in the first place.

TBH i found the Ultima thing gimmicky - it was neat at first but it quickly devolved into a mess for no reason at all. IMO if you are going to make an abstraction then make an abstraction that has good and practical UX which is convenient to use, not a gimmicky one. Prey could have used the Transtar device like a tablet (in landscape orientation, don't waste screen space for both the model and the conflicting aspect ratios of the in-game monitor and real monitor the player uses, otherwise it would artificially restrict the UI) though personally i prefer the separate screen and the only alternative i'd be fine with would be a toggleable UI mode like in System Shock 2 or Deus Ex.
 

Spukrian

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In the beginning of Prey, the female scientist pulls out a screen from her transcribe, making it wider, would've been cooler if Morgan's transcribe had worked the same.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
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I've finally played and completed this. Pretty swell, though it didn't grab me like System Shock did. The enemies never felt enjoyable to fight, though I believe this was the intent. Didn't care for most of the NPCs and their insipid lives. Wasn't surprised to see that Avellone wrote the most memorable characters/side quests; I imagine the cook was his response to Cook Cook. :P I knew right away that was one of his because of how over-the-top he was, though the others are a bit less obvious. I am surprised to see that Avellone didn't consider this a role playing game since it has both character building and a non-trivial amount of narrative reactivity which is enough to qualify as far as I'm concerned.

I was all set to sacrifice myself in the ending, especially after hearing that one incriminating recording, but then they had to go and give me an easy way out and have January itself encourage me to leave since I never installed any alien powers. Didn't like the sequel-bait post-credits stinger, though I knew something like that was coming because I already got the non-standard game over from taking that escape pod early just to see what would happen. Since this game underperformed and there will likely never be a sequel, I will prefer to interpret that as a weird dream. :M
 
Joined
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Chicago, IL, Kwa
The only thing I like about the ending is that it’s a pretty clever way of
explaining why Morgan and Alex appear to be almost forty years apart in age. Otherwise it’s pretty hamfistedly sequel bait.
 

Wunderbar

Arcane
Joined
Nov 15, 2015
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8,825
why Morgan and Alex appear to be almost forty years apart in age
being fat ages you.

They may be 35 and 40 yrs old, it's just Morgan is fit and healthy, while Alex is fat. There was an email that says something about him dodging exercising, and his treadmill looks like it wasn't used for a while.

7damagr4uw0z.jpg
 
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anvi

Prophet
Village Idiot
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Oct 12, 2016
Messages
8,405
Location
Kelethin
I loved Prey but only really because of what it represented, and because it felt like a love letter to System Shock. I had a lot fun with it too. But I wouldn't want to play it again.
 
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Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
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Messages
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This would have never been a point that's brought up in reviews if they didn't somehow market this as a Prey reboot.
Also I believe you're right.

Yeah, superfast enemies plus chaotic special effects plus stress-inducing combat stinger/music = "we don't ever want you to feel comfortable engaging with these things even when you're effortlessly stomping them." It's like the opposite of nuDoom (which Mick Gray also did the music for) where everything's built up to make you tense in a good way.
 

Silverfish

Arbiter
Joined
Dec 4, 2019
Messages
3,929
being fat ages you.

They may be 35 and 40 yrs old, it's just Morgan is fit and healthy, while Alex is fat. There was an email that says something about him dodging exercising, and his treadmill looks like it wasn't used for a while.

7damagr4uw0z.jpg

Those are hurdles. A regular treadmill just isn't enough for Alex.
 

Zboj Lamignat

Arcane
Joined
Feb 15, 2012
Messages
5,778
They should call it Prey 2: that's the number of interesting enemies we have in our horror game, which is two more than the previous part.

And then the cgi teaser should show that these enemies are as boring, not scary and meh as all the previous ones.

Probably more likely to happen than that "leak".
 

Silentstorm

Learned
Joined
Apr 29, 2019
Messages
885
Prey 2...isn't Earth at the end so fucked up that they want the player character to be a diplomat and convince the typhons that humans have feelings, thank you very much, and that they don't like being eaten, killed and controlled?

I guess the Typhons finally get to wherever the last human survivors are and thus you help them...or wait until the very last second to betray and kill all humans, still, saying it's smaller and shorter is actually a plus, i did genuinely think the game dragged a bit too much, and travelling in Zero Gravity got particularly annoying.
 
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
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I do wonder how a hypothetical Prey 2 without Colantonio will turn out. There have been a fair amount of hints that he was the one mandating the original stick to its SS2 roots (at least as much as it did) and attempting to bulwark against the more idiotic decisions the suits were pushing. Too bad it likely resulted in his forced resignation.

I’m immensely skeptical this thing is actually happening though. Seems like some pretty easy bait.
 

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