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Wadjet Eye Primordia - A Point and Click Adventure - Now Available

Pyke

The Brotherhood
Developer
Joined
Nov 29, 2011
Messages
1,196
Location
South Africa
Pretty much all of those reasons are why I veered away from AGS. When I first looked at it (a good few years ago) a big problem for me was that AGS doesn't read external files for graphics. Im not sure if thats still the case, but with Stasis I can literally render directly out of After Effects and run the game to see the changes.

It also builds the game in a way that allows for really easy patching.

Reading external files also means that the actual build time for testing is a few seconds (if that).

Are you guys building your own engine, or using an existing one? Unity seems to be the weapon of choice and I've seen some really amazing stuff done with it with adventure games (Daedelic specifically).
I personally would hate for you guys to move too far from that beautiful style you have!
 

trustno1code

Prophet
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
290
Location
La Pologne
Unity seems to be the weapon of choice and I've seen some really amazing stuff done with it with adventure games (Daedelic specifically).
Which of Daedalics adventures are done in Unity? I though they only used that for the RPG Blackguards, but their adventures were made in the same engine you're using, Visionaire Studio?
 

Crooked Bee

(no longer) a wide-wandering bee
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In quarantine
Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire MCA Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Unity seems to be the weapon of choice and I've seen some really amazing stuff done with it with adventure games (Daedelic specifically).
Which of Daedalics adventures are done in Unity? I though they only used that for the RPG Blackguards, but their adventures were made in the same engine you're using, Visionaire Studio?

Perhaps Pyke meant the Whispered World 2 trailer? That game is being developed in Unity, I believe.

But yeah, prior to Blackguards Daedalic used Visionaire and not Unity. They seem to be switching over to Unity now, though.
 

Pyke

The Brotherhood
Developer
Joined
Nov 29, 2011
Messages
1,196
Location
South Africa
Yeah - The Whispered World 2 is being done in Unity.

They haven't publicly released any 'official' game play footage, but this is a pretty good look at the game:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqO5lmK1zK0

And as Crooked Bee mentioned, the game trailer was done 'in game' (although I believe the particle effects were added in afterwards).
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
@ Pyke / Crooked Bee: I looked into Visionaire, but several things were offputting to me, including (1) the fact that almost all the support and community is German -- I'm sure they speak English, but it's still much harder to Google stuff and so forth; and (2) the license terms (perhaps due to poor English translation) were extremely vague and hard to understand. We looked at Unity, but in some respects it was both more and less than what we were hoping for. We're using Love2D as the low-level engine and building on top of it. Since the game is entirely 2D, it's a good foundation for us.

@ SCO: While I'm generally a "public good" kind of person, trying to make AGS into something that would suit our needs would be much more difficult than building what we need, and would make it that much less likely that we'd finish the game. The foundational stuff in AGS is simply not very good[*] -- it's not just the stuff I mentioned, it's other things like pathfinding, saving, etc. Each time a new layer is added on top of it -- like platform portability -- that, in my view, simply makes the whole edifice more rickety.

In building our engine, our hope is that it will be something that we can share with other developers so they can use it in lieu of AGS if they want. I doubt it will be like that in the first instance -- at the moment, we're making it to suit our needs, not to be super user friendly. But, for example, we have a functional dialogue editor that works more or less like the Neverwinter Nights editor. Anyone would be able to pick that up and figure it out.

[EDIT:

* "Not very good" was a poor choice of words. AGS is an amazing piece of work, all the more amazing given that it was developed for free, first by one guy and then by an international community. I guess I meant, "has too many legacy problems that would be too much to fix."]
 
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MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
I looked at Wintermute years ago -- well before working on Primordia. I looked into it again about a year ago. My impression both times was that the small number of games (and lack of any familiar commercial titles) suggested shortcomings that might not be obvious on the face of it. ("The White Chamber" may be the only one I've heard of.) In addition, it looks like development of Wintermute is dead (last release 4+ years old, last beta almost 2 years old), which is never a good sign.

Just FWIW, our engine has been in development for months, so it's not likely that we're going to scrap it at this point, unless something happens like our coder becomes ill or we hit an insurmountable barrier. The big-picture perspective I have here is that we'd like to have an engine that will be useful for a number of titles down the road if we're successful with our next one. Primordia established that we can make a commercial title, now we just want to work on building the pipeline that will enable us to make commercial titles with enough efficiency and profitability that we can sustain full-time employment for team members who want it (like Vic).

[BTW: I definitely appreciate the crowd-sourced efforts to help us on this!]
 
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MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
Cross-posting this from our FB page:

Over time, I've bought (or Kickstarted) a bunch of interesting, beautiful games that I'll never get around to playing, which has led to me having a large quantity of unused Steam keys going to waste. As a way of thanking people for their support, and of releasing the keys "into the wild" as it were, I'd like to give them out to Wormwood Studios fans.

I have not, however, been able to come up with a great approach for this. I don't want it to be a "first come, first served" type thing because that encourages neurotic behavior. On the other hand, I don't want it to be totally random because that increases the likelihood of it being gamed by bots. The approach I was thinking of pursuing was this:

I will list the keys. If people are interested, they can (1) email me and (2) follow us on Twitter (the latter being a way of limiting it to one per person). Every day, until the keys run out, I'll do a drawing. The winner can pick one of the remaining game keys. I'll then remove the winner's name from the "bowl" and remove the game from the list. That way everyone can only win once.

That way has the downside of requiring people to follow us on Twitter. That seems especially annoying in that I myself don't use Twitter for anything other than promoting Wormwood Studios, so it seems silly to require other people to use Twitter for the competition. Perhaps an alternative would be that they could email with some other way of confirming they aren't a bot / clone (I guess I could use Codex user names). But it seems like the basic approach would work pretty well. Is there a better one I'm missing?
 

Cowboy Moment

Arcane
Joined
Feb 8, 2011
Messages
4,407
I think you'll be fine so long as you don't have a key for Secret of the Magic Crystals.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,228
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Cross-posting this from our FB page:

Over time, I've bought (or Kickstarted) a bunch of interesting, beautiful games that I'll never get around to playing, which has led to me having a large quantity of unused Steam keys going to waste. As a way of thanking people for their support, and of releasing the keys "into the wild" as it were, I'd like to give them out to Wormwood Studios fans.

I have not, however, been able to come up with a great approach for this. I don't want it to be a "first come, first served" type thing because that encourages neurotic behavior. On the other hand, I don't want it to be totally random because that increases the likelihood of it being gamed by bots. The approach I was thinking of pursuing was this:

I will list the keys. If people are interested, they can (1) email me and (2) follow us on Twitter (the latter being a way of limiting it to one per person). Every day, until the keys run out, I'll do a drawing. The winner can pick one of the remaining game keys. I'll then remove the winner's name from the "bowl" and remove the game from the list. That way everyone can only win once.

That way has the downside of requiring people to follow us on Twitter. That seems especially annoying in that I myself don't use Twitter for anything other than promoting Wormwood Studios, so it seems silly to require other people to use Twitter for the competition. Perhaps an alternative would be that they could email with some other way of confirming they aren't a bot / clone (I guess I could use Codex user names). But it seems like the basic approach would work pretty well. Is there a better one I'm missing?

Obviously if you were doing this on the Codex only, you could ask people to PM you and that would be your proof. But since you aren't, email+Twitter is as good a method as any.

As for bots and clones, people CAN create fake email and Twitter accounts, or use additional ones if they have any, so that's not foolproof. For maximum security you could use the NeoGAF method of not allowing free email accounts, but that would shut out a large portion of your audience.

In any case, you might want to inform people about this here: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...beg-beg-beg-beg-beg-beg-beg-beg-thread.78755/
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
I dunno, I don't want to put people out too much. Plus running a contest would be a lot more complicated.
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
[Cross-posted from our site.]

Over the past few years, I've assembled a modest number of Steam, GOG, and Desura keys that I'm never going to use. Basically, when games go on sale, if they're games that I really liked, or are simply super cheap, I'll pick up copies, and then give them away to friends or, occasionally, to unsatisfied purchasers of Primordia. Also, I've backed a number of Kickstarter projects that have by now come to fruition, but which I'll never have time to play.

Anyway, I wanted to find a way to give copies out in a fair way to people who played Primordia or otherwise have supported Wormwood Studios. But after much agonizing and deliberation, I couldn't find an easy way to do it: running even a basic giveaway would take time I don't have, and my various means of trying to screen out bots/duplicates seemed like a pain to everyone involved.

So, alas, what I'm going to do is just post the keys at irregular intervals on our Twitter feed @WWSGames. This is perhaps the most inequitable way to distribute something, since one compulsive fast typist may get them all, but it's the easiest way to do this, and at least I'll be releasing the games "to the wild" rather than keeping them penned up in a text file.

[Not cross-posted]

I realize this is a totally non-ideal way to do things and that people hate Twitter, but it seemed the least bad option.
 

felipepepe

Codex's Heretic
Patron
Joined
Feb 2, 2007
Messages
17,274
Location
Terra da Garoa
You're giving out free stuff bro, you could be doing by hiding it beneath stones on the desert and you would still be a bro.
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
For those who are curious, I've posted a brief postmortem for the stillborn follow-up to Primordia, Cloudscape: http://www.wormwoodstudios.com/2014/09/eulogy-for-stillborn-cloudscape.html

Still hopeful we'll make it someday, but in the meanwhile I figured I'd show some of our work. Also, gearing up to give away some more random keys, but they're almost all from rather crappy recent bundles/sales.
 

Darth Roxor

Royal Dongsmith
Staff Member
Joined
May 29, 2008
Messages
1,878,404
Location
Djibouti
I love that art of the miner, complete with a caged bird :D

But one thing,

ambitiously imagined as the first game in a trilogy

Please don't do this. I don't think I can name any book, movie or game that wouldn't suffer in various degrees from being "planned as the first in a trilogy" from the get-go.
 

Alex

Arcane
Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Messages
8,750
Location
São Paulo - Brasil
I love that art of the miner, complete with a caged bird :D

But one thing,

ambitiously imagined as the first game in a trilogy

Please don't do this. I don't think I can name any book, movie or game that wouldn't suffer in various degrees from being "planned as the first in a trilogy" from the get-go.

Well, I already told you to play Ultima 7...
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
You should read The Demon Princes! That was planned as a five-book series and it's fantastico! In fact, the trilogy structure is pretty standard in science fiction. But each game would be self-contained, thematically and narratively; it wouldn't end on a cliff-hanger or anything.
 

MicoSelva

backlog digger
Patron
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
7,480
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Vigil's Keep
Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
Cloudscape really looks like it had tons of potential which makes this, for me, the most depressing gaming news since cancellation of Chaos Chronicles.

Now I am rooting for Fallen Gods even more. Put it on Kickstarter if you have to, I will pledge. :)

By the way, did you consider crowd-funding Cloudscape before making the final decision to can it?
 
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MicoSelva

backlog digger
Patron
Joined
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Messages
7,480
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Vigil's Keep
Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
No I am rooting for Fallen Gods even more. Put it on Kickstarter it if you have, to I will pledge. :)
?
Official Wormwood Studios site, mate:

www.wormwoodstudios.com said:
In 2013, the team expanded to include Steven Poulton, an English programmer, and Ben Chandler, another Australian artist. That team made Salt and Like A Raisin in the Sun and worked on the now-defunct adventure game, Cloudscape. In 2014, the team shifted to include Dan Miller, a pixel artist dividing his time between Japan and America, Zoltán Tóbiás, a Hungarian artist (and doctor!), and Connor Brennan, an American programmer. This team is working on Fallen Gods.
 

iqzulk

Augur
Joined
Apr 24, 2012
Messages
294
With all the people on board (props for Ben304/Ben_Chandler! - did you play PISS and The City demo, by any chance?) will Vic still play the first violin in the envisioning, development and setting in stone the style of the game, so to speak?
 
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MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
Messages
5,703
Location
California
Neither Vic nor Ben is involved in Fallen Gods. The current team is me, Miller, Zoltan Tobias, and Connor Brennan. Dan and Zoltan are driving the visual style, but I can tell you that two inspirations are Arthur Rackham and John Bauer. But the pixel art is sort of its own beast.
 

iqzulk

Augur
Joined
Apr 24, 2012
Messages
294
So, what is Vic doing (game-development-wise), if I may inquire?
 

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