Game News Project Eternity Kickstarter Update #62: Production Milestone Report - Areas, Characters, Features

[Infinitron]

Wait, they're not going to use the Storm of Zehir system? Are they insane? They get praise for finally working out a system that solves an age-old party RPG issue with a system that is solid as shit, and they won't reuse it?

Yeah, huh, i think i want a quote on that Infinitron/Roguey.

http://spring.me/GZiets/q/477333344988709487

Stats, sex, and race are all checked in dialogue, but not skills, as far as I know.

No reason that I can see not to check skills too since they will all have combat utility and no single one of them will be a "dialogue winner" skill.

 

[Grunker]

http://spring.me/GZiets/q/477333344988709487

Jesus Christ, why?

 

[Infinitron]

http://spring.me/GZiets/q/477333344988709487

Jesus Christ, why?

What Roguey said? You're not creating six identikit "generic adventurers" who would all say approximately the same things in a conversation minus individual skill and stat differences, so the SoZ system just isn't a very good fit.

Wasteland 2, on the other hand, can and will do this (or something similar)

 

[Grunker]

http://spring.me/GZiets/q/477333344988709487

Jesus Christ, why?

What Roguey said? You're not creating six identikit "generic adventurers" who would all say approximately the same things in a conversation minus individual skill and stat differences, so the SoZ system just isn't a very good fit.

Yeah, not using Storm of Zehir's system because it fixes glaring issues like "this is the PCs story" sure makes up for not being able to have my Cypher party member help my stupid fighter with a mental challenge or whatever.

Meh, it's no big deal, I just cannot fathom how they can make something so universally praised and just give up on it because the game is PC-focused.

 

[Infinitron]

Yeah, not using Storm of Zehir's system because it fixes glaring issues like "this is the PCs story" sure makes up for not being able to have my Cypher party member help my stupid fighter with a mental challenge or whatever.

He might be able to help, but it would be a scripted interjection

 

[Rake]

Yeah, not using Storm of Zehir's system because it fixes glaring issues like "this is the PCs story" sure makes up for not being able to have my Cypher party member help my stupid fighter with a mental challenge or whatever.

Maybe your Cypher buddy will interject on his own? It just won't be your choice.

 

[tuluse]

Yeah, not using Storm of Zehir's system because it fixes glaring issues like "this is the PCs story" sure makes up for not being able to have my Cypher party member help my stupid fighter with a mental challenge or whatever.

Meh, it's no big deal, I just cannot fathom how they can make something so universally praised and just give up on it because the game is PC-focused.

You're not going to make a stupid fighter because you need that INT defense and other things because attributes are balanced.

 

[Grunker]

Yeah, not using Storm of Zehir's system because it fixes glaring issues like "this is the PCs story" sure makes up for not being able to have my Cypher party member help my stupid fighter with a mental challenge or whatever.

Maybe your Cypher buddy will interject on his own? It just won't be your choice.

I thought SoZ system was avoided because it would require to much work? Now you're telling me they will instead write unique dialogue interjections every single time an NPC can assist me?

 

[Lancehead]

No, it's not being used because it doesn't suit the game being made.

 

[Lancehead]

By the way, does the game have any party member influence system?

 

[Rake]

every single time

That is the key word.

 

[Surf Solar]

I've never played SoZ, what did that dialogue system looked like there?

 

[Excidium]

Yeah, not using Storm of Zehir's system because it fixes glaring issues like "this is the PCs story" sure makes up for not being able to have my Cypher party member help my stupid fighter with a mental challenge or whatever.

Meh, it's no big deal, I just cannot fathom how they can make something so universally praised and just give up on it because the game is PC-focused.

You're not going to make a stupid fighter because you need that INT defense and other things because attributes are balanced.

So attributes being balanced means you have to distribute points equally now?

wut

 

[tuluse]

That wasn't meant seriously.

 

[Roguey]

I thought SoZ system was avoided because it would require to much work? Now you're telling me they will instead write unique dialogue interjections every single time an NPC can assist me?

Assuming that's the case, it would still be less work than tailoring every possible dialogue node to suit every companion's personality.

Plus, being a personal story, I imagine some dialogues would involve characters speaking to your character specifically. It'd be pretty strange if companions could answer for you in those cases.

I've never played SoZ, what did that dialogue system looked like there?

 

[Grunker]

^ The speech bubbles notify that a given character has a relevant skill, btw.

 

[Surf Solar]

Hm, I am actually in favor of the approach P:E is doing...

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

I don't like the SoZ system either, kinda renders speech skills pointless when you have them all covered by party members, doesn't it?

 

[Hormalakh]

It's such bullcrap Out this whole "it's the pc's game, so only they should talk." Someone else called it schizophrenic and I tend to agree with them. We can control their inventory and how they expend their skill points, but nononono when it comes to dialogue, suddenly they are their own person.

There are more interesting ways to solve this problem. One way would be to ask your party members to talk in your stead. You could ask a certain party member to threaten/persuade or whatever in your stead. It could play out where you don't know exactly what they're going to say (a la obsidian's a other game AP) but you have an idea.

So many ways to bring in the other players into the convo, but nooooo they have to gimp it. Kind of getting tired of it.

 

[Infinitron]

One way would be to ask your party members to talk in your stead. You could ask a certain party member to threaten/persuade or whatever in your stead. It could play out where you don't know exactly what they're going to say (a la obsidian's a other game AP) but you have an idea.

So many ways to bring in the other players into the convo, but nooooo they have to gimp it. Kind of getting tired of it.

Ie, player-initiated scripted interjections, like in PS:T. What's the difference? Who says PE won't have these?

I don't like the SoZ system either, kinda renders speech skills pointless when you have them all covered by party members, doesn't it?

That's just a question of game balance. What if they can't be covered?

 

[Excidium]

I don't like the SoZ system either, kinda renders speech skills pointless when you have them all covered by party members, doesn't it?

No. More skills covered = more active choice

It's only pointless if the game uses the shit design for skill checks that makes them I WIN buttons, because then it doesn't matter which one you pick anyway.

 

[crawlkill]

unhhh can we stop using Icewind Dale as our baseline

 

[Surf Solar]

unhhh can we stop using Icewind Dale as our baseline

Why?

 

[crawlkill]

No. More skills covered = more active choice

so not the case in any absolute way. locking some dialogue options behind checks doesn't make a game more choozee or more reactive. it makes one playthrough differ more from another, sure, but only in a way the player doesn't usually even get to know about. one of my favorite game design moments in New Vegas was actually the goofy "YOU CAN'T USE THIS CHOICE" stat-too-low dialogue options.

 

[crawlkill]

unhhh can we stop using Icewind Dale as our baseline

Why?

because Icewind Dale was fucking awful