Vapourware Realms Beyond: Ashes of the Fallen - Chaos Chronicles reborn and dead again

[ArchAngel]

They talked about no multiclassing and why on their forums: https://www.realms-beyond.com/forum/index.php?topic=109

We will have prestige classes but not multi-classing. You can create your party with up to 6 members (covering 6 different classes) and multi-classing would be just too much extra development effort to implement.

But many of the prestige classes require you to multiclass first

 

[Roqua]

Otherwise it will be more like POR:ROMD than ToEE.

Ruins of Myth Drannor featured multi-classing.

I stand corrected. So, even POR: ROMD, the first 3ed game, had multiclassing. The only two "d&d" games that didn't I can think of then is KotC, which had good rpg content, and was a good indie game despite having only 3 classes, 3 races, no skills, etc. And SCL, which invented a toddler friendly made up version of D&D.

Myabe that portable tactics game? I played that after the last time I played POR:ROMD but I couldn't get into it, and if I forgot ROMD had it I can't trust my memory for that.

Either way, I think we can all agree multiclassing is a necessary and required feature for it to be at least as good as POR:ROMD, a game that taught us that not implementing a D&D system right can destroy your hard drive.

 

[Russia is over. The end.]

While you pussies try to eat out someone's ass as usual, I'll say it like it is.

This Alexa looks like what Sid Vicious would be if he did krokodile for 50 years.

Any white knight who says she's not an uggo gives himself away as a pathetic incel.

 

[Roqua]

While you pussies try to eat out someone's ass as usual, I'll say it like it is.

This Alexa looks like what Sid Vicious would be if he did krokodile for 50 years.

Any white knight who says she's not an uggo gives himself away as a pathetic incel.

I know, right! My standards are so high I wouldn't even fuck that dog Gal Gadot. My taste in women is so elite I can only masturbate to the children in Anime while my dog licks peanut butter off my balls. Real women are gross!

 

[daveyd]

They talked about no multiclassing and why on their forums: https://www.realms-beyond.com/forum/index.php?topic=109

We will have prestige classes but not multi-classing. You can create your party with up to 6 members (covering 6 different classes) and multi-classing would be just too much extra development effort to implement.

But many of the prestige classes require you to multiclass first

I'm going off of my memory of NWN 1 & 2 (which I know changed some stuff from 3.5 PnP), but I don't think many of the prestige classes Hobs mentioned as potential actually require multi-classing to meet the prerequisites (though it might be a good idea for some)... Eldritch Knight comes close (need 3rd level arcane spell & "Martial Weapons Proficiencies"), though from the wiki I gather NWN2 changed is slightly so a wizard / bard could just take martial weapon proficiencies as one feat if they don't want to take a level in a fighter class.

At least pre-reqs for Arcane Archer, Arcane, Blackguard, Dragon Disciple, Duelist, Dwarven Defender, and Shadowdancer can all be achieved with a single class. Would have to look up the others that Hobs mentioned as they aren't in NWN.. (Ok Arcane Trickster requires Sneak attack & Arcane Spells so that is one that would need MC). Of course, it's also possible Ceres could just change the prereqs for any of the prestige classes as they're changing wizards to be more like sorcerers.

However, I am pretty much at a loss as to why implemented multi-classing would significantly add to the development time. Wouldn't the only new things that really need to be implemented be "favored classes" for non-human races and the XP penalty if your characters who aren't Humans or Half-elves multi-class outside of those parameters... So unless I'm forgetting something, this doesn't seem like something that should be hard to implement...

Without bards and multclasses, I hope it will have some good magic warrior-like prestige classes

The prestige classes said to under consideration as of December are:

Arcane Archer, Arcane Trickster, Archmage, Assassin, Blackguard, Cerebremancer, Dragon Disciple, Duelist, Dwarven Defender, Eldritch Knight, Elocater, Hierophant, Horizon Walker, Loremaster, Metamind, Mystic Theurge, Psion Uncarnate, Psionic Fist, Pyrokineticist, Shadowdancer, Slayer, Thaumaturgist, Thrallherd, War Mind.

So yeah ,you'd have options for magic warrior builds.

 

[Reinhardt]

Tim Caine did it with barely any money and the shortest dev cycle in the history of game development.

Tims Caines are an endangered species.

 

[Goral]

Tim Caine did it with barely any money and the shortest dev cycle in the history of game development.

Tims Caines are an endangered species.

Well duh, they don't reproduce after all.

 

[ArchAngel]

They talked about no multiclassing and why on their forums: https://www.realms-beyond.com/forum/index.php?topic=109

We will have prestige classes but not multi-classing. You can create your party with up to 6 members (covering 6 different classes) and multi-classing would be just too much extra development effort to implement.

But many of the prestige classes require you to multiclass first

I'm going off of my memory of NWN 1 & 2 (which I know changed some stuff from 3.5 PnP), but I don't think many of the prestige classes Hobs mentioned as potential actually require multi-classing to meet the prerequisites (though it might be a good idea for some)... Eldritch Knight comes close (need 3rd level arcane spell & "Martial Weapons Proficiencies"), though from the wiki I gather NWN2 changed is slightly so a wizard / bard could just take martial weapon proficiencies as one feat if they don't want to take a level in a fighter class.

At least pre-reqs for Arcane Archer, Arcane, Blackguard, Dragon Disciple, Duelist, Dwarven Defender, and Shadowdancer can all be achieved with a single class. Would have to look up the others that Hobs mentioned as they aren't in NWN.. (Ok Arcane Trickster requires Sneak attack & Arcane Spells so that is one that would need MC). Of course, it's also possible Ceres could just change the prereqs for any of the prestige classes as they're changing wizards to be more like sorcerers.

However, I am pretty much at a loss as to why implemented multi-classing would significantly add to the development time. Wouldn't the only new things that really need to be implemented be "favored classes" for non-human races and the XP penalty if your characters who aren't Humans or Half-elves multi-class outside of those parameters... So unless I'm forgetting something, this doesn't seem like something that should be hard to implement...

Without bards and multclasses, I hope it will have some good magic warrior-like prestige classes

The prestige classes said to under consideration as of December are:

Arcane Archer, Arcane Trickster, Archmage, Assassin, Blackguard, Cerebremancer, Dragon Disciple, Duelist, Dwarven Defender, Eldritch Knight, Elocater, Hierophant, Horizon Walker, Loremaster, Metamind, Mystic Theurge, Psion Uncarnate, Psionic Fist, Pyrokineticist, Shadowdancer, Slayer, Thaumaturgist, Thrallherd, War Mind.

So yeah ,you'd have options for magic warrior builds.

Does not matter what NWN2 says, source rules they are using for Eldritch Knight say this:

Weapon Proficiency
Must be proficient with all martial weapons.

So no, you cannot be a wizard with just one feat.

Also many of these prestige classes are designed around multiclassing. Yea you can be bard 10/Dragon Disciple 10 but most players are going to multiclass that bard with fighter or barbarian first so they can take most advantage of the big bonuses to melee stats and armor that DD gives.
Then you got classes like Mystic Theurge that is Wizard/Cleric multiclass designed PRC for people that want to be both but not by lvl 10/10 and only have lvl5 spells. It is pointless without multiclassing.

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.realms-beyond.com/back-home-from-gamescom/

Back home from Gamescom
August 28, 2018

There and back again – is what we’d say about our adventure at the GamesCom!

We’re finally home again after an amazing week full of meeting new and old friends, planning, joking, being way too tired, feeling all sorts of overwhelming things, almost losing our voices and explaining what we are doing over and over again to you guys!



We want to give a very warm thank you to the company Trusted Events and their whole team for providing us with technical equipment at the Gamescom: A huge 60 inch TV, two lightning fast computers with peripherals , as well as two PC monitors. Also a big thanks for sharing the invaluable expertise in setting up exhibition booths at conventions, especially Gamescom. Special thanks go to the head of the company, Stefan Kinner, as well as Felix Fauner, Thomas Schäfer and Stefan Blöckinger for the intensive support, without which our appearance at Gamescon would not have been such a great success.

Finally, for everyone who couldn’t attend our booth in person, here’s our flyer (click on image for high-res version)

 

[santino27]

I'll be looking for the kickstarter in October.

 

[Tigranes]

I'm just hoping 'open-world' is just a bait and switch.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Needs a Kickstarter stretch goal for Guido Henkel to become head writer and the game to be renamed Realms of Arkania IV: Deathfire.

 

[V_K]

Needs a Kickstarter stretch goal for Guido Henkel to become head writer and the game to be renamed Realms of Arkania IV: Deathfire.

And switch to TDE system

 

[BEvers]

Explanation for no multiclassing: https://www.realms-beyond.com/forum/index.php?topic=109

Beside technical restrictions inside our code base, we haven't implemented the classic 3.5e multi-classing approach because we are working on our own prestige/advance class system which is more like the one in Wizardry 7 (my personal all-time favorite class system) than the known epic/prestige classes of D&D. We want to combine the branching specializations of Wizardry 7 with the D&D prestige/epic classes.
At the end, our advanced classes will be something unique and we will most likely use different names (and not those of D&D) for the classes to not confuse the player.

 

[Roqua]

Explanation for no multiclassing: https://www.realms-beyond.com/forum/index.php?topic=109

Beside technical restrictions inside our code base, we haven't implemented the classic 3.5e multi-classing approach because we are working on our own prestige/advance class system which is more like the one in Wizardry 7 (my personal all-time favorite class system) than the known epic/prestige classes of D&D. We want to combine the branching specializations of Wizardry 7 with the D&D prestige/epic classes.
At the end, our advanced classes will be something unique and we will most likely use different names (and not those of D&D) for the classes to not confuse the player.

Wiz7 had no prestige or advanced classes. They had classes that required higher stats you could roll from from the start, and some skills like the gun skill you opened up in game.

This is fucking retarded. Don't make a D&D game and claim its based on a specific edition and then don't put in core features and invent a bunch of different shit. This is looking less like ToEE and more like SCL. I'm really starting to wish I didn't get my hope for this up so much. I'll still back it since its better than nothing, but I'll back it while holding my nose up like an English aristocrat tipping a homeless stinky peasant beggar. If they just stuck to the fucking 3.5 ed rules I could do it with a big smile and a light heart.

 

[Infinitron]

Technically it's an OGL game, not a D&D game. Like Knights of the Chalice.

 

[Russia is over. The end.]

technical restrictions inside our code base

So open visual studio and change it. Problem?

 

[Roqua]

Technically it's an OGL game, not a D&D game. Like Knights of the Chalice.

The handout you posted above says, "A complex character system adapted from the 3.5ed SRD."

Playing cute and using language like "based on a true story" is just ridiculous. Use all the 3.5ed faithfully. Use your creativity for content, not fucking up the rpg system that sparked the fucking interest in the game for everyone. If you want to use a made up system then make up your own system. Don't bastardize a good thing.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

adapted from the 3.5ed SRD

Adapting the ruleset is exactly what's happening innit?

 

[Roqua]

adapted from the 3.5ed SRD

Adapting the ruleset is exactly what's happening innit?

Playing cute and using language like "based on a true story" is just ridiculous.

Use your creativity for content, not fucking up the rpg system that sparked the fucking interest in the game for everyone. If you want to use a made up system then make up your own system. Don't bastardize a good thing.

I don't want another Sword Coats Legends and made up systems. They should put their energy into the game's content. Not destroying 3.5ed.

What initially sparked interest in this game? 3.5ed. Not made up edition lightly based on 3.5ed.

 

[ArchAngel]

adapted from the 3.5ed SRD

Adapting the ruleset is exactly what's happening innit?

Playing cute and using language like "based on a true story" is just ridiculous.

Use your creativity for content, not fucking up the rpg system that sparked the fucking interest in the game for everyone. If you want to use a made up system then make up your own system. Don't bastardize a good thing.

I don't want another Sword Coats Legends and made up systems. They should put their energy into the game's content. Not destroying 3.5ed.

What initially sparked interest in this game? 3.5ed. Not made up edition lightly based on 3.5ed.

You are overreacting. They are only changing how PRC work. Instead of having multiclass and PRC from books I guess you will choose a few paths for base classes that will be a combination of common multiclass and PRC used for those classes. Seems to be something like how D&D 5 works, but you will get into advanced classes at higher levels than in D&D 5.

Like for Rogue, people never stay pure Rogue, they either multiclass with Fighter, Ranger or Wizard (and then go into the PRC). They can just make 3-4 advanced classes for Rogue and it will be very similar to how 3.5e works.

 

[Roqua]

adapted from the 3.5ed SRD

Adapting the ruleset is exactly what's happening innit?

Playing cute and using language like "based on a true story" is just ridiculous.

Use your creativity for content, not fucking up the rpg system that sparked the fucking interest in the game for everyone. If you want to use a made up system then make up your own system. Don't bastardize a good thing.

I don't want another Sword Coats Legends and made up systems. They should put their energy into the game's content. Not destroying 3.5ed.

What initially sparked interest in this game? 3.5ed. Not made up edition lightly based on 3.5ed.

You are overreacting. They are only changing how PRC work. Instead of having multiclass and PRC from books I guess you will choose a few paths for base classes that will be a combination of common multiclass and PRC used for those classes. Seems to be something like how D&D 5 works, but you will get into advanced classes at higher levels than in D&D 5.

Like for Rogue, people never stay pure Rogue, they either multiclass with Fighter, Ranger or Wizard (and then go into the PRC). They can just make 3-4 advanced classes for Rogue and it will be very similar to how 3.5e works.

Like I said -

I'll still back it since its better than nothing, but I'll back it while holding my nose up like an English aristocrat tipping a homeless stinky peasant beggar. If they just stuck to the fucking 3.5 ed rules I could do it with a big smile and a light heart.

And people said a lot of things like you are with regards to the modified system of 5e Sword Coast Legends used.

Its the old bait and switch.

 

[daveyd]

Well, look at this way, if this game gets funded and released and is decent mechanically (i.e., not a buggy mess) then it will very likely have modders. Even if it is buggy / broken we can hope there will be modders. And it is very likely that some of these modders will be grognards who feel D&D 3.5 should be sacrosanct so they will mod the game to follow it to the letter. Considering all of the people here saying "it shouldn't be that hard to implement", this should be doable.

But shit, if you want an official D&D game, complain to WotC about how much SCL sucked and they should've at least made a TB tactical game that didn't dumb down / change their ruleset. Or you know, play ToEE with Co8 mods because that's already a thing.

I can see both pros and cons to the way Ceres is doing it. On the one hand, it somewhat takes away players freedom to build the character they want, which generally seems bad. But it also makes your party members a little more special(ized), which is someone I kinda like about the older editions of D&D. And prestige classes will be all the more "prestigious" as they'll be the only way to get some multi-class like builds. Ceres can also modify them to fit into what lore is unique to their world. Since this isn't an official D&D game, the gods will have to be different. Perhaps there will be a special prestige class for clerics / paladins / followers of a certain god; something like Stormlords (Talos) , Doom Guide (Kelemvor), or Heartwarder (Sune)... but you know, unique to RB. Just because it's not D&D doesn't mean it won't be interesting.

At the very least, I'd like to see how they handle these before grabbing my torch and pitchfork.

 

[Big Wrangle]

All it needs is to be less buggy than Temple of Elemental Evil AFAIK.

 

[ArchAngel]

adapted from the 3.5ed SRD

Adapting the ruleset is exactly what's happening innit?

Playing cute and using language like "based on a true story" is just ridiculous.

Use your creativity for content, not fucking up the rpg system that sparked the fucking interest in the game for everyone. If you want to use a made up system then make up your own system. Don't bastardize a good thing.

I don't want another Sword Coats Legends and made up systems. They should put their energy into the game's content. Not destroying 3.5ed.

What initially sparked interest in this game? 3.5ed. Not made up edition lightly based on 3.5ed.

You are overreacting. They are only changing how PRC work. Instead of having multiclass and PRC from books I guess you will choose a few paths for base classes that will be a combination of common multiclass and PRC used for those classes. Seems to be something like how D&D 5 works, but you will get into advanced classes at higher levels than in D&D 5.

Like for Rogue, people never stay pure Rogue, they either multiclass with Fighter, Ranger or Wizard (and then go into the PRC). They can just make 3-4 advanced classes for Rogue and it will be very similar to how 3.5e works.

Like I said -

I'll still back it since its better than nothing, but I'll back it while holding my nose up like an English aristocrat tipping a homeless stinky peasant beggar. If they just stuck to the fucking 3.5 ed rules I could do it with a big smile and a light heart.

And people said a lot of things like you are with regards to the modified system of 5e Sword Coast Legends used.

Its the old bait and switch.

Why are you still mentioning SCL, those modifications were extensive. They basically only kept party play and names of classes, everything else was different.
If you watched any of the gameplay videos from RB, it is clear this game is very true to D&D rules.