Codex Review RPG Codex Review: Disco Elysium

[Van-d-all]

Puzzles are required to demonstrate that it's not a visual novel, but actually has gameplay, you know, the G in the RPG. As for the rest, those are the claims developers make about their game. Since we have so many experts who supposedly understood DE better than I do, I'd love to hear an explanation for why I didn't find these features anywhere.

Gameplay is not inherent to puzzle solving. It also involves plot exploration, decision making, and overcoming challenges. Plot exploration is self explanatory, the plot is presented to the player piece by piece as he PROCEEDS through the game. Decision making in Disco obviously involves NPC interaction and with whom to talk, if at all, and what to say to them; this part of the game determines choices what information should be given and withheld, and whose help the player wishes to employ, the game REACTS accordingly. Overcoming challenges is a bit more nuanced, but is best exemplified by criminal investigation elements such as getting the hangman from the tree or entering the harbor, which can be ACHIEVED by variety of means. Gameplay means player - game interaction.

If someone wants to go over the so-called roleplaying options in this game, I'll be happy to hear an answer as for why maxing strength makes me roleplay a pharmaceutical researcher. I have been to many pharmacies and never saw Conan The Barbarian behind the counter, but perhaps it's different in Estonia.

I wrote it before, but the game lets you roleplay the ego of late stage alcoholic cop at battle with other parts of his own psyche. The numerical systems within the game, unlike other games, are not absolute for all NPCs as a whole, but fractional and represent the possible limits of Harry's body & mind, and as such 1 means Harry at his worst, and 6 at his best, whilst both still rely on his basic faculties, which simply include a certain base degree of knowledge, acumen or physical prowess. The persona you create resides not among other NPCs, but within the mind of one such character, therefore, your stats represent the prominence of his various impulses. So essentially, your character always had such knowledge, the numbers determine whether his barely functioning organism is able to perform a given task at a given time.

All in all I find this whole nonRPG debacle a sad testament of codexian reactionary conservatism, against a rare game that actually tries to present a unique RPG experience contrary to the stale combatfag cRPG formula.

 

[Prime Junta]

All in all I find this whole nonRPG debacle a sad testament of codexian reactionary conservatism, against a rare game that actually tries to present a unique RPG experience contrary to the stale combatfag cRPG formula.

The Codex has always been like that though. There's the reactionary party, the progressive party, the centrist party, the let's-have-a-party, and the party-pooper party. Be sure to be aware of which party you're dealing with at any given time and your life will be somewhat more tolerable.

 

[Van-d-all]

All in all I find this whole nonRPG debacle a sad testament of codexian reactionary conservatism, against a rare game that actually tries to present a unique RPG experience contrary to the stale combatfag cRPG formula.

The Codex has always been like that though. There's the reactionary party, the progressive party, the centrist party, the let's-have-a-party, and the party-pooper party. Be sure to be aware of which party you're dealing with at any given time and your life will be somewhat more tolerable.

I know, it's just that reactionism rubs me the wrong fucking way. It's the same kind of rhetoric that negated steam engine or automobiles. With mindset like that people would still be living in caves.

 

[Prime Junta]

I know, it's just that reactionism rubs me the wrong fucking way. It's the same kind of rhetoric that negated steam engine or automobiles. With mindset like that people would still be living in caves.

I agree, but it's not time to shoot all of them yet.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

I found myself liking Disco Elysium a lot, even more than I expected. And that's despise the insufferable hipster undertones that undeniably emerge here and there.
At times it also made me genuinely laugh out loud.

Still, every time I come to to Codex and find Prime Junta shilling relentlessly for it I feel to the urge to take a giant dump on the game's box.
Figuratively, of course. Who the fuck even buys boxes anymore.

 

[Van-d-all]

Figuratively, of course. Who the fuck even buys boxes anymore.

There's no box version in the first place.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

Oh for sure, we might as well talk about Might in Pillars of Eternity. Far as I recall, the problem people had with it, is that it was a gamey solution that was impending their ability to roleplay and high Might Priest bending iron bards with their bare hands in Raedrik's Hold was breaking their immersiun. And Disco Elysium does the same thing with numerous inconsistencies of it's gamey poorly constructed ruleset. The most obvious thing is how every attribute has its own "precognition" skill that does roughly the same thing with 4 different names, because that's the only way they could feed a lot of necessary contextual information through dialogue.

 

[Van-d-all]

we might as well talk about Might in Pillars of Eternity

Who gives a fuck about Pillars of Eternity though?

 

[bataille]

If someone wants to go over the so-called roleplaying options in this game, I'll be happy to hear an answer as for why maxing strength makes me roleplay a pharmaceutical researcher. I have been to many pharmacies and never saw Conan The Barbarian behind the counter, but perhaps it's different in Estonia.

But Conan wasn't stupid: he possessed a certain slyness, he was cunning, he had a set of roguish skills. He was adept at dealing with the material problems, because of course he was: the axe is not the alpha and the omega of solving everything on the physical plane.

Electrochemistry as a phys skill is only confusing to you because you conflate the subordinate aspect (strength) with the parent category (physicality). For anyone who has interacted the more grounded and visceral people that shouldn't be surprising. My more "down-to-earth" friends always pleasantly surprise me when it comes to their knowledge of the material, the bodily, the medicinal, or the everyday. On the other hand, the spiritual, intellectual, or logical people are blind as kittens when it comes to that stuff. So I'm not sure why you keep repeating the same sentiment instead of assessing it at least somewhat critically. Games don't have to make sense in the worldly way, but this side of Disco Elysium does make it.

 

[Crescent Hawk]

"It’s not very clear how to proceed from this point forward, but god knows, the medium needed this wake-up call."

Obsidian knows, its with more asexual lesbians.

 

[Tigranes]

it tracks character state and world state, it's not focused on puzzles, the mechanics are stat and RNG based, and items give stat boosts rather than being used to solve puzzles.

Is True Love a RPG?

I thought Princess Maker 2 was one of Codex's golden games

 

[Alienman]

Everything is an RPG.

 

[Valky]

Why the fuck does this digital CYOA even have the honor of getting a pinned codex review at all.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

I refer to genre characteristics, not genre categories. It is fallacious to think of genres as mutually exclusive categories. Such are only needed for marketing purposes. Things can belong to multiple genres at the same time, depending on the particular mix of characteristics they have.

“Is X a RPG?” is a fundamentally stupid question. “Does X have RPG characteristics?” is a much more intelligent one and leads to followups that can further deepen understanding.

It would only be a fundamentally stupid question to ask "Is X a RPG" if you were using a stupid definition of RPG (e.g. "any game where I play a role"). However, if we define the RPG genre by its mechanics, as any monocled individual would, then the two questions are identical. If you can identify "RPG characteristics", "adventure game characteristics", "cover-based shooter characteristics", et cetera, then you have also identified the RPG genre, the adventure game genre, the cover-based shooter genre, and so on and so forth. Of course, some particular characteristics are a fundamental component of multiple genres, but the genres themselves are useful in describing games and how they differ from each other. If you want to be true to your position that genre categories do not exist, then you should stop using the term "RPG" altogether, because it isn't any more meaningful to refer to "RPG characteristics" than it is to refer to RPGs.

Moreover, Disco Elysium is lacking many of the fundamental characteristics of RPGs, but it does have commonality with CYOA, which is why I think it should fall under the (new?) genre of digital gamebook.

Why the fuck does this digital CYOA even have the honor of getting a pinned codex review at all.

Disco Elysium is good great for what it is, but many people will be inevitably disappointed if they expect an RPG.

 

[agentorange]

game looks gay

 

[Prime Junta]

It would only be a fundamentally stupid question to ask "Is X a RPG" if you were using a stupid definition of RPG (e.g. "any game where I play a role"). However, if we define the RPG genre by its mechanics, as any monocled individual would, then the two questions are identical.

But there’s the rub: I reject the entire concept of genres as categories, other than as part of a pragmatic filing system, like in a shop or a library. And I’m not at all interested in filing systems, I’m not a librarian. I.e. we part ways at your “if:” I do not accept that there is any other than situationally useful definition of “the RPG genre” or indeed any genre at all.

Arguing about categorising a game teaches us nothing. It just leads to “but what is a RPG” which is just as pointless and futile.

Instead, ask “what are RPG qualities?” and “which RPG qualities does this game have and how are they expressed?” and we might actually learn something interesting.

“Is X a RPG?” THE FUCK DOES CUNTA CARE!

 

[AwesomeButton]

"It’s not very clear how to proceed from this point forward, but god knows, the medium needed this wake-up call."

Obsidian knows, its with more asexual lesbians.

Obsidian is dead and buried.

 

[lobsterfrogman]

Everything is an RPG.

No, it's a game for casuals.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/582270/Everything/

 

[ERYFKRAD]

If this elf deviant bataille does not get a chance to review Death Stranding, this world ain't fair.

 

[Deleted Member 22431]

But there’s the rub: I reject the entire concept of genres as categories, other than as part of a pragmatic filing system, like in a shop or a library.

 

[Prime Junta]

 

[Galdred]

What? DE may not be a "full-fledged RPG" (if RPGs require robust combat systems; there are occasional fights of a limited sort in the game), but it has not even the faintest resemblance to CYOA books, which don't track variables. Even the very, very limited number of gamebooks that tracked character stats (in a very, very limited way) didn't track world-state variables. And none of them had anything resembling dialogue.

Actually, Fabled Lands did track worl state (through the use of keywords).

It was pretty inconsistent (but no more than Morrowind which let you become heads of several guilds simultaneously, without someone ever really caring about it), and the mechanical problems of the approach became apparent too quickly (basically, most places have to be "unrelated" and most events depend upon a single keyword), butgiven the limitations of the medium, it is a pretty good attempt at "open world" gamebook.

 

[simtam]

It's tempting to define what computer RPG is by mechanics, but it's better to use mechanics to review them, while defining them as games inspired by pen&paper role-playing games (tabletop or live-action), and/or inspired by other computer RPGs.

Looking that way, DE falls more into the former than the latter. The scarcity of combat isn't an issue, the amount of violence is just what I would expect to find in an average Dick Mullen Scandinavian crime fiction novel.

DE differs from a table-top role-playing game session, though, in that in DE the GM "speaks in lists", to borrow the accusation that the game throws at the protagonist via a singular NPC.

A Fallout crpg could have a secret quest solution that would be accomplished by planting some evidence on an NPC (with reverse pickpocket). iI DE such an action would be listed in the conversation tree with the NPC, or behind the "interact" button for the planted item. Thus, no longer a secret.

There's little to stop players from solving the game by trying out every possible dialogue option, punishments for doing that while skipping on reading what the game describes you in the text are mostly minor setbacks. Most likely if you later arrive at an dialogue option that comes off as surprising to you, it is a valid option and you just missed reading something, rather than a dialogue landmine designed to trap players who don't read.

I guess that's enough to review DE as a CYOA game. That doesn't deny that there are attributes and skills that shape the game conversations, of course. It's just that those are opposite qualities: CYOA game <---> puzzle adventure game.

 

[Maggot]

gay game and gay review

 

[MasPingon]

gay game and gay review

Glad you like it.