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Skyrim is worse than Oblivion in every way

Mozgoëbstvo

Learned
Joined
Nov 23, 2011
Messages
812
Location
Od Vardara pa do Triglava
Ok.

But it still technically unsound, since whatever you do on a computer isn't live action.

At least, wait until TESXVII for that.
 

hiver

Guest
Well, i finally went and tried to go through one of the guilds main quests.

Me and the main theif guy went to search for some rogue theif woman who is a danger to the whole guild.
We go to this far draugr crypt and fight through huge numbers of high level drugr. I die several times but manage to cheese through it all finally.

We get into a part where this rogue thief supposedly just waits for us to kill her.
We go in - i get shot by some sort of poisonous scripted arrow, fall down and then i watch them two talk to each other revealing that the rogue is actually good and my thief guy is actually the bad guy.
She goes invisible after that retarded exposition ends and runs away and my thief guy comes to me and stabs me with a sword to kill me ... completely i guess.

And then i wake up somewhere outside with that rogue chick and she tells me how her poisoned arrow saved my life... and im all what the fucking fuck... because that poison something slowed down my heart beat .... so getting stabbed with a sword like didnt work...

and im all... what the fucking fuck im suffering here.... what the fuck is this shit???

and she tells me how she just knew i was alright and thats she saved my life in that completely retarded way...
and then im just fine and we are allies and im supposed to go after that guy now.
and my head hurts and i havent started the game since then...

and if i paid any money for this shit i would be puking now.
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
7,348
Sounds just like Bethesda, why even bother being surprised about it? Worlds in every game of theirs are nothing but huge insane asylums.
 

Wyrmlord

Arcane
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
28,886
Oh yeah, that Mercer Frey guy from the Thieves Guild.

I liked his taunts.

YOUR END IS NEEEEAAAAAAAR!
 

Wyrmlord

Arcane
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
28,886
I liked the Thieves Guild quest.

It was pretentious, had cheesy characters, and involved a silly daedric connection to everything that was happening.

It also culminates in two of the better designed dungeons in the game - one dwarven and one daedric, with hordes of enemies battled by you and two allies.
 

Gord

Arcane
Joined
Feb 16, 2011
Messages
7,049
Yeah, on the whole the thieves guild quest was nice, although I would have liked some more choice, but well...

I did like the integration of the random quest stuff that gave you improvements of the guild if you did enough of them.
 

hiver

Guest
well atleast this gives me a good reason to put more idiots on ignore list.
 

My Name is

Novice
Joined
Dec 12, 2011
Messages
11
Wyrmlord said:
Metagaming is bad, obviously, but don't many RPGs have corrections to prevent them?

If you are playing World of Xeen and you know in advance which powerful item is to be found where, you will still not go there, because the enemies will instantly kill you.

It is (sort of) the same in Skyrim, in which it is a bad idea for a Level 1 character to be wandering around too freely on foot. He will not survive fighting two necromancers simultaneously. Or the first Hagraven that spots him.

"The same"? Nope, It's totally different since almost all fixed loot is mediocre stuff and quest rewards/boss chests are scaled to your level. There is no way you can find anything uber as a low level even if you can kill anything you meet.
 

Wyrmlord

Arcane
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
28,886
My Name is said:
Wyrmlord said:
Metagaming is bad, obviously, but don't many RPGs have corrections to prevent them?

If you are playing World of Xeen and you know in advance which powerful item is to be found where, you will still not go there, because the enemies will instantly kill you.

It is (sort of) the same in Skyrim, in which it is a bad idea for a Level 1 character to be wandering around too freely on foot. He will not survive fighting two necromancers simultaneously. Or the first Hagraven that spots him.

"The same"? Nope, It's totally different since almost all fixed loot is mediocre stuff and quest rewards/boss chests are scaled to your level. There is no way you can find anything uber as a low level even if you can kill anything you meet.
As a low level character, you can certainly craft 10 levels ahead of the loot curve. With my first character, I had a full Dwarwen suit before I even reached Level 15.
 

Edwin

Scholar
Joined
Sep 15, 2011
Messages
395
Location
Athkatla
My first character is currently level 59 and I just reached 93 smithing.Thats how long it takes to level up smithing just from the ore you mine without focusig on mining exclusively or exploiting the system with fast traveling/waiting and buying all kinds of ores(alchemy 49,enchanting 74).

Its like complaining about OPness of the cluaconsole cheats in baldurs gate 2.If you intentionally exploit game mechanisms to create a godmode character very early in the game thats not the games fault.I dont mind such "features" in a single player game,at least the retards can have fun too.I dont get why it bothers you(and others),this is not an MMO so nobody forces you to you to use unbalanced spells(like walking around with 2 thalmor wizard thralls),items or to powerlevel crafting.
 

markec

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Croatia
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Edwin said:
My first character is currently level 59 and I just reached 93 smithing.Thats how long it takes to level up smithing just from the ore you mine without focusig on mining exclusively or exploiting the system with fast traveling/waiting and buying all kinds of ores(alchemy 49,enchanting 74).

Its like complaining about OPness of the cluaconsole cheats in baldurs gate 2.If you intentionally exploit game mechanisms to create a godmode character very early in the game thats not the games fault.I dont mind such "features" in a single player game,at least the retards can have fun too.I dont get why it bothers you(and others),this is not an MMO so nobody forces you to you to use unbalanced spells(like walking around with 2 thalmor wizard thralls),items or to powerlevel crafting.

Of all things being criticized about Skyrim you decide to defend something which is so obviously broken. Hey I play as a mage and after 50+ levels I still didint get my smithing skill to 100 so it must mean its not broken?
Look genius the problem is that crafting a iron dagger and deadric axe upgrades the skill in the same amount which is stupid and there is no excuse for it, so dont try to make one because you just make yourself look stupid.
 

tennishero

Novice
Joined
Jan 9, 2011
Messages
404
skyrim is awesome

best rpg in years- beth dont get enough credit for what they do

the writing isnt upto MCA standards but MCA is an acquired taste and beth has to cater to 10+ million gamers

if you werent a hater youd appreciate skyrim for what it is

a major incline for bethesda
 

tennishero

Novice
Joined
Jan 9, 2011
Messages
404
WTF did you expect

MCA isn't working for bethesda

bioware are shit

obsidian only have one good game on their resume (new vegas)

the indie gaming scene is stagnant and shit

best game i played all year was portal 2
giving out props is not something i like to do, but gabe made a fucking good game- then released free DLC and is making a level editor will make portal 2 the greatest game ever as far as im concerned
so gabe- here's a cookie you majestic son of a bitch- keep up the good work (release half life 3 already!)

halo reach is still the best FPS ever made but half life 2 is easily in second place which tells you how shit the FPS scene is right now
- motherfucking call of duty with its quick scoping and its hming bullets on even the pistol (no im not ragings because i suck- im raging because after 5 minutes i could beat elite gamers by exploiting the shitty quick scope)


skyrim is good-
just one of those facts youll have to deal with

Hitler sponsored the creation of israel
Zionists fed the nazi's jew sympathisers
Zionists actively killed holocaust survivors when they did move to israel
zionists control the federal reserve and 90% of the media

if it makes you butt hurt then dont read
 

Serious_Business

Best Poster on the Codex
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Aug 21, 2007
Messages
3,911
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Frown Town
Yeah tell me more about that

Let's be serious here, the point in Skyrim is to level up and get better gear, like all Elder Scrolls game. To do that you join guilds, explore dungeons, and complete quests. The rest is fluff and not worth talking about, unless - you know it - you're a faggot.

Does Skyrim succeed at what it's out to do then? Well, after playing it about 20 hours, I'll say yes and no. It has better gameplay than previous Elder Scrolls games - the levelling feels more natural, the dungeons are bigger (if linear - but I'm not a big fan of Daggerfall randomly generated dungeons), the combat is more fluid. The skill tree system is an improvement, and even though the options are more limited, I find that it improves the gameplay overall (we could argue this for a while but I'm not going to). The problem however can be summed up in one word - level scaling. It still plagues this game. It's not as atrocious as Oblivion as I understand it (didn't play that game much), but I think it still pretty much ruins the exploration in this game.

Sure in a way this is more of an action game than anything, so having no level scaling would mean no challenge, which would become boring fast. But this element of the game breaks the other element which is the reward-based gameplay ; levelling up effectively makes you weaker in this game. Sure, this isn't absolute - you can't take on the huge ennemies at level 1, so this is good - but there's still enough level scaling to make every dungeon you go into a pain. You'll never feel much difference, unless you face the exact same ennemy at a greater level, which doesn't happen that often.

Maybe it's because I played a melee guy on Master difficulty, which was the worst idea ever, and got tired of it, I don't know. But with this problem here, we can safely say that "mod will fix it". A anti level scaling mod would be great and would transform the game into a great sandbox rpg.
 

Papa Môlé

Arcane
Joined
Dec 30, 2011
Messages
1,812
Location
Voodoo Hell
Yeah tell me more about that

Let's be serious here, the point in Skyrim is to level up and get better gear, like all Elder Scrolls game. To do that you join guilds, explore dungeons, and complete quests. The rest is fluff and not worth talking about, unless - you know it - you're a faggot.

Does Skyrim succeed at what it's out to do then? Well, after playing it about 20 hours, I'll say yes and no. It has better gameplay than previous Elder Scrolls games - the levelling feels more natural, the dungeons are bigger (if linear - but I'm not a big fan of Daggerfall randomly generated dungeons), the combat is more fluid. The skill tree system is an improvement, and even though the options are more limited, I find that it improves the gameplay overall (we could argue this for a while but I'm not going to). The problem however can be summed up in one word - level scaling. It still plagues this game. It's not as atrocious as Oblivion as I understand it (didn't play that game much), but I think it still pretty much ruins the exploration in this game.

Sure in a way this is more of an action game than anything, so having no level scaling would mean no challenge, which would become boring fast. But this element of the game breaks the other element which is the reward-based gameplay ; levelling up effectively makes you weaker in this game. Sure, this isn't absolute - you can't take on the huge ennemies at level 1, so this is good - but there's still enough level scaling to make every dungeon you go into a pain. You'll never feel much difference, unless you face the exact same ennemy at a greater level, which doesn't happen that often.

Maybe it's because I played a melee guy on Master difficulty, which was the worst idea ever, and got tired of it, I don't know. But with this problem here, we can safely say that "mod will fix it". A anti level scaling mod would be great and would transform the game into a great sandbox rpg.

This post strikes me as both frivolous and recreational.
 

potatojohn

Arcane
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
2,646
Skyrim's "master" is very misleading because there's nothing to really master. It's just a 300% increase in tedium.
 

roll-a-die

Magister
Joined
Sep 27, 2009
Messages
3,131
Yeah tell me more about that

Let's be serious here, the point in Skyrim is to level up and get better gear, like all Elder Scrolls game. To do that you join guilds, explore dungeons, and complete quests. The rest is fluff and not worth talking about, unless - you know it - you're a faggot.
I agree slightly, except they took out a major way of customizing things, that is an unrestricted enchanting system, so essentially unless you glitch the system and fuck around with enchanting gloves with +X alchemy, then making potions of enchanting, then making gloves of +X Alchemy, etc, basically doing the same glitch that was in Morrowind. You are stuck with the gear the dev intended. Which means that after you progress to a certain point there's no room to progress further.
Does Skyrim succeed at what it's out to do then? Well, after playing it about 20 hours, I'll say yes and no. It has better gameplay than previous Elder Scrolls games - the levelling feels more natural, the dungeons are bigger (if linear - but I'm not a big fan of Daggerfall randomly generated dungeons), the combat is more fluid. The skill tree system is an improvement, and even though the options are more limited, I find that it improves the gameplay overall (we could argue this for a while but I'm not going to). The problem however can be summed up in one word - level scaling. It still plagues this game. It's not as atrocious as Oblivion as I understand it (didn't play that game much), but I think it still pretty much ruins the exploration in this game.
Combat is indeed more fluid, however, the addition of shouts, and certain spell effects, makes combat fairly trivial if you are decent with the system. If they were aiming for better balance and more fluid combat, force push wouldn't send enemies flying forcing you to chase their rag dolling corpse and likely arriving just as they get up, rendering the use of it mostly ineffective. The force speed shout wouldn't end up with you having to turn around when you aimed directly at an enemy.

The skill tree system is a clusterfuck, with most perks amounting to 20% increases in x category which could have just been rolled into a skill, with a little pull out bar explaining the effects of raising it as far as you have. More than that a level hardcap(level stops when X occurs), or a level soft limit(Leveling becomes too tedious to go on when X occurs), would enable you to have the same balance of perk powers, without having to clutter up the UI.

Moreover the removal of birthsigns in favor of the stones, adds an interesting quandary, you literally have no customization of your character beyond race at character creation.
Sure in a way this is more of an action game than anything, so having no level scaling would mean no challenge,
Lol what. Elaborate for the masses please.
which would become boring fast. But this element of the game breaks the other element which is the reward-based gameplay ; levelling up effectively makes you weaker in this game. Sure, this isn't absolute - you can't take on the huge ennemies at level 1,
Except you can take on giants and mammoths at level 1, you just have to stand on a rock high enough they can't hit you.
so this is good - but there's still enough level scaling to make every dungeon you go into a pain. You'll never feel much difference, unless you face the exact same ennemy at a greater level, which doesn't happen that often.
Indeed
Maybe it's because I played a melee guy on Master difficulty, which was the worst idea ever, and got tired of it, I don't know. But with this problem here, we can safely say that "mod will fix it". A anti level scaling mod would be great and would transform the game into a great sandbox rpg.
Not really, environments are blander than Oblivion. Snowy area with pine trees, snowy area without trees, not snowy area with trees, not snowy area without trees, there's Skyrim's main regions summarized. That's the core of the issue, it's like sitting in front of a bowl filled with 2 pounds of oatmeal, it will get you full, but in the end, you'd really rather have a 2 pound steak or equivalent delicacy
 

Chip

Educated
Joined
Nov 9, 2006
Messages
41
I liked the Thieves Guild quest.

It was pretentious, had cheesy characters, and involved a silly daedric connection to everything that was happening.

It also culminates in two of the better designed dungeons in the game - one dwarven and one daedric, with hordes of enemies battled by you and two allies.
Makes sense, wouldn't want the thieves guild questline to end with sneaking or stealing or anything remotely thieflike.
 

DraQ

Arcane
Joined
Oct 24, 2007
Messages
32,828
Location
Chrząszczyżewoszyce, powiat Łękołody
Yeah tell me more about that

Let's be serious here, the point in Skyrim is to level up and get better gear, like all Elder Scrolls game.
Except this is the area where all TES games have been traditionally very shitty, due to broken, exploitable mechanics. So no, you ar wrong. And edumb.

The point of TES games has always been to customize shit out of everything, from your looks (the only area where Skyrim actually allows proper customization), to style of your armour, to enchantments, to spells you were using, to quirks and flaws (Daggerfall only).

The other point of TES games has been messing around with shit like expansive spellmaking, enchanting, multitude of magic effects and wide opportunities to affect all kinds of stuff through mechanics, even if the mechanics itself was broken and leaky. Well, Skyrim lacks spellmaking, opportunities and expansivity parts. Derp.

Final point of TES games has been exploration and lore (at least as of Morrowind). I'm not commenting on those, since I still haven't played Skyrim nearly enough, although so far it seems to be a huge improvement from oblivious (then again, oblivious was definite rock bottom).

Does Skyrim succeed at what it's out to do then? Well, after playing it about 20 hours, I'll say yes and no. It has better gameplay than previous Elder Scrolls games
Well, TES gameplay consisted of exploration and messing around. Skyrim lacks the latter and may end up lacking former, so it isn't an improvement over previous TES just like an FPS wouldn't be an improvement over Wizardry 8's gameplay, despite more dynamic flow and not nearly as drawn out battles.
:troll:

Moreover the removal of birthsigns in favor of the stones, adds an interesting quandary, you literally have no customization of your character beyond race at character creation.
Indeed. And it's a "what." grade idiocy.


Except you can take on giants and mammoths at level 1, you just have to stand on a rock high enough they can't hit you.
Which is a common problem in TES games at least from Daggerfall onwards.

Not really, environments are blander than Oblivion.
This is physically impossible. Even Daggerfall had less bland environments than oblivious, and yes, I'm speaking of exteriors here.
 

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