Baldur's Gate The Baldur's Gate Series Thread

[chuft]

I could use the tweak that lets clerics use edged weapons. Then Tiax could backstab. Assuming I did a reinstall and a fresh game, which I am tempted to do, since something is obviously wrong with Jaheira's hit points, levels and XP.

 

[Dzupakazul]

I could use the tweak that lets clerics use edged weapons. Then Tiax could backstab. Assuming I did a reinstall and a fresh game, which I am tempted to do, since something is obviously wrong with Jaheira's hit points, levels and XP.

Tiax already can backstab. Moreover, Tiax can backstab with the best backstabbing weapon in the game - the Staff of Striking. He can buff his Strength for a solid boost to THAC0 and some additional damage (although bonus damage from Strength is applied after backstab damage calculation!) with his Cleric spells. Aside from the limited charges on the SoS, any Thief can pick up and enjoy the backstab from Aule's Staff +3 (purchasable at Ulgoth's) or the Staff Mace, both of which enjoy solid damage dice. Tiax very well might be one of the best backstabbers in the game - he's stuck with x3 damage, but has solid tools to support this playstyle (single-classed Thieves and dualled Shar-Teel get to hit the x4 multiplier, and the latter benefits from Fighter specialization from the potential dual; Montaron is also missing out on the x4); the only issue a lot of people have is that it's a little bit hard to imagine a staff backstab. Probably a Garrettesque bonk to the head, but with a weapon that's a little bit hard to conceal. (Tiax can also backstab with Clubs - blackjack, anyone? - but clubs are rather crappy in vanilla BG1; Enhanced Edition adds a magical one in Cloakwood).

Rule of thumb for determining whether something can or cannot backstab is whether the weapon is 1) melee and 2) belongs to a weapon type that a single-classed Thief would be able to wield. This doesn't include Use Any Item, so the Scarlet Ninja-To or Staff of the Magi, which belong to the Scimitar and Staff category respectively, can't backstab because they're Monk and Mage weapons respectively. There are some weird exceptions to this rule, as a Mage/Thief who uses Polymorph Self to turn into an Ogre is capable of backstabbing (at 18/00 Strength with a 2d4 weapon, not bad) even though the polymorphed form uses a Morning Star. This might not work in every version of the game, as I do not know if the Enhanced Edition or a fixpack changes this.

EDIT: Also, for fun: in the EE, Alora's lucky rabbit foot gives her a flat +2 to every roll. This includes THAC0 and damage rolls; this synergizes well with darts and possibly items that roll two dice for damage (like the Staff Mace), but is also a very nice boon to potential backstabs.

 

[Shadenuat]

EE just kinda adds 2 clubs early, +1 and +2, so not big deal.

I don't remember if you can backstab with staves in vanilla bg 1 tho.

 

[Dzupakazul]

I don't remember if you can backstab with staves in vanilla bg 1 tho.

You absolutely can, I just checked on a Candlekeep tutor with the standard issue starting Quarterstaff:

But you will have to believe my word that Cios w plecy: podwójne obrażenia means Backstab: Double damage in this case :D (What a horrid roll, anyhow: the damage roll must have been 2, which was then doubled to 4 and then, on top of that, 2 was added from being an 18 Strength Gnome)

 

[Cael]

I could use the tweak that lets clerics use edged weapons. Then Tiax could backstab. Assuming I did a reinstall and a fresh game, which I am tempted to do, since something is obviously wrong with Jaheira's hit points, levels and XP.

Tiax already can backstab. Moreover, Tiax can backstab with the best backstabbing weapon in the game - the Staff of Striking. He can buff his Strength for a solid boost to THAC0 and some additional damage (although bonus damage from Strength is applied after backstab damage calculation!) with his Cleric spells. Aside from the limited charges on the SoS, any Thief can pick up and enjoy the backstab from Aule's Staff +3 (purchasable at Ulgoth's) or the Staff Mace, both of which enjoy solid damage dice. Tiax very well might be one of the best backstabbers in the game - he's stuck with x3 damage, but has solid tools to support this playstyle (single-classed Thieves and dualled Shar-Teel get to hit the x4 multiplier, and the latter benefits from Fighter specialization from the potential dual; Montaron is also missing out on the x4); the only issue a lot of people have is that it's a little bit hard to imagine a staff backstab. Probably a Garrettesque bonk to the head, but with a weapon that's a little bit hard to conceal. (Tiax can also backstab with Clubs - blackjack, anyone? - but clubs are rather crappy in vanilla BG1; Enhanced Edition adds a magical one in Cloakwood).

Rule of thumb for determining whether something can or cannot backstab is whether the weapon is 1) melee and 2) belongs to a weapon type that a single-classed Thief would be able to wield. This doesn't include Use Any Item, so the Scarlet Ninja-To or Staff of the Magi, which belong to the Scimitar and Staff category respectively, can't backstab because they're Monk and Mage weapons respectively. There are some weird exceptions to this rule, as a Mage/Thief who uses Polymorph Self to turn into an Ogre is capable of backstabbing (at 18/00 Strength with a 2d4 weapon, not bad) even though the polymorphed form uses a Morning Star. This might not work in every version of the game, as I do not know if the Enhanced Edition or a fixpack changes this.

EDIT: Also, for fun: in the EE, Alora's lucky rabbit foot gives her a flat +2 to every roll. This includes THAC0 and damage rolls; this synergizes well with darts and possibly items that roll two dice for damage (like the Staff Mace), but is also a very nice boon to potential backstabs.

There is no reason why any other thief cannot backstab with the same weapons that Tiax can and with a higher multiplier. That alone makes him not "the best backstabber in the game".

 

[Dzupakazul]

There is no reason why any other thief cannot backstab with the same weapons that Tiax can and with a higher multiplier. That alone makes him not "the best backstabber in the game".

Read again: he has an easy time hitting high Strength values for higher THAC0 and damage due to Cleric buffs, which helps land your backstabs and pack additional wallop to them. "The best backstabber" wasn't written above at all ("one of the best" is not "the best"), and you managed to omit that fact even though you, once again, quoted my entire post. Shar-Teel in particular was already addressed as likely a superior backstabber due to being able to mix x4 with Fighter proficiency (and, let's add, her own exceptional Strength). All of this written in light of the erroneous information that Tiax can't backstab, when it's the opposite: his skillset is surprisingly accomodating for this purpose.

With the right prep, Tiax should be able to hit temporary 20 Strength, which translates to +8 additional damage after backstab calculation (and -3 THAC0). This isn't bad at all, considering it doesn't expend consumables (Shar-Teel runs around with exceptional strength of her own and, along with Montaron, can use the Potions of X Giant Strength for additional oomph). And this also comes with the fact that he fills another role on top of that. Solid NPC altogether.

 

[Cael]

There is no reason why any other thief cannot backstab with the same weapons that Tiax can and with a higher multiplier. That alone makes him not "the best backstabber in the game".

Read again: he has an easy time hitting high Strength values for higher THAC0 and damage due to Cleric buffs, which helps land your backstabs and pack additional wallop to them. "The best backstabber" wasn't written above at all ("one of the best" is not "the best"), and you managed to omit that fact even though you, once again, quoted my entire post. Shar-Teel in particular was already addressed as likely a superior backstabber due to being able to mix x4 with Fighter proficiency (and, let's add, her own exceptional Strength). All of this written in light of the erroneous information that Tiax can't backstab, when it's the opposite: his skillset is surprisingly accomodating for this purpose.

With the right prep, Tiax should be able to hit temporary 20 Strength, which translates to +8 additional damage after backstab calculation (and -3 THAC0). This isn't bad at all, considering it doesn't expend consumables (Shar-Teel runs around with exceptional strength of her own and, along with Montaron, can use the Potions of X Giant Strength for additional oomph). And this also comes with the fact that he fills another role on top of that. Solid NPC altogether.

With the right prep, a thief/mage has a constant 18/00 strength but that becomes completely irrelevant when he starts backstabbing with a Lightning Bolt. And, of course, there is things like Improved Invisibility, Haste and Melf's Meteors into the mix.

Tiax doesn't get a mention simply because in any party, it is simply far more efficient to have a thief/mage over a thief/cleric and given the plethora of thief/mages (including dualable ones) in the game, Tiax is a non-factor. In fact, out of all of the possible combinations (fighter/thief, thief/mage, thief/cleric), thief/cleric is the one that requires the most mothering as it is the least survivable (no Mirror Image, Shield, Haste, etc. compared to mages, no HP and outright fighting ability of fighter). And this is before we start talking about Tiax's 13 Wis.

 

[chuft]

Getting all sorts of weird bugs again. This has killed IE playthroughs for me many times before. I am not sure whether to blame mods or just modern OS's.

This time, the game acts like I am pressing keys that I am not. It will keep opening options screens, or inventory screens, or the like. HUDs will flash on and off. If I try to save a game or export a character, often it keeps adding extra characters to the filename like I have several keys pressed down. If I delete the extra characters, more appear in their place.

Very strange. Often I can stop the behavior if I can figure out the phantom key it is "pressing" at the moment and press it myself. Obviously no real keys are being pressed because it would show up in other apps.

I am going to reinstall from scratch before I go any further. The thing is I am not really using a lot of mods. BGT, Worldmap, and the Tweaks Anthology and Sword Coast Stratagems. Nothing that should be this buggy, I would think. Tutu was buggy as hell for me when I tried it years ago. I was hoping BGT would be better.

First clue I had something was wrong was right away - the mod to enable the party to move quickly out of combat was stuck in Haste mode with no way to turn it off (the special ability toggle was missing). I uninstalled that, and played normally for awhile. Next bug was Jaheira's XP and hit points and levels being wrong. Then, in Beregost, these weird "keypress" problems.

I've learned my lesson and will keep a fresh install of BG2 ready to mod handy. I was hoping I would at least get to Nashkel before having to start everything all over.

 

[Cael]

Getting all sorts of weird bugs again. This has killed IE playthroughs for me many times before. I am not sure whether to blame mods or just modern OS's.

This time, the game acts like I am pressing keys that I am not. It will keep opening options screens, or inventory screens, or the like. HUDs will flash on and off. If I try to save a game or export a character, often it keeps adding extra characters to the filename like I have several keys pressed down. If I delete the extra characters, more appear in their place.

Very strange. Often I can stop the behavior if I can figure out the phantom key it is "pressing" at the moment and press it myself. Obviously no real keys are being pressed because it would show up in other apps.

I am going to reinstall from scratch before I go any further. The thing is I am not really using a lot of mods. BGT, Worldmap, and the Tweaks Anthology and Sword Coast Stratagems. Nothing that should be this buggy, I would think. Tutu was buggy as hell for me when I tried it years ago. I was hoping BGT would be better.

First clue I had something was wrong was right away - the mod to enable the party to move quickly out of combat was stuck in Haste mode with no way to turn it off (the special ability toggle was missing). I uninstalled that, and played normally for awhile. Next bug was Jaheira's XP and hit points and levels being wrong. Then, in Beregost, these weird "keypress" problems.

I've learned my lesson and will keep a fresh install of BG2 ready to mod handy. I was hoping I would at least get to Nashkel before having to start everything all over.

Things like this is why I don't install too many mods that messes around with fundamental things like the AI and existing files. Adding stuff seems to be a lot more stable than changing parameters.

 

[chuft]

I have had the most problems with the bigg widescreen mods. Totally broke Planescape for me till I re-installed without it. I suspect it is to blame here too.

 

[chuft]

This time the mod to enable the party to move quickly out of combat was disabled because it was "not available for my game." Interesting.

 

[Russia is over. The end.]

Maybe you should call it a day and install EE.

 

[chuft]

When I google for these bugs, most of the time I end up in EE threads about bugs.

 

[Modron]

When I google for these bugs, most of the time I end up in EE threads about bugs.

Honestly, probably best to just search sorcerer's palace forums for IE engine game bugs. Had a rare issue with Icewind Dale 2 and a handful of scripts not firing for some reason on my playthrough and no amount of googling helped. One forum search on SP and got the exact console command needed to force an event to happen.

 

[Chippy]

I keep trying to get into Beamdog's version of BG and always start to want to give up. This is my second try. They have that 'no difficulty based damage increase option' under game options right? Well it doesn't work. I already realised that the difficulty option for more enemies spawning at higher levels only applied to SOD and not the main campaign, so am assuming this does as well?.

A wyvern is doing 5 poison dam/round on both core rules and hard. Buncha fucktards spreading fake news in their own game.

 

[TheDiceMustRoll]

I've only finished BG1 once. Every other time I play I just fuck around exploring and killing for a dozen hours. Im finally going to beat it for the second time. Current party: WTF bullshit protag/khalid/jaheira/minsc/xan/imoen TW mode.

Having this many spellcasters feels BROKE AS SHIT.

So, besides incels reeing about the paladin, how is SoD? It looks like its ok

 

[Cael]

I've only finished BG1 once. Every other time I play I just fuck around exploring and killing for a dozen hours. Im finally going to beat it for the second time. Current party: WTF bullshit protag/khalid/jaheira/minsc/xan/imoen TW mode.

Having this many spellcasters feels BROKE AS SHIT.

So, besides incels reeing about the paladin, how is SoD? It looks like its ok

Jaheira and Xan is "many spellcasters"?

 

[pomenitul]

I assume charname and Imoen count as well.

 

[Chippy]

I've only finished BG1 once. Every other time I play I just fuck around exploring and killing for a dozen hours. Im finally going to beat it for the second time. Current party: WTF bullshit protag/khalid/jaheira/minsc/xan/imoen TW mode.

Having this many spellcasters feels BROKE AS SHIT.

So, besides incels reeing about the paladin, how is SoD? It looks like its ok

I keep trying to approach the writing with a fresh outlook (mainly because it's beyond my comprehension that a professional company could create something this bad, and in a product where it should have been a priority to be good) but shit is shit. If MCA took several blows to the head that lowered his IQ 40 points, and injected himself with a cocktail of drugs and alcohol for 6 months - and then started writing about something mildly related to BG...it still would have been better that the writing in SOD.

It didn't help my opinion of him much that he recommended the game because of the writing.

 

[chuft]

What is “TW mode”?

 

[TheDiceMustRoll]

What is “TW mode”?

Thief/Wizard

Same with WTF = WizardThiefFighter

 

[chuft]

Anybody else have problems with the "Standard Attack" (aGen.bs) script not working, and resetting to "None" after a load, with BGT-WeiDU?

I read an old post from 2013 where someone said BGT was corrupting this script. When I check my own BGT debug log I can see it is replacing the BG2 script with a new one. Curious if the BGT version is just broken or mine got corrupted somehow. I am thinking about replacing it with the backup BGT makes during install.

 

[chuft]

Also having an intermittent issue that I nailed down as some kind of incompatibility between Logitech keyboard/mouse drivers and the Infinity Engine. It manifests as phantom keystrokes. Often if you can determine which keys are being "pressed" (usually by means of the Map Note feature, you can see them repeating endlessly in the field where you can type) you can stop it by pressing the real key. But not always.

In-game it shows up just like you kept rapidly hitting a key, so the AI will flicker on and off, the HUDs might flicker on and off, the Inventory screen might keep opening etc.

These phantom keystrokes do not happen in any app other than IE games. In the past (on the old Bioware boards apparently) this was described as a "wireless keyboard issue" but I am using all wired Logitech gear and the same thing is happening.

 

[Russia is over. The end.]

Dude this is hilarious, you have a million different problems that aren't even possible. What the hell.

- Have you overclocked your CPU? It looks like there's some kind of memory corruption going on, I don't know how all of that is possible, just no way.
- Do you have this shit happen in other games too or just this one?
- Why do you persist in playing non EE version with all of this happening?

 

[chuft]

These are known problems experienced by many others.

E.g. for the aGen.bs script problem
https://af.gog.com/forum/baldurs_ga..._to_none_for_certain_characters?as=1649904300

E.g. for the phantom keystrokes problem
https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/problem-running-bg2-at-home-need-advice.214676/

There were posts from Bioware on the phantom keystrokes problem on their old forums, one of which is quoted here
https://sorcerers.net/community/thr...g1-bg2-involving-formations-spellcasts.55150/

but since the old Bioware forums are gone, the information can be hard to find. One problem is caused by the BGT mod, the other by Infinity Engine not getting along with Logitech drivers. They are not related to overclocking, memory corruption, or anything else and they do not affect any other apps.

It's nice you are getting some entertainment from other people experiencing bugs, at least some good comes of it.

I find your faith in the curative powers of the EE editions somewhat amusing myself.