The Guild Wars 2 Thread

[Angthoron]

Grenade Kit underwater is idiotically efficient. High rate of fire, w/o the need to target like on surface, option to turn autofire on, AoE, very long range (1200), short cooldown on blinding, slowing and bleeding damage...

Do want

That does sound darn excellent.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

Finally come to the realisation that this game blows, progression is colossally dull and feels like i'm pulling teeth. I don't get it, the environments are there to make it an interesting levelling experience...so why is it so shit?

 

[Ulminati]

Also, I trasnfered my lvl 15 sylvari engineer to Seafarer's Rest.

Add me: csarga.1574

Done. Just in time too. Staturday morning around 3AM CET the guildwide +10% magic find boost should kick in

 

[RK47]

Today's Guild Chat is pretty , folks.
Migrating once I've found another server.

 

[Average Manatee]

The only vital knowledge here is the fact that you're a retard Manatee. Everyone says so you're just too stubborn or too dumb to pick up on it.

Only in MMOs can you find such idiots who will defend bad game design. You are as pathetic as any Bethtard or Biotard.

Imagine a D&D game where you weren't allowed to know anything about the combat mechanics. Every spell requires you to cast it 5 or 10 times to figure out exactly how strong it is against which monster and the peculiarities of the spell's effects. Every weapon requires you to fight multiple fights before even figuring out how useful it was. Such a game would be a joke. Yet because GW2 is an MMO, a genre with earth-shatteringly low standards, this is accepted by the player base.

 

[Mangoose]

The only vital knowledge here is the fact that you're a retard Manatee. Everyone says so you're just too stubborn or too dumb to pick up on it.

Only in MMOs can you find such idiots who will defend bad game design. You are as pathetic as any Bethtard or Biotard.

Imagine a D&D game where you weren't allowed to know anything about the combat mechanics. Every spell requires you to cast it 5 or 10 times to figure out exactly how strong it is against which monster and the peculiarities of the spell's effects. Every weapon requires you to fight multiple fights before even figuring out how useful it was. Such a game would be a joke. Yet because GW2 is an MMO, a genre with earth-shatteringly low standards, this is accepted by the player base.

Someone never played Morrowind.

Do you even play CRPGs?

Also that would be a fine fucking game. You act like it's a chore to experiment, when I enjoy it.

 

[Mangoose]

it's mostly just doing a half-way aping of Cryptic's gameplay model.

Lol what. Cryptic apes everyone else.

What I have a problem with is that the information I want so I can plan ahead is simply not there

It is there, just not readily available the way YOU want it. And that's not a problem with the game. That's just a problem with your expectations.

THEN I can go and try out one or maybe a few more at a testing area, and see which clicks the best with me.

Well, too bad. Here you have to try out your shit first, THEN go and think about builds, THEN go test out specific builds. Sucks for you there's an extra step. Doesn't suck for me.

tl;dr: You shouldn't have to make pure guesswork regarding your build.

You don't make guesswork. You have to experiment beforehand. You get concrete data from observations. Then you continue.

(Also, I'm starting to have a suspicion that they have all of this shit explained indepth in their strategy guide)

I'm starting to suspect you're even more retarded, if you don't know the details behind specific abilities, and haven't spent the time to research outside of the game. What did I say about games that hide information that lead to players collaborating on data? Yeah.

 

[Mangoose]

ITT Limited information is apparently bad game design.



I don't understand how you people survive in real life, where there is no number chart for any set of actions.

 

[SerratedBiz]

ITT Limited information is apparently bad game design.

I don't see why you defend it so vehemently, though. It wouldn't break the game to just define exactly what skills do and how they benefit from different stats, given that they already know the answer.

It's cool that you're into the whole "shit ain't certain, let's discover it together" shtick but there's nothing wrong with a full disclosure approach either.

 

[Mangoose]

Oh there's nothing wrong with either approach at all. Mentioned that a few times. I'm just ITT making fun of retards.

 

[Angthoron]

Tbh what bothers me more than tooltip "vagueness" ever will is their patch note vagueness. "Tweaked the dungeons". Tweaked how? What's a tweak? Is it like tweaking a nipple? Will the tweak arouse me? Oh, NPCs now behave differently and charge instead of following, cool, nice to know I guess, is that intended? Oh.

It's like 2 sets of different people write patch notes - one set writes everything down to % ranges and values, and the other just throws some shit together. Then there's a HUGE amount of updates on Twitter all day long - I don't mind, but couldn't these same people like write down patch notes? Or does it distract them from tweeting too much?

Yeah, that annoys me. Bugs, crashes, unintended functions (Played story with GF, her story derailed completely into MY version of the story at Fort Trinity, yayay - guess it shows I was right with my choices, eh, bros, eh?), lags, bugs, fine, I can handle that, and I don't need a minute plan regarding your upcoming actions, but GIVE ME THE PATCH NOTES. I like to know if that shit I see now is a bug, or a feature. Sure, I could discover it by research, but that's probably not one of those things that I should be discovering by research. Anyway, p.sure they'll get there, they're a communicative bunch.

Lulz with this thread though, it's pretty amusing.

What's the drama in DEX? I'm kinda running my own guild on Gunnar's, so am kinda left out of the action.

 

[Average Manatee]

The only vital knowledge here is the fact that you're a retard Manatee. Everyone says so you're just too stubborn or too dumb to pick up on it.

Only in MMOs can you find such idiots who will defend bad game design. You are as pathetic as any Bethtard or Biotard.

Imagine a D&D game where you weren't allowed to know anything about the combat mechanics. Every spell requires you to cast it 5 or 10 times to figure out exactly how strong it is against which monster and the peculiarities of the spell's effects. Every weapon requires you to fight multiple fights before even figuring out how useful it was. Such a game would be a joke. Yet because GW2 is an MMO, a genre with earth-shatteringly low standards, this is accepted by the player base.

Someone never played Morrowind.

Do you even play CRPGs?

Also that would be a fine fucking game. You act like it's a chore to experiment, when I enjoy it.

Three Points:

1. Morrowind is not a PvP game. Rules in PvP need to be much more rigidly defined than a single player game. If I go outside and play a sport with a friend, we hardly need a few hundred pages of rules and referees to go with it. So there is a lower standard in the first place. Morrowind can be about exploration, but a PvP game has to be clear about the rules of the match.

2. Morrowind still gave a lot more information on most things. All I can think of that was not well-defined was the to-hit formula and the formulas for various misc things like spellcrafting and alchemy. Things like spell effects? All right there and well defined. The difference is that in Morrowind you can figure out how to-hit works in the first 5 mins and then the combat is completely understandable. For GW2 you have to figure out each and every individual skill for each class to understand the combat.

3. GW1 had detailed skill descriptions. GW2 does not. The TES series has always similar mechanics, it isn't breaking any traditions here by hiding anything new in Morrowind. Imagine how bad (worse...) Fallout 3 would be if all skills were hidden so that you could only raise them randomly through stats. That surely wouldn't be hated by the codex, no siree.

Tbh what bothers me more than tooltip "vagueness" ever will is their patch note vagueness. "Tweaked the dungeons". Tweaked how? What's a tweak? Is it like tweaking a nipple? Will the tweak arouse me? Oh, NPCs now behave differently and charge instead of following, cool, nice to know I guess, is that intended? Oh.

It's like 2 sets of different people write patch notes - one set writes everything down to % ranges and values, and the other just throws some shit together. Then there's a HUGE amount of updates on Twitter all day long - I don't mind, but couldn't these same people like write down patch notes? Or does it distract them from tweeting too much?

Yeah, that annoys me. Bugs, crashes, unintended functions (Played story with GF, her story derailed completely into MY version of the story at Fort Trinity, yayay - guess it shows I was right with my choices, eh, bros, eh?), lags, bugs, fine, I can handle that, and I don't need a minute plan regarding your upcoming actions, but GIVE ME THE PATCH NOTES. I like to know if that shit I see now is a bug, or a feature. Sure, I could discover it by research, but that's probably not one of those things that I should be discovering by research. Anyway, p.sure they'll get there, they're a communicative bunch.

I presume that things are like this because they are still flying by the seat of their pants in rapid development mode, without a strong chain of decision making and documentation behind it. 90% of their work is probably fixing the hundreds of events that can break if you carry out certain actions, and no one is really keeping track of this beyond the broad strokes. Once things have settled in a month or so the patch notes should be similar to GW1's. Very exact, with accompanying developer notes to specify the (often retarded but at least clearly stated) reasons for any changes made.

Or the GW2 devs could just be incompetent. Want to throw that out there

 

[Mangoose]

Traditions, lol. What a riot.

 

[Ulminati]

So this is what we're down to now? Manatee has no clue how to play the game so he needs to blame the tooltips? Is he at least indirectly admitting he has no clue how the fuck to play thief or is he still going to maintain venomshare is a shit build despite it being the most popular tournament build beside baller-whip

 

[Average Manatee]

So this is what we're down to now? Manatee has no clue how to play the game so he needs to blame the tooltips? Is he at least indirectly admitting he has no clue how the fuck to play thief or is he still going to maintain venomshare is a shit build despite it being the most popular tournament build beside baller-whip

Do you want to provide any evidence that venom can add usable DPS? Especially any evidence that it can do so against a competent opponent? No? Fuck off.

Paladin was the most popular GW1 warrior build in high end PvP for a long time btw. If you have any knowledge of GW1 you will see how that clearly discredits any attempt at a popularity argument. All venom is is a low skill ceiling build that can beat noobs easily. Given that I can see why you would favour it.

 

[Angthoron]

So this is what we're down to now? Manatee has no clue how to play the game so he needs to blame the tooltips? Is he at least indirectly admitting he has no clue how the fuck to play thief or is he still going to maintain venomshare is a shit build despite it being the most popular tournament build beside baller-whip

Arguing with people in this thread is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how good you are at chess the pigeon is going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board, and strut around like it's victorious.

 

[RK47]

Street Fighter 4 sucks.

 

[Angthoron]

But which one of them?!

 

[Mangoose]

You know, what's so much better about GW1 tooltips anyway? Let's look at the criteria..

You also need to see how quickly it scales by attribute level. You need to see whether it scales linearly or exponentially so you can extrapolate

Well, damage updates on the tooltip when your attributes change in both GW1 and GW2.

You then need to figure out how an ability scales vs armor.

Neither game provides this.

GW1 provided every single piece of information needed.

GW1 Axe Rake: Axe Attack. If this attack hits a foe suffering from a Deep Wound, you strike for +1...8...10 damage, and that foe becomes Crippled for 15 seconds.

So GW1 provides tooltips with damage that updates on the fly and condition info. So does GW2. What's your point?

Also on this note:

This isn't even considering the number of skills that have descriptions which are flat out wrong.

Wrong descriptions are obviously bad, but that's not what we're talking about.

 

[Konjad]

mangoose, why r u in the guild, but you don't represent it? Are you ashamed to be a part of this community?

 

[Kane]

do you have to be on the same server as the guild to be able to join a guild?

 

[SuicideBunny]

do you have to be on the same server as the guild to be able to join a guild?

no, but each server has its own influence and upgrades.

 

[Konjad]

guys, support the idea!
http://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/gw2-subforum.76252/

 

[Kane]

do you have to be on the same server as the guild to be able to join a guild?

no, but each server has its own influence and upgrades.

yeah but if i am on server X and the guild is on server Y, what sense does it make?

 

[Kane]

ONE GUILD MUST DOMINATE ALL SERVERS

no, i mean as far as i understand if i am on server X i can only play with people on server X. or am i wrong?

 

[SuicideBunny]

yeah but if i am on server X and the guild is on server Y, what sense does it make?

you can be in many guilds but represent only one, which is the one whose guild chat (server independent) you participate in and for which you earn influence (server bound) by doing stuff. you can switch what guild you represent at will, so you can join all of them just to occasionally chat with the people. also, you can theoretically play with people from other servers through the guest system, though i'm not sure if that's implemented yet and how it related to guild upgrades.

but since influence is server bound anyways, the best solution for all of us would be one fucking united codex guild with one leader per server, but i highly doubt that will happen.

 

[Kane]

well as i understand it we have two codex guilds: one made by sov (because he also made the gw guild) and someone else was a cheap manboon and wanted power and also did a guild.

anyway, you can invite me.

 

[Average Manatee]

You know, what's so much better about GW1 tooltips anyway? Let's look at the criteria..

You also need to see how quickly it scales by attribute level. You need to see whether it scales linearly or exponentially so you can extrapolate

Well, damage updates on the tooltip when your attributes change in both GW1 and GW2.

Find me a damage on the tooltip for traits. Find me a way to find total damage on an PAOE without testing it, because there are multiple inconsistencies in how it is displayed.

You then need to figure out how an ability scales vs armor.

Neither game provides this.

GW1: Ability says it does 100 damage. I know it does 100 damage to low armor. To higher armored characters it will do 50-70 damage.
GW2: Ability says it does 1000 damage. To what? There is no standardized armor value here. All the damage helps you figure out is that a 1k damage spell is better than an 800 damage spell, but that tells you little about the total damage you actually have in any given situation until you test it.

GW1 provided every single piece of information needed.

GW1 Axe Rake: Axe Attack. If this attack hits a foe suffering from a Deep Wound, you strike for +1...8...10 damage, and that foe becomes Crippled for 15 seconds.

So GW1 provides tooltips with damage that updates on the fly and condition info. So does GW2. What's your point?

Except for where the GW2 skill is missing vital info. Like cast time on every single one. Or the complete lack of a chance for effect I pointed out earlier with GoEP. And again, find a trait that gives anything near the same information. There are a very few that are clear, the vast majority are all at varying levels of uncertainty.

Traits are really the biggest problem, if they were at least displayed with the level of detail of skills, and the various obviously-wrong, information-lacking, and inconsistent skills were brought up to speed, things would be bearable.