Turn-Based Tactics The Lamplighters League - turn-based tactics in pulp 1930s setting from Harebrained Schemes

[RegionalHobo]

paradox must be real happy with its acquisitions.... vtmb saga and this giga flop

from dragonfall to this

 

[mediocrepoet]

paradox must be real happy with its acquisitions.... vtmb saga and this giga flop

from dragonfall to this

It's nothing that $9000 of DLC won't fix!

Pretty sure that's the Paradox official motto. You can find it on a plaque in their offices.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Set aside the narratives of decline. The most notable thing about Harebrained Schemes is that they made a strategic (and in retrospect rather puzzling) decision not to make RPGs any more. Just threw away whatever experience they'd accumulated making the Shadowrun games. It'd be interesting to learn what went on behind the scenes in reaching that decision.

Because no matter how good your game is, it's always going to be hard to stand out making yet another "quirky-themed tactics game™". Why?

Less perplexing when considering that Battletech appears to have outsold the Shadowrun games combined.

Though it doesn't seem to have occurred to anyone at either Harebrained Schemes or Paradox that the earlier games possessed advantages derived from their licensed intellectual property (RIP FASA), whereas for this game they decided to create their own IP rather than utilizing anything owned by Paradox or that might have been available from a third-party. It seems evident already that not many are interested in this combination of ugly cartoonish graphics, a 1930s setting that is ahistorical, and supposed pulp influences that are overshadowed by Current Year quirkiness.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Set aside the narratives of decline. The most notable thing about Harebrained Schemes is that they made a strategic (and in retrospect rather puzzling) decision not to make RPGs any more. Just threw away whatever experience they'd accumulated making the Shadowrun games. It'd be interesting to learn what went on behind the scenes in reaching that decision.

Because no matter how good your game is, it's always going to be hard to stand out making yet another "quirky-themed tactics game™". Why?

Less perplexing when considering that Battletech appears to have outsold the Shadowrun games combined.

Though it doesn't seem to have occurred to anyone at either Harebrained Schemes or Paradox that the earlier games possessed advantages derived from their licensed intellectual property (RIP FASA), whereas for this game they decided to create their own IP rather than utilizing anything owned by Paradox or that might have been available from a third-party. It seems evident already that not many are interested in this combination of ugly cartoonish graphics, a 1930s setting that is ahistorical, and supposed pulp influences that are overshadowed by Current Year quirkiness.

Not to mention that, hey, I want to bring back IPs I brought out at FASA, is its own draw for certain nerds.

 

[The_Mask]

Doesn't half of the UI remind one of Empire of Sin?

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Disregarding how much of a nothing game this obviously is, there's surely no living soul in the universe who thinks this "art style" is in any way acceptable?

Like, wtf.

 

[Trithne]

They seem to have really gone all-out in paying people to play the game, I've seen like five sponsored reviews on YouTube without even looking.

That's just a Paradox thing it seems. They shit sponsored videos all over the internet every time they release anything.

Because no matter how good your game is, it's always going to be hard to stand out making yet another "quirky-themed tactics game™". Why?

All shall kneel before Troubleshooter.

 

[Cross]

Ironically, a stealth-focused tactics game about managing a team of runners and infiltrating corporate bases would be a perfect fit for the Shadowrun setting. One failing of Harebrained's Shadowrun games is that it felt more like you were playing as a generic group of RPG adventurers than a team of Shadowrunners.

Though a better setting wouldn't have fixed the bad game design, such as the decision to use a 2 AP system in a stealth-focused game. The most basic thing required for stealth is the ability to tread carefully, i.e. move one tile at a time, which you can't really do in a 2 AP system. Though that might not even matter since the stealth is apparently confined to the real-time portions? Which is just more bad game design.

 

[Infinitron]

Though that might not even matter since the stealth is apparently confined to the real-time portions? Which is just more bad game design.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here. Isn't "sneak up as close as you can to the enemy group in real time before selectively going into turn-based mode to engage in combat" how almost every modern turn-based isometric RPG works?

 

[Lord_Potato]

Though that might not even matter since the stealth is apparently confined to the real-time portions? Which is just more bad game design.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here. Isn't "sneak up as close as you can to the enemy group in real time before selectively going into turn-based mode to engage in combat" how almost every modern turn-based isometric RPG works?

Yeah, always turn-based solution is quite terrible gameplay-wise as proven by Paradise Cracked (in this game even picking dialogue options used action points).

 

[Cyberarmy]

In before blaming the gamers for another hard flop...

 

[Lord_Potato]

I'll most likely check it out on gamepass, but the price? Geeez...

 

[Grunker]

I'll most likely check it out on gamepass, but the price? Geeez...

I guess the logic is that if this is only going to sell 5 copies no matter how they market and price it, it might as well be 5 very expensive copies...

 

[VonMiskov]

It has stealth. But the problem is that camera in default always focus on selected character and it has really low field of view. So if you want to do stealth with two independent characters you loose focus on what is happening around the other ones. You can always change to "recon" mode but that only unlocks camera but pauses the game without the ability to issue orders. Camera is slow AF too. It was really painful to play like this.
The game also very poorly informs player about a lot of statuses. If your characters are grouped or you deselected the limited special abilites.

 

[Van-d-all]

Honestly, this game >needs< to fail so that they realize releasing 2AP nuXCom clones with stale, Bioshock inspired setting isn't a way to move forward. Battletech might've sold nicely, but it's on behalf of almost ancient franchise with way too little new games, not some brilliance of HBS design. Wasn't too big on Shadowrun (it's the lamest big SciFi setting IMO, generic cyberpunk with D&D critters strapped on with duct tape) but at least the games were enjoyable enough to finish (and buy) all three, this I don't even want to pirate.

 

[Black_Willow]

Though that might not even matter since the stealth is apparently confined to the real-time portions? Which is just more bad game design.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here. Isn't "sneak up as close as you can to the enemy group in real time before selectively going into turn-based mode to engage in combat" how almost every modern turn-based isometric RPG works?

Yeah, always turn-based solution is quite terrible gameplay-wise as proven by Paradise Cracked (in this game even picking dialogue options used action points).

RPGs are turn - based games, "real time" dialogue is a popamole abomination.

 

[Modron]

I guess the logic is that if this is only going to sell 5 copies not matter how they market and price it, it might as well be 5 very expensive copies...

It's like you've never heard of gatekeeping before.

 

[Dickie]

I'll wait for the $5 DLC that doubles the number of stealth takedowns you're allowed to do.

 

[Cross]

Though that might not even matter since the stealth is apparently confined to the real-time portions? Which is just more bad game design.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here. Isn't "sneak up as close as you can to the enemy group in real time before selectively going into turn-based mode to engage in combat" how almost every modern turn-based isometric RPG works?

You should still be able to sneak in turn-based mode. After all, if an enemy spots only one of your characters, the other characters that are not in his line of sight should remain undetected.

At least that's how it works in other games. Here, it looks like it's a binary switch between real-time stealth and an XCOM shootout.

 

[agris]

Ironically, a stealth-focused tactics game about managing a team of runners and infiltrating corporate bases would be a perfect fit for the Shadowrun setting.

you want cyber knights: flashpoint. the character art is a bit prosperian, but not as bad as lamplighters. going from their previous game, startraders: frontiers, I believe the mechanics and execution will be top notch.

 

[Lemming42]

Honestly I'm glad they went for a new setting rather than Shadowrun again, in a world of sequels and licensed shit we need more original videogame settings. Plus you can't really go too far wrong with "1920s/30s where the occult is real and everyone's a stereotype/archetype". I think if the game was actually good, the setting would complement it fine (though the art style is pretty bad).

 

[Delterius]

Honestly I'm glad they went for a new setting rather than Shadowrun again, in a world of sequels and licensed shit we need more original videogame settings. Plus you can't really go too far wrong with "1920s/30s where the occult is real and everyone's a stereotype/archetype". I think if the game was actually good, the setting would complement it fine (though the art style is pretty bad).

Yeah they tried to do their own thing and I'm willing to give them some points for effort. Only it was always clear that I enjoyed Shadowrun for the setting the stories in it, not the combat or the art. Someone would have to explain to me why this Lamplighters world is interesting at all, but since it's not an RPG it would be an uphill battle. That's my take.

Also Lamplighters League is priced the same as Baldur's Gate 3 in brazil doubloons lmfao.

 

[Axioms]

The game clearly costs way too much for what it is on top of the soundtrack, artbook, and day 1 character dlc. I just don't understand the model financially. What is the market for this?

 

[Parsimonious cook]

There apparently isnt one.

 

[Lemming42]

Oh god, didn't realise there was a day 1 character DLC going for £6.99. So the actual cost of the full game is around £50. That's outrageous.

Someone would have to explain to me why this Lamplighters world is interesting at all, but since it's not an RPG it would be an uphill battle.

One of the developers worked on Crimson Skies back in the day, I think. They could have used that to really sell the game on the high-spirited 1930s pulp adventure remix stuff. Although the writing in this actually seems a bit bland in the way a lot of media these days is, characters just sort of talking in perfunctory ways as they move through a by-the-numbers plot, so it looks like they've failed to tap into the appeal of that genre anyway.

What is the market for this?

It's temping to blame Paradox, I suppose, since making people pay not-insignificant sums of money for very insubstantial DLC is their whole model.

Very confusing as to why they thought this game would be a winner, though. Even if it was good, the market for this kind of thing is surely relatively niche. Between the relative flop of Midnight Suns (which I thought was fantastic, aside from the writing) and the total giga-flop of this, devs and publishers in future might start to be wary of turn-based tactics games, which is a shame.