The Outer Worlds: Spacer's Choice Edition - Obsidian's first-person sci-fi RPG set in a corporate space colony

[Deleted Member 16721]

Lol. I literally said I was the one who felt like I was taking crazy pills. What baffles me is the complete contradiction of my experience by the apparent experience of others.
I would genuinely like to enjoy this game. Tim and Leonard have been (and still are) some of my heroes for the work they've done.

Allow me to attempt to illustrate:

The quest to sober up Nyoka. This quest is part of the main story line and a way to get a new companion, so it's fairly major.
First of all, getting a hangover cure is a pretty contrived quest, but that's not a huge point.
Here's how the quest went for me:

1. Nyoka says she needs Caffenoid pills.
2. I go to the dispensary and talk to the lady.
3. She says Nyoka can't have any more Caffenoid pills.
   
4. She also literally tells me (a complete stranger) that she has a key to the storeroom and that there is a computer terminal upstairs that controls how many drugs people can have.
5. I walk upstairs to the terminal, hack it, up Nyoka's limit, go back downstairs and get the Caffenoid.
6. End of quest

Now, I also had enough intimidate to force her to give me the pills through dialog, and I may even have had enough lock-picking to open the storeroom.

In Fallout 1, in contrast, I would have been told to fuck off by the dispensary lady.
Then I could have intimidated her (if I had the skill),
or I would have had to look around the building and maybe notice the computer terminal and try to hack it (if I had the skill),
or maybe try picking the lady's pocket (if I had the skill),
or I could have searched around town and asked about Caffenoid and whether anyone knew where to get some or how to get into the storeroom.

But in TOW, 0 thinking was required to both advance the main story line and get a new companion. It may have even triggered a level up, I can't remember specifically, but it sure happens often enough.
The most I could have done was decide the scent of the air as a breezed through this, because I had 2 - 3 separate major options for completing the quest open to me without even planning for it, and it took 5 minutes.

Dude. There is very little difference in the 2 scenarios. Not every quest needs to have a million figure it out yourself options. What you described from TOW is still incline. You could pickpocket the lady, pick the door lock, had to hack the computer and so on. That is incline my friend. So what she tells you about the computer? It wasn't a major quest despite being part if the main quest. No big deal.

 

[Dishonoredbr]

Well, the user score on Meta critic is steadily going down and the PC one is lower than Greedfall

Metacritic User Score is literaly useless. Even trash lik FO76 has 10/10 and good games 1/10. It's retarded. Open Critic is way better than Metacritic because it take in account all reviews across all system instead putting PC with 14 reviews then ps4 with 50+ then Xbox with 30. They let retarded journos but at least it much better than "Epic bad" 1/10 and "Obsidian good. Bethesda bad" 10/10.

 

[LudensCogitet]

Lol. I literally said I was the one who felt like I was taking crazy pills. What baffles me is the complete contradiction of my experience by the apparent experience of others.
I would genuinely like to enjoy this game. Tim and Leonard have been (and still are) some of my heroes for the work they've done.

Allow me to attempt to illustrate:

The quest to sober up Nyoka. This quest is part of the main story line and a way to get a new companion, so it's fairly major.
First of all, getting a hangover cure is a pretty contrived quest, but that's not a huge point.
Here's how the quest went for me:

1. Nyoka says she needs Caffenoid pills.
2. I go to the dispensary and talk to the lady.
3. She says Nyoka can't have any more Caffenoid pills.
   
4. She also literally tells me (a complete stranger) that she has a key to the storeroom and that there is a computer terminal upstairs that controls how many drugs people can have.
5. I walk upstairs to the terminal, hack it, up Nyoka's limit, go back downstairs and get the Caffenoid.
6. End of quest

Now, I also had enough intimidate to force her to give me the pills through dialog, and I may even have had enough lock-picking to open the storeroom.

In Fallout 1, in contrast, I would have been told to fuck off by the dispensary lady.
Then I could have intimidated her (if I had the skill),
or I would have had to look around the building and maybe notice the computer terminal and try to hack it (if I had the skill),
or maybe try picking the lady's pocket (if I had the skill),
or I could have searched around town and asked about Caffenoid and whether anyone knew where to get some or how to get into the storeroom.

But in TOW, 0 thinking was required to both advance the main story line and get a new companion. It may have even triggered a level up, I can't remember specifically, but it sure happens often enough.
The most I could have done was decide the scent of the air as a breezed through this, because I had 2 - 3 separate major options for completing the quest open to me without even planning for it, and it took 5 minutes.

Dude. There is very little difference in the 2 scenarios. Not every quest needs to have a million figure it out yourself options. What you described from TOW is still incline. You could pickpocket the lady, pick the door lock, had to hack the computer and so on. That is incline my friend. So what she tells you about the computer? It wasn't a major quest despite being part if the main quest. No big deal.

This is useful information to me, thank you. You are saying that you see no difference between applying your mind to understanding a situation and choosing how to proceed (limited by your previous choices) and choosing from a list of proffered options. I'm not being sarcastic, that is helpful to know. If that's what people mean when they praise player choice, etc. when discussing TOW it explains a lot.

Also, I'd argue it was part of my point, and criticism of the quest, that advancing the main story line and gaining a new companion was not a major quest. I'm not saying every quest needs to be like I described, nor that it needs a million options, but can you name me 1 quest in TOW that does require player thought rather than simple selection among equally viable options?

 

[Hot Coldman]

Wasn't gonna say anything, yes. What Fluent fails to consider was your last paragraph. Zero thinking required. All your options are in your face, presented by an option in the "diaogue box", and there is no more than just that.
You are not required to do anything than click your preferred option it's over.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Who cares though? Obviously you guys do but I don't. Games have progressed. They're not trying to stump gamers at every turn like the ancient games you worship. Back then that was the trend, today it is not. Games are for fun first and foremost. Is the game fun? That gets a resounding yes from me. Not having to suffer or think too much is incline because the game is still fun. There are still options present, more so than most RPGs especially first person action shooting RPGs.

 

[Hot Coldman]

Who cares though? Obviously you guys do but I don't. Games have progressed. They're not trying to stump gamers at every turn like the ancient games you worship. Back then that was the trend, today it is not. Games are for fun first and foremost. Is the game fun? That gets a resounding yes from me. Not having to suffer or think too much is incline because the game is still fun. There are still options present, more sothan most RPGs especially first person action shooting RPGs.

That's fine. Now go watch Die hard or whatever other crap media you consume.

It's not to convince you that your tastes are shit.
It's just to tell you what you said was wrong.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

That's fine. Now go watch Die hard or whatever other crap media you consume.

It's not to convince you that your tastes are shit.
It's just to tell you what you said was wrong.

I'm not a prude or snobbish prick about stuff. I'm perfectly fine enjoying things for what they are. Sounds like you're just angry and bitter and can't enjoy new things.

 

[Riddler]

Well, the user score on Meta critic is steadily going down and the PC one is lower than Greedfall

Metacritic User Score is literaly useless. Even trash lik FO76 has 10/10 and good games 1/10. It's retarded. Open Critic is way better than Metacritic because it take in account all reviews across all system instead putting PC with 14 reviews then ps4 with 50+ then Xbox with 30. They let retarded journos but at least it much better than "Epic bad" 1/10 and "Obsidian good. Bethesda bad" 10/10.

1. I don't give a fuck about what consoletards think.
2. There are over 800 reviews for the outer worlds on PC.
3. Fallout 76 has a 2.8 rating.
4. If you looked at the actual user reviews you would be able to see that ToW isn't subjected to review bombing.

 

[Hot Coldman]

That's fine. Now go watch Die hard or whatever other crap media you consume.

It's not to convince you that your tastes are shit.
It's just to tell you what you said was wrong.

I'm not a prude or snobbish prick about stuff. I'm perfectly fine enjoying things for what they are. Sounds like you're just angry and bitter and can't enjoy new things.

I can honestly say I am content with not playing many video games.
Besides, I play Sandy Petersen's CALL of CTHULHU *the RPG not the video game on mondays. AND I can do other things.

HOWEVER there are video games that I absolutely love, also newer ones, like Stygian, Age of Decadence, whatnot.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

I can honestly say I am content with not playing many video games.
Besides, I play Sandy Petersen's CALL of CTHULHU *the RPG not the video game on mondays. AND I can do other things.

HOWEVER there are video games that I absolutely love, also newer ones, like Stygian, Age of Decadence, whatnot.

Stygian is good, yes. We can agree there. I'm saying I enjoy many RPGs of all shapes and sizes. I enjoy complex RPGs and also easier more casual ones. As long as they have real RPG elements I will usually be happy. But the game also has to meet my criteria. I don't want to play The Witcher 3 for example. No interest.

 

[Child of Malkav]

Wasn't gonna say anything, yes. What Fluent fails to consider was your last paragraph. Zero thinking required. All your options are in your face, presented by an option in the "diaogue box", and there is no more than just that.
You are not required to do anything than click your preferred option it's over.

I don't understand what you're saying about options being presented in a dialogue box and not being more than that.
If you played Fallout 1 and 2 and if you invested into speech, a speech option would appear during dialogue. Now, the only difference between FO1/2 and FONV (in dialogue) is that the speech option is marked as such in NV but not in FO 1/2. In the latter, you need to pay attention and read carefully but even then the option becomes evident as it's simply the best one from all the options, the one that gives the best quest resolution.
Also, if you have the skill, you have the option. If you have enough lock picking then you can simply unlock the door. Do you want a minigame for it? The same thing with hacking. Or if you have high strength, you can break/kick the door open. Etc.

 

[Nano]

Now Stick of Truth?
That was a real high brow RPG.

Obsidian's decline started with Dungeon Siege 3 nearly a decade ago and hasn't stopped since.

 

[Hot Coldman]

Wasn't gonna say anything, yes. What Fluent fails to consider was your last paragraph. Zero thinking required. All your options are in your face, presented by an option in the "diaogue box", and there is no more than just that.
You are not required to do anything than click your preferred option it's over.

I don't understand what you're saying about options being presented in a dialogue box and not being more than that.
If you played Fallout 1 and 2 and if you invested into speech, a speech option would appear during dialogue. Now, the only difference between FO1/2 and FONV (in dialogue) is that the speech option is marked as such in NV but not in FO 1/2. In the latter, you need to pay attention and read carefully but even then the option becomes evident as it's simply the best one from all the options, the one that gives the best quest resolution.
Also, if you have the skill, you have the option. If you have enough lock picking then you can simply unlock the door. Do you want a minigame for it? The same thing with hacking. Or if you have high strength, you can break/kick the door open. Etc.

Do you not see the giant arrow pointing you from A to B as you shoot a thousand bandits on your way to talk to a guy so you can talk to another guy?
In fact, this is kind of irrelevant to the fact that it is simply not my kind of game. It is game foremost and RPG second. A toddler could play this "RPG".

 

[Hot Coldman]

Yes, I like games, but I'm picky about any brain dead media. It is not something I generally enjoy in my free time. I liked Mass Effect 1 because I could pick on freaky aliens.

 

[Daidre]

Metacritic User Score is literaly useless. Even trash lik FO76 has 10/10 and good games 1/10. It's retarded. Open Critic is way better than Metacritic because it take in account all reviews across all system instead putting PC with 14 reviews then ps4 with 50+ then Xbox with 30. They let retarded journos but at least it much better than "Epic bad" 1/10 and "Obsidian good. Bethesda bad" 10/10.

Am I wrong or Open Critic does not have user reviews of any kind and deals only with "official" reviews from journos and some approved youtube "influencers"? And uses like/dislike ratio as its only unique site-specific metric?

Not the kind of data that makes me excited.

 

[JDR13]

You guys are the ones taking crazy pills. The game is awesome. Maybe you just secretly hate successful devs and people enjoying RPGs. You probably also hate RPGs if you don't like this game. Grow up. Adapt or be left in the dust. You're all too rigid. Weirdos.

Lol. I literally said I was the one who felt like I was taking crazy pills. What baffles me is the complete contradiction of my experience by the apparent experience of others.
I would genuinely like to enjoy this game. Tim and Leonard have been (and still are) some of my heroes for the work they've done.

Allow me to attempt to illustrate:

The quest to sober up Nyoka. This quest is part of the main story line and a way to get a new companion, so it's fairly major.
First of all, getting a hangover cure is a pretty contrived quest, but that's not a huge point.
Here's how the quest went for me:

1. Nyoka says she needs Caffenoid pills.
2. I go to the dispensary and talk to the lady.
3. She says Nyoka can't have any more Caffenoid pills.
   
4. She also literally tells me (a complete stranger) that she has a key to the storeroom and that there is a computer terminal upstairs that controls how many drugs people can have.
5. I walk upstairs to the terminal, hack it, up Nyoka's limit, go back downstairs and get the Caffenoid.
6. End of quest

Now, I also had enough intimidate to force her to give me the pills through dialog, and I may even have had enough lock-picking to open the storeroom.

In Fallout 1, in contrast, I would have been told to fuck off by the dispensary lady.
Then I could have intimidated her (if I had the skill),
or I would have had to look around the building and maybe notice the computer terminal and try to hack it (if I had the skill),
or maybe try picking the lady's pocket (if I had the skill),
or I could have searched around town and asked about Caffenoid and whether anyone knew where to get some or how to get into the storeroom.

But in TOW, 0 thinking was required to both advance the main story line and get a new companion. It may have even triggered a level up, I can't remember specifically, but it sure happens often enough.
The most I could have done was decide the scent of the air as a breezed through this, because I had 2 - 3 separate major options for completing the quest open to me without even planning for it, and it took 5 minutes.

Welcome to 2019.

 

[Child of Malkav]

Wasn't gonna say anything, yes. What Fluent fails to consider was your last paragraph. Zero thinking required. All your options are in your face, presented by an option in the "diaogue box", and there is no more than just that.
You are not required to do anything than click your preferred option it's over.

I don't understand what you're saying about options being presented in a dialogue box and not being more than that.
If you played Fallout 1 and 2 and if you invested into speech, a speech option would appear during dialogue. Now, the only difference between FO1/2 and FONV (in dialogue) is that the speech option is marked as such in NV but not in FO 1/2. In the latter, you need to pay attention and read carefully but even then the option becomes evident as it's simply the best one from all the options, the one that gives the best quest resolution.
Also, if you have the skill, you have the option. If you have enough lock picking then you can simply unlock the door. Do you want a minigame for it? The same thing with hacking. Or if you have high strength, you can break/kick the door open. Etc.

Do you not see the giant arrow pointing you from A to B as you shoot a thousand bandits on your way to talk to a guy so you can talk to another guy?
In fact, this is kind of irrelevant to the fact that it is simply not my kind of game. It is game foremost and RPG second. A toddler could play this "RPG".

You went from options being presented in the dialogue box to quest markers. Which can be turned off. Or so I've heard. The number of marauders should be reduced by at least 70%. And you don't need to kill them, you can sneak past them or just YOLO it and dash through.
This game pales in comparison to NV. It has good parts and bad parts. Worth 1 or 2 playthroughs.
Also, a toddler can play many games. They're not rocket science nor quantum physics. Games are made to be finished. Even the most obscure hints in various difficult games can be understood or noticed, it just depends on how much time you need to figure it out. After you finish a puzzle in a game and you replay it, when you reach that puzzle again you know how to solve it. Does it somehow diminish the value the game?
And if it's is not your kind of game, why are discussing this?

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

What Fluent fails to understand is every thing

ftfy.

 

[Hot Coldman]

Wasn't gonna say anything, yes. What Fluent fails to consider was your last paragraph. Zero thinking required. All your options are in your face, presented by an option in the "diaogue box", and there is no more than just that.
You are not required to do anything than click your preferred option it's over.

I don't understand what you're saying about options being presented in a dialogue box and not being more than that.
If you played Fallout 1 and 2 and if you invested into speech, a speech option would appear during dialogue. Now, the only difference between FO1/2 and FONV (in dialogue) is that the speech option is marked as such in NV but not in FO 1/2. In the latter, you need to pay attention and read carefully but even then the option becomes evident as it's simply the best one from all the options, the one that gives the best quest resolution.
Also, if you have the skill, you have the option. If you have enough lock picking then you can simply unlock the door. Do you want a minigame for it? The same thing with hacking. Or if you have high strength, you can break/kick the door open. Etc.

Do you not see the giant arrow pointing you from A to B as you shoot a thousand bandits on your way to talk to a guy so you can talk to another guy?
In fact, this is kind of irrelevant to the fact that it is simply not my kind of game. It is game foremost and RPG second. A toddler could play this "RPG".

You went from options being presented in the dialogue box to quest markers. Which can be turned off. Or so I've heard. The number of marauders should be reduced by at least 70%. And you don't need to kill them, you can sneak past them or just YOLO it and dash through.
This game pales in comparison to NV. It has good parts and bad parts. Worth 1 or 2 playthroughs.
Also, a toddler can play many games. They're not rocket science nor quantum physics. Games are made to be finished. Even the most obscure hints in various difficult games can be understood or noticed, it just depends on how much time you need to figure it out. After you finish a puzzle in a game and you replay it, when you reach that puzzle again you know how to solve it. Does it somehow diminish the value the game?
And if it's is not your kind of game, why are discussing this?

Yes, I went from dialogue to quest markers. The meat of the matter, what I and other people like LudensCogitet have said, is that it requires 0 thinking and we didn't enjoy that. FFS. Are you purposely dense?

 

[theremin]

Played up to Roseway and decided Obsidian had earned my my 60 bucs. Finished it. Feel kinda swindled. 45 would've been more appropriate, I think. But, hey, what game lives up to its (that) price tag nowadays?

Just wasn't a fulfilling experience for me. From Byzantium's Twin Elms-levels of incompleteness, the down right direct lifts from Firefly (Pavarti and Vicar being essentially plagiarism), the clunky, hook-less opening (from one pod to another pod ; A Tale of Two Pods), to the downright unforgivable lack of a main villain (was I supposed to know who that Sophia woman was?) it all just felt... shallow, a sentiment already expressed here. In the end, for a game marketed to me as "Bethesda ARPG, but with a good story!" I found the story woefully lacking.

The silver lining, I guess, is that competition is good, right? Free market and all that (lulz). Perhaps (and, I know how stupid this is going to sound) TOW will spur Bethesda's next endeavor to greater heights? Please? I like shooting/stabbing things, but I also like being motivated to shoot/stab things beyond "They're crazy, or whatever. Who cares? I, the hypothetical game developer in this already overly long post sure don't! Now collect your 10 bits, raptidon hide, and move the fuck along! We've got another fucking slideshow to get to!"

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

I love how Metacritic score on the Codex are simultaneously worthless and of utmost importance when the scores feed people's agenda.

 

[Crichton]

You guys are the ones taking crazy pills. The game is awesome. Maybe you just secretly hate successful devs and people enjoying RPGs. You probably also hate RPGs if you don't like this game. Grow up. Adapt or be left in the dust. You're all too rigid. Weirdos.

Lol. I literally said I was the one who felt like I was taking crazy pills. What baffles me is the complete contradiction of my experience by the apparent experience of others.
I would genuinely like to enjoy this game. Tim and Leonard have been (and still are) some of my heroes for the work they've done.

Allow me to attempt to illustrate:

The quest to sober up Nyoka. This quest is part of the main story line and a way to get a new companion, so it's fairly major.
First of all, getting a hangover cure is a pretty contrived quest, but that's not a huge point.
Here's how the quest went for me:

1. Nyoka says she needs Caffenoid pills.
2. I go to the dispensary and talk to the lady.
3. She says Nyoka can't have any more Caffenoid pills.
   
4. She also literally tells me (a complete stranger) that she has a key to the storeroom and that there is a computer terminal upstairs that controls how many drugs people can have.
5. I walk upstairs to the terminal, hack it, up Nyoka's limit, go back downstairs and get the Caffenoid.
6. End of quest

Now, I also had enough intimidate to force her to give me the pills through dialog, and I may even have had enough lock-picking to open the storeroom.

In Fallout 1, in contrast, I would have been told to fuck off by the dispensary lady.
Then I could have intimidated her (if I had the skill),
or I would have had to look around the building and maybe notice the computer terminal and try to hack it (if I had the skill),
or maybe try picking the lady's pocket (if I had the skill),
or I could have searched around town and asked about Caffenoid and whether anyone knew where to get some or how to get into the storeroom.

But in TOW, 0 thinking was required to both advance the main story line and get a new companion. It may have even triggered a level up, I can't remember specifically, but it sure happens often enough.
The most I could have done was decide the scent of the air as a breezed through this, because I had 2 - 3 separate major options for completing the quest open to me without even planning for it, and it took 5 minutes.

I don't have any opinion on this directly since I'm waiting for a Steam release (and a substantial) discount on Outer Worlds, but I can't help but notice that your critique is an almost 1:1 match for JarlFrank's critque of Age of Decadence. There may be some people who simply can't stand the CYOA system of laying everything out in dialog.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

I don't have any opinion on this directly since I'm waiting for a Steam release (and a substantial) discount on Outer Worlds, but I can't help but notice that your critique is an almost 1:1 match for JarlFrank's critque of Age of Decadence. There may be some people who simply can't stand the CYOA system of laying everything out in dialog.

That's not the issue at all. You don't do these things in dialogue. The issue is that this pharmacist woman is the roadblock. You need to get around her. You can just persuade her to give you the pills--fine, good. But there are two alternative ways to solve the quest: you can break into the store room or you can hack the computer--both good! The problem is that the woman who's supposed to be the roadblock directs you to both of these options. You don't need to explore or sneak around. What's the point of having these systems if you don't use them? You just follow her directions, which is weird because she should be the person who's trying to prevent you from breaking into the storeroom or hacking the computer.

The thing is, TOW is not at all a dialogue mediated game like AOD. You actually have to act this stuff out in the world. But when the NPCs who should be trying to make your job more difficult instead go out of their way to hold your hand and make it easier, that takes a lot of fun out of the experience.

Edit: this is a pseudo open world game that rarely gives you the chance to be clever.

 

[Child of Malkav]

Wasn't gonna say anything, yes. What Fluent fails to consider was your last paragraph. Zero thinking required. All your options are in your face, presented by an option in the "diaogue box", and there is no more than just that.
You are not required to do anything than click your preferred option it's over.

I don't understand what you're saying about options being presented in a dialogue box and not being more than that.
If you played Fallout 1 and 2 and if you invested into speech, a speech option would appear during dialogue. Now, the only difference between FO1/2 and FONV (in dialogue) is that the speech option is marked as such in NV but not in FO 1/2. In the latter, you need to pay attention and read carefully but even then the option becomes evident as it's simply the best one from all the options, the one that gives the best quest resolution.
Also, if you have the skill, you have the option. If you have enough lock picking then you can simply unlock the door. Do you want a minigame for it? The same thing with hacking. Or if you have high strength, you can break/kick the door open. Etc.

Do you not see the giant arrow pointing you from A to B as you shoot a thousand bandits on your way to talk to a guy so you can talk to another guy?
In fact, this is kind of irrelevant to the fact that it is simply not my kind of game. It is game foremost and RPG second. A toddler could play this "RPG".

You went from options being presented in the dialogue box to quest markers. Which can be turned off. Or so I've heard. The number of marauders should be reduced by at least 70%. And you don't need to kill them, you can sneak past them or just YOLO it and dash through.
This game pales in comparison to NV. It has good parts and bad parts. Worth 1 or 2 playthroughs.
Also, a toddler can play many games. They're not rocket science nor quantum physics. Games are made to be finished. Even the most obscure hints in various difficult games can be understood or noticed, it just depends on how much time you need to figure it out. After you finish a puzzle in a game and you replay it, when you reach that puzzle again you know how to solve it. Does it somehow diminish the value the game?
And if it's is not your kind of game, why are discussing this?

Yes, I went from dialogue to quest markers. The meat of the matter, what I and other people like LudensCogitet have said, is that it requires 0 thinking and we didn't enjoy that. FFS. Are you purposely dense?

Wow ok. What a waste of time this was. Anyway your opinion is duly noted. You are entitled to it as am I to mine.

 

[Wesp5]

The meat of the matter, what I and other people like LudensCogitet have said, is that it requires 0 thinking and we didn't enjoy that.

I completely agree with that. All the options and stats are there, but they don't really matter because the game is much too easy! You get endless XP, weapons, ammo and items. And I guess this is all intended to get the usual Bethesda crowd to play the game, and maybe some others not into RPGs at all too. Which seemed to have worked fine...