Wizardry The Wizardry Series Thread

[Luzur]

The Siroteks really were cheap when it came to the early PC Wizardries.


Hardcore Gaming 101 has finished Stones of Arnhem and Wiz 8. Next up is the Japanese games.

So Stones of Arnhem is really Wizard And Warriors accroding to HG101?

 

[octavius]

2. What were the release dates for the SNES/Super Famicom versions of Wiz 1-3? They are strangely absent from MobyGames.

The guy who translated the SNES release mentions the 1st January 1996 (http://agtp.romhack.net/project.php?id=wizardry), GameFaqs has the 1st June 1999 (http://www.gamefaqs.com/snes/944492-wizardry-i-ii-iii-the-story-of-llylgamyn/data). A few years ago I compiled a list with all the release years for all SNES games from some website, and that list mentions 1995, so I guess the one from the translator is probably pretty close (and I don't really trust GameFaqs in these matters).

Thanks. It seems the Wiz 1-3 were released after Wiz 5-6 on the SNES, then.
I think I'll add them late 1995 on my chronological play list. They have enough differences, and good enough artwork, to be worth playing even though I completed the DOS versions of Wiz 1-3.

 

[Scroo]

I bought a Wiz VI manual in German from ebay for like 50 cents. It's incredible how manuals were back then and it's a really entertaining read. Sometimes I wish I could have experienced these days.

Yeh, my cam sucks ^^

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

It was an amazing time. Waiting many months for something you knew was coming, with a smattering of news here and there in mags or occasionally over Fido (BBS days).

When the day finally came and the box was actually in my hands, I remember reveling in every moment of discovery. Even system specs were worth reading to see how your system measured up- either boss mode or wondering what marvels those who had higher specs might see differently or better. The manuals were read cover to cover - once for sheer enjoyment and again when it was time to get serious. Back then I remembered laughing at the small number of blank lined pages at the back for notes. Like anyone would use just a few pages and spoil the manual no less. Still it was cool that they were there, a reminder that you'd better keep clean notes.

You can still do this Scrooge. I am really thinking about starting to collect. I missed a lot of the glorious first person crawlers because I was completely absorbed in the Ultimas. I'd like to find and buy boxed copies of some of the classics I missed from back in the day and relive the experience from admiring the box to reading the manual, then I can grab whatever the most recent media is for the title and play it in the sipirit of purity.

Fuck I am getting old.

 

[octavius]

I wish I had the same memories if Bane of the Cosmic Fore.
I hadn't played Wiz 1-5, and was barely aware of their existence, but Bane was the first in the series available for the Amiga. I think I bought after my gaming buddy had shown me a cracked copy and it seemed very fun. It was fun to, but alas my quest came to an end when I saved after surviving a major fireball in the Temple of the Amazulus. When I reloaded the trap set off again, killing my entire party.
I still have the nice fat manual in nice condition, though, and I completed the DOS version twice.

 

[Malignant Manor]

The Siroteks really were cheap when it came to the early PC Wizardries.


Hardcore Gaming 101 has finished Stones of Arnhem and Wiz 8. Next up is the Japanese games.

So Stones of Arnhem is really Wizard And Warriors accroding to HG101?

I think they mean it as an alternate Wiz 8 like Stones of Arnhem. They label W&W as a related game (to SoA).

 

[Dominae]

The Siroteks really were cheap when it came to the early PC Wizardries.


Hardcore Gaming 101 has finished Stones of Arnhem and Wiz 8. Next up is the Japanese games.

So Stones of Arnhem is really Wizard And Warriors accroding to HG101?

I think they mean it as an alternate Wiz 8 like Stones of Arnhem. They label W&W as a related game (to SoA).

W&W was Bradley's f@ck-you to Sirtech for not keeping him around to finish what he considered his trilogy of games (Wiz 6-8). He wandered off and basically cranked out W&W (after much delays) with his own studio. A lot of things in W&W are slight renames or remeshes of Wizardry bits & pieces. I mean ... the anthropomorphic animal people (Elephant dudes instead of Umpani, etc), the phoot-like plant monsters .. and on and on.

That is how it is "related", but it kinda' isn't. Think of it like a "what if" Bradley was around ... Wiz8 may have been what W&W ended up being. It almost feels like a reskin in a lot of ways.

 

[octavius]

Wasn't Bradley's problem (and thus indirectly Sir-Tech's) that he was not comfortable working in a group? That's the impression I get from all the interviews with other Sir-Tech people.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

Yes that is the Sir-Tech line. I wonder what the other side of that coin looks like. Has there been a retrospective interview with Bradley?

 

[bussinrounds]

So I started playing Wizardry 5 - Heart of the Maelstrom.

Was rolling out a party for this on the psp (SNES version) the last few nights while watching the game and this just happened...

:kwafuckyeah:

The other night I was rolling for a while before I even got a 'rare' bonus roll. (over 10)

And yea, has Matt tried to get a hold of Bradley ? Maybe he's a real sensitive guy or something and he should promise not to mention Dung lords ?

 

[cvv]

Yeah, would love to hear from Bradley too. It used to be my favourite dev - Wiz7 is the best RPG ever made plus Wiz6 and W&W are great too - and his decline annoyed me for years. I'd really like to know wtf happened to this guy.

Btw still waiting for the damn GOG to bring those W&W back

 

[Melan]

He is a mysterious character. Every dev under the sun who used to be someone in the 90s has been interviewed to hell and back (and people like Garriott/Molyneux have regular cults around them), but I can't remember a single interview where someone could get hold of Bradley.

If he ever did a Kickstarter for something even approaching Wizardry VII...

 

[cvv]

If he ever did a Kickstarter for something even approaching Wizardry VII...

When I came to Codex I thought Cleve is Bradley's alt.

Deep down I stilll do.

 

[QuestionMan]

Thank you for hinting to the Hardcore101 article!

I thought it was my wrong imagination, false memory, a dream, brainwashed etc. but now I know it was true! In an old magazine some 16 years ago I once saw screenshots of an RPG showing a full party in 3D following you through the dungeons. All characters were featured in 3D, running, fighting and camping with you, looking from 1st person view. Gave an "awesomeness" impression. A real fantasy party with real battles. A backup you could actually see in the combat. You and your team. However time passed and I forgot the title, never found it again (of course the name changed multiple times). When Wizards & Warriors was finally released it looked similar, but since it was changed in various aspects I thought "But that other one had this and that... no... it can't be that"... well it can.

The article confirms that the old version featured optional 3rd person view - meaning the characters were displayed as 3D in the world. You could switch the view from 1st to 3rd person anytime you wished. Hey - RPG developers from nowadays - you read that? You can have BOTH, not only either isometric or Skyrim style.

I know the complexities of game development and pathfinding so I can understand why they changed it after all, but still kinda disappointed in the end. One thing I personally find unfortunate also is, that I find the old layout from Swords & Sorcery looked much better than the final version (old one had 3 portraits each side, very clean symmetrical interface).

 

[octavius]

Yeah, would love to hear from Bradley too. It used to be my favourite dev - Wiz7 is the best RPG ever made plus Wiz6 and W&W are great too - and his decline annoyed me for years. I'd really like to know wtf happened to this guy.

This is just speculation, but I guess Bradley suffers from some personality disorder (social anxiety and/or being a total control freak maybe) that makes it hard for him to work with a team.
So as AAA games became ever more difficult to produce as a one man team, quality started to suffer.
But it sure would have been nice to hear from the man himself.

 

[Machocruz]

So for those of you who played Wizardry V SNES ,in the pre internet days: did you bother grinding cash for that item that gives you unlimited Lumapic, or did you just map yourself and buy it at whatever point you got the cash? Or did you just ignore it completely?

I've only made cursory exploration into the 3rd floor in my game. It was suggested in a guide to grind that shrine on Floor 2 that releases bats when you answer the question wrong, but it looks like that would take hours and hours. I'm wondering if it would be more time efficient to build up cash by just progressing through the game (under the assumption that encounters give up more gold the lower you go), or to grind this sonuvabitch. Why not just use internet maps? I have some, but they're all for the computer version, which I've heard has some differences. And graphing by hand is a last resort.

 

[octavius]

Using your hand is always the last resort. Unfortunately I don't have a wife, girlfriend or secretary to do the mapping for me.

Building up cash by playing normally sure is more fun than grinding and using premade maps.
But I've found that Wiz 5 is more grindy or slower than Wiz 1-3 thanks to how secret doors work. The Light spells will no longer show where secret doors are, and there are more closed off areas, combined which means a slower game. I miss the brisk pace with which I could play Wiz 1-3. In Wiz 5 I feel compelled to search every wall to closed off areas searching for secret doors, and I still haven't found one.

 

[bussinrounds]

Fuck pre made maps. Kinda defeats the purpose.

 

[octavius]

Due to some info scrolling too fast for me to screen cap it, and my party being too cheap to pay for another consultant fee to the Duck of Sparks, I decided to check out part of a Let's Play on YouTube. Of course it was a Nintendo version, and the censorship is so laughable that instead of asking for a drink Renegade Rob asks for a soda.
And enemies are not killed, they are "destroyed"
And the Duck of Sparks no longer talks about spirits, but "ghosts", thus ruining the pun. Those fucking Nintendo people and their fucking censorship; how I despise them.

 

[TigerKnee]

You should probably blame the Americans at Nintendo there, JP Nintendo is much more lenient concerning this kind of humor and themes.

 

[octavius]

You should probably blame the Americans at Nintendo there, JP Nintendo is much more lenient concerning this kind of humor and themes.

You're probably right. I have censored edited my post accordingly.

 

[QuestionMan]

Wasn't Bradley's problem (and thus indirectly Sir-Tech's) that he was not comfortable working in a group? That's the impression I get from all the interviews with other Sir-Tech people.

This is just speculation, but I guess Bradley suffers from some personality disorder (social anxiety and/or being a total control freak maybe) that makes it hard for him to work with a team.
So as AAA games became ever more difficult to produce as a one man team, quality started to suffer.
But it sure would have been nice to hear from the man himself.

Interesting and very unfortunate point, if true. Then we'll never see a W&W successor. Why must the geniouses always be handicapped socially
Maybe the codex should make an interview with him?

 

[Lord Azlan]

Well, well, well. 8 hours into Wizardy 8 and god damn it -it's pretty good.

The only issue seems to be the lengthy combat, but I found a mod on the web that fixes that for me. I also seen some other mods patches highlighted in this forum - but not used them yet.

It makes me wonder what I have been doing all these years where decent RPG have sort of been just sitting there under my nose - shame on me.

Completed the Monastry and now out and about in the real world. It has taken a while to get used to the interface and the damn 5 trillion options you have nearly all the time - quite fascinating actually. Going with default party except swapped out a fighter for another Ninja. Don't ask me why - I just wanted to explore the character creation process and modelled the new one on someone I know.

It has taken me a while to adjust to the Quake like real time movement compared to the turn based combat. Okay for now. I understand how the combat from distance adds to the strategy element - did not like it so much - but assuming with a speed fix added that should sort itself out. The only time any of my party died so far was when I ignored advice given to me by EVERYONE and did not use the environment to my advantage in combat and was surrounded by about 11 ants, after a fight with about 12 enemies and my little fairie mage at the back got killed. Saying that, I liked that a re-load was not required and I used some special powder to bring her back from the netherworld. Good stuff indeed.

Music and graphics all fine. Had an issue getting movement working but changing the DirectX fixed that.

No bugs or crashes at all. It even has a map that you can annotate - what has happened to Games' Developers I ask since then?

Looking back - I reckon it was 1994 when Arena came out I stopped playing turn based RPGS. Savant came out in 1992 which I remember vaguely playing a bit. I am assuming there are decades of turn based goodness available for me now.

Onwards!

 

[octavius]

By Jove, Wizardy 5 is getting tedious!
Currently exploring level 4, which boils down to mapping a long, long maze, get beheaded by some monks and ninjas, then head back to the castle ('cause my guys haven't got any Teleport, Life or Recall spell yet), then spend all my hard earned money, explore a few more squares if I'm lucky, and then have party member getting beheaded again. And those that don't get beheaded get magic drained, paralyzed or poisoned.

I've searched hundreds of wall units, but not found one fucking secret door so far. And you have to hit several keys just to search one wall unit, which is tedious.
After my last foray I had not enough gold to resurrect two of my guys, but my Priest was only 7,000 XP away from a new level (hopefully getting the Life spell), so I decided to systemetically search the whole perimeter of lvl 1 for secret doors.
I finally found one, leading to a large area, inside which there was a new secret door in a buidling of four rooms. There was a message - Adix Non Viote Monous - which apparantly means "Don't Enter Alone". Does this mean I need an NPC in the party? From CRPG Addict's blog I seem to recall him talking about NPCs that could join the party.
Anyway, the last of the four rooms contained a chute which ignored my Levitate spell (how cute), which dropped my party all the way down to lvl 6. Needless to say my weakened party did not last long against monsters with a fuckton of HP, spell resistance and Paralyze attacks. I could swear I could hear Dewey Bradley going Mwahahaha! while twirling his mustache...

This game is so fucking SLOOOOOOOOOOOOOW.
It started very promising, with large levels (reminded my of the Dungeon Master levels), that are more properly interconnected than previous Wizardries (stairs and elevators line up properly, but pits don't), and more unlinear levels.
Sadly, there does not seem to be any short cuts, so there is a fuckload of walking back and forth the same corriodors over and again and over again.

Of the first five Wizardries the only one that is prefectly balanced, both difficulty wise and game pace wise, is the first one.

As it is Wiz 5 is starting to become interesting only to see how Bradly reused puzzles in later games, Wiz 6 used things from Wiz 5 like the Dwarven smith and the engineering puzzle, while Wiz 7 used the Swimming skill, an object that gives 100% Swimming skill and the silly Priests.

 

[Crooked Bee]

Of the first five Wizardries the only one that is prefectly balanced, both difficulty wise and game pace wise, is the first one.

Yeah, I always thought Wizardry 1 is kinda underrated, especially when it comes to playing the series today. In a sense, it remains a perfectly designed game.