Wizardry The Wizardry Series Thread

[DraQ]

God, playing Ironman with a completely experimental party. That takes some ballballs.

Why? I've completed this game several times already. I'll FFFUUU- if I get TPKd, but it won't actually waste my time. I know most of the content this game has to offer, so my playthrough isn't oriented towards experiencing new stuff that would require playing through already seen content repeatedly on failure.
Any new stuff I'll see or not in Wizardry 8 will be restricted to gameplay and gameplay alone, and thus it will be unique and won't repeat, as gameplay is different with different parties and RNG rolls anyway.

OTOH playing ironman provides thrill that would be hard to replicate otherwise and it actually enriches the gameplay, by allowing situations I wouldn't experience normally due to feeling screwed beyond all hope and reloading.
Surviving such situations is extremely memorable and satisfactory.

I'm not a fan of ironman in general, because I consider the price of failure too hefty, but pressing player into undesirable situations without giving them feasible easy way out by reloading (ironman, delayed consequences, etc.) almost inevitably results in much richer and better gameplay than just providing them with unbroken string of boring 'awesome' successes.

Hmm.... Well, even then, the likelihood of your whole party dying in combat is extremely low, especially if you powergame. It has literally never happened to me except during my first playthrough - with Nessie (I was unprepared & underleveled, but even then if I wasn't such an idiot I could have simply ran), and that weird suprise buttsex unique creature by late-late game (one that ignores all resistances to insane/turncoat etc. everyone in 1 turn).

It works quite a bit differently in ironman. Normally you won't really see the game over screen because you will reload much earlier (unless you really own in this game). On ironman small failures tend to accumulate and there is no "I'll try to battle this monster" - do or do not, there is no try.

Oh, and I savescum and keep backups exclusively in case of game/system fucking up.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

So, I'm going to start a new game using some rather odd, but not necessarily out there characters/races

Was wondering what made a very high chance lightning strike samurai?
Does anyone know what Lightning Strike's stats, well what it draws from specifically, are?

Edit:
Also, anyone know any good mods for this? I've heard Flamestryke's mod is pretty good. I did a bit way back when, not too difficult to do it.

 

[hoverdog]

I'm currently using christian coder's ( ) mod, a small one that only modifies things like class requirements, skills (for example, lord is now more of a tank and specializes in shield rather than dual wielding) and adds more items. I've played Dodd's mod before, and it's good if vanilla doesn't pose a challenge to you, but some textures and creatures are just fugly.


I changed my team, now it's staff-wielding dwarf monk (again), wolfie lord, dracon ninja (thanks to Renegen for the idea), cat gadgeteer, elf alchemist and gnome bishop. Ninja rocks my socks, leads the party in kills, even though he was to specialize in daggers but found his first ones in Arnika . The monk, on the other hand, is made of fail: having 17% damage reduction is nice, but deals shit damage, is worse in battle than my alchemist (who's third in kills somehow), and has no magic to speak of. In terms of progress, I've just killed the rat breeders (it was surprisingly easy to be honest) and am en route to Marten's Bluff.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Monk Dwarf doesnt get nasty til mid or higher level. Real tough to work with at the beginning. Eventually will strike 3x per turn each hand

 

[catfood]

I'm currently using christian coder's ( ) mod, a small one that only modifies things like class requirements, skills (for example, lord is now more of a tank and specializes in shield rather than dual wielding) and adds more items. I've played Dodd's mod before, and it's good if vanilla doesn't pose a challenge to you, but some textures and creatures are just fugly.


I changed my team, now it's staff-wielding dwarf monk (again), wolfie lord, dracon ninja (thanks to Renegen for the idea), cat gadgeteer, elf alchemist and gnome bishop. Ninja rocks my socks, leads the party in kills, even though he was to specialize in daggers but found his first ones in Arnika . The monk, on the other hand, is made of fail: having 17% damage reduction is nice, but deals shit damage, is worse in battle than my alchemist (who's third in kills somehow), and has no magic to speak of. In terms of progress, I've just killed the rat breeders (it was surprisingly easy to be honest) and am en route to Marten's Bluff.

I have a staff weilding monk as well (but mine's an elf) and I have the same problems as you. She's level 15 and does pitiful damage, I count myself lucky if she does 10 per hit. She doesn't even have that many attacks per round either. Meanwhile RFS-81 is owning house. I just finished maxin dex and speed for her and started investing in the newly unlocked skills, but I read in a guide that for a staff build it is necessary do develop strength first. Anyone know if there's any truth to that? Not that it matters at this point of course, but I'd like to know for the future.

On the other hand her psionics is developing really nicely with minimal skill point ivestemnt at level up thanks to the identify item grinding semi-exploit, and coupled with her high speed she can drive enemies insane as soon as the battle starts. :D

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Want an interesting monk build?
Fairy Monk, female, unarmed.
That's all you'll need. Faeries make the best psionics around, coupled with no need for a weapon.
Only problem is health and initially low strength. But that shouldn't be a problem in the long run of it.
Or, if you want an unconscious making machine, get a dwarf and give him dual nunchuks.
Want insanely high damage?
Give a Rogue Bloodlust, and if you want, make him a lizardman.

Another build that has at least some damage capabilities?
Priest, almost any race, ebon staff.

Other than that, let's see.
Samurai: If you want a melee heavy build that can simply butcher everything in it's path, go Lizardman or Dracon.
These guys will take a little bit of time to build up, but they are insanely badass.
Or go a hobbit. Great senses, amazing speed, will instakill with the best of them.

Ranger is a tough role to go without once you've had them. Good ranged capabilities, but overall not the best class in the game.
You should focus on ranged combat then alchemy, but if you want alchemy magic, go Gnome or Elf Alch then switch to ranger later on.

 

[Deitti]

Last time i played this game, i didn't get all that far thanks to having too many games piled up on me. Now however i wanna play this game through finally, and im planning my party, but one thing i wanna know is can hybrids become good enough replacements for some of the caster types. For example if i would start INT/DEX Samurai, would that class be able to replace any mage or other wizardry users? this is with full 6 character party that is.

what about the other magic types?

 

[Kashrlyyk]

... I just finished maxin dex and speed for her and started investing in the newly unlocked skills, but I read in a guide that for a staff build it is necessary do develop strength first. Anyone know if there's any truth to that? Not that it matters at this point of course, but I'd like to know for the future.

Every skill has two controlling attributes which determine how fast she skill grows if you use it. For weapons they are practically always strength and dexterity. For martial arts it's dexterity and speed. If I remember correctly RFS-81 starts with a pretty high strength value. Do a quick calculation to see if you can raise strength to high levels or not before the game is over. I think it is relatively easy to reach level 22.

Also there are some really strong staffs out there that will deal lots of damage even with low strength.

Last time i played this game, i didn't get all that far thanks to having too many games piled up on me. Now however i wanna play this game through finally, and im planning my party, but one thing i wanna know is can hybrids become good enough replacements for some of the caster types. For example if i would start INT/DEX Samurai, would that class be able to replace any mage or other wizardry users? this is with full 6 character party that is.

what about the other magic types?

Theoretically, yes! BUT your samurai will be sitting in the front row most likely, so the moment enemies get into melee range his melee attack will probably be more useful than the magic. So it will be quite hard to raise some of the magic skills. But you can have a samurai who knows and can use ALL mage spells. The same goes for all the other hybrids too. It just takes planning, effort and time.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

First off to that: a big fucking no.
Hybrids aint that great for casting unless you focus on casting specifically. And really, alot of hybrids are probably best played as combat heavy with a touch of magic. However, there aren't many hybrids you'd want to start off playing as.
For example, Lord. Don't start playing as one, or a valkyrie for that matter (unless for Valk you intend to go combat heavy). These guys don't get good at healing for the most part.
What you want to do is this: Start with a priest, get to a high level, the switch to Valk or Lord.
Samurai isn't much of a spellcaster at all but he is dangerous in melee and that's what counts.
Same for Ninja though from what I hear, they can get really good with Alchemy if you use faerie or something.
Ranger: stick to ranged combat. Don't bother with magic except for maybe some earth spells. Outside of that they're kinda useless for magic.

So there you have it: mage classes are awesome. Bard is amazing. The base classes will level relatively quickly but can be kinda boring. Rogue is good and absolutely necessary if you want to get some of the crazy shit (like any badass polearms, etc.) Valk is an awesome tank class if built properly, but don't focus on magic with her. Rather, get the polearm shit up to snuff and then worry on magic.

Edit: Also, anyone know how to install this fucker on Vista 64?
Yeah I know, fucking sucks and all that. Had it a while ago on my PC, but I had the warehouse guys work on it and give it some updates and all that shit, and now the fucker won't install. Goddamn.

 

[Renegen]

I find the Lords and Valkyries to be the best hybrids because of healing. All you need is a high powered heal here and there or a bless and it makes all the difference. But a true divine caster also has water spells for buffing, and they will be lacking those. Generally, you must boost skills at level up if you want those skills to be good, if not they will always be second rate.

 

[catfood]

I find the Lords and Valkyries to be the best hybrids because of healing. All you need is a high powered heal here and there or a bless and it makes all the difference. But a true divine caster also has water spells for buffing, and they will be lacking those. Generally, you must boost skills at level up if you want those skills to be good, if not they will always be second rate.

The good thing is the key defensive divine spells, heal, magic screen and soul shield are all under divine magic, so it's easier to build their respective skills to a decent level with minimal grinding.

Every skill has two controlling attributes which determine how fast she skill grows if you use it. For weapons they are practically always strength and dexterity. For martial arts it's dexterity and speed. If I remember correctly RFS-81 starts with a pretty high strength value. Do a quick calculation to see if you can raise strength to high levels or not before the game is over. I think it is relatively easy to reach level 22.

Yeah, RFS starts with 70 in strength. His dex is initially in the 50s I think. My monk has now has 55ish strength, so I'lll probably manage to get it to 70 before I hit 22.

 

[Deitti]

thanks for the answers, guess ill ignore the magic part on hybrids mostly then and focus on having proper casters in the party. one more question, if i wanted to make dependable damage dealer who uses swords in my party, which would be better, dual-wielding fighter or dual-wielding samurai? incase of the samurai, if i focus only on the physical part of the class, would samurai still get any spells that might benefit him during combat?

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Samurai or Fighter? Hard to say.
More dependable and survivable? Fighter, hands down.
The Samurai is a fighter with a bit of randomness and magic thrown in.
Samurai can get some wizardry spells, such as Enchant edge, which is very good for penetration, etc.
Fighter Gets Berserk, doing a shitton of damage per swing.
Samurai can Lightning Strike, doing 4x or 6x attacks per round with primary weapon on a single enemy.
Fighter Gets Berserk, doing a shitton of damage per swing.
Samurai has the chance to perform a critical strike, which can instantly kill certain enemies.
Fighter Gets Berserk, doing a shitton of damage per swing.
Fighter also gets the increased ability to knock an enemy unconscious as well, and gets increased stamina regeneration.
Get yourself a female fighter and give her a stam regen pendant or two and she'll never stop swinging.
Samurai is fearless.

Fighter's downsides? It's fucking boring. Versatile with weapons, but nothing crazy beyond that. Guaranteed winner? Hell yes. Guaranteed to put you to sleep? Hell yes.

Samurai's downsides? Less survivable. Needs more work. Can also suffer from the fact that you can build it wrong. Also, there's a bit of randomness to the Samurai.
I once did on a shitton of Rapax with my Dracon Samurai four instakills in a row and a lightning strike, all in a single fight.
Could never really replicate that performance reliably.

 

[Rpgsaurus Rex]

Was wondering what made a very high chance lightning strike samurai?
Does anyone know what Lightning Strike's stats, well what it draws from specifically, are?

No one knows, even the most dedicated modders / FAQ writers admit to having no clue. It's probably random.

Also, anyone know any good mods for this? I've heard Flamestryke's mod is pretty good. I did a bit way back when, not too difficult to do it.

Personally, I've played Dodd's and Reforged, but got too bored with either about 80% way through.

Both are huge and extend the game's length by far more than 2x, adding a shitton of new monsters and locations. Both also up the difficulty, you have to have a balanced party or you're screwed (esp. in Dodd's). In Dodd's there willl be like groups of 6 mobs with stuff like 10 attacks per round *each* with each attack 50% chance of instant kill or turncoat or some shit. Dodd's is also a more challenging one, with better encounter design for your maxed-out party, pushing the character system "to the limit". Reforged feels more "polished" on locations and mobs, but is IMO too uneven on gameplay - 90% piss easy combat 5% interesting 5% hard, while Dodd's more challenging overall.

In any case Wiz8 breaks down at higher lvls. (e.g. maxed out resistances cease to matter, damage spells cease to matter, there's little variety to what items can give you, etc.)

Overall they all suck compared to original Wiz8. The "feel" of the original is mostly gone in new places / with new mobs - poor texturing/modeling/location design overall, but understandable given how hard it is for one or two people to make a mod like that. My advice is just play the original Wiz8, and if you get bored play another dungeon crawler. There are a lot of good/great ones, and a quite few good ones come out each year...

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Thats too bad. They don't really need to add new enemies. Game has so fucking many. Just do what the creators did and just update the existing ones. Don't even need new skins or anything, just give em new stats, etc.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Also, did anyone ever work to the point to get excaliber or any of the other super weapons? Gotta be a fucking ridiculous level for that.

 

[DraQ]

Give a Rogue Bloodlust, and if you want, make him a lizardman.

I'm more partial to Dracon - has more style and acid breaths is a good way to say "fuck you" to lack of ranged weapons.

Another build that has at least some damage capabilities?
Priest, almost any race, ebon staff.

Why not replace it later on with Staff of Doom?

Fighter Gets Berserk, doing a shitton of damage per swing.
Samurai has the chance to perform a critical strike, which can instantly kill certain enemies.

Give your Samurai Bloodlust for berserk, bonuses to init and sword skill (IIRC) and extra swing (moar instakills)?

...shit, one thing I would really change in Wiz8 classes is give Lord additional special ability - ignore cursed status.

Would mesh awesomely with HP regen and would offset shitty class skill (dual wield flattens over 100) as well as poor offensive magic.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

That would make it too OP'd tho. Ignoring cursed status is waay too powerful. What class does that?
Some have Remove Curse, but nothing crazy like that shit.

Edit: Some of the nastier weapons are cursed with stuff like HP drain or Stam drain. Ignoring those effects would basically make those weapons ultimate weapons.

 

[DraQ]

That would make it too OP'd tho. Ignoring cursed status is waay too powerful. What class does that?
Some have Remove Curse, but nothing crazy like that shit.

Edit: Some of the nastier weapons are cursed with stuff like HP drain or Stam drain. Ignoring those effects would basically make those weapons ultimate weapons.

All maluses would work as usual, only the sticky thing would be gone.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Ahh, that would be good. A nice little bonus really.

Edit: Hell, why not. The HP regen increase isn't really that great, not nearly as the Valk's ability to cheat death. Now THATS a bonus ability.

 

[DraQ]

Ahh, that would be good. A nice little bonus really.

Edit: Hell, why not. The HP regen increase isn't really that great, not nearly as the Valk's ability to cheat death. Now THATS a bonus ability.

The HP regen is only actually useful to allow cursed stuff without +HP items, so why not go the entire way and make Lord a shining incorruptible fighter blahblah class that's built around ability to handle cursed equipment while shrugging off the curses or at least their worst part?

Being able to actually pull out your bow/3-shot xbow/blunderbuss when swinging bloodlust, or equip one of those nasty, yet awesome cursed polearms when the enemy hits your casters in the ass and leg would be a nice compensation for the lack of all that flashy cheat deaths, lighting strikes, berserks, backstabs, critical strike, or KO chance on everything.



Oh, one more thing - triple base damage on Axe of Many Runes or GTFO.
I mean - what the fuck is the point of that weapon? It's no better than all that high-end maces and swords, but unlike them you can only swing it with your anus?


(Also offhand beastslayer)

 

[Shadenuat]

t, not nearly as the Valk's ability to cheat death

Ahh Valk. First time i've beaten game with my own Valk in party, I still can see the consequences somewhere.. yeah, here, in this notebook of mine, there is a list of group of characters I tried last, and there is big heart drawn with red pen near one:
"Valkyrie (dwarf or human)/ STR + PIE first / DEX + SPD last".
I did't have cleric in party, so I've created this hybrid character. She ended up as tough as a fighter, with good resistances (max strength and piety first, remember?) and in the latter part of the game she started gathering dexterity and speed and I think I armed her with some staff, not a halberd/spear. What a kickassu character.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

I love Valks. And Draq, your sarcasm is not necessary. The HP regen of Lord certainly did not counter balance the effect of draining curses. The ability to ignore the unremovable effect (or act like a bishop or priest and remove it with a spell-like ability) would have been a boon.

 

[moraes]

Started replaying this recently, my party:

Mook Fighter
Dwarf Valkyrie
Hobbit Gadgeteer
Faerie Ninja
Elf Alchemist
Elf Bishop

My valkyrie will concentrate on being a good fighter first, so I'm pumping STR + DEX. Later I'll pump SPD + VIT.
The bishop will concentrate on Divinity and Wizardry.
The alchemist will cover Alchemy (obviously).
Psionics gets left behind.

My question is: realms skills go up very slowly for my bishop. I'm forced to waste 6 skill points in Divinity and Wizardry every level up and only get another 3 to distribute between the realms. Should I play like a retard, casting non-combat spells like Light whenever I can or should I just play "normally"? Also, what are the most useful realms for a Divinity/Wizardry caster? Should I save spell picks for later and buy books for the weak spells?

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Train your spells if you can but don't let it slow you down.
For divinity, gotta be divine realm. Download the instruction manual, has all the spellbooks and spells under each section.
Save spell picks, buy books (or steal) from Braffit and others.
You definitely need someone who can pickpocket for that tho, a good thief really.
Lets see, other than that? Not a bad loadout.
Alchemist will ensure pretty much that you'll never want for cash. Still you should steal anyway, just to get some really good rare drops, like the Raven's Bill, etc from Antone and other characters.

If I can get my game to actually install, I'm gonna go with the following character included in my party
Lizardman Fighter. Yeah, I know, totally unimagined, but he'll level up fast enough (and max out stats quickly enough) where I can really start switching him up with another class pretty quickly. By level 6, I might be able to just change him over to something else and have some fun with it.