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There's a whole chain of retarded statements and deductions in the last few pages, but now we're reaching absurd levels.
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Interview Torment 2 Interview with Brian Fargo at NowGamer + First Concept Art
- Thread starter Crooked Bee
- Start date
There's a whole chain of retarded statements and deductions in the last few pages, but now we're reaching absurd levels.
Moribund
A droglike
We're here to discuss games not other people's posts. If that's all you have to add just go play in GD, insults and stupid nonsense are not what these boards are for.
Mrowak
Arcane
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And what if person's post is filled with baseless guesswork and demagoguery? Clearly then the quality of discussion drops and therefore there's little to debate with the said individual. :prod, prod, nudge, nudge:
Rake
Arcane
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Thats not what i said. I said that if they ask for the fans opinion i believe the game will be RTwP. The only way it can be TB is if inXile desides to make it TB without fan input.
If i'm proven wrong no harm done
Rake
Arcane
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Moribund That RTwP=autoshit is your opinion.(and many other Codexers') But to say that all the people out there share the same opinion is... retarded.
All you are saying is that you want the game to have TB tactical combat and all who disagree can go to hell ,as they are no true "Torment fans"(RTwP game) and Fargo doesn't need their money.
I liked IE combat equally with ToEE combat so i don't give a shit which combat model they will follow. I'm way more conserned for the game to be 2D.There are others like me even in the Codex. There are others like this guy
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/61856-planescape-torment-first-playthrough/
and this guy
http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer/q/415604236269677636
who only care for the story.(which may be idiotic most of the time but in a P:T spirituall successor is a valid approach)
So don't say to me that "all the true Torment fans hate RTwP"
All you are saying is that you want the game to have TB tactical combat and all who disagree can go to hell ,as they are no true "Torment fans"(RTwP game) and Fargo doesn't need their money.
I liked IE combat equally with ToEE combat so i don't give a shit which combat model they will follow. I'm way more conserned for the game to be 2D.There are others like me even in the Codex. There are others like this guy
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/61856-planescape-torment-first-playthrough/
and this guy
http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer/q/415604236269677636
who only care for the story.(which may be idiotic most of the time but in a P:T spirituall successor is a valid approach)
So don't say to me that "all the true Torment fans hate RTwP"
Dorateen
Arcane
So this is what became of Studio Fawn
Moribund
A droglike
Mrowak, then you give some kind of real response not just LOL RETARD LOL. And only if you have some real point to make, not just to be contrarian.
I don't think old school gamers like rtwp. I know because I am one and I hated it, and all the old codexers hated it.
There's also no general IE fan, Torment wasn't made by bioware, didn't sell as much as BG series, and was different in almost every aspect.
Old bioware fans aren't the same as new ones. Some like volourn are holdouts but volourn was always horribly insane, the rest of the group just came to his level as it were.
The people who say they don't care it's rtwp don't even perticularly want rtwp, they just don't care much about combat. Some of them hope combat won't be all hard and stuff. That's why rtwp exists, pretty much. Just make mass appeal.
But people who were already playing RPGs back then are your torment market and they are not going to get any extra appeal. There's also the poser/tards who say they like games like torment but whose first RPG was oblivion. People like inaneatron. Well they will probably donate a bit regardless if they have the money but a few guys on forums are not enough to make a game get funded for millions of dollars like PE did.
That money came from the bioware fanboys, not even the BG fanboys, and from the fallout:nv fanboys. That money is not up for grabs, they just aren't getting it.
The money they can get realistically is the WL 2 fans, who only funded it because they wanted a real old school RPG. Plus the original torment fans. Who are old school enough by and large they are going to want a turn based game with a party. And general old school RPG fans, who mostly want TB games.
Mass appeal doesn't mean funding happens, it's all through niche appeal or through broad brand name recognition, like all marketing. And you can't steal the brand recognition of someone else, it just doesn't work. IE you can't say "We making something kind of like PE now give us 4 million dollars too!". Not to mention it's getting reegoddamdiculous to have every KS be another permutation of the same 5 popular games and game companies.
I worked at X too, and we are gonna make TormentFallout and FalloutBaldursGate which is much better than BaldursGateTorment!
I don't think old school gamers like rtwp. I know because I am one and I hated it, and all the old codexers hated it.
There's also no general IE fan, Torment wasn't made by bioware, didn't sell as much as BG series, and was different in almost every aspect.
Old bioware fans aren't the same as new ones. Some like volourn are holdouts but volourn was always horribly insane, the rest of the group just came to his level as it were.
The people who say they don't care it's rtwp don't even perticularly want rtwp, they just don't care much about combat. Some of them hope combat won't be all hard and stuff. That's why rtwp exists, pretty much. Just make mass appeal.
But people who were already playing RPGs back then are your torment market and they are not going to get any extra appeal. There's also the poser/tards who say they like games like torment but whose first RPG was oblivion. People like inaneatron. Well they will probably donate a bit regardless if they have the money but a few guys on forums are not enough to make a game get funded for millions of dollars like PE did.
That money came from the bioware fanboys, not even the BG fanboys, and from the fallout:nv fanboys. That money is not up for grabs, they just aren't getting it.
The money they can get realistically is the WL 2 fans, who only funded it because they wanted a real old school RPG. Plus the original torment fans. Who are old school enough by and large they are going to want a turn based game with a party. And general old school RPG fans, who mostly want TB games.
Mass appeal doesn't mean funding happens, it's all through niche appeal or through broad brand name recognition, like all marketing. And you can't steal the brand recognition of someone else, it just doesn't work. IE you can't say "We making something kind of like PE now give us 4 million dollars too!". Not to mention it's getting reegoddamdiculous to have every KS be another permutation of the same 5 popular games and game companies.
I worked at X too, and we are gonna make TormentFallout and FalloutBaldursGate which is much better than BaldursGateTorment!
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What's with all these posts? Aren't you supposed to be RPGWatch'd? 
Hobz
Savant
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Oh the irony...
Moribund
A droglike
Infinitron It was like that for three days then it got lifted.
Hobz Again, if your post has no content, don't bother.
Hobz Again, if your post has no content, don't bother.
I didn't say everyone did. I said most oldschoolers do. Most the old codexers certainly did. More important no one really loves rtwp. No one thinks the game would be worse off for being TB or wouldn't play, but lots of people pledged to WL 2 ONLY because they were going to get a TB RPG with a party, and those people won't pledge to this.
He'd get their money anyway. Not one person here is saying that they wouldn't back if it were TB. Lots of people will drop out if it's not, though. If they could get games of a type already they wouldn't have to bother with KS.
Exactly. Because it's like some people are bisexual and some are straight. Bisexuals could go either way, but the straight guys aren't going to go gay.
Well, good for you? But you probably won't get that. And the 2D games I do see today are rather shit anyway.
Well I never will then, but certainly I am not the only one who does. That's the point. They are trying to win mass appeal and jump on the PE bandwagon but mass appeal is the opposite of what makes KS work, and the PE appeal is not because of BG it's because of broad name recognitiont hat's impossible to steal, it's nothing to do with the game itself (which is gonna be utterly retarded and is not really what any group reallyw ants anyway).
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Oh I see. Let me get back to you on that
Moribund
A droglike
Infinitron Why do you reject the wisdom of my teachings?
And Mrowak, yes I think the PE donators are going to be unhappy with what they get. The Bioware fans will be disappointed it's just an uninspired, mediocre low budget RPG, and the BG fans will hate the horrible butcher job Sawyer is doing on the lame 4e DnD clone game system, and everyone will hate the artwork, all of which is crap after the initial good artwork they did to con people into backing it which was quite nice.
And Mrowak, yes I think the PE donators are going to be unhappy with what they get. The Bioware fans will be disappointed it's just an uninspired, mediocre low budget RPG, and the BG fans will hate the horrible butcher job Sawyer is doing on the lame 4e DnD clone game system, and everyone will hate the artwork, all of which is crap after the initial good artwork they did to con people into backing it which was quite nice.
Moribund
A droglike
Look rake, we seem to agree on the basics. Looks like your post was deleted so you can fix the quotes but I am already typing so will respond.
People who played torment also played all those other games, and they generally seemed to like the combat in them much better and hate the combat in torment. The rtwp wasn't a feature it was an annoyance!
Now there is this new group of people like inaneatron who went back and played it after it came out, but do even they have some burning love for rtwp? At worst they simply don't care. Yet on the other hand most if not all of the original torment fans would have preferred a better turn based system.
And there's people who liked both BG and Torment but they are still completely different and many people didn't like both. So you can't expect to pull in BG fans by making a torment game. Let alone PE fans! And just like with Torment, plenty of people would rather have had TB than rtwp.
So you gain nothing by making it rtwp, and you lose at least some of the people you'd otherwise get, likely many or even most of the same people who funded your last game. Since they are waffling and considering TB now, maybe they see this too. Didn't get the overwhelming outpour of support they expected I guess. Looks like I am right, as usual when I make a comment on these stupid newsposts.
People who played torment also played all those other games, and they generally seemed to like the combat in them much better and hate the combat in torment. The rtwp wasn't a feature it was an annoyance!
Now there is this new group of people like inaneatron who went back and played it after it came out, but do even they have some burning love for rtwp? At worst they simply don't care. Yet on the other hand most if not all of the original torment fans would have preferred a better turn based system.
And there's people who liked both BG and Torment but they are still completely different and many people didn't like both. So you can't expect to pull in BG fans by making a torment game. Let alone PE fans! And just like with Torment, plenty of people would rather have had TB than rtwp.
So you gain nothing by making it rtwp, and you lose at least some of the people you'd otherwise get, likely many or even most of the same people who funded your last game. Since they are waffling and considering TB now, maybe they see this too. Didn't get the overwhelming outpour of support they expected I guess. Looks like I am right, as usual when I make a comment on these stupid newsposts.
Moribund
A droglike
But it doesn't work both ways!
Where are the people who hate turn based? Not here. Not backing WL 2. Not fans of the original Torment.
I'm sure they EXIST, though I have not seen too many, but they don't actually matter because they won't be backing this game anyway.
Where are the people who hate turn based? Not here. Not backing WL 2. Not fans of the original Torment.
I'm sure they EXIST, though I have not seen too many, but they don't actually matter because they won't be backing this game anyway.
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Troll, alt, shitposter. Whatever you want to call it.
I'm amused by the idea some people (including non-trolls) have that the Torment fanbase and the Baldur's Gate fanbase are these completely separate things. BG2 and Torment are the #1 and #2 top selling games on GOG, respectively. How much are you willing to bet that almost everybody who owns (and loves) the one also owns (and loves) the other?
Anyway, put the fucker on ignore and report all his posts. He'll be nuked eventually, Underlord willing.
I'm amused by the idea some people (including non-trolls) have that the Torment fanbase and the Baldur's Gate fanbase are these completely separate things. BG2 and Torment are the #1 and #2 top selling games on GOG, respectively. How much are you willing to bet that almost everybody who owns (and loves) the one also owns (and loves) the other?
Anyway, put the fucker on ignore and report all his posts. He'll be nuked eventually, Underlord willing.
Surf Solar
cannot into womynz
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Reads a bit like Knotanalt for me.
Moribund is such an obvious newfag troll shitposter.
Oh yes, what a fucktard.
Moribund
A droglike
You so can't stand to see someone disagree with you that you have to find a way to silence them. It's hard for me to even believe it.
BG sells 30 copies a week and Torment 25 copies a week, that proved a lot.
Are the fanbases of all source games the same?
Aside from shitty combat and DnD, there's absolutely nothing about them that's the same. Of course they are different, these are all different things. There's DnD fans like me, but even that's not enough to really like either game that much. But Torment was still good, and BG series was OK.
There seems to be a few rabid BG fans but mostly it succeeded because it had more mass appeal and was dumbed down a bit for retards and had romances, not because there is some big rtwp crowd. And even people who liked the system in BG and Torment might not without the DnD aspect, which to me is the only thing that made it anything but utter shit and kept me from ragequitting.
Then there's storyfag fans, which didn't really exist before fallout came along. And guess what some people liked the story in torment and not in BG because one was sublime and the other was written by a fat bald retard named david gaider.
Then there's rtwp fans. Theoretically. People playing just because they like that kind of gameplay. Do they exist, even? I doubt it, rtwp is just streamlining/dumbing down so retards can play too. But if they are retards then they won't be backing an old school RPG anyway so what's the point.
BG sells 30 copies a week and Torment 25 copies a week, that proved a lot.
Are the fanbases of all source games the same?
Aside from shitty combat and DnD, there's absolutely nothing about them that's the same. Of course they are different, these are all different things. There's DnD fans like me, but even that's not enough to really like either game that much. But Torment was still good, and BG series was OK.
There seems to be a few rabid BG fans but mostly it succeeded because it had more mass appeal and was dumbed down a bit for retards and had romances, not because there is some big rtwp crowd. And even people who liked the system in BG and Torment might not without the DnD aspect, which to me is the only thing that made it anything but utter shit and kept me from ragequitting.
Then there's storyfag fans, which didn't really exist before fallout came along. And guess what some people liked the story in torment and not in BG because one was sublime and the other was written by a fat bald retard named david gaider.
Then there's rtwp fans. Theoretically. People playing just because they like that kind of gameplay. Do they exist, even? I doubt it, rtwp is just streamlining/dumbing down so retards can play too. But if they are retards then they won't be backing an old school RPG anyway so what's the point.
Moribund
A droglike
The point is that you are not going to get the PE crowd by having rtwp, but you will alienate some of the torment fanbase. After all story may not be as good, and the combat was not that good so then you'd really have a bad game if the story isn't just as good (which is unlikely).
Does anyone even disagree? Everyone seems to love to shitpost one liners but if you don't even say what your issue is there's not much point discussing it.
Does anyone even disagree? Everyone seems to love to shitpost one liners but if you don't even say what your issue is there's not much point discussing it.
Murk
Arcane
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What would be the point? Some like Turn Based, some like Real Time, some like a mix of both.
If you're saying that the majority of Torment fans will support Turn Based then ok, cool... that's an opinion. We have no empirical data suggesting things one way or the other. More-so-than-that, just because the idea of TB combat is theoretically superior to RT combat doesn't mean its implementation in a specific game will be as well.
This line of logic goes on but I'm sure you can figure out the rest. I'm also hesitant to engage in any discourse with someone who flings insults so readily. I don't have the patience or care to interact with people who are unpleasant. So, if that's your thing -- I'd mostly rather not. We can disagree forever, but as soon as "faggot" or "dumbfuck" enters into the posts then my willingness to continue ends there.
If you're saying that the majority of Torment fans will support Turn Based then ok, cool... that's an opinion. We have no empirical data suggesting things one way or the other. More-so-than-that, just because the idea of TB combat is theoretically superior to RT combat doesn't mean its implementation in a specific game will be as well.
This line of logic goes on but I'm sure you can figure out the rest. I'm also hesitant to engage in any discourse with someone who flings insults so readily. I don't have the patience or care to interact with people who are unpleasant. So, if that's your thing -- I'd mostly rather not. We can disagree forever, but as soon as "faggot" or "dumbfuck" enters into the posts then my willingness to continue ends there.
Might be good. I shall follow with interest.
Rake
Arcane
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Well, BG2 and Torment fanbase overlap in bigger extent than you seem to think. Also the P:E crowd. Torment was one of the games mentioned on kickstarter, and in Obsidian forums is the second favourite after BG2. Most of the backers want the game to be like Torment. So again there is a big overlap.
As i said i loved IE combat. I'm sure others like Infinitron liked it too. And have you read the W2 and P:E kickstarter comments? Plenty of retards there but they backed anyway. If inXile does a poll their opinion will count too
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