Underrail: The Incline Awakens

[Blaine]

About jet skis - you can steal them if you're done with Core City. Assuming you already did the oligarch questline, there's nothing essential that would make turning the whole city hostile stop your from finishing the game. It's just one station.

There are a lot of shekel dispensers in that caravanserai.

 

[Tygrende]

About jet skis - you can steal them if you're done with Core City. Assuming you already did the oligarch questline, there's nothing essential that would make turning the whole city hostile stop your from finishing the game. It's just one station.

There are a lot of shekel dispensers in that caravanserai.

Nothing you can't do without. CC doesn't even have any essential traders, with maybe the exception of Harlan for high quality electronic components if you joined CoreTech. The point is, you can steal a jet just fine, there's just somewhat hefty consequences for doing so and it requires getting out of the typical "everyone has to like me" RPG mindset.

 

[CHEMS]

Ray's was never meant to reward stealth and theft skills.

What? He has dialogue acknowledging when you steal things and jets.

 

[CHEMS]

So i did the following:

>got 6.6k charons through crime, murder and pickpocketing everyone in the institute
>went back to the docks and bought the freighter with discount because i always have high mercantile
>moved the freighter back to its position before the update
>sold back to Ray
>removed all the parts from the freighter because now the camera can't detect me
>bought back for a pittance
>put back the parts and sold for profit

GET FUCKED, RAY. I'M SMARTER THAN YOU DUMBASS!

 

[Supermedo]

Which NPC or where do you discover that stacking Spore Infection will take me to pulsating roots, I always play the game blind and try to give myself a chance before reaching to a walkthrough.

I'm supposed to open the gates to Tchort, I figured out returning the power grid and repairing the gate mechanism through normal conversation with NPCs and discovery.

I explored the mushroom forest and didn't find anything and I read all the logs in Caerus Residential, it mention the forest but in no way did it mention anything about Mycokardia and getting spore infection.

did I miss something?

 

[Ol' Willy]

did I miss something?

If I recall correctly, old man specifically tells you not to linger in the forest for too long. So, you actually supposed to do the opposite of what he says.
Not gonna lie, I learned how to progress there only from the forums.

 

[Blaine]

Ray's was never meant to reward stealth and theft skills.

What? He has dialogue acknowledging when you steal things and jets.

Styg clearly didn't originally intend for the place to be theft-proof—official acknowledgement that Ray's isn't theft-proof and that it's possible to rob the place, however, isn't the same as deliberately intending that players rob the shop blind every playthrough.

I think that Styg intended Ray's to be very difficult to rob of jetskis and components, while the office is much easier to rob. Since his entire player base are grognards, it turned out that we had little to no trouble robbing Ray's of anything not nailed down. Hence, he's made it even harder, and finally impossible without turning the entire zone permanently hostile (and I disagree with him on that, by the way).

Rewarding Mercantile, however, was clearly very intentional. Ray's is THE premier reward for Mercantile now, other than secret inventories. There are minor dialogue trees related to haggling for every jetski, a Mercantile-based discount gradient for each, and the antique can be sold to him for a large sum with high Mercantile.

You say the existence of dialogue is proof that Ray's was meant to be robbed. While I acknowledge this, I say that Styg never intended the place to be robbed blind or for it to be a primary means of rewarding theft skills, which is borne out by his repeated attempts to stop it being robbed blind. The massively huge truckload of locked-away treasure seeded throughout the entire game is and always will be the primary means of rewarding subterfuge skills.

 

[Black Angel]

did I miss something?

If I recall correctly, old man specifically tells you not to linger in the forest for too long. So, you actually supposed to do the opposite of what he says.
Not gonna lie, I learned how to progress there only from the forums.

Yeah, I learned that too from the forums. Supposedly at some patch they tweaked the dialogue to better convey the intention behind the debuff, but I don't know how true that is. And even then, it's still a pretty convoluted way for our character to progress in that specific area. Maybe if they add another, more convincing hint in Caerus Residential with the related researcher taking a deep breath of the mushroom (for science!) only to find him/herself awaken somewhere else.... but that still doesn't explain how tf did our character ended where they were after completing the debuff because the map layout before destroying the 'boss' just doesn't make sense.

 

[Ol' Willy]

You know what's the real irony? First time I entered the Mushroom Forest I wore Bio-Protection suit which makes you completely immune to Spore Infestation. So, to progress, I had to take it off which is completely nonsensical

I'm genuinely curious how people figured it out on their own

 

[Sweeper]

I'm genuinely curious how people figured it out on their own

By being autistic probably.

 

[Blaine]

You know what's the real irony? First time I entered the Mushroom Forest I wore Bio-Protection suit which makes you completely immune to Spore Infestation. So, to progress, I had to take it off which is completely nonsensical

I'm genuinely curious how people figured it out on their own

Somehow I managed to figure out DC all on my own without ever asking for hints, including Spore Infestation; I seem to recall that there is some kind of hint, but it's very subtle. I even navigated the worm maze without making any kind of a map at all, just dead reckoning.

I'm not congratulating myself, by the way. I put it down to dumb luck and determination. Codexers had been bitching and moaning about how much they hated DC before I first experienced it in 2014 or whenever, so I was prepared to suffer and persevere.

I could see the point of most of the complaints, but at the same time, I felt that people's reactions to it were over-exaggerated. So my opinion on DC falls somewhere in between the two extremes... although, to be fair, I don't know of anyone who LOVES DC.

 

[Blaine]

I've just realized that pretty soon I'll have been playing Underrail for nine years, averaging one playthrough and 115 hours per year. I intend to make it a round decade.

While nice it still does not fix the problem with now niche PSI abilities not being worth innervating. Also having to constantly smoke shrooms everytime you change your loadout is plain retarded. Imagine losing all your ammo in your gun when you switch ammo types.

I'd meant to address this, but had forgotten.

I agree, and the existence of niche/less desirable psi abilities was something that I had in mind but never got around to mentioning. Cherrypicking the most useful abilities from one's chosen schools was the way to go pre-nerf, and this must be especially true now that players are limited by innervation slots. Niche abilities that went mostly unused before now no doubt go entirely unused.

At the same time, all psi abilities can't be equally useful, and some are bound to be more niche than others, so it's a real quandary. D&D's Vancian-style magic systems classified spells on a power gradient, with more rarefied slots for more powerful spells, but in Underrail all slots are created equal.

I am and always have been totally opposed to the psi nerf. Even setting aside the draconian nature of the nerf in general and its unwanted side-effects in particular (e.g. niche abilities going unused now), with the innervation slots it now "feels" more like a fantasy wizard spell system; whereas before, it felt more like techno-psionics.

 

[Ol' Willy]

I don't know of anyone who LOVES DC.

I wouldn't go as far to say that I love DC, but I kinda like it in a way. DC requires ultimate preparation and actually rewards you for it. For example, Labyrinth is not that hard, there's no respawn in there and combination of Biohazard boots, Protectorate Chemical armor and Aegis helmet gives you 100% immunity to all Acid and Bio attacks, making worms harmless. Easy-peasy. Same true for Mushroom forest, except for Chompers and their melee atacks, but you had to prioritize them first. For Arke, you need stealth or means to kill robots as fast as possible. And so on. Basically, properly prepared character will breeze through DC without any significant problems.

My main gripe with DC is only that if you go there blind you will have a hard time figuring out what to do with all the cryptic bullshit. After that, it's fine.

 

[lukaszek]

You know what's the real irony? First time I entered the Mushroom Forest I wore Bio-Protection suit which makes you completely immune to Spore Infestation. So, to progress, I had to take it off which is completely nonsensical

I'm genuinely curious how people figured it out on their own

i went to dc twice(with large gap in between). Each time in bio suit and each time had to check on forums wtf am i doing wrong

 

[CHEMS]

Ray's was never meant to reward stealth and theft skills.

What? He has dialogue acknowledging when you steal things and jets.

Styg clearly didn't originally intend for the place to be theft-proof—official acknowledgement that Ray's isn't theft-proof and that it's possible to rob the place, however, isn't the same as deliberately intending that players rob the shop blind every playthrough.

I think that Styg intended Ray's to be very difficult to rob of jetskis and components, while the office is much easier to rob. Since his entire player base are grognards, it turned out that we had little to no trouble robbing Ray's of anything not nailed down. Hence, he's made it even harder, and finally impossible without turning the entire zone permanently hostile (and I disagree with him on that, by the way).

Rewarding Mercantile, however, was clearly very intentional. Ray's is THE premier reward for Mercantile now, other than secret inventories. There are minor dialogue trees related to haggling for every jetski, a Mercantile-based discount gradient for each, and the antique can be sold to him for a large sum with high Mercantile.

You say the existence of dialogue is proof that Ray's was meant to be robbed. While I acknowledge this, I say that Styg never intended the place to be robbed blind or for it to be a primary means of rewarding theft skills, which is borne out by his repeated attempts to stop it being robbed blind. The massively huge truckload of locked-away treasure seeded throughout the entire game is and always will be the primary means of rewarding subterfuge skills.

Well... the only stealable jet was the junk one. Stealing it would reward you with exploring the waterways without booting up the expansion or interacting with Aegis, nothing else, since it's got shitty parts and you can't sell it. There was absolutely no way you could steal any other without getting spotted, unless there's some trick i don't know. I don't see why Styg would take the possibility of free roaming the waters before starting the expansion, it wouldn't break the game in any way.

 

[Jezal_k23]

Which NPC or where do you discover that stacking Spore Infection will take me to pulsating roots, I always play the game blind and try to give myself a chance before reaching to a walkthrough.

I'm supposed to open the gates to Tchort, I figured out returning the power grid and repairing the gate mechanism through normal conversation with NPCs and discovery.

I explored the mushroom forest and didn't find anything and I read all the logs in Caerus Residential, it mention the forest but in no way did it mention anything about Mycokardia and getting spore infection.

did I miss something?

As far as I know, it isn't communicated to the player. I think you are supposed to look it up on the internet.

 

[Blaine]

Well... the only stealable jet was the junk one. Stealing it would reward you with exploring the waterways without booting up the expansion or interacting with Aegis, nothing else, since it's got shitty parts and you can't sell it. There was absolutely no way you could steal any other without getting spotted, unless there's some trick i don't know. I don't see why Styg would take the possibility of free roaming the waters before starting the expansion, it wouldn't break the game in any way.

Ah, I hadn't realized this. My single Expedition playthrough (and my most recent) just after the expansion's release was a mobile riot shield spearman, and I knew that there was zero chance of me getting away with stealing a jetski, so I didn't try. With a crafted cloaking device and black clothing, there's of course still a great deal you can steal in Underrail with 0 skill points invested, but at that point I'd probably just bought them all.

I think I actually have to concede your point, here. I assumed you'd all found a way to steal the good jets. What you're saying is that he's now made it impossible to steal the shittiest jet available, because "u no go water before official expansion cutscene"? For the love of God, Styg.

▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬​

Anyway, that reminds me: I've once again tried (and once again failed) to make a decent riot cop build—that is, all-in on grenades (Quick Pockets, Three-Pointer+10, Grenadier); Sprint, Nimble, lean riot gear with a shield, and Armor Sloping for mobility alongside decent protection, plus non-garbage CON; pistol with a few feats (because there's nothing else but knives, fists, and specced spears); Intimidation and Yell; and Stealth, because why not? Given the base attribute requirements and minimized armor penalty, it will at the very least mean you won't have to suffer through locust spam.

I give up, again. The shield isn't anywhere near protective enough without being loaded down with feats (and ideally paired with melee) yet eats a feat for Armor Sloping; the base attributes get yanked in too many different directions (especially if you want Guard or something) to meet all the feat requirements without leaving your Perception at literally fucking 10 AFTER the veteran feat; etc.

If riot shields protected from bullets to some extent—as they do in real life if made out of solid steel plates—then it'd be okay. But they don't, so it's crap.

I mean, it can work, but only on Normal Classic or perhaps Hard Classic. This guy would get roasted on Hard Oddity or DOM-anything.

https://underrail.info/build/?HgcHB...XOR0eFkQ-LzFLJFU6KUXCtSbDj-KgvQTipbwK4qa4Ad-_

 

[Ol' Willy]

because "u no go water before official expansion cutscene"

There's always Protectorate Jet at Port Zenith. Chems likes to steal his Jet, I like to loan it from Tincans

 

[Major_Blackhart]

I thought there was a random one where there was a log about a guy waking up in some random spot and seeing a huge pulsating spore shroom of some kind.

 

[ciox]

Spores are flying everywhere in the mushroom forest, on average you should get stoned about 5 minutes in, or as soon as you rest somewhere. If anything needs to be changed, it should be having more sources of spores, and more reasons to loiter next to them, rather than just sledgehammering this original bit of design out of existence.

 

[Supermedo]

Fucking finally finished the damn game.

Didn't know about the Mutegen puzzle or mutagen tanks, I killed him on my 3rd try, I eat a mushroom jar that increases psi crits by 40% then I used drugs that increase crit chance by 15% and damage by 40% then I used Electroynis with Psychostatic Electricity giving me 25% crit chance then I spammed neural.

It took me 111 hours to beat the game, well I'm sure 4-6 hours I was idle in the game while I was doing something else also when I reached the junkyard for the first time I started a new game to optimize my psi build.
I loved the game so I'm going to list the things I didn't like:

• Game UX is bad, you have very small icons and a lot of items without any good way to filter them, you can't sort by weight or value so you have to hover over each item, and the icons being small make it harder to get what you want.
• The end game and expansion spawning enemies for me is bad design, you only making the game more tedious especially we do a lot of backtracking.

Anyway I still think the expansion is the weakest part of the game.

 

[ciox]

Oh yeah, sorting by weight especially would be quite useful, more sorting options is something that was mentioned a bunch of times but somehow never made it into the game so far.

 

[Blaine]

Right, I think I'm fairly happy with this Spec Ops build: https://underrail.info/build/?HgQIB...WNy87woVJJhkpQMK1wqQo4qS2AuKloAXip6oD4rGCBd-_

In the end, I opted to focus more on Traps and flashbang cooldowns and less on maxed-out Throwing and specced Three-Pointer. I'll be going with Hard Classic as per usual, so the lack of absurdly pumped PER shouldn't be a deal-breaker.

I'm thinking of getting rid of Paranoia and replacing it with Hypertoxicity for caltrop/trap poisons, Mad Chemist (chemical pistol sidearms would add versatility and support Opportunist), or even Sure Step, in which case the feat order would need to change in order to obtain it before Junkyard, where it's quite useful. Even Versatility could do, for the sole purpose of knifing weaker things to death to save shekels.

I'm nervous about carrying my current sniper character any further. For one thing, Expertise and higher DEX greatly eases the early game, even using pistols and as early as GMS Compound (my sniper character is there now). I know I want a stealth character this time around, though. It's been many years since I attempted to play a sniper, and I remember being aggravated with maintaining range, dealing with move-and-shoot penalties, and being plot-forced into small quarters where neither stealth nor sniper rifles are as useful. I've never "mained" SMG, either.

Critiques are appreciated. I'm going to take my time settling on what to play, because once I really get going, I'll be stuck with it for 115 hours.

 

[lukaszek]

Critiques are appreciated

recklessness + expertise?
are you dead set on perception? join cool kids versatile squad with 3 per! Fancy footsteps instead of suppresive fire and you can outrun any enemy if need arises

Hypertoxicity for caltrop/trap poisons

that feat is useful only against bosses when your build cant cope otherwise. Not the case for you

Mad Chemist (chemical pistol sidearms would add versatility and support Opportunist)

i think this one only improves dmg? I expect you will be fine without it

 

[CHEMS]

I think I actually have to concede your point, here. I assumed you'd all found a way to steal the good jets. What you're saying is that he's now made it impossible to steal the shittiest jet available, because "u no go water before official expansion cutscene"? For the love of God, Styg

Yeah, that's what i'm saying. Of course, you could steal Port Zenith's Protectorate Cruiser, but that's impossible to steal stealthly and low-mid levels stand no chance fighting for it.