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Underrail: The Incline Awakens

lukaszek

the determinator
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Edit: So I got the Sormirbaeren slide and apparently even tho I destroyed their fragment I didn't beat defeat them. Despite me killing Magnus and their lead witch doctor (I left the bone guy and their blind guy alone). However, I only went after them before I descended to Acorn, and the remaining supplies for the expedition were down to nothing.

Did I wait too long or fail to meet the condition of defeating them another way?
defeating means fully clearing a number of tiles/maps assigned to them. You know when you are in clear when lighthouse guy says that he can no longer see their fires. Bosses are not required, you can game the system by clearing easier tiles early
 

Trashos

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I am starting a new playthrough, first time with the latest version. I am already noticing graphical changes, not sure what I think about them yet. I think the inventories look slightly uglier now, but are easier to read, so I am OK with the change.

I am worried about the announced buffing of DOM bosses, We will see how it goes.
 

Trashos

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Dammit, is there a way to disable the flashing of the "Notes" tab every time I get a new quest? It is annoying. Was it like that in earlier versions? I do not remember it.

On the plus side, my loading times seem to be much faster now.
 

Serus

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I have 2-3 question and since the most active thread i'll ask here. I couldn't find definitive answers on the net.
1. Do I remember correctly, when crit chance is higher than 100% you can crit more than once and the additional damage stacks? Say 120% crit chance = 1x guaranteed crit + 20% chance for a second one?
2. What about feats that provide not % chance to crit but a guaranteed critical hit like Aimed Shot. Do they stack with crit chance?
3. Critical Power, does it work with other feats? Say, Sharpshooter?
 

ItsChon

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
1. Do I remember correctly, when crit chance is higher than 100% you can crit more than once and the additional damage stacks? Say 120% crit chance = 1x guaranteed crit + 20% chance for a second one?
As far as I know, I don't think you can get over 100% crit chance, and even if you could, I do not think this is a mechanic in the game.
2. What about feats that provide not % chance to crit but a guaranteed critical hit like Aimed Shot. Do they stack with crit chance?
Your critical hit chance is a chance to crit. If you use aimed shot, guaranteeing a critical hit, then your critical hit chance doesn't come into play at all.
3. Critical Power, does it work with other feats? Say, Sharpshooter?
Both feats work to increase your critical damage bonus. I don't remember whether or not they each determine their critical damage bonus based off of your unmodified critical damage bonus and then add their two separate bonuses to said base critical damage bonus to give you your final critical damage bonus, or whether or not they stack and their critical damage bonuses are roilled off of each other. If they do stack, there is the question of which feat is applied first and which feat is applied second.

Either way however, if you're taking one, you should be taking the other.
 

Serus

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1. Do I remember correctly, when crit chance is higher than 100% you can crit more than once and the additional damage stacks? Say 120% crit chance = 1x guaranteed crit + 20% chance for a second one?
As far as I know, I don't think you can get over 100% crit chance, and even if you could, I do not think this is a mechanic in the game.
2. What about feats that provide not % chance to crit but a guaranteed critical hit like Aimed Shot. Do they stack with crit chance?
Your critical hit chance is a chance to crit. If you use aimed shot, guaranteeing a critical hit, then your critical hit chance doesn't come into play at all.
3. Critical Power, does it work with other feats? Say, Sharpshooter?
Both feats work to increase your critical damage bonus. I don't remember whether or not they each determine their critical damage bonus based off of your unmodified critical damage bonus and then add their two separate bonuses to said base critical damage bonus to give you your final critical damage bonus, or whether or not they stack and their critical damage bonuses are roilled off of each other. If they do stack, there is the question of which feat is applied first and which feat is applied second.

Either way however, if you're taking one, you should be taking the other.
Of you can have more than 100%. End game it isn't even that hard with some builds:
Case 1, sniper: rifle with fancy scope 24% + feats (Reckless + SI + Scrutinous) 44%, 59% with max specialisation + stim 15% = up to 98%. Add crit chance googles and a couple more i forgot.
Case 2, Ambush (feat) that can put you above 100% on its own. Hell, you can get not only over 100% but over 200% critical chance with Ambush combined with all other sources. Of curse in practice it would be a huge waste of time.
And those are the easy examples, it can be done on PSI Psychosis Psychokinetic too.
Obviously, you can't (at least I don't think so) have 100% critical chance permanently, it requires feats that only work in certain circumstances, consumables, etc...
That's why i was asking. I recall something about getting more than 1 critical hit damage bonus at once but perhaps that was from a different game that also allows to stack critical chance to more than 100%.

About Critical Power - yes, that was my question.
 

Trashos

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Critical Power tends to stack with everything, but I haven't used Sharpshooter for a long time, so I can't speak specifically for it.

Yeah, Crit Chance > 100% should be a waste to the best of my knowledge. (Unless you expect to have some debuff that brings it back down, that is.) Anyway, from some point on, better invest in critical damage bonus instead.
 

jackofshadows

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I have 2-3 question and since the most active thread i'll ask here. I couldn't find definitive answers on the net.
1. Do I remember correctly, when crit chance is higher than 100% you can crit more than once and the additional damage stacks? Say 120% crit chance = 1x guaranteed crit + 20% chance for a second one?
2. What about feats that provide not % chance to crit but a guaranteed critical hit like Aimed Shot. Do they stack with crit chance?
3. Critical Power, does it work with other feats? Say, Sharpshooter?
No, I'm afraid you've mixed up the mechanic with some other game.
See above so no.
Yes.
 

Serus

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Ok, thanks guys. I must have mixed it with some other game or misremembered.


Critical Power tends to stack with everything, but I haven't used Sharpshooter for a long time, so I can't speak specifically for it.

Yeah, Crit Chance > 100% should be a waste to the best of my knowledge. (Unless you expect to have some debuff that brings it back down, that is.) Anyway, from some point on, better invest in critical damage bonus instead.
Depends. It's better if you want mathematically more damage, sure. However, reliability cannot always be so easily quantified. I'd certainly would prefer slightly less damage overall for a significant increase in reliability on high AP cost attacks. On many small attacks it doesn't matter much. Even more so if I ever tried ironman.


Sykar
Yes, i'm not a fan of SI either, it takes the meaning of "glass cannon" to a whole new level. But if someone is be able to first strike everytime then it makes sense. Kill everything before it kills you works in this game, as it does in many others. Still, i don't like it much, perhaps because i play RL so much and there glass cannons are not always a good idea.
 

agris

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so the style of Lemurian vault doors is pretty... specific

bakN7Z3.jpg


maybe it's the psychic scar of seeing goatse as a teenager, but everytime I see this...

or perhaps that's a stretch?
 

Parabalus

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Yes, i'm not a fan of SI either, it takes the meaning of "glass cannon" to a whole new level. But if someone is be able to first strike everytime then it makes sense. Kill everything before it kills you works in this game, as it does in many others. Still, i don't like it much, perhaps because i play RL so much and there glass cannons are not always a good idea.

Realistically with a lot builds it really doesn't matter whether you have 3/9 CON + 30%/100% hp, in many encounters if an enemy touches you, you are dead immediately or CC-locked to death.
 
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Trashos

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I am not disputing that reliability is important! But we were talking about exceeding 100%.
--------

At some point I went through a SI phase and kept playing SI builds. Extremely strong when on the attack, of course. But I would die here and there when the wind would happen to blow my way, so eventually I reverted back to non-SI. Except for Psychosis Psi, I will still play that SI-style next time.
 

Serus

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Yes, i'm not a fan of SI either, it takes the meaning of "glass cannon" to a whole new level. But if someone is be able to first strike everytime then it makes sense. Kill everything before it kills you works in this game, as it does in many others. Still, i don't like it much, perhaps because i play RL so much and there glass cannons are not always a good idea.

Realistically with a lot builds it really doesn't matter whether you have 3/9 CON + 30%/100% hp, in many encounters if an enemy touches you are dead immediately or CC-locked to death.
Agreed, that's why it's not the best game to play ironman. I think it's only doable by surviving early game (restarting if needed) and then cheesing the hell out of it. Going for 100% resistances, etc... seems a logical choice. With permadeath You have to be able to survive if something goes wrong - and in a game as long as Underrail something eventually will. Anyone here on the Codex played and finished an ironman attempt?


What does "single-target ranged weapon" mean? Every firearm minus shotguns?
Aimed shot works for everything except shotgun if that's what you're asking
Thanks, i figured it out. It's not just Aimed Shot that is limited that way, apparently you can't Ambush anyone with a shotgun, lol. Maybe there are other feats i forgot.
 

Trashos

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I agree that the game is not designed with ironman in mind, but it is doable.
I almost did it on Hard a long time ago, but eventually died in Arke. Now on Dominating I get close sometimes, but I am still relatively new to it and my builds tend to stumble eventually. I generally play soft ironman (counting number of deaths) and try to lower the number of deaths as much as possible, until I hopefully get it to zero some day.


From memory:
Yaz did it by throwing a lot of grenades.
Tygrende gave it a go, but I don't remember the results.
 

Serus

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What do you think about this build. I don't know what i'm doing - which is fun. Never used melee, never went without psionic, i don't know how reliable are dodge and evasion as defensive mechanism - though i have uncanny dodge, this isn't random just limited in uses. Want too check parry + riposte combo. This is not meant for DOM, just normal or hard (on screenshot life on normal difficulty). I'm not changing a lot, just want some impressions.
gbzRgJF.png

Edit: forgot cheap shots.
Ok, melee no PSI, here i come.
 
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lukaszek

the determinator
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Serus provide link instead next time.

Fancy footwork is enough, drop sprint
with movement pool provided by fancy footwork, uncany dodge is not needed. But then you want to get hit... But then uncanny dodge triggers before you get a chance to block I think
why so high dex? Why not str instead? Or con even
evasive manouver isnt that good
You obtain your combo pieces quite late into the game to have enough fun with it
THere is no cheap shots, got enough points for grenadier too.

Ahh I see, dex is for increasing parry chance. Still it doesnt play that well with dodging... Did you consider going shield route instead? Could increase survival with more con or dmg with str
 
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Your crafting skills are far higher than they need to be. 180 quality metal needs 144 mechanics, and you have 152 effective with no bonuses. After house bonus+engineer suit+hypercerebrix+Jon's special you have 203 (!!!). You could cut it way down and not lose anything. Electronics and tailoring can go down too. You can use the saved points to max out stealth or get enough lockpicking to open everything or go into chemistry. Something useful. I'm sure you can find something.
 

Serus

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Serus provide link instead next time.

Fancy footwork is enough, drop sprint
with movement pool provided by fancy footwork, uncany dodge is not needed. But then you want to get hit... But then uncanny dodge triggers before you get a chance to block I think
why so high dex? Why not str instead? Or con even
evasive manouver isnt that good
You obtain your combo pieces quite late into the game to have enough fun with it
THere is no cheap shots, got enough points for grenadier too.

Ahh I see, dex is for increasing parry chance. Still it doesnt play that well with dodging... Did you consider going shield route instead? Could increase survival with more con or dmg with str
Why would i take more STR? 1 more for tungsten machette? Meh. And I'm not going higher that that, I could take 1 maaaybe 2 points from dex but not more. This is supposed to be a light swordsman (machette-man?). It could go to CON, that's a better idea. With so high crit damage on swords (~160% base i think) i like every point of crit chance.
You are right about uncanny dodge being counter-productive for parry+riposte. I'll drop it.
As to getting parry + riposte late, sort of but if i'm dropping uncanny dodge and sprint then i can squeeze them earlier.
I found the lack of Cheap Shots myself, this is a very good feat, would be bad to miss it.
Grenadier is good, i loved it on my temporal tincan but you can't have everything. Hard choice here.
True about sprint, probably not very useful here. My first game was a tincan and sprint is great there, even on a ranged tincan. I will drop it too.

Thanks for the post. It was insightful.
 

lukaszek

the determinator
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Why would i take more STR? 1 more for tungsten machette?
since you stated its your first melee char... each melee weapon provides different dmg increase %. Daggers/fists ditch str because dex provides them AP decrease. Thats not true for swords/hammers/spears. Of the 3 spears can maaaaybe go full dex dues to weird throwing mechanics around them.
Otherwise both str/dex can be used to scale melee skill. Since STR provides extra dmg increase its preferable. 7% for swords isnt laughable.

1 more for tungsten machette?
YES. You have critical power for a reason

Thats why im suggesting that heavy might go better for blocking swordman.
Light melee fighters go well with spears
 

Serus

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Why would i take more STR? 1 more for tungsten machette?
since you stated its your first melee char... each melee weapon provides different dmg increase %. Daggers/fists ditch str because dex provides them AP decrease. Thats not true for swords/hammers/spears. Of the 3 spears can maaaaybe go full dex dues to weird throwing mechanics around them.
Otherwise both str/dex can be used to scale melee skill. Since STR provides extra dmg increase its preferable. 7% for swords isnt laughable.

1 more for tungsten machette?
YES. You have critical power for a reason

Thats why im suggesting that heavy might go better for blocking swordman.
Light melee fighters go well with spears
I know what STR and DEX provides, the fact i didn't play melee doesn't mean I can't read.
Speaking of which, DEX provides 1% crit chance. Consider that swords have the biggest(?) base crit damage of all melee weapons by far and access to 2x great feats that further increase it. Surprisingly enough, AFAIK, the 1% crit chance should be more than +7% damage from mid-late game - at least for swords. This is also why I find STR swords counter intuitive. Otoh STR provides more reliable damage, so there is that. Consider further that Dex provides more advantages than STR other than damage.
STR for spears, that i would understand, critical damage is bad on spears so damage wise STR wins by far. Perhaps the feat Spear Throw is so good?
 

Trashos

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Serus, I do not have much experience with Swords to give advice, but if you were looking for the most unreliable build in UR, I think you have found it! Flurry should give your fights a feeling of russian roulette.
(Doesn't mean it won't be fun!)
 

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