Vapourware Zodiac Legion - X-COM and dungeons

[Jaesun]

I like the squares better. The circles as HP just seem odd to me.

 

[Ninjerk]

I don't suppose it would make any difference to me.

 

[Galdred]

And concerning the trees, would you prefer larger ones cut down to one hex on a toggle, or smaller "supermarket christmas tree" ones?

 

[Jaesun]

The regular sized trees look fine. What is their function? I assume they block line of site and walking?

 

[Ninjerk]

And concerning the trees, would you prefer larger ones cut down to one hex on a toggle, or smaller "supermarket christmas tree" ones?

I think in the long run it doesn't matter much if you're only handling them as an abstraction a la Warcraft:Orcs and Humans or similar RTS types.

 

[Galdred]

The regular sized trees look fine. What is their function? I assume they block line of site and walking?

That's the problem with trees : I don't like the idea of them blocking movement (I mean, it would work in a jungle, but it makes no sense in a forest : trees never form a labyrinth, and that makes them redundant with walls).
So if going with smaller trees, I would prefer them to block sight, and just hamper movement (like make the hex cost more MV for footmen, and make it impassable for larger creatures), but it is a bit hard to convey graphically, so they will block LoS and movement in the whole hexagon so I will run some tests ASAP to see how best it can work.

 

[Galdred]

Here is a version where trees don't hamper movement at all (the cost of moving around them is already factored in the forest cost), but do provide cover :

I placed them on Tile corners so that it is obvious they are non blocking. The main advantage is that we can have a denser forest without turning movement into a clusterfuck, which means that trees can have a much greater impact on LoS. The board is not very readable when the trees are too densely packed, but as very few tiles will be blocking (only rocks, walls, which would be obvious) in forest, and health appear on top of trees (but the faction needs to be easier to see through trees), that should still be OK (I will still add the option to cut trees to a more manageable height : maybe I will reserve the larger trunks for this purpose) .

 

[Jaesun]

That looks fine to me.

 

[Galdred]

Normal forest view :

"chopped down" forest view :

That should be clear enough, but I will also add transparency (for a more "natural" transition). Lines of sight will be displayed with an overlay.

 

[Chris Koźmik]

and oppose the lieutenants of your arch enemy, a pretender god(let's call him the Overlord for now) who wants to storm the gates of Asgard(or some other name) you are supposed to defend.

It reminds me of an old Polish game "God's of Vikings". There were two sides, the gods (good) protecting the Yggdrasill (sacred tree) and giants + evil gods (Loki, Hera) that were storming Midgar via the prismal bridge. All of this (the god's land) was floating in void which was looking quite cool.

Check the screens:
http://portal.strategie.net.pl/inde...catid=20:recenzje-gier-planszowych&Itemid=119


Maybe, if you haven't decided it yet, you could retheme the game to norse legends? These should fit your project, plus you would have memorable characters and a rich backstory "for free".

 

[Galdred]

and oppose the lieutenants of your arch enemy, a pretender god(let's call him the Overlord for now) who wants to storm the gates of Asgard(or some other name) you are supposed to defend.

It reminds me of an old Polish game "God's of Vikings". There were two sides, the gods (good) protecting the Yggdrasill (sacred tree) and giants + evil gods (Loki, Hera) that were storming Midgar via the prismal bridge. All of this (the god's land) was floating in void which was looking quite cool.

Check the screens:
http://portal.strategie.net.pl/inde...catid=20:recenzje-gier-planszowych&Itemid=119


Maybe, if you haven't decided it yet, you could retheme the game to norse legends? These should fit your project, plus you would have memorable characters and a rich backstory "for free".

Actually, I had started from Norse legens, but we moved away from that because we wanted to have a dozen different factions that could align with either of the 2 major sides, or remain neutral. So we ended up with the zodiac themed champions + it helped give each faction a distinctive look (so basically, we change the lore whenever a gameplay or artistic change requires it, it might not be the best approach to world building, but it's more efficient to do it this way, as lore can be fixed pretty late in the development cycle). I need to update the first post with the new lore (it is basically a civil war between the 12 guardian orders of the Empire ).

 

[Ninjerk]

That's where great settings come from, dammit.

 

[Severian Silk]

Does your game support 32-bit graphics for sprites?

 

[Galdred]

Actually, the game uses indexed 32 bits graphics (ie, a limited color palette, but the color themselves are 32 bits). It made palette swapping easier (to add more variety to the look of the armors, which both allows customization, and makes it easier to tell stronger opponents from other).

 

[Severian Silk]

I can't tell 100% for sure, but it doesn't look like you have an 8-bit alpha channel for sprites.

Also, those trees need shadows.

 

[Galdred]

I can't tell 100% for sure, but it doesn't look like you have an 8-bit alpha channel for sprites.

Indeed, the alpha channel is mostly use by the engine to make some objects transparents when needed (trees and walls on mouse over for instance, but I may make them transparent when someone is behind one too).

Also, those trees need shadows.

Indeed, they alreay have shadows as sprites, but I will need to tweak the direction of the sprite shadows(characters and walls shadows is obtained from transformations, by applying a shear and scaling to the original sprite) to be consistent with the shadow of the trees so that they don't clash, or generate tree shadows the same way as character shadows.

 

[Severian Silk]

Are you developing on a Mac? Colors look a bit washed out. Is your gamma set correctly?

 

[Galdred]

Are you developing on a Mac? Colors look a bit washed out. Is your gamma set correctly?

I am developing on a PC. Which parts exactly do you find washed out? The ground? The armors (there are a lot more color schemes available, I just need to export everything, and set it up before they become usable in game)? It might be the contrast with the forest background (we only had dungeons interiors when the character sprites were drawn).

 

[Galdred]

Are you developing on a Mac? Colors look a bit washed out. Is your gamma set correctly?

But actually, the character appearance can be customized, so you can choose another set of colors if you prefer :
There are about 8 sets of color for each piece. The plan is to have an armor customizer like in neuXCOM where you can choose the exact piece and the color set you want for the greaves, vambraces, breastplace for each character armor (you will obviously be limited to the armor pieces that match the armor type, ie plate, leather...).
I just need to slap a proper UI on top of the existing functionalities.

 

[Severian Silk]

I was mainly talking about the environment, such as the grass, trees, dirt, etc. The colors are a bit unsaturated and light, leading me to believe the gamma was off. Here's a version that I think looks better:

 

[zwanzig_zwoelf]

I have to admit that I liked the "unsaturated" version a bit more.
But that's just my personal preference.

 

[Chris Koźmik]

You have to do something with the units behind the trees (obstacle turns transparent?) Will there be zoom option?

I would add some icons to units (strength), not just health.
Also, have you considered making the battlefield smaller and units bigger?
How about adding "miniatures base"? It would give it the playfull feeling (plus you can add some icons/info to the base).

 

[Cosmo]

Here's a version that I think looks better:

It really doesn't.

 

[Galdred]

You have to do something with the units behind the trees (obstacle turns transparent?) Will there be zoom option?

There already is a zoom*2 and zoom*3 option. Zooming out looks horrible, and is too small to be usable (so a minimap would achieve the same, without looking gross), and the zoom*1 already shows a lot of the battlefield.
For the units behind the trees, I am not to sure about the best way to do it :
Currently, hovering the mouse on an obstacle makes all of them transparent, and hitting the "o" key chops trees and walls.
I could make the obstacles with someone behind transparent, but that would not be enough (in case you need to see the ground).

I would add some icons to units (strength), not just health.

I will have to put that in a separate info window, as it would clutter the view (strength would depend on a lot of factors : armor, range, attack value, defense, "spirit"...).
I will probably just add a spirit bar to the characters, (Edit) and a level indicator.

Also, have you considered making the battlefield smaller and units bigger?
How about adding "miniatures base"? It would give it the playfull feeling (plus you can add some icons/info to the base).

The character size will stay as is (I mean, making them bigger relative to the hexes would mean redoing all the animations...). There are several reasons why we needed big hexes :
1) We wanted to have one hex represent around 3meter diameter (because we wanted range to go up to something like 12 tiles, and having max range = 12 m would make little sense
It also makes it easy to accept that characters can pass through an inoccupied hex.
2) We wanted to be able to have large creatures or mounted warriors in an hex, even though there won't be any at launch (unless we reach the relevant KS stretch goal)
The total size of the battlefield is not set yet.
The animation wouldn't work with bases either : we opted for a "realistic" representation over a boardgamey one, as I think it makes immersion easier.
I am considering adding bases on the strategic layer, though.

 

[Jaesun]

It really doesn't.

If you don't have anything to share and just going to shitpost, go to the other forms. thanks.