Eternity Avowed - Obsidian's first person action-RPG in the Pillars of Eternity setting - coming February 18th

[luj1]

No one is up to task because all of them are trembling bitches with 0 passion and love.

 

[Grunker]

Excellent summary, except you barely mention expectations about faction states and quest design.

What do you mean by "faction states" though?

New Vegas' quests are intervowen with the faction states/points which is in turn connected to YES MAN (though to a lesser extend that the faction interactions themselves).

More broadly, I was saying that New Vegas was saved for me due to the way faction interaction and some of the best quests were designed. Expecting the rest of the game to be as you described, these things are about the only thing I can see Obsidian getting right, thus making a game I could potentially be interested in. Hence why I think it's missing from your otherwise broadly correct expections speculation.

 

[Cologno]

to be extra extra super fair iron shortage is more creative than YET ANOTHER PLAGUE

NWN did the strange plague ugh I'm getting PTSD now

Yep. To varying degrees of involvement:

- NWN
- Dragon Age Origins
- GreedFall
- Dishonored
- Bloodborne
- Darkest Dungeon
- TES: Morrowind
- and even VTM Bloodlines

Probably many more.

Of course it makes some sense at least, since plague/disease is a major factor in human history and personal experience. So people like to tell stories about it, I guess.

Seems criminal not to mention Deus Ex and Gray Death in there. I played that for the first time about a year back. Common theme in those games you listed is desperation and despondency and may did that come through in DX.

 

[luj1]

Roguey and Infinitron you guys are going to overheat from damage control

 

[AwesomeButton]

Paramo's work history

Yes, I think you or someone else already cited his past projects. This did make me biased, but I would have guessed it either way.

 

[Grunker]

Don't make me tap the sign:
>If lockpicking is determined by character skill, its an RPG system.
>If lockpicking is determined by player skill, its an action system.

what if it's determined by both

checkmate, liberals

Action system. One drop rule, if a very good player can make a character do something that character is completely unskilled at, then its an action game mechanic.

But they can't in a lot of previous systems like you described. The ability to attempt the real time dexterity mini game is gated behind skill thresholds.

 

[Grunker]

Roguey and Infinitron you guys are going to overheat from damage control

Isn't Roguey still in his "Obisidian bad" phase

 

[whydoibother]

Google Avowed, 4 featured news articles, 1 positive, 1 negative, 2 neutral...

.... except even the positive article has this banger quote:

Last decade, Avowed would have passed for a great title, but the standards for RPGs have changed since then.

I think the general mood about this is low, and the gameplay shown disappointed the normies as well. We've also had a few big flagship titles flop recently, and this has the same vibes. A game pitched before a market shift, that already had lead rotations, that already revised itself at least once, and that has no bright selling point/gimmick.
I hope the game is good on release, or at least eventually, and I am sure I'll put at least 10 hours into it myself. But I don't think we are looking at Skyrim 2 tier success. I think six months after this releases, Starfield has more people online on Steam. Pure speculating, just my bet.

 

[whydoibother]

But they can't in a lot of previous systems like you described. The ability to attempt the real time dexterity mini game is gated behind skill thresholds.

Well, then its 2 systems: first an RP system, to determine if you can proceed to the second action system. Your character has to be good enough at the skill, to permit you to see if you are good enough at the associated minigame.

 

[luj1]

Roguey and Infinitron you guys are going to overheat from damage control

Isn't Roguey still in his "Obisidian bad" phase

I thought your anti-bullshit save was higher

 

[Old Hans]

Google Avowed, 4 featured news articles, 1 positive, 1 negative, 2 neutral...
View attachment 45920

.... except even the positive article has this banger quote:

Last decade, Avowed would have passed for a great title, but the standards for RPGs have changed since then.

I think the general mood about this is low, and the gameplay shown disappointed the normies as well. We've also had a few big flagship titles flop recently, and this has the same vibes. A game pitched before a market shift, that already had lead rotations, that already revised itself at least once, and that has no bright selling point/gimmick.
I hope the game is good on release, or at least eventually, and I am sure I'll put at least 10 hours into it myself. But I don't think we are looking at Skyrim 2 tier success. I think six months after this releases, Starfield has more people online on Steam. Pure speculating, just my bet.

I like how how Forbes of all places is the only one who's like "someting is just not right"

 

[Grunker]

Roguey and Infinitron you guys are going to overheat from damage control

Isn't Roguey still in his "Obisidian bad" phase

I thought your anti-bullshit save was higher

I think this is more a case of you being out of date with Roguey's current identity crisis. He mostly shares news criticizing Sawyer or satirizing Obsidian these days AFAIK

 

[luj1]

Roguey's current identity crisis agenda

 

[AwesomeButton]

Also true.

On a sidenote, it's funny that it's Carrie Patel who is to design a game where the player's main task is to resolve a conflict, after seeing glimpses of her own inability to resolve conflicts. Seems like she is one of those passive-aggressive people who just ignore any expression of disagreement, hoping it goes away.

Excellent summary, except you barely mention expectations about faction states and quest design.

What do you mean by "faction states" though?

New Vegas' quests are intervowen with the faction states/points in effect tallyed up with YES MAN.

More broadly, I was saying that New Vegas was saved for me due to the way faction interaction and some of the best quests were designed. Expecting the rest of the game to be as you described, these things are about the only thing I can see Obsidian getting right, thus making a game I could potentially be interested in. Hence why I think it's missing from your otherwise broadly correct expections speculation.

I think I understand what you mean and I was going to bring up a different example. AoD's approach of the typical RPG situation of "resolve a conflict between factions". Your backstory determines your skillset, and your skillset determines your part in the resolution of that conflict which is portrayed as something bigger than you that's going to resolve itself with or without your input. I think that approach to the story, as "something that will inevitably progress" and how AoD executes it, is the most outstanding thing about that game. However I doubt Avowed will rise above Deadfire's level of "destroy the adra" vs "fix the adra", where the potential change in the village's life wasn't depicted ingame.

 

[Grunker]

But they can't in a lot of previous systems like you described. The ability to attempt the real time dexterity mini game is gated behind skill thresholds.

Well, then its 2 systems: first an RP system, to determine if you can proceed to the second action system. Your character has to be good enough at the skill, to permit you to see if you are good enough at the associated minigame.

Which is why I made fun of your point. A genre label becomes kind of useless when you need to write out how the entire system works to describe it. At that point, of what use is the label

Roguey's current identity crisis agenda

If Roguey's current objective is shilling for Obsidian, why is he mostly sharing quotes that does the opposite. Are you thick?

EDIT: oh wait, you're luj1, nevermind

 

[AwesomeButton]

I like how how Forbes of all places is the only one who's like "someting is just not right"

That's not surprising. Forbes' entertainment writers are candid, even if they often show plebean tastes. They can afford to be candid because Forbes is not a "gaming outlet", and they don't have to bow to publishers' marketing departament people for their salaries.

 

[Grunker]

Also true.

On a sidenote, it's funny that it's Carrie Patel who is to design a game where the player's main task is to resolve a conflict, after seeing glimpses of her own inability to resolve conflicts. Seems like she is one of those passive-aggressive people who just ignore any expression of disagreement, hoping it goes away.

Excellent summary, except you barely mention expectations about faction states and quest design.

What do you mean by "faction states" though?

New Vegas' quests are intervowen with the faction states/points in effect tallyed up with YES MAN.

More broadly, I was saying that New Vegas was saved for me due to the way faction interaction and some of the best quests were designed. Expecting the rest of the game to be as you described, these things are about the only thing I can see Obsidian getting right, thus making a game I could potentially be interested in. Hence why I think it's missing from your otherwise broadly correct expections speculation.

I think I understand what you mean and I was going to bring up a different example. AoD's approach of the typical RPG situation of "resolve a conflict between factions". Your backstory determines your skillset, and your skillset determines your part in the resolution of that conflict which is portrayed as something bigger than you that's going to resolve itself with or without your input. I think that approach to the story, as "something that will inevitably progress" and how AoD executes it, is the most outstanding thing about that game. However I doubt Avowed will rise above Deadfire's level of "destroy the adra" vs "fix the adra", where the potential change in the village's life wasn't depicted ingame.

I wish I was able to enjoy AoD and experience that

 

[Readher]

Google Avowed, 4 featured news articles, 1 positive, 1 negative, 2 neutral...
View attachment 45920

.... except even the positive article has this banger quote:

Last decade, Avowed would have passed for a great title, but the standards for RPGs have changed since then.

I think the general mood about this is low, and the gameplay shown disappointed the normies as well. We've also had a few big flagship titles flop recently, and this has the same vibes. A game pitched before a market shift, that already had lead rotations, that already revised itself at least once, and that has no bright selling point/gimmick.
I hope the game is good on release, or at least eventually, and I am sure I'll put at least 10 hours into it myself. But I don't think we are looking at Skyrim 2 tier success. I think six months after this releases, Starfield has more people online on Steam. Pure speculating, just my bet.

Starfield hate and BG3 praise shifted gears in normie minds and the expectations have risen by a lot. Avowed will be closer to Starfield for sure. Probably better writing still (hard not to have better writing than current Bethesda), but outdated mechanics, loading screens, probably even missing some of the stuff Skyrim had (NPC schedules, random encounters, patrols, etc.) - all things Starfield got criticized for.

The real problem is, it's hard to predict how plebbit normies will react to a game. Starfield got a lot of flak for outdated design and even missing some stuff from Skyrim, yet everyone sucks CDPR's cock for Soyberpunk, despite the fact it's missing even more stuff from Skyrim than Starfield did. And then you have Jap games which seemingly exist in some sort of vacuum and are held to completely different standards than Western games, with no one ever mentioning outdated graphics, facial animations (or even lack thereof, in favor of VN-style segments), and mechanics as well (Japs suck at environmental storytelling and simulation systems even harder than Western nu-devs). Your average Jap """AAA""" game would be considered indie/AA if made by a Western dev, with notable exceptions being some Square Jewnix games, some Capcom games and Kojimbo.

 

[whydoibother]

And then you have Jap games which seemingly exist in some sort of vacuum and are held to completely different standards than Western games, with no one ever mentioning outdated graphics, facial animations (or even lack thereof, in favor of VN-style segments), and mechanics as well (Japs suck at environmental storytelling and simulation systems even harder than Western nu-devs). Your average Jap """AAA""" game would be considered indie/AA if made by a Western dev, with notable exceptions being some Square Jewnix games, some Capcom games and Kojimbo.

Weebs are a religious movement. God Japan can do no wrong. Even free speech absolutist weebs who want to abolish intellectual property will then post in support of Nintendo purging emulators and LetsPlays on YouTube, because its okay when Japan does it.

 

[Peachcurl]

Yep. To varying degrees of involvement:

- NWN
- Dragon Age Origins
- GreedFall
- Dishonored
- Bloodborne
- Darkest Dungeon
- TES: Morrowind
- and even VTM Bloodlines

Probably many more.

Of course it makes some sense at least, since plague/disease is a major factor in human history and personal experience. So people like to tell stories about it, I guess.

Seems criminal not to mention Deus Ex and Gray Death in there.

 

[whydoibother]

Which is why I made fun of your point. A genre label becomes kind of useless when you need to write out how the entire system works to describe it. At that point, of what use is the label

Well, a game which has 2 lockpicking systems: one character skillcheck, and one player skillcheck, therefore has 1 RP and 1 action system. Such a game could be called..... an action-RPG. Which is what we do anyways. But just calling it RPG is incorrect, autistically speaking.

 

[Quillon]

the convo in the trailer made me realize I'm so tired of these huana names ending with -ui -iki etc and they'll be everywhere this time again, with no big valian presence to at least mix things up a bit

 

[Gargaune]

I'm much more pessimistic about the state of Avowed as an RPG though. With someone who makes a presentation of elemental interactions, dual wielding wands, and "mixing and matching weapons and abilities" it seems nearly certain that all the "mixing and matching" will mean nothing because the game will be piss easy anyway. It will be curious to see how they've ported the isometric games' abilities and spells to first-person action gameplay, but it's clear at this stage that no one gives a rat's ass about the systems, and that combat will be completely superficial and neglected as a mechanic. I don't expect them to come up with something at the level of say FNV's balance by fall this year. Not that FNV is a shining example, but it's better than average for a first person RPG, I think.

So, "good for what it is/10". Another Obsidian mediocrity.

I think what frustrates me most is that, at a glance, what they're promising on paper looks like it could have some potential, at least the base formula if not the predestined execution. Think about it - they're pitching us a FPP hub/"zone"-based Action-RPG with freeform, classless character progression, "multiple paths to tackle or avoid combat situations" and some hints at emergent gameplay opportunities supplied by "objects in the environment you can interact with" and a "comprehensive elemental system [...] both in and out of combat." Doesn't that sound vaguely familiar? This structural approach could, theoretically, accommodate a Deus Ex-style game.

But I think familiarity with both Obsidian and industry trends in general means we all know that's not what they're shooting for. What they're trying to do, same as they tried with The Otter Worlds, is fun-sized New Vegas with the odd new gimmick. And what they'll actually end up delivering... is Bioshock. Well, Bioshock with dialogue trees (and a worse fashion sense), but ultimately, it'll be the same level of gameplay sophistication and that's nothing to get excited about.


P.S. In reference to that Xbox "deep dive", when did commercial interviews in general stop trying to look unscripted? We've always known that the questions are planned in advance to facilitate the guests plugging everything they want about their product, but it used to be that participants tried to make it look like a "natural" conversation, like interviewers were trying to "discover" new information. Nowadays it's painfully transparent as interviewers guide devs through the agreed material, their follow-up questions are practically "you missed a spot!" prompts as guests fumble over their own details, so why not just ditch the interview pretense and go to a straight presentation which would be easier to follow?

 

[Grunker]

Which is why I made fun of your point. A genre label becomes kind of useless when you need to write out how the entire system works to describe it. At that point, of what use is the label

autistically speaking.

The only truly important metric, as we all know

 

[Iskramor]

He isn't white and he knows it.

Days without jewish tricks