Baldur's Gate #BaldurGate: Siege of Dragonspear

[Turjan]

Might as well talk about the game.

Preposterous!

 

[HatTrick]

One can still be transgender in a magic fantasy setting, it's just that the means to become your gender are easier to obtain than in real life where you gotta get your dick turned inside out.

Anyway, you ask the character why they have a weird name, they give you an answer. The answer's poorly written fantasy shlock, as per the literary standards of the Forgotten Realms setting, but I don't know why people say "It came out of nowhere!"

Also, what game isn't political? Even the simplest of things teaches some moral like "Fight EVIL!" or "Don't trust authority!" Arcanum, for instance, has you help orc workers in a socialist rebellion and it's clearly considered a good thing to help them. While there is indeed the option to stamp all over the dreams of these poor orcs, while in SoD there's no way to say "Haha! I laugh at your gender issues, knave!" to the trans character, the game clearly advocates for you, the player, to not take the side of corrupt business and favor the working class seizing the means of production.

 

[Wulfric Pinewood]

BURN THEM

 

[Prime Junta]

transgender woman, Mizhena, who has exactly one short dialogue entry on the subject when asked, followed by the player character going “Okay,” and changing the subject

That's what all the fuss is about?

Man, talk about easily offended.

 

[Delterius]

Arcanum, for instance, has you help orc workers in a socialist rebellion and it's clearly considered a good thing to help them.

That's actually very well integrated into the setting and the larger story of the game. At all opportunities does Arcanum bring up the industrial squalor and the racial prejudice of its world -- most of all if you are a low CHA Orc yourself -- and then caps off with an opportunity to actually roleplay about it. 'Mizhena', as far as I've heard, is but a poorly written sideshow that sets Dragon Age: Inquisition as a new standard for subtle writing. Hell, Dorian was more than just a superficial gay poster boy for new age RPGs. He was also a well intentioned national supremacist who believes in the social virtues of Slavery. Talk about interesting writing.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

I'm starting to think we need a stickied post saying "no, people aren't just bitching about a tranny in the game" as it seems that gets asked every few pages.

 

[Excidium II]

transgender woman, Mizhena, who has exactly one short dialogue entry on the subject when asked, followed by the player character going “Okay,” and changing the subject

That's what all the fuss is about?

Man, talk about easily offended.

It angered people because it was obviously just there to be incloosiv by addressing transgenderism. And all the player is allowed to do is listen with attention and respond in the manner the writer wanted him to respond (this goes for a lot of SoD's writing).

fyi:

Spoiler

What happened with Baldur's Gate?

ass jay dubya

Can you elaborate? I'm out of the loop.

Writer added tranny NPC for no reason besides muh inclusivity. Naturally, there's no evil response in the dialogue to avoid triggering transfriends.


That's the first hint at SJW shit, but then interviews appear of writer saying they modified female NPCs like Safana and Jaheira because muh soggy knees, new female companion is a single mother badass, etc. Everything p. forced.

People get outraged, devs respond in the worst way possible bringing the gg vs sjw debate right into their own game. Angry reviews on gog/steam/metacritic, Devs beg for positive reviews, etc

It blew out of proportion because of the way beamdog reacted to the complaints. The catalyst was SoD Producer who went to whine on twitter to @femfreq or some other sjw and used #gamergate tag, bringing the sjw vs gg war right into their world.

 

[Sizzle]

transgender woman, Mizhena, who has exactly one short dialogue entry on the subject when asked, followed by the player character going “Okay,” and changing the subject

That's what all the fuss is about?

Man, talk about easily offended.

People were "offended" because it's badly written (really, really, horribly badly written), out of place in the setting, and the responses where all "Oh, that's so interesting and cool, thank you ever so much for sharing your harrowing, but brave, story of overcoming hardship and prejudice."

 

[HatTrick]

Arcanum, for instance, has you help orc workers in a socialist rebellion and it's clearly considered a good thing to help them.

That's actually very well integrated into the setting and the larger story of the game. At all opportunities does Arcanum bring up the industrial squalor and the racial prejudice of its world -- most of all if you are a low CHA Orc yourself -- and then caps off with an opportunity to actually roleplay about it. 'Mizhena', as far as I've heard, is but a poorly written sideshow that sets Dragon Age: Inquisition as a new standard for subtle writing. Hell, Dorian was more than just a superficial gay poster boy for new age RPGs. He was also a well intentioned national supremacist who believes in the social virtues of Slavery. Talk about interesting writing.

Fair enough, and I do agree that the SoD writer is the sort of slacktivist who thinks that more gays and trans in video games will somehow change the opinions of those who cause problems for and victimize gays and trans. I don't think Pastor Pete and Adolf Jr. are going to be swayed by the struggles of Mizhina, the trans elf. I'm just saying that the idea that all games have no message or politics is laughable. Maybe shit like Pong or Pac-Man, but narrative games will have at least some message or theme.

 

[Trashos]

transgender woman, Mizhena, who has exactly one short dialogue entry on the subject when asked, followed by the player character going “Okay,” and changing the subject

That's what all the fuss is about?

Man, talk about easily offended.

If you read the thread, then you already know that this is not true. In a nutshell, all writing in the game is propaganda for specific worldviews. You play the game, you get the propaganda shoved down your throat. It may be OK if you don't understand it, don't care about it or are actually in favor of it, but it is not OK at all if you happen to disagree with it.

The tranny is just one of the several examples of that propaganda. Others are the Minsc quote and the rewriting of established (from BG1 and BG2) characters. The options in the dialogues where you interact with women complete the picture.

 

[Prime Junta]

Yeah but... one badly-written dialog? Jesus you people

 

[Excidium II]

Yeah but... one badly-written dialog? Jesus you people

Do you have trouble reading or what?

 

[Sizzle]

Yeah but... one badly-written dialog?

Oh, if only that were true :D

 

[Prime Junta]

If you read the thread, then you already know that this is not true. In a nutshell, all writing in the game is propaganda for specific worldviews. You play the game, you get the propaganda shoved down your throat. It may be OK if you don't understand it, don't care about it or are actually in favor of it, but it is not OK at all if you happen to disagree with it.

The tranny is just one of the several examples of that propaganda. Others are the Minsc quote and the rewriting of established (from BG1 and BG2) characters. The options in the dialogues where you interact with women complete the picture.

The irony is, though, you guys are doing the exact thing you accuse SJW's of doing: subjecting a game to a political litmus test. If it doesn't fit your politics, you rage.

 

[Mustawd]

Yeah but... one badly-written dialog? Jesus you people

It's also compunded by some statements made by the specific dev. And once the "againsters" realized they were a large group within the intended audience, then they decided to pile on and see if they could move the needle. Which they were able to. So it kind of grew out of a badly written tranny, but really came to a head due to the perceived reason why it was included in the first place.

It didn't help that shill articles and opinions came out making it out like all these people were bigots. I'm sure some are, but the vast majority of people were not specifically calling for zero trans characters. More like "if you included it don't do it just for tokenism".

 

[Excidium II]

The irony is, though, you guys are doing the exact thing you accuse SJW's of doing: subjecting a game to a political litmus test. If it doesn't fit your politics, you rage.

classic

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

The irony is, though, you guys are doing the exact thing you accuse SJW's of doing: subjecting a game to a political litmus test. If it doesn't fit your politics, you rage.

I wanted it to fit in with BG and BG2 - an unreasonable expectation, I know. But it's clear you know exactly what people were really complaining about so this "just one tranny dialogue, wow you guys" trolling routine is wearing a bit thin.

 

[GrainWetski]

Yeah but... one badly-written dialog? Jesus you people

The entire expansion is badly written. Jesus, guy.

Oh, and

 

[Trashos]

The irony is, though, you guys are doing the exact thing you accuse SJW's of doing: subjecting a game to a political litmus test. If it doesn't fit your politics, you rage.

Personally, I did nothing of that sort. I just decided that these people won't see a cent from me and I also made fun of them here (deservingly, I believe). On an intellectual level, I found it very low of them to initially dismiss the BG fans that didn't share Beamdog's worldview. They also insulted such fans ("not real fans", probably other insults as well that I 've heard but haven't doublechecked), insulted the old game ("sexist"), and their writer said in an interview "if you don't like it, too bad". And "Deal with it".

Well, the fans dealt with it.

 

[Mustawd]

If it doesn't fit your politics, you rage.

Hmm, no that's not what it was. It fits my politics just fine, but it really triggered me how sloppily it was done and for the exact reason that the writer just writes diverse characters for the sake of it.

 

[sser]

If you read the thread, then you already know that this is not true. In a nutshell, all writing in the game is propaganda for specific worldviews. You play the game, you get the propaganda shoved down your throat. It may be OK if you don't understand it, don't care about it or are actually in favor of it, but it is not OK at all if you happen to disagree with it.

The tranny is just one of the several examples of that propaganda. Others are the Minsc quote and the rewriting of established (from BG1 and BG2) characters. The options in the dialogues where you interact with women complete the picture.

The irony is, though, you guys are doing the exact thing you accuse SJW's of doing: subjecting a game to a political litmus test. If it doesn't fit your politics, you rage.

From what I can tell, it's just not a well put together game, technically or narratively. This one blurb sticks out because the writer herself shat on some people and boasted that her entire purpose was to push some politics, so even if you could ignore it (and I do think it's mostly harmless, even if hamfisted), it's hard to ignore the impetus that was behind it.

 

[Lacrymas]

Yeah, I also got triggered by this sloppy attempt at writing. I found their complete lack of talent, knowledge, experience and creativity to be extremely problematic. I want them to check their privilege regarding their status as "writers".

 

[Excidium II]

Prime Cunta must have logged on the Watch first today. What's so hard to accept in that hijacking a beloved classic to push sjw political agenda makes people angry? Even the writer already confirmed that one of her main motivations is adding more diversity.

On the codex specifically most people already held a very low opinion of beamdog, we just want to see them crash and burn.

 

[Infinitron]

I think it's more like Prima Junta was in the mood for trolling today.

 

[Immortal]

I think it's more like Prima Junta was in the mood for trolling today.

I remember the last time Prime Junta "trolled" us.. It ended with him crying to DU.