Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Early Access Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[rusty_shackleford]

For comparison's sake:

Traveller is the sci-fi version of D&D and a good example of what D&D would look like if it went down the path of not being a sellout. Miller chose being niche instead of popular at every turn, and purposely never gave up the rights to Traveller for this reason. Miller only licenses it when he feels it will be adequately represented by the licensee. Mongoose's Traveller 2E -- the most recent version of Traveller -- was released 40 years after classic Traveller, and is also very similar to it and faithful to the source material.

D&D is a whore that does whatever it's paid to do. Traveller is a waifu.

[edit]
reminded me of this post by a representative from Mongoose to a question asking why Traveller isn't more popular
https://www.reddit.com/r/traveller/...snt_traveller_more_popular/ghthxjn/?context=3

MongooseMatt 24 points 5 months ago

A couple of things here...

We are not looking for Traveller to be mentioned in the same breath as D&D. We strive to make Traveller the best it can possibly be without losing what makes it Traveller. Putting a lot of the things suggested in this thread (such as level-style progression or more pointed character creation) would erode that. Neither Mongoose nor, more importantly, Mr Miller are willing to trade the core of Traveller for commercial success (something that reared itself massively very recently behind the scenes, for the better - a story I may tell in the future).

That is not to say we are not pushing Traveller forward. Two video games are in development right now, we are experimenting with fiction, the development of Charted Space is running at full chat, the game punches suitably high on Kickstarter on a regular basis, and we are currently in discussions with some names you will properly recognise for... something great.

Right now, Traveller is doing well. We stand ready to take a phone call from CDPR, but we do not require it for Traveller to make a notable and successful stand.

Be proud to be a Traveller in the Far Future

 

[Cryomancer]

They see old editions as threats to the popularity of the current one and will do everything in their power to stop them from resurfacing. I honestly don't know how Beamdog got away with Siege of Dragonspear, probably only because they sold it as an expansion for an already existing game.

Yes, WotC is THAT dumb.

Yep. When they launched 4E, they NUKED the 3E forum and one reason which Throne of bhaal is so rushed and poorly made is due the fear of being forced to switch to 3E. OwlCat see no problem allowing Paizo to make PF:WoTR in PF1E instead of PF2E.

If someone is playing AD&D in 2021, he definitely won't stop only because WotC said 5E is better; and if a newbie wants to start playing D&D, he most probably won't even consider AD&D.

If I could find a group to play AD&D, I would be playing it. The closest that I reached was S&W, a retroclone and took a very long time to find a group of it on Frog God's discord.

Anything in BG3 could not happen if it was using 2E ruleset instead ? I dont think so .

If BG3 was 2E, would be a far better game. And you will have no chance vs intellect devours at lv 1 like you have on BG3.

4E

4E = Generic WoW clone : Tabletop Edition
The unique 4E edition which worth being played is GURPS 4th edition.

GURPS is so great. You have a system which can be used to simulate everything, from Neanderthals on the ice age in a low tech/no magic setting to space technomancers using his magical powers to build a dyson sphere and harness the powers of a star. And the best part. You only need 3d6 to play the game. You can even easily remake most MARVEL heroes into GURPS. Most of then are about 700 points which is quite strong. Few "DMs" would allow you to play a 700 point character.

A good chunk of the marketing for 4E consisted of repeatedly stating that everyone who enjoyed 3.x was a munchkin unable to appreciate a real RPG. With 5E they toned down the verbal abuse, but still acted in the most harmful possible ways towards fans of previous editions, taking down online resources very useful to everyone who was still playing 3.5. Obviously, they had the right to do so, but conveniently acted only when they needed to steer the player base towards the new edition.

Yep. This is why I don't get people comparing PF2E with D&D 4E.

Pf2e is not good as Pf1E but at least is a decent game. And Paizo is not trying to do everything that they can to force everyone and everything to play Pf2E. The unique good thing about D&D 4E is that it popularized Pathfinder. And showed how a Tabletop game with mechanics completely disconnected from the lore will fail. Because to have a boredom of cooldown managing, gear farming, you already have 16651165615615 wow clones to play on computers.

 

[Larianshill]

And you will have no chance vs intellect devours at lv 1 like you have on BG3.

So you hate "dungeons and kobolds" games, but you also hate player characters fighting anything other than kobolds.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Intellect Devourers have low CR because they got rid of Ustilagors, their larval form.

 

[Cryomancer]

And you will have no chance vs intellect devours at lv 1 like you have on BG3.

So you hate "dungeons and kobolds" games, but you also hate player characters fighting anything other than kobolds.

Because if you are making a low level D&D game, make the adventures as expected to a low level D&D game.

I don't like for example, when I killed a templar at lv 3 on Dark Sun : Shattered Lands. Templars on wake of the ravager(mid level D&D -> lv 7~15 game) are far more nasty enemies after Kalak got killed and they lost their powers. IMO the best TT adventures are mid level ones. Lv 1~4 PC's should't be dealing with creatures from Far Realm, underdark and etc. Lv 3 in underdark should give the bare minimum chance to survive against common animals on the desert. Not a level to go toe to toe with templars.

 

[Reinhardt]

And the best part. You can even easily remake most MARVEL heroes into GURPS.

Never change, Victor.

 

[Spectacle]

If Lord of the Rings were a 5e adventure like BG3 is Gandalf would be as powerful as Frodo and Pippin.

Gandalf is an obvious DMPC, not a regular player character.

 

[Storyfag]

If Lord of the Rings were a 5e adventure like BG3 is Gandalf would be as powerful as Frodo and Pippin.

Gandalf is an obvious DMPC, not a regular player character.

There even was a webcomic using movie screencaps based on that premise. It was enjoyable.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

If Lord of the Rings were a 5e adventure like BG3 is Gandalf would be as powerful as Frodo and Pippin.

Gandalf is an obvious DMPC, not a regular player character.

There even was a webcomic using movie screencaps based on that premise. It was enjoyable.

DM of the rings

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

Well, two day after that forking for a public version this mystical patch 5 has now four different forks on the SteamDB but Larian still isn't releasing shit, nor commenting explicitly on what's coming.

We Italian have a very nuanced and poetic motto that summarizes these scenarios, and it goes more or less "E ANCHE OGGI SI SCOPA DOMANI" which translates roughly as "Life can be unfair, at times".

 

[Larianshill]

"E ANCHE OGGI SI SCOPA DOMANI

Profane, delirious incantation of most terrible implication.

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

Infinity Engine art will never be topped.

why can't some company just take that engine and pump out old AD&D modules 2 times a year? Seems like they would have had a steady market for 20-30 years w/o only minor upgrades to the engine as time went on..

WotC isn't keen on licensing its old discontinued products. They see old editions as threats to the popularity of the current one and will do everything in their power to stop them from resurfacing. I honestly don't know how Beamdog got away with Siege of Dragonspear, probably only because they sold it as an expansion for an already existing game.

Yes, WotC is THAT dumb.

could just use D20 system and modify it to be like whatever version you want basically.

 

[Cryomancer]

Never change,

Never liked playing as a "superhero", I just mentioned as example of how versatile the system is. But you can easily play your 30 point manlet on gurps if you like too. I an pretty sure that modders will mod your favorite subclass into BG3 too. The animu swordsman homebrewed subclass.

IS a bit off topic, but is truth that Grimoire : Heralds of the Winged Scholar uses a "hidden" 3d6 system?

3d6 distribuition

 

[The_Mask]

Sounds like you need to play Grimoire.

 

[Salvo]

Well, two day after that forking for a public version this mystical patch 5 has now four different forks on the SteamDB but Larian still isn't releasing shit, nor commenting explicitly on what's coming.

We Italian have a very nuanced and poetic motto that summarizes these scenarios, and it goes more or less "E ANCHE OGGI SI SCOPA DOMANI" which translates roughly as "Life can be unfair, at times".

In tempi di guerra...

 

[Cryomancer]

Sounds like you need to play Grimoire.

I asked cuz I really loved Grimoire but really disliked one aspect. The game gives little information. When my giant fails to penetrate a rat's armor, the game doesn't give me which he checked against what. But the game has a amazing necromancy and I have played over 50 hours of it and have no clue about how his game mechanics works.

Back to BG3. The most popular mods on NEXUSMODS :

https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3?tab=popular+(all+time)

As you can see, modders are updating and putting more things necessary to BG3 than Larian itself. And people don't believe when I say that modders will gonna fix the game. Larian added one class. Druid. Modders added Barbarians, Bards, Sorcerers, Monks and Paladins.

Just look to what one modder added to BG3.

• Aganazzar's Scorcher - Largely based this spell off of the existing Burning Hand's, which is a close comparison, so should be smooth.
• Alter Self - This spell was partly in the game already but I followed a similar setup to the Disguise Self spell, where multiple variations of the spell are in containers.
• Calm Emotions - Currently, this only possesses half of the spell's effect which is geared towards suppressing Charmed and Frightened. The other is technically doable I believe but also iffy? I dunno.
• Cause Fear - This spell wasn't already in the game but largely straightforward in use.
• Chaos Bolt - So this spell was kind of interesting implementing but couldn't be done -exactly- like it is in 5e. Instead of the damage rolls themselves determining what the damage type is, some randomized behind the scenes nonsense is how the damage type is determined. Additionally, rather both d8s causing an additional attack, its also a behind the scenes RNG determination that has the same % chance of occurring, which will result in gaining a new spell on the hotbar that can only be used on those within 9m of the initial target. Easy enough right.
• Chromatic Orb - This spell kind of already in the game but lacking the other elemental choices. It now provides each option within a spell container.
• Command (Approach, Flee & Grovel) - While Command Halt is already functional, the other Command variations weren't entirely as much except Grovel honestly. I couldn't get Drop to work with the current limitations for scripting but I'll see if I can figure something out with that one.
• Dragon's Breath - A mostly straightforward creation that follows the actual spell fairly well I would think. Not much else to it.
• Dust Devil - This spell is easily the most ghetto questionable of all the added spells. It actually brings forth a summon that can be moved around but cannot attack. Functions largely like Dust Devil except creating the cloud of debris, which I'm working on adding later.
• Earth Tremor - As a "replacement" to Catapult, this spell is pretty close to the DnD version except the difficult terrain aspect. Not only is there no way to check if a surface for some like "loose earth", also can't just make it difficult terrain without using another surface type, like Mud as an example. It could make mud but that's deviating a little too much away from it in my eyes.
• Enhance Ability - Another spell that was mostly already in the game save for a few bits here and there. Only one that won't work 100% is Bull's Strength with doubled carry capacity as that is something that everybody becomes affected by if adjusted.
• Enlarge or Reduce - This/These spells were in the code and honestly pretty functional, so not entirely sure why they weren't added. Both are held within a container.
• Flaming Sphere - This spell is also kind of questionable in the way it works given limitations but gets close enough to the genuine article at least.
• Heroism - This spell exists in the code but had an entirely different effect (regaining hit points per turn). It's not perfect but by and large I got it working to function like the spell itself.
• Ice Knife - This spell didn't exist at all whatsoever but now it does and works fairly well.
• Knock - This spell I didn't understand why they didn't add as it has everything going for itself, icon and all. Maybe not wanting people to abuse it to unlock stuff that requires special keys and all I suppose but oh well.
• Levitate - This spell has a container with one version being usable on others and one on yourself. It doesn't do a whole lot but have plans to add a little more to it (not that it allows to much). Hopefully, I can figure out something for like melee attacks. (No longer has a container).
• Mind Spike - This spell hasn't actually been tested for its prevention of sneaking and invisibility but I'm mostly confident it works. Just "hard" to test.
• Protection From Poison - Also technically already in the game without an icon for it and in need of a few touch ups.
• Shield - This spell itself didn't exist but the passive and statuses for this worked perfectly fine, so worked this out to be perfectly functional.
• Spiritual Weapon - So this spell is kind of a lot like Dust Devil using an existing character model (being Mage Hand) but functions a bit differently as you use the skill gained when summoning it to give it the ability to move and attack accordingly.
• Suggestion - So I know this spell is probably unusual to add and do anything with given the way it works but that's also why it realistically has like an infinite number of uses, which I (very) minimally addressed by giving it just six various effects that are all largely minor but of course can last a long while if Concentration can be maintained and all.
• Zephyr Strike - This spell was one of my favorites I tried my best with and got it working pretty spot on

https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/125.

I an pretty sure that once BG3 launches and modders fixes the game, it can become a decent game.

 

[The_Mask]

I really loved Grimoire but really disliked one aspect. The game gives little information.

The game has a manual now. And the UI is very explicit. All you need is will and you can figure things out.

 

[Reinhardt]

and I have played over 50 hours

Nigga, it's 600 hours long. You barely scratched prologue.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

Managed to get a 24h ban (“mute”) on Larian’s discord yesterday.

Apparently arguing publicly that the itemization in DOS 2 was absolute trash tier (and the steep power curve that followed wasn’t any better) will get a lot of people bizarrely defensive about it and it will be labeled as “disruptive behavior in a public space” or something.

You know, the whole parade of “HOW DARE YOU?” and “THAT’S JUST YOUR OPINION” with a fringe case of “The system is every bit as good as BG2 and Pathfinder to me”.

Honestly I didn’t even imagine people who liked how the loot worked in DOS 2 and were willing to get aggressive to defend it could exist.
Best I happened to cross in the past was some tepid indifference to the issue with a side admission it wasn’t good. But for most people opinions ranged from “It’s completely awful” to “It’s downright a deal breaker”.

 

[Ninjerk]

Managed to get a 24h ban (“mute”) on Larian’s discord yesterday.

Apparently arguing publicly that the itemization in DOS 2 was absolute trash tier (and the steep power curve that followed wasn’t any better) will get a lot of people bizarrely defensive about it and it will be labeled as “disruptive behavior in a public space” or something.

You know, the whole parade of “HOW DARE YOU?” and “THAT’S JUST YOUR OPINION” with a fringe case of “The system is every bit as good as BG2 and Pathfinder to me”.

Honestly I didn’t even imagine people who liked how the loot worked in DOS 2 and were willing to get aggressive to defend it could exist.
Best I happened to cross in the past was some tepid indifference to the issue with a side admission it wasn’t good. But for most people opinions ranged from “It’s completely awful” to “It’s downright a deal breaker”.

Who will face your wrath next? Obsidian forums?

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

Who will face your wrath next? Obsidian forums?

Been there, done that.

But nah. It’s been a while but I don’t really remember any particular conflict.

On a side note, I’ve spotted a bunch of guys on the Larian forum who boldly claimed PoE II was their favorite game EVER.
Didn’t know this was a thing, either.

 

[The_Mask]

I’ve spotted a bunch of guys on the Larian forum who boldly claimed PoE II was their favorite game EVER.

We have/had some of those here too. Like... one of them even had a monocle. Hilarious.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Managed to get a 24h ban (“mute”) on Larian’s discord yesterday.

Apparently arguing publicly that the itemization in DOS 2 was absolute trash tier (and the steep power curve that followed wasn’t any better) will get a lot of people bizarrely defensive about it and it will be labeled as “disruptive behavior in a public space” or something.

You know, the whole parade of “HOW DARE YOU?” and “THAT’S JUST YOUR OPINION” with a fringe case of “The system is every bit as good as BG2 and Pathfinder to me”.

Honestly I didn’t even imagine people who liked how the loot worked in DOS 2 and were willing to get aggressive to defend it could exist.
Best I happened to cross in the past was some tepid indifference to the issue with a side admission it wasn’t good. But for most people opinions ranged from “It’s completely awful” to “It’s downright a deal breaker”.

all discords are garbage, even those created by (PBUH) Swen

 

[Swen]

Managed to get a 24h ban (“mute”) on Larian’s discord yesterday.

Apparently arguing publicly that the itemization in DOS 2 was absolute trash tier (and the steep power curve that followed wasn’t any better) will get a lot of people bizarrely defensive about it and it will be labeled as “disruptive behavior in a public space” or something.

You know, the whole parade of “HOW DARE YOU?” and “THAT’S JUST YOUR OPINION” with a fringe case of “The system is every bit as good as BG2 and Pathfinder to me”.

Honestly I didn’t even imagine people who liked how the loot worked in DOS 2 and were willing to get aggressive to defend it could exist.
Best I happened to cross in the past was some tepid indifference to the issue with a side admission it wasn’t good. But for most people opinions ranged from “It’s completely awful” to “It’s downright a deal breaker”.

Milan isn't that far from Ghent, take a train to the office and camp in front of the door. Maybe I'll let you in and you can explain to the team why our system is wrong.

 

[Alienman]

Managed to get a 24h ban (“mute”) on Larian’s discord yesterday.

Apparently arguing publicly that the itemization in DOS 2 was absolute trash tier (and the steep power curve that followed wasn’t any better) will get a lot of people bizarrely defensive about it and it will be labeled as “disruptive behavior in a public space” or something.

You know, the whole parade of “HOW DARE YOU?” and “THAT’S JUST YOUR OPINION” with a fringe case of “The system is every bit as good as BG2 and Pathfinder to me”.

Honestly I didn’t even imagine people who liked how the loot worked in DOS 2 and were willing to get aggressive to defend it could exist.
Best I happened to cross in the past was some tepid indifference to the issue with a side admission it wasn’t good. But for most people opinions ranged from “It’s completely awful” to “It’s downright a deal breaker”.

From what I understand just casually browsing the Larian spaces (forums etc) is that you are not allowed to be negative Tuco. NO NEGATIVITY!

Put on a happy face and argue things happily. Happy thoughts. I'm so happy. Are you happy Tuco?