Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Pre-Release Thread [EARLY ACCESS RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[DraQ]

I'm also happy to see the loot system looking "slimmed down". It was one of the worst things about DOS2 IMO.

Ad fontes, bitchez!

View attachment 13275

IDK, man, as much as I came to hate the itemization in D:OS II and love the idea of farting around with a base weapon for awhile I think I'm leaning toward the gay green dragon on this one.

Hey, no homo.

Anyway, if you took away bloat you would no longer have item treadmill either, just multiple weapons different from one another with no clear gradation of superiority or inferiority.
It's not my fault brainlets confuse bloat and having a lot of variables and modifiers to an item.

Apparently Codex's dream RPG these days is standing on a single tile and having random encounters happen to you until one of them is boss battle, because, hey, simplicity!

Well, simple games for simple audiences, I guess.

 

[Thac0]

One effect of being shown the weapon dice over whatever the hell divinity is doing is it gives me perfect information over the probability of the weapon.
(not perfect as most games fudge their RNG with algorithms instead of using true randomness to make it appear more random but that is besides the point)

I know that a 1d10 weapon has a 10% chance of landing each of the 10 results, while the average is 5.5 damage. Even a mess like 1d10+2d6+1d4+7 is easy to break open and to get a halfway decent read of the damage results off from a first glance. (low is 11, max is 33, average is 23, very likely to land close to the average) If a weapon has 13-76 as a damage scale in OS I have zero clue how volatile the weapon damage is.

But yes, simulation mechanics like weight and item size absolutely have their place in rpgs.

 

[DraQ]

One effect of being shown the weapon dice over whatever the hell divinity is doing is it gives me perfect information over the probability of the weapon.

Yeah, I kind of like dice notation for this reason, even though it's technically a vestige of tabletop paraphernalia.
In a cRPG you could use wider set of "dice" too, I guess, though one beneficial side effect of regular ones is limiting the number ranges and making it slightly more awkward to implement bloat.

Of course, I'm kind of averse to straight, numerical damage, but wherever you want flat or gaussian distribution that's conveyed to player, dice notation comes in handy.

 

[FranticDistortion]

100 pages of complaining about item throw doing 1-3 damage. Only on codex.

 

[DraQ]

100 pages of complaining about item throw doing 1-3 damage. Only on codex.

Should be 0-3.

 

[Ontopoly]

Remove the weight and this might very well be Heaven on Earth. I'm worried about the weapon skill without save, but we need to accept compromises.

What's would a Larian game be with out compromises? A lot of compromises. So many compromises.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Remove the weight and this might very well be Heaven on Earth. I'm worried about the weapon skill without save, but we need to accept compromises.

What's would a Larian game be with out compromises? A lot of compromises. So many compromises.

Just like Baldur's Gate made a compromise to refit an rts engine and use it for RPGs.

 

[Ontopoly]

Remove the weight and this might very well be Heaven on Earth. I'm worried about the weapon skill without save, but we need to accept compromises.

What's would a Larian game be with out compromises? A lot of compromises. So many compromises.

Just like Baldur's Gate made a compromise to refit an rts engine and use it for RPGs.

Many things are inspired by other things and make changes. It's a clear difference when your inspired by the same thing your trying to make but gut it anyways.

 

[Elex]

Zero item levels, zero stat bonuses, zero rarity colors, zero nonsensical increasing damage ranges, zero "%" effects, zero durability.

Only a single piercing 1d8, living in the moment.

Remove the weight and this might very well be Heaven on Earth. I'm worried about the weapon skill without save, but we need to accept compromises.

The immobilize condition don’t exist in 5e so i suppose is a placeholder.

 

[Black]

Remove the weight and this might very well be Heaven on Earth. I'm worried about the weapon skill without save, but we need to accept compromises.

What's would a Larian game be with out compromises? A lot of compromises. So many compromises.

Can you teach me how to farm the prestigious Codex titles like you do?

 

[Elex]

Since when is equipment weight a bad thing?
Stop making all caster parties you fags.

Since when I'm not interested in playing an inventory management simulator.

Equipment weight almost never manages to achieve what it tries to simulate and it ends up being just an hassle.

Well you need weight or str become THE dumpstat.

 

[Lacrymas]

When are we going to get actual news about this game for once? When is the Early Access?

 

[Elex]

When are we going to get actual news about this game for once? When is the Early Access?

News 6-8 june apparently

 

[Thac0]

Since when is equipment weight a bad thing?
Stop making all caster parties you fags.

Since when I'm not interested in playing an inventory management simulator.

Equipment weight almost never manages to achieve what it tries to simulate and it ends up being just an hassle.

Well you need weight or str become THE dumpstat.

As a bit of context here since many seem to not know the system of 5E:
As in most DnD systems dexterity is again a lot stronger than strength. But this time around almost all advantages from hybrid builds are gone. All weapons that may use dexterity for their Thac0/to hit calculation can also use dexterity for the damage bonus. Dexterity no longer helps when wearing heavy armor. So the only class that usually wants moderatly high dexterity in addition to strength is the barbarian since he is a melee class that doesnt want to use platemail for rage.
In a direct comparison light armors give pretty much the same AC as heavy armor and on the weapon side they are equivalently good aswell. 1d8 is the best a one handed weapon gets for both DEX and STR. The only big difference is that DEX gets amazing bows compared to STR builds having to run with Javelins, while STR gets access to two handed weapons.
Now for builds that need neither DEX or STR as a main stat DEX is much better. It raises your AC, the save is a major save instead of a minor one and it raises your initiative and your stealth.
If the DM doesnt enforce encumbrance and item weight in a 5e game (which almost none do since that is a lot of bookkeeping to do irl) everyone that isnt a fighter, barbarian or paladin ends up with 8 strength. And 8 STR max DEX fighters/paladins/barbarians are perfectly viable aswell.

So Elex is right, weight as a mechanic makes 5e a lot more balanced and gives STR a lot more reasons to exist.

 

[Lawntoilet]

Yeah, but being able to throw shit is something any reasonable GM would allow, so the only consideration here is the type of action it should be.

There already are rules for throwing, and it's an attack action and not a bonus action.
Making it a bonus action makes it way better. If they go with this it might be time to bring back the AD&D "Fastest Dart-Thrower in the West" build that was in BG1:
https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Zal

 

[Thac0]

Yeah, but being able to throw shit is something any reasonable GM would allow, so the only consideration here is the type of action it should be.

There already are rules for throwing, and it's an attack action and not a bonus action.
Making it a bonus action makes it way better. If they go with this it might be time to bring back the AD&D "Fastest Dart-Thrower in the West" build.

It will lead to literally everyone carrying a stack of the lightest throwing weapons with finesse around. Everyone will have 100 daggers in their pocket and at the end of the turn they will throw a dagger. The fighter? Hit a dude, throw dagger. The mage? Cast a spell, throw dagger. The ranger? Shoot an arrow, throw a dagger. It will be annoying af and cheese of the highest magnitude.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Yeah, but being able to throw shit is something any reasonable GM would allow, so the only consideration here is the type of action it should be.

There already are rules for throwing, and it's an attack action and not a bonus action.
Making it a bonus action makes it way better. If they go with this it might be time to bring back the AD&D "Fastest Dart-Thrower in the West" build that was in BG1:
https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Zal

Let's just hope they'll either get a clue or that their changes won't be intrusive enough to make a mod that changes all the rules back to normal impossible.

 

[Ontopoly]

Remove the weight and this might very well be Heaven on Earth. I'm worried about the weapon skill without save, but we need to accept compromises.

What's would a Larian game be with out compromises? A lot of compromises. So many compromises.

Can you teach me how to farm the prestigious Codex titles like you do?

Go against the mainstream Larian cultists and they'll try to silence you with titles. It's a tactic used by them.

 

[The_Mask]

So how much damage do fists do?

Oh wait... this game won't have monks.

Spoiler

 

[NJClaw]

So how much damage do fists do?

Oh wait... this game won't have monks.

Spoiler

They already said that every class from the PHB will be included in the game.

 

[The_Mask]

They already said that every class from the PHB will be included in the game.

My apologies then. I'm kinda more interested in the Pathfinder and Solasta stuff. I kinda lost track on stuff for Divinities Gate 2.5: Electric Boogaloo.

Follow-up then: Will my fists start glowing when I get Ki?

Also further, this time for a friend. Is it gay if they do glow? And which colours are acceptable?

 

[Thac0]

So how much damage do fists do?

Oh wait... this game won't have monks.

Spoiler

Monk is not in early access but in the final release.
Fists from plebeians do 1+Str damage, Monk fists do 1d4+Str or Dex from lvl 1.
Fist damage raises per level up to 1d10, making them equal to a Longsword wielded with both hands at level 17...
Monks usually use a Quarterstaff with both hands for most of the game, as they then get the 1d8 damage dice and they can still punch on a bonus action.
But with the new rules they might aswell throw daggers I guess...

Monks are in a weird place in 5e, they hold up relatively well until level 7, then they completely fall behind. In general one of the weaker classes.

 

[Lawntoilet]

Monks are in a weird place in 5e, they hold up relatively well until level 7, then they completely fall behind. In general one of the weaker classes.

They're still decent if they Stunning Strike on the regular. It's probably the best way to burn through Legendary Resistances, too.
Monks and Rangers are probably the weakest classes though.

 

[Thac0]

Monks are in a weird place in 5e, they hold up relatively well until level 7, then they completely fall behind. In general one of the weaker classes.

They're still decent if they Stunning Strike on the regular. It's probably the best way to burn through Legendary Resistances, too.
Monks and Rangers are probably the weakest classes though.

But at that level legendary resistance start to show up, and DnD has so high damage that it is very rarely a good idea to burn through them. Just kill the boss and be done with it.

As a rough tier list i would say:

Tier 1: Wizard, Cleric, Druid*, Fighter*, Bard, Paladin
Tier 2: Warlock, Sorcerer, Druid, Fighter, Rogue
Tier 3: Barbarian, Ranger, Monk

* Moon Druid and abusing Variant Human on Fighters puts them in T1. Otherwise T2

Ironically the entire T3 suffers the most from the bonus action rule change. Maybe Ranger the least as he needs his bonus action only once for Hunters Mark. I hope that rule doesnt survive the EA.

 

[Lawntoilet]

Monks are in a weird place in 5e, they hold up relatively well until level 7, then they completely fall behind. In general one of the weaker classes.

They're still decent if they Stunning Strike on the regular. It's probably the best way to burn through Legendary Resistances, too.
Monks and Rangers are probably the weakest classes though.

But at that level legendary resistance start to show up, and DnD has so high damage that it is very rarely a good idea to burn through them. Just kill the boss and be done with it.

As a rough tier list i would say:

Tier 1: Wizard, Cleric, Druid*, Fighter*, Bard, Paladin
Tier 2: Warlock, Sorcerer, Druid, Fighter, Rogue
Tier 3: Barbarian, Ranger, Monk

* Moon Druid and abusing Variant Human on Fighters puts them in T1. Otherwise T2

Ironically the entire T3 suffers the most from the bonus action rule change. Maybe Ranger the least as he needs his bonus action only once for Hunters Mark. I hope that rule doesnt survive the EA.

I'd put Barb above Ranger and Monk, for the unkillable Bear Totem if nothing else.
They are more MAD than other martials though since they're the only ones who really want both Str and Dex.