Cain on Games - Tim Cain's new YouTube channel

[Infinitron]

I talk about all the times I was underestimated...by teachers, by schoolmates, by work colleagues. It feels like the opposite of impostor syndrome.

Isn't Grounded a huge success?

For Obsidian and Microsoft, not for Private Division.

 

[Old Hans]

Isn't Grounded a huge success?

that game is like a TV show that's been on for 30 seasons, but you've never seen a single person talk about it.

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

The Outer World should've been Isometric cRPG. The fact that it needs to be "Fallout (New Vegas) in Space" proof how detrimental FNV impact has been to FPP CRPG-like games.

Seems more like it's proof Pillars didn't sell too well.

I haven't played many newer games besides PF Kingmaker, that was a modest success by crpg standards and despite console ports and hiw easy it is to learn about and purchase games nowadays, its sales numbers are comparable to how well BG2 did the first 5 years after release.

I followed the CRPG scene a bit the past 2 years, BG3 is really an anomaly as it sold very well but is tb and has a DND ruleset. Basically any similar game that I know of that's come out the past 20 years or so hasnt been terribly successful besides D: OS2 and BG3 allegedly has sold double of what that game did.

I can't blame Obsidian for trying to make something that would appeal to a larger demographic. They tried making a more traditional crpg and it didn't work out well enough to continue in that direction. Sawyer wants a huge budget to try that type of game again and I don't think he's just being dramatic about it. He feels like they won't make money if they don't have big money to produce something that could compete with BG3.

I guess there's something special about Larian. After the success of BG3 maybe we will get more games that are similar in the future.

Plenty of explanation.

My understanding is:

5e is fairly popular for being a relatively easier to understand ruleset compared to prior iteration. Larian is known to have successfully made an RPG that is inclusive enough that everyone, not just regular cRPG folk, can enjoy (even for those who are not familiar with RPG, DOS2 was easy enough to understand to play and enjoy). It's a perfect match.

Baldur's Gate 3 is the logical conclusion of both 5e and Larian's philosophy. Some hate it, but evidently much more people loved it.

 

[NecroLord]

I talk about all the times I was underestimated...by teachers, by schoolmates, by work colleagues. It feels like the opposite of impostor syndrome.

Isn't Grounded a huge success?

For Obsidian and Microsoft, not for Private Division.

Careful who you call ugly in high school...

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

Isn't Grounded a huge success?

that game is like a TV show that's been on for 30 seasons, but you've never seen a single person talk about it.

This is that one time where you should bask in the experience of not being the target audience of thing.

It has 50k+ user review on Steam. Recently traditional audience affirming RPG Skald barely hitting their target sales.

I tried grounded, it's good casual game you would be interested in playing after works. I think the target audience are kids and adults.

 

[Roguey]

"They misunderestimated me," - George W Bush and Tim Cain

When the money's not there, it's not there https://www.videogameschronicle.com...vision-staff-reportedly-laid-off-by-take-two/ https://www.gamedeveloper.com/busin...ill-either-sell-or-shut-down-private-division

That's the money not being there now. Between Outer Worlds and now, they've managed to release a handful of questionable titles and canceled others. There's also the debacle of KSP2's Early Access, which was probably financial, but they absolutely wrecked the chances for that title to succeed.

There's a lot of risk in putting all your eggs in one basket.

With the label's formation on December 14, 2017, Take-Two announced four games already in the works to be published under the label: The Outer Worlds from Obsidian Entertainment, Darkborn (originally as working title Project Wight) from The Outsiders, Disintegration from V1 Interactive, and Ancestors: The Humankind Odyssey from Panache Digital Games. Additionally, Kerbal Space Program, acquired earlier by Take-Two from Squad, will be re-published under the Private Division label.[6][5] In the case of Darkborn, some time in 2018, Private Division and The Outsiders decided to go separate ways, with Private Division stating that they continued to support The Outsiders for several months after the termination of the contract.

They got rid of one and had two others, both games being pretty small. They didn't have a lot of money to throw around.

The Outer World should've been Isometric cRPG.

An isometric crpg from Obsidian would not have sold over 5 million copies. We have proof of that in Pillars, Pillars 2, and Tyranny.

 

[Yosharian]

Cain is irrelevant.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

Deadfire was and still is visually stunning, build on that technology, sprinkle some Cain&Boyarsky magic on top and who knows, could've been a hit.

Question is would Private Division fund it. Probably not.

 

[Silverfish]

Cain will be relevant as long as the genre exists and "what have you done for me lately" is poison.

 

[Yosharian]

Some hasbeen game developer who doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about now, and it's questionable if he ever did. This cunt is relevant? Give it a fucking rest.

"Fallout is a great show" this dude is fucking done.

 

[Silverfish]

When you're one of the key people behind Fallout, you're allowed to have bad takes.

 

[Alienman]

Sure, but I think it comes with a limit still.

 

[scytheavatar]

The Outer World should've been Isometric cRPG. The fact that it needs to be "Fallout (New Vegas) in Space" proof how detrimental FNV impact has been to FPP CRPG-like games.

Seems more like it's proof Pillars didn't sell too well.

I haven't played many newer games besides PF Kingmaker, that was a modest success by crpg standards and despite console ports and hiw easy it is to learn about and purchase games nowadays, its sales numbers are comparable to how well BG2 did the first 5 years after release.

I followed the CRPG scene a bit the past 2 years, BG3 is really an anomaly as it sold very well but is tb and has a DND ruleset. Basically any similar game that I know of that's come out the past 20 years or so hasnt been terribly successful besides D: OS2 and BG3 allegedly has sold double of what that game did.

I can't blame Obsidian for trying to make something that would appeal to a larger demographic. They tried making a more traditional crpg and it didn't work out well enough to continue in that direction. Sawyer wants a huge budget to try that type of game again and I don't think he's just being dramatic about it. He feels like they won't make money if they don't have big money to produce something that could compete with BG3.

I guess there's something special about Larian. After the success of BG3 maybe we will get more games that are similar in the future.

Larian never made games with the aim of "appealing to a larger demographic", they made games they wanted to make and then believe the audience would support them. Successful studios like CDPR and Fromsoft did the same thing.

Like you said DOS2 is already far more successful than anything Obsidian has done other than New Vegas and Sawyer is being delusional if he thinks he can make a game of BG3's success with BG3 money.

 

[Yosharian]

When you're one of the key people behind Fallout, you're allowed to have bad takes.

No you're not.

 

[Russia is over. The end.]

Larian never made games with the aim of "appealing to a larger demographic"

they made games they wanted to make

Dude, who are these "Larian people" who make games that "they want to make"? Everything is run by one guy called Swen. Larian employees make what he wants them to make. What kind of mess do you have in your head? Larian isn't Valve.

As to "not appeal to larger demographic", you must be fucking kidding me. It's just that Swen personally enjoys female-oriented slash fanfic content personally, with gay shit all over the place, right? But ALSO it's apparently a recent development, because previous games weren't pumped with gay shit. So he must have had a personality change. Oh no, it wasn't for a larger audience, he just got into gay shit personally and recently, uh huh.

 

[0sacred]

I talk about all the times I was underestimated...by teachers, by schoolmates, by work colleagues. It feels like the opposite of impostor syndrome.

I don't care enough to remember all the times I've been underestimated, but Tim remembers vividly? Or does he also put it in writing with little angry doodles on the side?

Tim certainly knows how to hold a grudge, but instead of going postal he just buys a carton of muffins to eat by himself while crying a little. So wholesome.

 

[NecroLord]

Tim certainly knows how to hold a grudge, but instead of going postal he just buys a carton of muffins to eat by himself while crying a little. So wholesome.

He gay.

 

[Russia is over. The end.]

I don't care enough to remember all the times I've been underestimated, but Tim remembers vividly?

Non-weak women and homos are often underestimated because they look weak by virtue of being women and homos. Naturally it pisses them off, so they remember.

Tim, if you didn't act like a faggot all the time, nobody would underestimate you. Act normal. Unlearn your faggy voice (it's disgusting).

 

[Lemming42]

Some hasbeen game developer who doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about now, and it's questionable if he ever did. This cunt is relevant? Give it a fucking rest.

He's going to be perpetually relevant because of Fallout, same way GabeN is relevant despite not having done anything of note in a long time, and not having done anything actually good since 1998.

Good games are created largely by accident; I don't think Tim has any unique skills and his post-Fallout career is mostly questionable at best, and Fallout itself was - like most good creative works - probably the result of a unique combination of factors and a massive amount of good luck which coalesced to produce something greater than any of the people working on it were capable of doing individually. But Fallout's enough of an achievement that it rightly secures Tim's place in history. He's only made one superb game... but that's still one more superb game than most game devs make. If the creator of Fallout speaks, I'll still listen.

Having said that, I have stopped watching his YT vids on the grounds that I hate hearing him be ludicrously wrong about shit constantly.

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

An isometric crpg from Obsidian would not have sold over 5 million copies. We have proof of that in Pillars, Pillars 2, and Tyranny.

Pillars and Tyranny are RTWP cRPGs only. General audiences are likely not going to like that.

Deadfire has turn-based combat but came out later. As far as I've seen, there are more newer players on Deadfire in recent years than on Pillars 1.

I'm betting that because a lot of their popularity with the general public comes from New Vegas, some New Vegas "fans" (who consist of mostly FPS players with a limited understanding of RPGs) aren't really interested in cRPGs, especially one that didn't have turn-based combat at launch. It's a shame because Deadfire is practically a New Vegas-like experience.

 

[Roguey]

Pillars and Tyranny are RTWP cRPGs only. General audiences are likely not going to like that.

Says who? Neverwinter Nights, Knights of the Old Republic, and Dragon Age sold a few million.

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

Says who? Neverwinter Nights, Knights of the Old Republic, and Dragon Age sold a few million.

I'm pretty sure there is a gap between these games and the release of Pillars 1 which we conveniently ignore to glaze over how "RTWP is not the problem".

Also DAO and KOTOR isn't exactly "RTWP" for general audience. And let's not forget that NWN1 isn't really popular and remembered when people talk about "Classic cRPG" outside this shithole.

 

[Roguey]

Says who? Neverwinter Nights, Knights of the Old Republic, and Dragon Age sold a few million.

I'm pretty sure there is a gap between these games and the release of Pillars 1 which we conveniently ignore to glaze over how "RTWP is not the problem".

Dragon Age Inquisition was released in 2014 and did well enough to keep making Dragon Age games.

 

[PunchYouInTheFace]

Dragon Age Inquisition was released in 2014 and did well enough to keep making Dragon Age games.

DAI is GOTY of that year, but nobody talks RTWP as the main selling point of the game. Come on now.

It's literally the one thing "traditional RPG fans" are keep complaining about DAI combat.

 

[Roguey]

DAI is GOTY of that year, but nobody talks RTWP as the main selling point of the game. Come on now.

It's literally the one thing "traditional RPG fans" are keep complaining about DAI combat.

A lot of people hate Bioware's rtwp combat, didn't stop them from selling millions.