CD Projekt's Cyberpunk 2077 Update 2.0 + Phantom Liberty Expansion Thread

[Parsimonious cook]

Yeah, the "unreliable narrator" angle certainly makes sense (I almost forgot about that line said by Alt), and certainly does make Johnny look like a pathetic and malicious tard:

- Thomson saved his life and acted respectfully towards him when he could see he was hurt by Alt´s death, he deals with that memory by smashing Thomson´s face in his mind and then just wiping him out of the story

- Shaitan is the actual cool Rambo dude who fucks shit up, so he imagines him as a mook who goes down five seconds after shooting starts

- Bombing of Arasaka tower is an actual military operation backed by Militech (yes, Johnny, the paragon of "Fuck the corps" movement actually had Militech commandos as a part of his team), but he imagines it as some revenge trip that he sets out on right after walking out of a concert

I wonder if I am not giving the writers too much credit here, but if this is the intention they had, I would say its pretty cool.

 

[Danikas]

Yeah, the "unreliable narrator" angle certainly makes sense (I almost forgot about that line said by Alt), and certainly does make Johnny look like a pathetic and malicious tard:

- Thomson saved his life and acted respectfully towards him when he could see he was hurt by Alt´s death, he deals with that memory by smashing Thomson´s face in his mind and then just wiping him out of the story

- Shaitan is the actual cool Rambo dude who fucks shit up, so he imagines him as a mook who goes down five seconds after shooting starts

- Bombing of Arasaka tower is an actual military operation backed by Militech (yes, Johnny, the paragon of "Fuck the corps" movement actually had Militech commandos as a part of his team), but he imagines it as some revenge trip that he sets out on right after walking out of a concert

I wonder if I am not giving the writers too much credit here, but if this is the intention they had, I would say its pretty cool.

In that scene when Alt gets kidnapped he thinks its all about him even when Thompson says its about soulkiller and Alt he still thinks it was all about him and she got kidnapped only because she is his girlfriend.

 

[Sòren]

idk. panam's romance was so realistic that it was uncomfortable. like a girlfriend simulator. textmessages and stuff. to say that the game has a hint of genious would be too much, but some people working at CD certainly knew what they are doing.

 

[alyvain]

Yeah they were going for that if you listen to this alt line.

Sure, that's what I based my assumptions upon, but it's not a developed theme anyway.

I do believe that the chip corruption may have to lead to Johnny's memories being particularly rough around the edges, while the personality is preserved and is left to fill the gaps. Or not. It is never addressed properly. We do know that the chip is not intact after the heist, and it's actually getting worse (hence, the insertion) but what does that actually mean to Johnny we can't be sure.

 

[JustMyOnion]

On the other hand, "that guy who's an asshole on the surface? Well if you dig deeper, you might find out that he's a super asshole" isn't much of an interesting twist.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Yeah they were going for that if you listen to this alt line.

Sure, that's what I based my assumptions upon, but it's not a developed theme anyway.

I do believe that the chip corruption may have to lead to his memories being particularly rough around the edges, while the personality is preserved and fill the gaps. Or not. It is never addressed properly. We do know that the chip is not intact after the heist, and it's actually getting worse (hence, the insertion) but what does that actually mean to Johnny we can't be sure.

Well, even in real life, memories tend to deteriorate over time since what you are recalling is not an event, but your previous held memory of it. So in the case of a corrupted engram, it would make perfect sense that the missing data would be replaced with memories that complement Johnny's personality and view of himself.

 

[alyvain]

Well, even in real life, memories tend to deteriorate over time since what you are recalling is not an event, but your previous held memory of it. So in the case of a corrupted engram, it would make perfect sense that the missing data would be replaced with memories that complement Johnny's personality and view of himself.

Right, that's what I think. But now we have only some circumstantional evidence to Johnny's being an unreliable narrator (Alt's single line and some weird retcons), and the influence of the chip's corruption is only a guess. For all we know everything may be just wishful thinking, especially given the miserable state of the game. Maybe some of the DLCs will clarify this.

 

[Ezeekiel]

Isn't Johnny the one who unintentionally killed Alt's human aspect (or prevented her from returning or something like that) by disconnecting her body during that first rescure mission? Maybe that, coupled with being in digital storage for ages fubared his personality and memories.

Too bad this game doesn't commit enough to it's various narrative threads and themes, for the most part.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Isn't Johnny the one who unintentionally killed Alt's human aspect (or prevented her from returning or something like that) by disconnecting her body during that first rescure mission?

Yes, but he didn't know that Alt was out of her body and he remained ignorant of this fact all the way to becoming an engram.

 

[JustMyOnion]

But he said that she contacted him a few weeks after.

 

[Ezeekiel]

Isn't Johnny the one who unintentionally killed Alt's human aspect (or prevented her from returning or something like that) by disconnecting her body during that first rescure mission?

Yes, but he didn't know that Alt was out of her body and he remained ignorant of this fact all the way to becoming an engram.

For some reason I thought he either found out or was told by Saburo to torment him or something, guess my memory is no better than ol' Silverhand's :D

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Isn't Johnny the one who unintentionally killed Alt's human aspect (or prevented her from returning or something like that) by disconnecting her body during that first rescure mission?

Yes, but he didn't know that Alt was out of her body and he remained ignorant of this fact all the way to becoming an engram.

For some reason I thought he either found out or was told by Saburo to torment him or something, guess my memory is no better than ol' Silverhand's :D

I could be wrong myself, but I don't recall the game implying that Saburo or someone else had told him.

 

[Mefi]

Right, that's what I think. But now we have only some circumstantional evidence to Johnny's being an unreliable narrator (Alt's single line and some weird retcons), and the influence of the chip's corruption is only a guess. For all we know everything may be just wishful thinking, especially given the miserable state of the game. Maybe some of the DLCs will clarify this.

There are clear steers that Johnny's memory isn't wholly truthful, at the same time you're never certain just how much is continuity error on the part of the game.

Spoiler

Like that big heroic opening scene where he's finally caught by Smasher, and then has his arm blown off. Is it intended to show that the subsequent scene being tortured and then having Soulkiller used on him is false because he's still got the arm which was blown off attached? It does seem far too neat to be watching the nuclear mushroom over the city while Saboru does a Saturday morning cartoon villain routine and Johnny cracks wise.

 

[alyvain]

But he said that she contacted him a few weeks after.

I could be wrong myself, but I don't recall the game implying that Saburo or someone else had told him.

I do remember a line, according to which Alt somehow contacted him

Spoiler

after her "death".

Saburo has probably nothing to do with it: those are two different Arasaka's tower break-ins, after all.

There are clear steers that Johnny's memory isn't wholly truthful, at the same time you're never certain just how much is continuity error on the part of the game.

Spoiler

Like that big heroic opening scene where he's finally caught by Smasher, and then has his arm blown off. Is it intended to show that the subsequent scene being tortured and then having Soulkiller used on him is false because he's still got the arm which was blown off attached? It does seem far too neat to be watching the nuclear mushroom over the city while Saboru does a Saturday morning cartoon villain routine and Johnny cracks wise.

That's what irritates me about this game's story (and maybe entertains a bit).

Spoiler

The probability that Johnny constructed/remembered of all things a woman who lost her husband in the bombing could have been a nice psychological touch. I feel that whoever was responsible for narrative direction of the game obviously wanted a more accurate and humane treatment of characters, than it is usually accepted in video games, but the fact that this game is half-baked and even story-wise not executed properly, makes it all too akin to LARPing.

 

[DalekFlay]

It's not only delusional but out right false. First and foremost, they got 150% base pay during the crunch, that alone is better than imaginary twitter points. They're also still getting bonuses from the release (it sold very well). In a few months/patches the game will be stable and from a tech perspective it's a good accomplishment. Any company these people will be going to from CDPR will be more than impressed that they worked on a game of Cyber Punk 2077 scale.

The people hee-haw'ing and pretending to feel bad for the engineers who worked on the game are out of their minds.

People are different, some might prefer to make less in exchange for more freedom and switch to an indie or whatever. I'd guess the vast majority of people there want to be there though, and think 5 months of hell are worth the financial reward. My wife recently did a 6 week Covid emergency assignment in a small town for three times her base pay, working 60 hours a week, and while it was absolute hell for her we now get to remodel our dining room. People make these kinds of decisions all the time.

 

[typical user]

By the way I can't help but point out the grey-morality trick is sloppy in Cyberpunk 2077 to the point the illusion of the deep problems in Witcher 3 disappears for me. The quests are great because they make you think but... When my only option of resolving XBDs studio ran by a guy and his son is to shoot them in the heads and their only argument is that "someone else will replace them" just feels lacking. Or Takemura who can't be persuaded to leave his vendetta behind and actually talk to Yorinobu or all those shards which try to show gangsters assaulting random stores from desperation.

In Witcher 3 it worked since it was Geralt's choice to not try and save the entire world but in the end he did get involved in political schemes and he very often could speak up his mind about different problems. V very often just gives up or the quests end in the middle with no definite solution. Also CP2077 is telling the story of Silverhand who did try to change things around but with a fucked-up execution.

EDIT: Shame the main story is so personal due to The Relic and less about trying to change things around and acting as a non-canon to not mess up with Pondsmith vision. Silverhand getting engrammed is a retcon so I don't think he would mind it if the game had more defined ending affecting NC.

 

[Twiglard]

Isn't Johnny the one who unintentionally killed Alt's human aspect (or prevented her from returning or something like that) by disconnecting her body during that first rescure mission?

Yes, but he didn't know that Alt was out of her body and he remained ignorant of this fact all the way to becoming an engram.

In the memory, yes. In canon, something else entirely happened.

https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Alt_Cunningham

Johnny detonated an explosive charge which gave Toshiro the chance to disconnect Alt from her body. Johnny killed Toshiro and left with Alt's lifeless body, unknowingly leaving her digital form behind.[2]

You think it sucks working at CDPR now, compared to crunching for a year to release this turd?

Absolutely, it means the crunch was for nothing and now most people think you are lazy or incompetent

And I have to repeat yet again that they worked for one additional day a week, with full overtime. This isn't Kwa.

 

[Danikas]

Just heard Mike pondsmith talking on the radio (he voices one radio personality) about the net being hell didnt manage to screenshot first part.

 

[Semiurge]

Playing through the endings at the moment. It took a few fights to notice a certain armor issue - again.

Not that it matters much at that level.

You must be feeling all those grenades and other quick access items click against your back teeth.

 

[hans_af_claes]

Hope you kids are enjoying this "role playing" game I heard you can meet...

..Keanu Reeves there, wonder what "role" he is playing, weird huh, I thought he was an actor.

 

[msxyz]

The whole story doesn't make a lot of sense since its premises... what value could possibly have the Relic of Johnny Silverhand? Why Yorinobu steals that Relic, if his aim is just to sell technology to competitors (or to denouce the practice to NetWatch)? Any other Relic would do just fine. It's not like that Relic contains damning evidence against Arasaka. It proves that Night City was indeed nuked by a bunch of terrorists, among other things.

I'm starting to believe those rumors that the role of Silverhand in the story was greatly reshaped late in development, once the deal with Mr Reeves was finalized.

Come to think of it, the story would be more believable if Yorinobu and Saburo Arasaka roles in the hotel are switched and the Relic contains the memory of none other than Mr. Saburo Arasaka himself. The old man comes to Night City for whatever business reason. He brings with him one of the relics he uses to 'backup' his mind in case something happens along the way or if his aged body gives up. Somebody knows that Mr. Arasaka always travels with a Relic and sees an opportunity to steal it. The memories of the most powerful man in the word are worth a fortune (unlike those of a forgotten rockerboy and wannabe terrorist). The plan however goes to hell once Yorinobu comes to visit and kills his father; then he takes over the family company and he has all the other relics of his father destroyed. So V find himself/herself with the vengeful ghost of Mr. Saburo Arasaka in the head slowly taking over and (s)he must struggle to survive while taking a part in shaping the destiny of the most powerful corporation in the world.

 

[Twiglard]

The whole story doesn't make a lot of sense since its premises... what value could possibly have the Relic of Johnny Silverhand? Why Yorinobu steals that Relic

He wants to burn 'Saka to the ground. Which is why he specifically takes Silverhand's engram on the prototype.

It's specifically said that the engram part is old tech, and the prototype -- in particular, the way it takes over a person's nervous system -- is the rare, expensive part. So Yorinobu and Johnny have the same goals.

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

Silverhand with his Polish VO is by far the single greatest thing about CP2077.

I never imagined Keanu to be out of character of Keanu, but there we go lmao.

 

[Haplo]

Before I invested a perk point into wall penetration

Wat. There is a perk required for wall penetration?
My tech guns always penetrate when charged. Yeah baby.The anti-materiel rifle does that as well.
Lizzy is hillariously OP and carried my low rez ass a looooooong time. After that it was a two-shot Burya with some 700 dmg per shot. Totally balanced weapons.

That tremble effect is also... I don't get the mechanic behind it. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes it's gone after switching weapons. It's not related to cover, body, crouching or tech. It's just... random. And especially in the case of the Negromata makes the gun useless when it shakes.

Probably a bug. Most likely a bug. Yeah, definitly a bug.

No. But there is a perk that is supposed to make wall penetration significantly easier on Tech weapons. You see, normally you'd need to (nearly?) fully charge the weapon (causing heavy shake - yeah, often bugged also) to penetrate walls, that perk should reduce the required charge (therefore also the charge time AND shake magnitude).

 

[Turjan]

Before I invested a perk point into wall penetration

Wat. There is a perk required for wall penetration?
My tech guns always penetrate when charged. Yeah baby.The anti-materiel rifle does that as well.
Lizzy is hillariously OP and carried my low rez ass a looooooong time. After that it was a two-shot Burya with some 700 dmg per shot. Totally balanced weapons.

That tremble effect is also... I don't get the mechanic behind it. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes it's gone after switching weapons. It's not related to cover, body, crouching or tech. It's just... random. And especially in the case of the Negromata makes the gun useless when it shakes.

Probably a bug. Most likely a bug. Yeah, definitly a bug.

No. But there is a perk that is supposed to make wall penetration significantly easier on Tech weapons. You see, normally you'd need to (nearly?) fully charge the weapon (causing heavy shake - yeah, often bugged also) to penetrate walls, that perk should reduce the required charge (therefore also the charge time AND shake magnitude).

The bug is that the Nekomata always acts like fully charged without the perk, which means 100% wall penetration without shaking, as it works without charging. At least it did for me. With the perk, wall penetration failed about half the time, even fully charged. I experienced the first shaking after I got a few tech perks.