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Crown Wars: The Black Prince - historical fantasy turn-based tactics from Naheulbeuk devs

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Deep discounts don't happen overnight, especially with successful/semi-successful games. It might take around 2 years for a game to reach a really deep discount. Or it might take 3 months like with that Age of Sigmar RTS. However, people have such extensive backlogs, there's no real need to buy games on release unless you really, really want them or want to support the devs. Even then, you should still look at legit third party retailers because they usually have a 10% or even 20% launch discount and the devs still get the same or close to the same amount.
 

Alienman

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Codex Year of the Donut Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Niche pricing, as being higher because of genre rarity would work if indie games showed high quality consistently, but they don't. So, I find it hard to argue for that.
 

Tyranicon

A Memory of Eternity
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Niche pricing, as being higher because of genre rarity would work if indie games showed high quality consistently, but they don't. So, I find it hard to argue for that.
Niche pricing could work if the game couldn't be described as "yet another XCOM knockoff".

I've always wondered about this. Is the nu-XCOM formula really that popular for it to be so attractive to so many devs?
 

mediocrepoet

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Niche pricing, as being higher because of genre rarity would work if indie games showed high quality consistently, but they don't. So, I find it hard to argue for that.
Niche pricing could work if the game couldn't be described as "yet another XCOM knockoff".

I've always wondered about this. Is the nu-XCOM formula really that popular for it to be so attractive to so many devs?

I think it might be because it's relatively simple on the face of it. A movement point, 1-2 action points, grid to move on. So you have the skeleton for your mechanics and such to sit on.
 

mediocrepoet

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I have no idea how this guy plays through these games so quickly and 100% no less.

Sometimes gets things in advance, no lifes the shit out of everything and it seems like he's not going for the "experience" most of the time so much as just trying to check the boxes to pump out another video. It's why his insights tend to be comprehensive over the entire game but usually pretty shallow.
 

Trash Player

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Niche pricing, as being higher because of genre rarity would work if indie games showed high quality consistently, but they don't. So, I find it hard to argue for that.
Of course, the industry wouldn't become what it is if niche products with medium production values are more attractive to customers. It is AAA and shoestrings indies that are the rages now for very valid reasons.
 

Galdred

Studio Draconis
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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Niche pricing, as being higher because of genre rarity would work if indie games showed high quality consistently, but they don't. So, I find it hard to argue for that.
Niche pricing could work if the game couldn't be described as "yet another XCOM knockoff".
That said, it is one of the very few ones to really follow the formula (ie having a base to manage, research and tactical missions), even though the geoscape layer itself is a bit barebones (I think you have to manage the corruption of the main factions later on).
 
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Galdred

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
FWIW (take that with a grain of salt, as I am doing a very similar game!), after 9h or so:

- The combat itself is pretty enjoyable, and mission variety is not bad. Fixed weapons (couleuvrines, stone throwers, ballistas) on castle maps are quite cool. I wish they did more with that.
- Good mission variety. Some players complained about timers. I found them quite manageable so far, but I am only in act 2 (and optimizing this phase by maxing the castle).
- Very cool execution animations.
- True permadeath (yes, it is becoming rarer!)

Neutral:
- It is supposed to be during the HYW, but you fight all factions that for some reason get corrupted with non historical character classes.
- I'm not sure there is much build variety as some classes seem to work better when taking all the perks of a single side (you have 2 branches to take perks from, but some seem to only synergize with other perks of the same branch).
- There is quite some disconnect between the missions and the geoscape (the first assassination unlocks the forge because reason? It is pretty minor though).
- Research is a bit meh, with basically number upgrades. Armor works as in NuXCOM (flat DR, with small numbers, but that still make a significant difference).
- You unlock customization options with level ups, and you can decide between males and females

WTF
- Every character from a class has the same base stats.
- it is cheaper to recruit a level 3 character than to train your level 2 to level 3...
- Zero penalty for ranged characters in melee. They even have melee executions with their ranged weapons.
- Many players reported stability issues, but I haven't got much problem so far (but it is supposed to increase later on).
- You have a doom clock, but not before chapter 3, so you can spend the whole chapter 2 grinding your base
- You cannot order a character while someone else is finishing his move...

Overall, I enjoy it quite a bit, despite its flaws. It probably suffers from having been out too quickly.
 

mediocrepoet

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I agree with your thoughts for the most part. These ones though:

WTF
- Every character from a class has the same base stats.
- it is cheaper to recruit a level 3 character than to train your level 2 to level 3...

Yeah some of the costing is a bit bizarre, but I sort of wonder if they're intending for the guys to feel expendable and generic. Granted, some of the costs are bizarre like how you can get new hires for less than a 25% hp healing balm.


- Zero penalty for ranged characters in melee. They even have melee executions with their ranged weapons.

This, but they do tend to be (a little bit) weaker than melee weapons and have less good special effects that go with the hit. It is weird though, just like how there's no dead zone, even for weapons like ballista and trebuchets. Sometimes shots defy physics, re: minimum range. :lol:

- You have a doom clock, but not before chapter 3, so you can spend the whole chapter 2 grinding your base

From what I've seen, it looks like side quests will dry up so even though you can have semi-infinite gold I think from tithes, you'll likely run out of other resources. Or were you thinking just basically collect tithes forever and buy everything off the market? :lol:

Do the enemies tech up based on time or just chapters? Do you know?
 

Nortar

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Overall, I enjoy it quite a bit, despite its flaws. It probably suffers from having been out too quickly.

Thansk for the details. It's good to know the game is fun.
I have yet to see it myself, maybe on Steam summer sale.

But I heard someone mentioned nuXCom style "evacuation" zones.
There's could an area, not even near borders of a map, just in an open field, and once your characters reach it, the mission is over.
There's no helicopter to evacuate your troops though, like in XCom.

Is this true?
 
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Galdred

Studio Draconis
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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
- You have a doom clock, but not before chapter 3, so you can spend the whole chapter 2 grinding your base

From what I've seen, it looks like side quests will dry up so even though you can have semi-infinite gold I think from tithes, you'll likely run out of other resources. Or were you thinking just basically collect tithes forever and buy everything off the market? :lol:
Oh, I haven't noticed that yet. I will check back later if I run out of these. Waiting days for the tithe to collect would be a bit too boring for my sanity, and the amount is a bit low.
Do the enemies tech up based on time or just chapters? Do you know?
I don't know. I find mission easier than when I started chapter 2 so far (as in, I got a few perfect ones lately, and I'm sure it was not even close before).
Bonus point is that chapter 2 is much stabler than 3+!


Overall, I enjoy it quite a bit, despite its flaws. It probably suffers from having been out too quickly.

Thansk for the details. It's good to know the game is fun.
I have yet to see it myself, maybe on Steam summer sale.

But I heard someone mentioned nuXCom style "evacuation" zones.
There's could an area, not even near borders of a map, just in an open field, and once your characters reach it, the mission is over.
There's no helicopter to evacuate your troops though, like in an XCom.

Is this true?
Yes, they copied this a bit too much. However, the evac zones are located further away from anything (enemy, ...) on the battlefield, so you don't have to suspend disbelief much to accept these were the edges (maybe sometimes a reinforcement point is a bit further away).

The weird thing is that you are told that when clicking evac, any characters not in the area will be counted as casualty, while in XCOM2, you just evac-ed the characters there and kept fighting with the others.
Also, I'd rather have the game tell me if I have a character not in the area. It is trivial to check, but still, it feels like an unecessary step.
 

mediocrepoet

Philosoraptor in Residence
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Yes, they copied this a bit too much. However, the evac zones are located further away from anything (enemy, ...) on the battlefield, so you don't have to suspend disbelief much to accept these were the edges (maybe sometimes a reinforcement point is a bit further away).

What's funny is when your evac point is right beside reinforcement points and guys start spawning in right around it. The first reinforcements are basically guaranteed to spawn in and the second could. Usually I wipe the first squad and get out before the second comes in, but you could basically just rush the point and end the turn with an extraction, despite being surrounded by guys.

That's weird, it's not like you have a helicopter to extract with. :lol:
 

ArchAngel

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Yes, they copied this a bit too much. However, the evac zones are located further away from anything (enemy, ...) on the battlefield, so you don't have to suspend disbelief much to accept these were the edges (maybe sometimes a reinforcement point is a bit further away).

What's funny is when your evac point is right beside reinforcement points and guys start spawning in right around it. The first reinforcements are basically guaranteed to spawn in and the second could. Usually I wipe the first squad and get out before the second comes in, but you could basically just rush the point and end the turn with an extraction, despite being surrounded by guys.

That's weird, it's not like you have a helicopter to extract with. :lol:
It works like that in plenty of games including those that are supposed to be more realistic like Phoenix Point. Sure you got a craft in PP but unlike Xcom where it actually shows your guys evac on to it, in PP you just disappear and mission ends.
 

ArchAngel

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As for this game, I watched people play it a bit on Twitch, it does look kind of fun. I willl try to check it out in some future when it is properly patched and maybe with an expansion or two.
 

Galdred

Studio Draconis
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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
As for this game, I watched people play it a bit on Twitch, it does look kind of fun. I willl try to check it out in some future when it is properly patched and maybe with an expansion or two.
It really doesn't look like they will be able to make expansions for the game. The launch has been quite lackluster so far.

Btw, I had to interrupt my playthrough in the beginning of chapter 3, because the party I sent to clear a corruption mission got lost in the warp afterwards (it reseted to the stronghold, and went back to the corruption site instead of going back from the corruption site mission to the stronghold. Upon reaching it, it crashes the game...).

Edit: it looks like the crash may have been dure to something else. Actually, it looks like they are back in the castle. That said, I had to skip (ie, kill my own guys) a few fights to pass time, so I'll check whether it is really a playthrough ending bug or not.
 
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Galdred

Studio Draconis
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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
ok, it worked in the end, so not a game breaking bug. Funnily, it freed the party slot twice: once after "teleporting" to the castle, and the second time upon reaching the previous mission site, making me end with 6 free parties out of 3!
I also wrote a small "guide" on Steam as people were complaining about difficulty and turn limits (like wtf are they spending their turns on??? I had exactly zero missions where it was an issue):

I read a lot of complains about the difficulty increase in chapter 3, but I went through without too much trouble (I just moved to chapter 4) at max difficulty. Here is what I think helped:

- Grow tall, not wide
You are constrained by 2 things: number of groups/available characters to send on mission and resources.
It means you need to make sure your characters don't spend too much time recovering.
But it laos means you need to make very good use of your resources to help with that.
The best upgrade by far are more parties with more characters, but that cost a lot of resources, as you need to upgrade 6 buildings between each level of stronghold upgrade.

I think the best way to do so is to just forget diversity and focus on as little weapons and classes as possible. I went with:

- Armors: Crusader and duelist almost exclusively (you can field 2 of each, and they both have easy access to taunt).
Rationale: I don't care much about the armor of the other: the petmaster has a pet to tank for him. Alchemists, archers, and gunners should avoid getting in harm's way instead of wasting your precious resources. 1 armor upgrade here and there can be ok, but don't overdo it

Weapons:
- halberd (best AoE power in game), works for crusaders and duelists. I give one to all duelists.
- poleaxe (ie, giant hammer): not sure it was the best choice
- greatsword: Very versatile. Not sure it was not redundant with poleaxe and halberds
- sword (but I don't like 1 handed weapons much in the game): dagger has no business being a main weapon, hatchet will turn the enemy to your direction which is exactly what you don't want to do with duelists. However, it means petmaster weapon won't get upgraded.
- bows (I went with bows, because 3 classes can use them, but crossbows are still OKish, it's just that they are probably not worth investing on early)
As in XCOM, staying alive is mostly done through killing opponents, so I didn't increase shields at all (and seldom use these to begin with).
- guns: arrive much later, but best ranged weapons IMO.

Alchemist:
skip every specific ailment remover. I just use crusader to delete debuffs, and stock on health potions. Later on, incense of heal + all debuff removal is a good choice.
Enhanced balms are a must have. Most other items should be skipped
Stick with 1 single kind of arrow and upgrade it. I went with fire to ignite the alchemist surface.

Invest all you can into building improvements:
- Barracks makes the most difference. recruiting high level characters for cheap makes your life much easier.
- Prison can provide more passive bonus
- Forge and alchemist when you can afford some of the upgrades (typically, after you need with imbalanced resources, it may be a good time to upgrae crusader armor/weapons).


Important class skills and other considerations:
As with all similar games, action economy is everything. You can usually spend some time setting up before a fight, so buffs are not that bad, but they only provide 1 turn of benefit because you should never use them instead of wrecking faces.
It is always better to select the skills that give or deny actions over others (hence why AoE melee weapons are the best!: halberd AoE attack can give you 4 attacks for a single AP, without cooldown if you have 2 opponents in range).
You can make the AI do stupid things with hazardous surface, but the nature of the hazard doesn't change much. I like the alchemist fire surface for that. They don't care as much about the slowing surface, though.

That is also what makes archers (whatever the class name is) great:
the free item slot per turn can be use to great effect with a special arrow, granting them a third attack, or a siege engine if there is one nearby.
That means lonewolf is also much, much better than caltrops, because it applies to each of your attacks (and you already have the alchemist do to the same).

Alchemists work best with a focus on either healing or damage. I haven't tried damage much, but buffed acid potions seem like a good alternative to bringhing a hammer crusader to deal with armors.

Crusaders can go whatever you want, and mix things from both side. I think removing debuffs is much better than self healing (they have the highest armor, and healing is the job of the alchemist in the first place). Also, recovering armor is good!
They have great armor and survivability. I lost 1 of each other class (but duelist), but never a crusader. Don't waste them by putting a shield (also, it would be ahistorical to do so; it is plate armor OR shield when not on horseback!). Taunt is their bread and butter: They cannot prevent an engaged archer from shooting, nor can they prevent an armored opponent from ignoring them to whack your backline. That is why taunt is very very important on them.

For duelists, both options seem viable, but I wouldn't take the skill that waste an action to multi taunt (haven't tried it, though), over the one granting free AP/MP on kill/backstab. I think a single taunt is enough, and more crits is great, because you'd rather kill opponents than hope you can parry them while they bring reinforcements.

For beastmasters, coordinated strike is a must have, even though marked looks great, a single coordinated strike with a bear can almost delete most opponents.
I have found the bird underwhelming.

Unlike in XCOM, if you heal before heading back to town, you will have less downtime, so make sure to do so, and load up on potions.

You can randomly meet characters that can be captured, even in non capture missions, so always bring shackles (except for storyline missions, where there is no random opponent).
A missed capture is 200-800 GP wasted!

Losing characters is OK, replacements are cheap, and no one is unique. A maxed barrack lets you not to lose much in the porcess. Note that weapon training is valued higher than level for replacement.

As for turn limits, if you focus on killing opponents (as opposed to kiting or whatever), they should never be an issue. Even before the patch changing them, I never had any issue with them. Sometimes, the assassinate/free character and extract missions can be a bit tough, as characters that just get there as reinforcement may tarpit your own characters before they can reach the skyranger for extraction.

You should just make sure that you don't end within 1 move range of the reinforcement area the turn before you want to extract. I usually kill every one in the first pod to spawn, then get out.
 

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